| My conscience is clear 22:16 - Oct 31 with 9103 views | pistonbroke |
People were saying don’t vote for Corbyn , when there was only one alternative to a Tory majority which happened , who do you now blame , look at yourself in the mirror and if you voted other than labour then blame yourselves |  | | |  |
| My conscience is clear on 12:44 - Nov 1 with 3055 views | The_Flashing_Smile |
| My conscience is clear on 09:03 - Nov 1 by marcus1642 |
I voted Conservative. Glad I did. So I look myself in the mirror knowing Brexit will be achieved, and kept the appalling Corbyn lead far left out of office. |
What's been good about Brexit so far? |  |
| Trust the process. Trust Phil. |
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| My conscience is clear on 12:44 - Nov 1 with 3053 views | noggin |
| My conscience is clear on 12:44 - Nov 1 by The_Flashing_Smile |
What's been good about Brexit so far? |
You not seen the new passports? |  |
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| My conscience is clear on 14:26 - Nov 1 with 3006 views | tractordownsouth |
| My conscience is clear on 12:04 - Nov 1 by noggin |
Are you saying Corbyn is a racist or have I misread that? |
Yep. I didn't realise it at the time (something I'm embarassed about) but have since learnt more about the scale of the company he kept and the meaning of the stuff he said. The mural, the English irony comment, the antisemites he invited to parliament, the accounts from Ruth Smeeth and Luciana Berger about how Corbyn was totally indifferent to the suffering of members during PLP meetings, his response to the report. It all adds up to one conclusion.
I'm sure he wouldn't have messed Covid up more than Johnson and I'd always prefer a Labour government to a Tory one, but I can't name a single General Election in the last 50 years with a worse choice of leaders to choose from? |  |
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| My conscience is clear on 14:28 - Nov 1 with 3001 views | tractordownsouth |
| My conscience is clear on 10:24 - Nov 1 by solemio |
I voted LibDem because it was the only chance of defeating the appalling sitting Conservative in this constituency.
It worked; we got rid of the Tory. |
Were you a constituent of Zac Goldsmith? | |
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| My conscience is clear on 14:41 - Nov 1 with 2983 views | solemio |
| My conscience is clear on 14:28 - Nov 1 by tractordownsouth |
Were you a constituent of Zac Goldsmith? |
Certainly not. | | | |
| My conscience is clear on 15:37 - Nov 1 with 2950 views | Darth_Koont |
| My conscience is clear on 14:26 - Nov 1 by tractordownsouth |
Yep. I didn't realise it at the time (something I'm embarassed about) but have since learnt more about the scale of the company he kept and the meaning of the stuff he said. The mural, the English irony comment, the antisemites he invited to parliament, the accounts from Ruth Smeeth and Luciana Berger about how Corbyn was totally indifferent to the suffering of members during PLP meetings, his response to the report. It all adds up to one conclusion.
I'm sure he wouldn't have messed Covid up more than Johnson and I'd always prefer a Labour government to a Tory one, but I can't name a single General Election in the last 50 years with a worse choice of leaders to choose from? |
That’s pretty weak though - you’re basically taking the factional approach.
What have you “learnt” about the English irony statement for example? |  |
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| My conscience is clear on 15:53 - Nov 1 with 2933 views | Kropotkin123 |
- I was in a labour safe seat
- Labour won the safe seat
- I didn't vote out of principle for the undemocratic system that gives me no fair choice.
- If people want to hold me accountable, then simply make my vote equal to other peoples.
- Until my vote is equal to others, I blame those who limit my democratic right responsible.
- That includes Labour who came into power in 1997 promising to reform the "first past the post" system and instead gerrymandered. |  |
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| My conscience is clear on 15:56 - Nov 1 with 2924 views | giant_stow |
| My conscience is clear on 15:37 - Nov 1 by Darth_Koont |
That’s pretty weak though - you’re basically taking the factional approach.
What have you “learnt” about the English irony statement for example? |
What makes Mr South's opinions the factional approach? |  |
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| My conscience is clear on 16:03 - Nov 1 with 2917 views | Darth_Koont |
| My conscience is clear on 15:56 - Nov 1 by giant_stow |
What makes Mr South's opinions the factional approach? |
Tractor has just parroted the accusations.
I know you’re just going to ignore other accounts and information that lead to a more objective assessment so let’s not pretend you’re interested in what I’m saying. | |
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| My conscience is clear on 16:06 - Nov 1 with 2912 views | giant_stow |
| My conscience is clear on 16:03 - Nov 1 by Darth_Koont |
Tractor has just parroted the accusations.
I know you’re just going to ignore other accounts and information that lead to a more objective assessment so let’s not pretend you’re interested in what I’m saying. |
It like he's had a think about them to me - seems a thoughtful person who's more than interested in politics, so maybe he just disagrees.
