| Our fan base 12:11 - Aug 18 with 8000 views | BelsteadCav |
I honestly think it’s now one of the worst in the country
I couldn’t believe some of the comments on Twitter last night, worse than hurst, cook out, it’s time to go!
It’s just embarrassing. Saturday will be a horrible atmosphere, I just know it.
We used to have one of the best fan bases around, but we are a shadow of our former selves. If we go behind on Saturday, God help us |  |
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| Our fan base on 13:28 - Aug 18 with 1096 views | jayessess |
I mean, so what if it is a horrible atmosphere? If Cook's project here (or anywhere) depends on the supporters creating a brilliant, positive atmosphere as we rack up defeats to bottom half League One teams then he might as well pack up now. There's no club in the EFL where he'd get that and I doubt there ever has been.
You want to play in front of cheering crowds of appreciative fans, you have to win football matches. That's reality. |  |
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| Our fan base on 13:38 - Aug 18 with 1058 views | StirlingArcher |
| Our fan base on 12:31 - Aug 18 by bluelagos |
Has our fan base changed? Or has social media given everyone a voice.
Many on there will maybe watch a game or two a season, yet their voice carries as much weight as someone who goes far more regularly. Previously the armchair fan went unheard, now they make as much noise as regular fans... |
Keep seeing this one guy, based in Great Bentley, who keeps hurling "must be a TWTD fanboy" like it's an insult...
can't imagine who that would be |  | | |
| Our fan base on 13:38 - Aug 18 with 1056 views | itfcjoe |
| Our fan base on 13:25 - Aug 18 by Vic |
What are you really saying Joe?
In one breath you say you think Cook will be a success, but the the main thrust of the post is suggesting he won’t be! |
I'm just trying to say that a manager having a rocky patch and recovering, whilst they already have credit in the bank - can not be used as 'evidence' that managers start badly and turn it round often. |  |
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| Our fan base on 13:41 - Aug 18 with 1045 views | Vic |
| Our fan base on 13:38 - Aug 18 by itfcjoe |
I'm just trying to say that a manager having a rocky patch and recovering, whilst they already have credit in the bank - can not be used as 'evidence' that managers start badly and turn it round often. |
OK - it just read to me more like you are actually doubting that he will turn it around. Overall, despite your protestations of positivity you do sound like you have serious, serious concerns about Cook and don’t actually like him! |  |
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| Our fan base on 13:44 - Aug 18 with 1029 views | Guthrum |
People might say that on Twitter in anger after the defeat, but the crowd were pretty supportive for most of the game last night. |  |
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| Our fan base on 13:44 - Aug 18 with 1024 views | StirlingArcher |
| Our fan base on 13:38 - Aug 18 by itfcjoe |
I'm just trying to say that a manager having a rocky patch and recovering, whilst they already have credit in the bank - can not be used as 'evidence' that managers start badly and turn it round often. |
Joe - doesn't need to be "often"
just needs to be this once ;) | | | |
| Our fan base on 14:45 - Aug 18 with 948 views | itfcjoe |
You can't read the links you send here
Ferguson - again
Conte won first 3 games, drew 1, lost 2, then won the next 13 | |
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| Our fan base on 14:52 - Aug 18 with 912 views | C_HealyIsAPleasure |
Ferguson - already covered
Conte - won his first 3 games and 16 of his first 19. LOL
Pocchettino - won first 2 games, and 10 of first 20. It was slow by comparison to where he ultimately took Tottenham but in no way comparable to Cooks record here
Sarri - already covered
Klopp - took over Liverpool mid-season placed 10th, 1 loss in first 6 games including a 4-1 win at Man City, ultimately finished 8th due to focusing on Europe and making the Europa League final. Again no way comparable to Cooks record so far
Are you actually looking at any of these articles or just posting random links? [Post edited 18 Aug 2021 14:52]
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| Our fan base on 14:57 - Aug 18 with 914 views | MattinLondon |
When were we one of the best fan bases around? When some booed and wanted Sir Bobby gone? When people ran onto the pitch demanding McGiven sacked? When people booed Jim? Or when some sang songs against Mick?
Like all clubs, Ipswich have had bell ends in every generation since the club has been around. Twitter and social media simply amplify their views.
The original post is utter rubbish. [Post edited 18 Aug 2021 15:01]
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| Our fan base on 15:01 - Aug 18 with 907 views | Chrisd |
| Our fan base on 14:45 - Aug 18 by itfcjoe |
You can't read the links you send here
Ferguson - again
Conte won first 3 games, drew 1, lost 2, then won the next 13 |
I read the links. You keep mentioning Ferguson, he had mid table finishes from 1986 to 1989, how does that equate to a successful start as manager at United, the biggest club in English football? United had Forest in the FA Cup 3rd Round in 1989 and the rumour was if he didn’t win that game he was getting sacked. Then look how it turned, the rest is history. Pochettino at Spurs won only 3 of his first 9 games and then look at the job he achieved at Spurs. Sarri at Chelsea equally had an ‘iffy’ start at Chelsea and Napoli before turning them into Serie A’s second best side behind Juventus at the time. There are examples that address the point you raise, it’s whether you want them to or not?
Edit: Ferguson at United - 1986-87: 11th, 1987-1988: 2nd, 1988-89: 11th, 1989-90: 13th!!!
