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Indeed. But are they being as diligent with what actually caused this outbreak... 'wet markets' and the nation's obsession with eating what most countries find unspeakable.
A slightly more realistic apparaisal of their extraordinary efforts is that they need these hospitals because the true number of cases is probably utterly horrendous. Or could be.
But as has been pointed out before it's largely hysteria and what might be. Flu is a far greater killer every year.... 12,000 in the UK every year.... lord knows how many in secretive places ike china.... and nobody cares one iota.
Indeed. But are they being as diligent with what actually caused this outbreak... 'wet markets' and the nation's obsession with eating what most countries find unspeakable.
A slightly more realistic apparaisal of their extraordinary efforts is that they need these hospitals because the true number of cases is probably utterly horrendous. Or could be.
But as has been pointed out before it's largely hysteria and what might be. Flu is a far greater killer every year.... 12,000 in the UK every year.... lord knows how many in secretive places ike china.... and nobody cares one iota.
You flu point is only semi-valid. Flu is a known quantity, it's mutation rates and processes are understood. It can be horrific as the the Spanish flu but in general it is a known quantity that unfortunately kills specific individuals with underlying conditions.
The issue here is that it's an RNA virus which can mutate very quickly into things which might be much worse. The more it spreads the more chance their is of the random mutation which makes it horrific.
You are almost certainly right about China hiding/not really knowing the true number of cases - most analysts think it's at least 10 times as many as they are saying, maybe even more than that.
You flu point is only semi-valid. Flu is a known quantity, it's mutation rates and processes are understood. It can be horrific as the the Spanish flu but in general it is a known quantity that unfortunately kills specific individuals with underlying conditions.
The issue here is that it's an RNA virus which can mutate very quickly into things which might be much worse. The more it spreads the more chance their is of the random mutation which makes it horrific.
You are almost certainly right about China hiding/not really knowing the true number of cases - most analysts think it's at least 10 times as many as they are saying, maybe even more than that.
On the virus itself, you are correct it's a new strain which probably mutated from snakes or bats. RNA viruses have a high mutation rate so a vaccine will likely be a while coming. I wouldn't say it's unforeseen, experts have been saying it will happen since SARS but because of the virus mutations you can't even start on a vaccine until it comes along. The worry is 2-fold: a mutation to make human-to-human transfer easier and a mutation which shifts the mortality from killing people who already have an underlying condition to killing healthy people (like what happened with the Spanish flu).
I think we also need to look at the numbers here. They are claiming there are 1200 cases worldwide now (48 hours after the hospital announcement) yet they need 1000 dedicated beds in just Wuhan by Monday? 100m people in lockdown for 1200 cases? Something doesn't stack up at all. China tried to cover up SARS, lets hope they are being more honest this time (I think they are).
With regards to building speed, it's linked to human rights though. It's easier to build things when you can just seize someones property because you want the land, use prisoners to do the manual labour or care little for the environmental cost of what is being built.
You are right though - they are very quick and it's very, very impressive. You really can't compare it to HS2 though - it would be like the UK government kicking everyone out of their houses on the route without any recourse. When they built the 3 gorges damn they displaced 1.3m people from their homes with no recourse including a single city of 600,000 people. It also lead directly to the extinction of the magnificent Chinese paddlefish which wasn't even considered during the construction:
SB
Advanced in so many ways, yet so behind in others.
I've never been to China but it was clear in India that just a few laws regarding Health and Safety - maybe some clear labelling for example, might go some way to saving many health issues, education on food contamination...
I saw something on the demand for fresh meat in China; fresh being as opposed to chilled or frozen, meaning bacteria can have field day before consumption.
You have to wonder if they want to save the poorest or if they're ok to see the numbers diminish any way possible.
Advanced in so many ways, yet so behind in others.
I've never been to China but it was clear in India that just a few laws regarding Health and Safety - maybe some clear labelling for example, might go some way to saving many health issues, education on food contamination...
I saw something on the demand for fresh meat in China; fresh being as opposed to chilled or frozen, meaning bacteria can have field day before consumption.
You have to wonder if they want to save the poorest or if they're ok to see the numbers diminish any way possible.
[Post edited 26 Jan 2020 23:46]
I think China will have to ban wet markets. They eat a lot more variety of animals than any other country and having them alive, slaughtered and sold on the actual stand is asking for trouble. They will likely have to bring in a more segregated approach where the animals aren't alive in the market stands.
Death toll has jumped overnight to 80 plus 400+ critical. It seems some more realistic figures are being released. Imperial College are saying they think it's closer to 100,000 infected in just the Wuhan area rather than the claimed 2000 globally.
I think China will have to ban wet markets. They eat a lot more variety of animals than any other country and having them alive, slaughtered and sold on the actual stand is asking for trouble. They will likely have to bring in a more segregated approach where the animals aren't alive in the market stands.
