| A few thoughts on Saturday and our start 08:24 - Sep 14 with 2108 views | Steve_M |
Well, it's a decent start. That on it's own won't be enough to stay up but - looking at the last few seasons of the league - it definitely helps. A home win, an away win, a win from behind, late winners, both of our new strikers with goals already - all good thins.
I still can’t work out if we’re going to be any good or not or exactly what GON is trying to do. Large parts of Saturday's match were incoherent from us, the first 20 minutes we were all over the place and looked a long way off the level of Palace. I hope the players knew what we were trying to do at the start because, other than getting the ball wide, there didn’t seem a plan. The goal wasn't a surprise but was disappointing, Palacios not tracking a run in midfield and leaving Leif exposed.
But, and here's the good part we stayed in the game, didn't concede a quick second goal and scored a really well worked equaliser. A lot of players forward, a ball from right to left, two superb touches from Jack Clarke and then a great cross and powerful header.
I think we needed that goal, after the previous three halves of football to give us a little belief as we looked better even before the red card - you could tell it was a bad foul because the ref gave us the decision having done the usual Premier League thing of treating minor contact differently depending which team it was.
A nice second goal, numbers forward again and making use of the space wide and a second unmarked header in the area. Not sure Leif needed to even jump. Despite the slow start we were in a good place at half-time. It would have been even better had we taken one of the presentable chances we made in the first 15 minutes or so after the break, maybe a slight lack of ruthlessness in those.
After that, there was another loss of control which is also a concern. I think fitness may be an issue for Lukic as he slowed down a bit and certainly Palace ended up having a lot of the ball in the middle for a side a man down. Florentino was good when he came on but Palace already had a bit of belief and, whilst we could definitely have done better with the equaliser, it was a good finish.
It wasn't just that though, I think it was six times they crossed or shot into the Holmesdale End second half from good positions and we weren't able to stop them getting into those positions. Fortunately they probably only made one chance at 2-2 and then took off Strand Larsen seemingly content with a point.
I'm glad we weren't, eight outfield players had a touch in the move for our winner. The early cross from Encisio and the header from Davis being so good made the defending for that slightly more justifiable from Palace but as much as that, Flemming’s ability to get scrappy rebound goals is definitely something we’ve missed. The half-second of anticipation for the ball to go in just made sure the celebration was properly done.
So, definitely a work in progress. Six points out of 12 is good in this league and our ability to make good chances and take them looks like it might be a bit better than two years ago. We need to improve defensively, we are playing against good players in - nearly - every game but we have left those players far too much time and space this season already.
I don't think we won because of the red card but nor did we show the sort of ruthlessness second half that would have put Palace out of the game. There was some comment on a muted celebration at the winner but I think the players knew they had thrown the win away once and didn't want to do it again.
If some of the above sounds harsh well it is a harsh league (see Coventry) but we do also have a lot of players getting up to speed at the moment and the understanding and organisation should improve.
Some of those players though, Palacios still looks off the pace to me a bit but I can't wait until he's got used to that and the team because he is such a good footballer. Efficient on the ball, works hard and very mobile - I doubt he'll be here for more than a season so make the absolute most of him.
Enciso seems more mature than 18 months ago, struggled for space a bit when Palace had 11 but absolutely made the most of the extra space after the sending off. The speed of action is necessary for this league, see the cross for Leif before the winner.
If those two can stay fit then it will go a long way towards keeping us where we want to be. If we can pick up anything next Saturday then we can go into the international break having done the first part of the job well. [Post edited 14 Sep 8:31]
|  |
| |  |
| A few thoughts on Saturday and our start on 08:26 - Sep 14 with 2039 views | MK1 |
We have 6 points from 4 games. |  |
| |
| A few thoughts on Saturday and our start on 09:16 - Sep 14 with 1788 views | Steve_M |
| A few thoughts on Saturday and our start on 08:26 - Sep 14 by MK1 |
We have 6 points from 4 games. |
Did you really think I meant we had played 12 matches? I've tightened that wording up though - thanks. | |
| |
| A few thoughts on Saturday and our start on 09:18 - Sep 14 with 1786 views | homer_123 |
Good post Steve.
For me, right now, we seem a touch Jekyll and Hyde. We can flip from very good to not at all good very quickly.
It's evident GON wants us to attack in numbers, and that's great but the trade off is we look suspect defensively at times. It is probably a culmination of GON not quite getting the balance right, players not quite delivering on the tactics and positioning, players still getting fitness levels and match levels up to speed.