And not true on my ignoring your points - I even read you middle-east eye liunk last night. | |
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| My conscience is clear on 17:05 - Nov 1 with 2890 views | vindicatedblue |
| My conscience is clear on 14:26 - Nov 1 by tractordownsouth |
Yep. I didn't realise it at the time (something I'm embarassed about) but have since learnt more about the scale of the company he kept and the meaning of the stuff he said. The mural, the English irony comment, the antisemites he invited to parliament, the accounts from Ruth Smeeth and Luciana Berger about how Corbyn was totally indifferent to the suffering of members during PLP meetings, his response to the report. It all adds up to one conclusion.
I'm sure he wouldn't have messed Covid up more than Johnson and I'd always prefer a Labour government to a Tory one, but I can't name a single General Election in the last 50 years with a worse choice of leaders to choose from? |
“Sh1t-stirring Zionist cum buckets, bought and paid for by Israel.”
According to the Labour party governance unit, as recently as last year, this statement made about Margaret Hodge and I was neither racist nor misogynist and didn’t warrant any action against the Labour party member who had written it. That is, until it appeared on the front page of a national newspaper and even then, the member wasn’t suspended until Jeremy Corbyn had to face MPs in parliament.
https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2020/nov/01/jewish-labour-members-have
He was indifferent to the abuse his Jewish members were facing. |  | | |
| My conscience is clear on 17:05 - Nov 1 with 2893 views | soupytwist |
| My conscience is clear on 07:19 - Nov 1 by bluelagos |
How did you vote in the AV referendum?
A far more pertinent question as to why we continue to be governed by a shower of sh1t politicians elected on a minority vote. |
I voted to change the electoral system, even though the change offered wasn't ideal if I recall correctly. |  | | |
| My conscience is clear on 17:12 - Nov 1 with 2885 views | Darth_Koont |
| My conscience is clear on 16:06 - Nov 1 by giant_stow |
It like he's had a think about them to me - seems a thoughtful person who's more than interested in politics, so maybe he just disagrees.
And not true on my ignoring your points - I even read you middle-east eye liunk last night. |
What the point of you reading it but never addressing it? You see detailed stuff from an objective reporter like Oborne doesn’t back up the much more superficial and subjective prevailing narrative but you just keep carrying on with the same mantra anyway.
You’re by no means alone. But it’s like talking to Brexiteers on this subject because you’re not looking for facts or evidence. | |
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| My conscience is clear on 17:28 - Nov 1 with 2868 views | jas0999 |
| My conscience is clear on 22:26 - Oct 31 by ghostofescobar |
I have voted Labour all my life. Under no circumstances would I ever, ever vote Tory. I detest almost everything that they stand for. They appall me. Sicken me at times. Make me despair. Shake my belief in this country and why they keep getting voted in. But in my heart, and my head, I shudder to think how Corbyn and McDonald would have handled this. Sixth form politics doesn’t always make for an effective government. If Starmer had been in charge for a couple of years, different matter altogether. |
Completely agree. Certainly not a Tory voter BUT also couldn’t vote for a Corbyn led Labour and didn’t. Different story with Starmer now leading the party. Trouble is it’s likely four more years before another vote. | | | |
| My conscience is clear on 17:38 - Nov 1 with 2853 views | pistonbroke |
| My conscience is clear on 17:28 - Nov 1 by jas0999 |
Completely agree. Certainly not a Tory voter BUT also couldn’t vote for a Corbyn led Labour and didn’t. Different story with Starmer now leading the party. Trouble is it’s likely four more years before another vote. |
And to late | | | |
| My conscience is clear on 17:56 - Nov 1 with 2838 views | ElephantintheRoom |
People could only vote for Corbyn if they had him as there constituency MP
I'm guessing that is nobody on here | |
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| My conscience is clear on 17:59 - Nov 1 with 2836 views | tractordownsouth |
| My conscience is clear on 15:37 - Nov 1 by Darth_Koont |
That’s pretty weak though - you’re basically taking the factional approach.
What have you “learnt” about the English irony statement for example? |
It's not a factional issue for me. There are plenty of Labour MPs on the left, both past and present, who weren't complicit in this stuff - Dennis Skinner, Cat Smith, Clive Lewis. I have absolutely no issue with them, the party is and should be a broad church, it's just the likes of Corbyn and Burgon who turn a blind eye to this stuff that I dislike.
For that comment specifically, I've learnt about the historical context of Israel and how it came into existence as a territory for Jewish people to have self-determination. And yes, the way the current Israeli government treats Palestine is a disgrace but that doesn't excuse an elected politician portraying those who support Jewish self-determination as outsiders.