Death toll has jumped overnight to 80 plus 400+ critical. It seems some more realistic figures are being released. Imperial College are saying they think it's closer to 100,000 infected in just the Wuhan area rather than the claimed 2000 globally.
The deaths in Beijing are a real concern, might mean the quarantine hasn't worked.
SB
[Post edited 27 Jan 2020 9:37]
The virus is nowhere near as bad as SARS. SARS killed one in ten of those infected, Coronavirus has from the last time I checked killed about 140 from 7,700 infected.
Still a massive concern but they will manage it.
“Hello, I'm your MP. Actually I'm not. I'm your candidate. Gosh.”
Boris Johnson canvassing in Henley, 2005.
Amazing what you can achieve with a billion peasants
I think China hugely overstates its' population, but your sentiment is right.
In the spirit of reconciliation and happiness at the end of the Banter Era (RIP) and as a result of promotion I have cleared out my ignore list. Look forwards to reading your posts!
Tho, on the other hand, they also spent several weeks claiming the virus was a minor problem and nothing worth worrying about. Until it became too obvious that the reverse was the case.
And presumably hiding the numbers. You don't quarantine a whole city if the infection rates are no different to normal viruses, as was originally claimed.
(edit - I've seen SB's post now - agreed, something doesn't add up to me either).
The virus is nowhere near as bad as SARS. SARS killed one in ten of those infected, Coronavirus has from the last time I checked killed about 140 from 7,700 infected.
Still a massive concern but they will manage it.
That's if you believe the official Chinese figures. Most experts outside the country put the infection rate at about 150,000 to 200,000 now. Why build hospitals with thousands of beds if it's not many cases and why quarantine hundreds of millions of people.
You are entirely correct that the mortality rate isn't as high as SARS at the moment but SARS only had 8000 cases over about a year - this has been a month. With that much of the virus in humans it has far more scope to mutate and become deadlier.
I think they are doing a good job in managing the spread, the worry is transparency and any mutations which make human-to-human transfer easier.
You remind me of Prince Philip's racist gag about what the Chinese eat, which sorry to say, I found funny.
Although if we ate more of our rodents; i.e pigeons, we wouldn't be so overrun with them and it would take some pressure off other live foodstuff. And rabbits of course.
I'm not sure it's necessarily the items they eat, but the conditions that either the meat is kept under and of course the choice in picking animals that are themselves disease ridden given the conditions they may live under.
I'd be more cautious of eating a city pigeon than one that has spent its time wandering around the countryside and raiding my feeding table for example.
Slosh some sweet and sour over the top, add noodles and *insert Chinese name here*' is your uncle.
Although if we ate more of our rodents; i.e pigeons, we wouldn't be so overrun with them and it would take some pressure off other live foodstuff. And rabbits of course.
I'm not sure it's necessarily the items they eat, but the conditions that either the meat is kept under and of course the choice in picking animals that are themselves disease ridden given the conditions they may live under.
I'd be more cautious of eating a city pigeon than one that has spent its time wandering around the countryside and raiding my feeding table for example.
Slosh some sweet and sour over the top, add noodles and *insert Chinese name here*' is your uncle.
Yes that-s fair. I gather squirrels are alright to eat and very eco, especially the grey ones. I might have mentioned this before..
Has anyone ever looked at their own postings for last day or so? Oh my... so sorry. Was Ullaa
They are very good at building stuff.....like that re-education camp.
They are not a power for good at all. The virus, as discussed on R4, was potentially due to live animals at markets. Apparently the chinese like this as it's a better flavour!
Very poor, if any, animal and food safety or care.
Nature has a way you know. China might have to buck it's ideas. Nature might just be giving them a kick up the backside.
I'm not saying it's a good idea, before you pile in, it's just another view.
Assumption is to make an ass out of you and me.
Those who assume they know you, when they don't are just guessing.
Those who assume and insist they know are daft and in denial.
Those who assume, insist, and deny the truth are plain stupid.
Those who assume, insist, deny the truth and tell YOU they know you (when they don't) have an IQ in the range of 35-49.
They are very good at building stuff.....like that re-education camp.
They are not a power for good at all. The virus, as discussed on R4, was potentially due to live animals at markets. Apparently the chinese like this as it's a better flavour!
Very poor, if any, animal and food safety or care.
Nature has a way you know. China might have to buck it's ideas. Nature might just be giving them a kick up the backside.
I'm not saying it's a good idea, before you pile in, it's just another view.
It's not that, it's just another irrelevant comment on this thread.
I didn't mention nor ask what they're no good at; I already know.
It's weird how people keep dropping by to comment on what we already know with no interest in the OP whatsoever.
If everyone had seen the pictures I was relating to - which I should have included, now I can see, but assumed all and sundry were already familiar with - there wouldn't have been any intrusions.
There was popular footage a week ago of dozens of construction machines working together hurriedly like a nest of organised ants - incredible.
That's it. That's all. They don't mess about -no hidden meaning, nothing more.
What I should have posted is 'look at all those shiny machines - they look like toys at work'.
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