There is a lot to like about us in many ways and I make you spot on. We are picking up points when it's clear we are not at our best.
6pts after 4 games - I think we'd all agree we'd be more than happy with that. [Post edited 14 Sep 9:51]
|  |
| |
| A few thoughts on Saturday and our start on 09:24 - Sep 14 with 1742 views | Guthrum |
| A few thoughts on Saturday and our start on 09:18 - Sep 14 by homer_123 |
Good post Steve.
For me, right now, we seem a touch Jekyll and Hyde. We can flip from very good to not at all good very quickly.
It's evident GON wants us to attack in numbers, and that's great but the trade off is we look suspect defensively at times. It is probably a culmination of GON not quite getting the balance right, players not quite delivering on the tactics and positioning, players still getting fitness levels and match levels up to speed.
There is a lot to like about us in many ways and I make you spot on. We are picking up points when it's clear we are not at our best.
6pts after 4 games - I think we'd all agree we'd be more than happy with that. [Post edited 14 Sep 9:51]
|
The key thing is that, while issues are (hopefully) being ironed out, we are continuing to pick up a good haul of points. It gives the leeway to continue developing. |  |
| |
| A few thoughts on Saturday and our start on 09:38 - Sep 14 with 1641 views | xrayspecs |
I thought that first half we did not set up well against their back three. Palace had an extra man in midfield and were able to play through us too easily. Our defensive lines did not look good watching side on. For the opening goal, Palace were able to switch the ball out wide for a 2v1 and a neat finish.
Once down to 10, my suspicion is that Palace simply went compact and aimed to stay in the game until 60 mins, and then become more adventurous. That may be retro-fitting on my behalf.
[EDIT: I also think Palace missed Pino, their number 10, when he was subbed after the dismissal of Diasai]
We certainly looked like we tired in the middle of the pitch in the second half and along with more Palace ambition, were on the back foot. We did not concede any really clear chances from memory, and the equaliser was a well worked finish.
What we were able to do, which is something we struggled to do two years ago, was to keep going for 90 mins, and we had quality on the pitch to both create and score the winning goal.
So reasons to be optimistic but at this stage it is cautious optimism. [Post edited 14 Sep 9:41]
|  | | |
| A few thoughts on Saturday and our start on 09:40 - Sep 14 with 1627 views | FlittonBlue |
International break coming at a good time. The mental fatigue from working to get up to speed as a new team in a very tough league would be massive partially offset by the emotional adrenaline of the new season which will now be running dry. I think the cultural integration for the side is there now, they know what is expected and have been embraced by the fans (bar one obvious exception).
Im sure GoN has put across his philosophy of play, and at times you can see it. The 3 weeks after Everton will be about further embedding this and working further on plans B to Z.
Doing this from a base of more points than games played is probably the high end of expectations when GoN signed on. If they can take anything from Saturday will give them a boost leading towards a run of games including Fulham, Forest & Bournemouth at home along with Hull away before the next break | |
| |
| A few thoughts on Saturday and our start on 09:46 - Sep 14 with 1579 views | ElderGrizzly |
I'm still not convinced Lukic and Palacios are a pairing that will ultimately work in this division.
They leave us too open in the middle. It needs a Matusiwa or Florentino as a 3rd sitting midfielder in there for some of our games? |  | | |
| A few thoughts on Saturday and our start on 10:21 - Sep 14 with 1357 views | ZapatasMoustache |
It's been a generally good start punctuated by some midfield but especially defensive fragility. We're going to score plenty of goals this season, so it will be more exciting than last time, and even as we are currently set up we'll get a few wins despite conceding. I suspect though, that GON will be concentrating on a few key things in the break. Not losing runners so easily, guarding the ball better in the area between the centre circle and the penalty area, more accurate passing out of defence etc. Better communication too, and better positioning for Scherpen who has conceded on fairly narrow angles a few times now.
But overall, the worst we can be after 4 games is 11th, and more likely 10th (depends on how Leeds/Newcastle goes of course). Which is really good! |  | | |
Login to get fewer ads
| A few thoughts on Saturday and our start on 10:28 - Sep 14 with 1337 views | jayessess |
Inevitable that the opposition are going to have phases of sustained control in this division, even with 10-men.
I'm actually pretty optimistic about our defence. The goals we've conceded to Sunderland, Liverpool and Crystal Palace have all been from half chances. I would not expect to have conceded 5 goals from the chances we gave up across those games. |  |
| |
| A few thoughts on Saturday and our start on 10:31 - Sep 14 with 1325 views | Billywitch |
We can look sloppy at times, and the keeper concerns me.