Even if you disagree with that, there's plenty of other stuff. For example, read Ruth Smeeth's Guardian article and her episode of Corbynism: The Post Mortem on Spotify/Apple Podcasts. | |
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| My conscience is clear on 18:18 - Nov 1 with 2820 views | pistonbroke |
| My conscience is clear on 17:59 - Nov 1 by tractordownsouth |
It's not a factional issue for me. There are plenty of Labour MPs on the left, both past and present, who weren't complicit in this stuff - Dennis Skinner, Cat Smith, Clive Lewis. I have absolutely no issue with them, the party is and should be a broad church, it's just the likes of Corbyn and Burgon who turn a blind eye to this stuff that I dislike.
For that comment specifically, I've learnt about the historical context of Israel and how it came into existence as a territory for Jewish people to have self-determination. And yes, the way the current Israeli government treats Palestine is a disgrace but that doesn't excuse an elected politician portraying those who support Jewish self-determination as outsiders.
Even if you disagree with that, there's plenty of other stuff. For example, read Ruth Smeeth's Guardian article and her episode of Corbynism: The Post Mortem on Spotify/Apple Podcasts. |
Fair comment , but labour ideals are towards the left
Left ,socialism , it’s what Labour Party represents ,none of this middle ground garbage like under Blair | | | |
| My conscience is clear on 18:25 - Nov 1 with 2806 views | Darth_Koont |
| My conscience is clear on 17:59 - Nov 1 by tractordownsouth |
It's not a factional issue for me. There are plenty of Labour MPs on the left, both past and present, who weren't complicit in this stuff - Dennis Skinner, Cat Smith, Clive Lewis. I have absolutely no issue with them, the party is and should be a broad church, it's just the likes of Corbyn and Burgon who turn a blind eye to this stuff that I dislike.
For that comment specifically, I've learnt about the historical context of Israel and how it came into existence as a territory for Jewish people to have self-determination. And yes, the way the current Israeli government treats Palestine is a disgrace but that doesn't excuse an elected politician portraying those who support Jewish self-determination as outsiders.
Even if you disagree with that, there's plenty of other stuff. For example, read Ruth Smeeth's Guardian article and her episode of Corbynism: The Post Mortem on Spotify/Apple Podcasts. |
But you’ve learnt the historical context for the accusation, not the actual context of the event and the couple of people Corbyn was referring to.
It does seem factional or political when you’re willing to ignore the specific details. And I’d say the same about anyone on ”my side” who did the same. These are serious accusations that people should take seriously before repeating idly. | |
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| My conscience is clear on 18:31 - Nov 1 with 2799 views | vindicatedblue |
| My conscience is clear on 18:18 - Nov 1 by pistonbroke |
Fair comment , but labour ideals are towards the left
Left ,socialism , it’s what Labour Party represents ,none of this middle ground garbage like under Blair |
Who do you think achieved more for the poorest in society? Left idealist Corbyn or middle ground garbage centrist Blair? | | | |
| My conscience is clear on 18:51 - Nov 1 with 2776 views | SouthBucksBlue |
| My conscience is clear on 22:49 - Oct 31 by pointofblue |
Then what's the point of the other parties? They may as well be scrapped if the only choice is Conservative or Labour, no matter what they might stand for.
I read each manifesto prior to the election (I am that sad) and the Green's were closest in my view so I voted for them. |
Which is the correct way to vote and if more voted like this there would be more choice.
I cannot understand the mentality of voting for the same party all your life irrespective of manifesto and party leaders.
The current Tory party is utterly different in ideology, integrity and competence to that of for example Thatcher’s. Tony Blair’s New Labour was similarly totally different to that of for example Corbyn’s.
Sadly many, maybe most voters have no idea what they’re voting for when they cast their vote. | | | |
| My conscience is clear on 18:52 - Nov 1 with 2773 views | pistonbroke |
| My conscience is clear on 18:31 - Nov 1 by vindicatedblue |
Who do you think achieved more for the poorest in society? Left idealist Corbyn or middle ground garbage centrist Blair? |
That’s easy , left idealists | | | |
| My conscience is clear on 18:54 - Nov 1 with 2772 views | noggin |
| My conscience is clear on 18:31 - Nov 1 by vindicatedblue |
Who do you think achieved more for the poorest in society? Left idealist Corbyn or middle ground garbage centrist Blair? |
How was Corbyn allowed to achieve anything? | |
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| My conscience is clear on 19:44 - Nov 1 with 2741 views | vindicatedblue |
| My conscience is clear on 18:54 - Nov 1 by noggin |
How was Corbyn allowed to achieve anything? |
Marcus Rashford has achieved more for the poorest in society in just a few months than Corbyn has in 40 years in Parliament. | | | |
| My conscience is clear on 19:46 - Nov 1 with 2737 views | vindicatedblue |
| My conscience is clear on 18:52 - Nov 1 by pistonbroke |
That’s easy , left idealists |
That wasn't the question I asked. Who achieved more for the poorest in society? Blair or Corbyn? | | | |
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