That aside, I'm happy with where we are | | | |
| A few thoughts on Saturday and our start on 10:52 - Sep 14 with 1231 views | BseaBlue |
I started a thread about my midfield concerns yesterday and how open we were but struggled for the right words without coming accross as negative, so you have put this much better than I did!
I'm delighted with the character we have shown to get the wins but at the same time concerned about our lack of control and how easily we are carved open. Like you, I can't make my mind up whether its tactical brilliance and the gamble is going to pay off or whether we are going to unravel and get a good, few hammerings. Maybe it will be both and we will do enough to stay up!
A few people made a point that we practically have a brand new midfield and forward line so maybe defending as a team will come more naturally once we have bedded in a bit. |  | | |
| A few thoughts on Saturday and our start on 10:53 - Sep 14 with 1222 views | LeoMuff |
| A few thoughts on Saturday and our start on 09:24 - Sep 14 by Guthrum |
The key thing is that, while issues are (hopefully) being ironed out, we are continuing to pick up a good haul of points. It gives the leeway to continue developing. |
Let hope so but we looked just as wide open v Palace as we did v Liverpool and Man Utd. When away from hope or playing a top team I would like to see two in midfield that cover and win the ball, I don’t think Lukic and Pala are enough.
We should be looking a a clean sheet first and foremost and hard to break down |  |
| |
| A few thoughts on Saturday and our start on 10:56 - Sep 14 with 1202 views | gainsboroughblue |
| A few thoughts on Saturday and our start on 10:53 - Sep 14 by LeoMuff |
Let hope so but we looked just as wide open v Palace as we did v Liverpool and Man Utd. When away from hope or playing a top team I would like to see two in midfield that cover and win the ball, I don’t think Lukic and Pala are enough.
We should be looking a a clean sheet first and foremost and hard to break down |
It does feel like 0-0 is going to be a rare, or even non-existent, result for us this season. |  |
| |
| A few thoughts on Saturday and our start on 11:02 - Sep 14 with 1156 views | pauldart |
| A few thoughts on Saturday and our start on 09:38 - Sep 14 by xrayspecs |
I thought that first half we did not set up well against their back three. Palace had an extra man in midfield and were able to play through us too easily. Our defensive lines did not look good watching side on. For the opening goal, Palace were able to switch the ball out wide for a 2v1 and a neat finish.
Once down to 10, my suspicion is that Palace simply went compact and aimed to stay in the game until 60 mins, and then become more adventurous. That may be retro-fitting on my behalf.
[EDIT: I also think Palace missed Pino, their number 10, when he was subbed after the dismissal of Diasai]
We certainly looked like we tired in the middle of the pitch in the second half and along with more Palace ambition, were on the back foot. We did not concede any really clear chances from memory, and the equaliser was a well worked finish.
What we were able to do, which is something we struggled to do two years ago, was to keep going for 90 mins, and we had quality on the pitch to both create and score the winning goal.
So reasons to be optimistic but at this stage it is cautious optimism. [Post edited 14 Sep 9:41]
|
and bar Liverpool game , evidence our fitness levels are good, we have scored in the 90th minute in every game | | | |
| A few thoughts on Saturday and our start on 11:19 - Sep 14 with 1081 views | gringoblue |
| A few thoughts on Saturday and our start on 10:28 - Sep 14 by jayessess |
Inevitable that the opposition are going to have phases of sustained control in this division, even with 10-men.
I'm actually pretty optimistic about our defence. The goals we've conceded to Sunderland, Liverpool and Crystal Palace have all been from half chances. I would not expect to have conceded 5 goals from the chances we gave up across those games. |
Backed up by the Opta stats
https://theanalyst.com/competi
We look much more of a goal threat than last time out and we're not fading in games because our squad is so much better. |  | | |
| A few thoughts on Saturday and our start on 11:27 - Sep 14 with 1029 views | homer_123 |
| A few thoughts on Saturday and our start on 10:56 - Sep 14 by gainsboroughblue |
It does feel like 0-0 is going to be a rare, or even non-existent, result for us this season. |
We could argue that we are the opposite of Hull, whereas Cov are neither.
Hull looking to continue to be what they were in the Champ, tough to breakdown and play on the break. We are committing players forward creating opportunities and looking to score.
Cov are in trouble. | |
| |
| A few thoughts on Saturday and our start on 11:34 - Sep 14 with 964 views | Wright1 |
| A few thoughts on Saturday and our start on 09:46 - Sep 14 by ElderGrizzly |
I'm still not convinced Lukic and Palacios are a pairing that will ultimately work in this division.
They leave us too open in the middle. It needs a Matusiwa or Florentino as a 3rd sitting midfielder in there for some of our games? |
I don't think you will see it often. We would lose a lot of attacking impetus by taking out one of the forward players and frankly, Enciso is so good at the moment that you almost put him in the 10 and build the team around that - you want him central.
I think it is much more likely we see Florentino partner a Palacios than it becoming at full blown 3. | | | |
| A few thoughts on Saturday and our start on 11:40 - Sep 14 with 937 views | bsw72 |
We have played against mainly settled teams - Across their midfield and attacks; Sunderland had a very settled midfield and attack from last year, Man Utd only had Tielemans as a new addition, Liverpool only added Munoz and Palace only had Timber and Khalaili - much more settled and experienced with each other than ourselves.
I think the fact that for us at least 75% of the players in front of the back 4 have only played 5 competitive games with each other in total explains most of the problems / gaps - and the more we play the more cohesive it will become.
The fact that we are winning games with almost an entirely new midfield and attack suggests that the signings are working, and as we progress will really start to know and understand each other.
Feels like night vs day compared to our levels of performance two years ago, the team feels mentally and physically stronger . . . [Post edited 14 Sep 11:47]
|  | | |
| A few thoughts on Saturday and our start on 13:40 - Sep 14 with 651 views | Illinoisblue |
That 20 minute spell in the second half when we lost our way totally was a massive concern, perhaps masked by scoring the late winner. But we are of course a work in progress, with some players barely knowing each other’s names let alone how they play or what runs they’ll make. But if we can pick up points while figuring it out along the way that’s a really good sign. |  |
| |
| A few thoughts on Saturday and our start on 13:50 - Sep 14 with 609 views | unstableblue |
| A few thoughts on Saturday and our start on 13:40 - Sep 14 by Illinoisblue |
That 20 minute spell in the second half when we lost our way totally was a massive concern, perhaps masked by scoring the late winner. But we are of course a work in progress, with some players barely knowing each other’s names let alone how they play or what runs they’ll make. But if we can pick up points while figuring it out along the way that’s a really good sign. |
I think the partnerships are emerging, OShea and Fatawu
Greaves and Diop
And especially Pallacios, Davis and Maeda/clarke
I can see Clarke staring at Everton given how well that trio emerged in Saturday
It was a 15min spell second half for me, and I’d focus on our inability to score in the time after our second, we should have got a third and deserved a third - but didn’t and gave them their chance to come back
But as I posted palace completely knackered themselves to get the equaliser and we were able to mount a lot of pressure and posession, maybe not chances! |  |
| |
| A few thoughts on Saturday and our start on 15:36 - Sep 14 with 451 views | ElderGrizzly |
| A few thoughts on Saturday and our start on 13:50 - Sep 14 by unstableblue |
I think the partnerships are emerging, OShea and Fatawu
Greaves and Diop
And especially Pallacios, Davis and Maeda/clarke
I can see Clarke staring at Everton given how well that trio emerged in Saturday
It was a 15min spell second half for me, and I’d focus on our inability to score in the time after our second, we should have got a third and deserved a third - but didn’t and gave them their chance to come back
But as I posted palace completely knackered themselves to get the equaliser and we were able to mount a lot of pressure and posession, maybe not chances! |
I'm still struggling with our best CB being at RB.
He will never let us down there, but it still feels like a position we are compromising on and he'll be exposed against better teams with pace. | | | |
| A few thoughts on Saturday and our start on 16:20 - Sep 14 with 355 views | StokieBlue |
| A few thoughts on Saturday and our start on 13:50 - Sep 14 by unstableblue |
I think the partnerships are emerging, OShea and Fatawu
Greaves and Diop
And especially Pallacios, Davis and Maeda/clarke
I can see Clarke staring at Everton given how well that trio emerged in Saturday
It was a 15min spell second half for me, and I’d focus on our inability to score in the time after our second, we should have got a third and deserved a third - but didn’t and gave them their chance to come back
But as I posted palace completely knackered themselves to get the equaliser and we were able to mount a lot of pressure and posession, maybe not chances! |
I don't think either of those top two partnerships will be there much longer.
Think O'Shea will move centrally with Diop and Ouattara will be RB.
SB |  |
| Avatar - M101 - Pinwheel Galaxy |
| |
| |
By continuing to use the site, you agree to our use of cookies and to abide by our Terms and Conditions.