[Post edited 18 Aug 2021 15:09]
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| Our fan base on 15:05 - Aug 18 with 884 views | _sanctimoanious_ |
| Our fan base on 12:49 - Aug 18 by itfcjoe |
Can we have some examples of managers having slow starts and turning it round? Because often that isn't the case - 99% of the time they've achieved someting quite quickly to get some credit in the bank before maybe having a rockier patch - is certainly the case re Robson here who came in and made an instant impact in retaining out 1st Division status
Ferguson another one who gets cited, he came in when united were 2nd bottom in November, took them to 11th and then finished 2nd the year after.
This isn't to say Cook is going to fail, I think he'll have success - but when a manager has no impact and fails to meet expectations consistently it isn't just a slow start |
TBH I'm sure there are plenty.
'When Hull slumped to sixth consecutive defeats that sealed relegation to League One, there were huge calls for McCann to be sacked. That miserable run coincided with the departure of key players and severe loss of form. Their season hit a new low when Wigan Athletic put eight past them at the DW Stadium.
However, McCann was heavily backed by the board even when Hull endured struggles during this campaign. A poor December which saw the Tigers pick up just four points from five games brought heavy criticism and pressure on the manager. Huge credit to the board for sticking by McCann and he has firmly delivered what was required.' |  | | |
| Our fan base on 15:06 - Aug 18 with 859 views | C_HealyIsAPleasure |
| Our fan base on 15:01 - Aug 18 by Chrisd |
I read the links. You keep mentioning Ferguson, he had mid table finishes from 1986 to 1989, how does that equate to a successful start as manager at United, the biggest club in English football? United had Forest in the FA Cup 3rd Round in 1989 and the rumour was if he didn’t win that game he was getting sacked. Then look how it turned, the rest is history. Pochettino at Spurs won only 3 of his first 9 games and then look at the job he achieved at Spurs. Sarri at Chelsea equally had an ‘iffy’ start at Chelsea and Napoli before turning them into Serie A’s second best side behind Juventus at the time. There are examples that address the point you raise, it’s whether you want them to or not?
Edit: Ferguson at United - 1986-87: 11th, 1987-1988: 2nd, 1988-89: 11th, 1989-90: 13th!!!
[Post edited 18 Aug 2021 15:09]
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United didn’t have mid table finishes from 86-89, they finished 2nd in 87/88, Ferguson’s first full season in charge
Sarri’s ‘iffy’ start at Chelsea saw them win his first 5 games, and go unbeaten in his first 12 in the league
Maybe do some actual research before regurgitating then same non-examples? | |
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| Our fan base on 15:06 - Aug 18 with 877 views | itfcjoe |
| Our fan base on 15:01 - Aug 18 by Chrisd |
I read the links. You keep mentioning Ferguson, he had mid table finishes from 1986 to 1989, how does that equate to a successful start as manager at United, the biggest club in English football? United had Forest in the FA Cup 3rd Round in 1989 and the rumour was if he didn’t win that game he was getting sacked. Then look how it turned, the rest is history. Pochettino at Spurs won only 3 of his first 9 games and then look at the job he achieved at Spurs. Sarri at Chelsea equally had an ‘iffy’ start at Chelsea and Napoli before turning them into Serie A’s second best side behind Juventus at the time. There are examples that address the point you raise, it’s whether you want them to or not?
Edit: Ferguson at United - 1986-87: 11th, 1987-1988: 2nd, 1988-89: 11th, 1989-90: 13th!!!
[Post edited 18 Aug 2021 15:09]
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The Feeguson example is covered - he came in when they were 2nd bottom in November, they finished 11th, they then finished second - ergo he earned a load of credit in the bank. He then burned through that and nearly lost his job
But managers have to get credit in the bank, in the first instance - this is the point.
Look at Lambert here, came in and no bounce to avoid relegation, missing play offs, then given another go - then failed again.
You have to hit some of your short and medium term goals on the pitch if you want to keep your job in the long term, you have to have success to get credit in the bank.
Cook taking us from brink of play offs to where we finished was a failure, he can't afford another one. | |
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| Our fan base on 15:09 - Aug 18 with 855 views | itfcjoe |
| Our fan base on 15:05 - Aug 18 by _sanctimoanious_ |
TBH I'm sure there are plenty.
'When Hull slumped to sixth consecutive defeats that sealed relegation to League One, there were huge calls for McCann to be sacked. That miserable run coincided with the departure of key players and severe loss of form. Their season hit a new low when Wigan Athletic put eight past them at the DW Stadium.
However, McCann was heavily backed by the board even when Hull endured struggles during this campaign. A poor December which saw the Tigers pick up just four points from five games brought heavy criticism and pressure on the manager. Huge credit to the board for sticking by McCann and he has firmly delivered what was required.' |
McCann had had an excellent start, they were in the play offs in January then sold their 2 best players and barely scored a goal from there so a clear mitigating circumstance on that one. | |
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| Our fan base on 15:11 - Aug 18 with 845 views | _sanctimoanious_ |
| Our fan base on 15:09 - Aug 18 by itfcjoe |
McCann had had an excellent start, they were in the play offs in January then sold their 2 best players and barely scored a goal from there so a clear mitigating circumstance on that one. |
fair enough but Cooky does have clear mitigating circumstances too, tbf. | | | |
| Our fan base on 15:16 - Aug 18 with 815 views | itfcjoe |
| Our fan base on 15:11 - Aug 18 by _sanctimoanious_ |
fair enough but Cooky does have clear mitigating circumstances too, tbf. |
I really think his mitigating circumstances are overplayed, most managers take a job on which is far from perfect or wouldn't be a vacancy.
We are in strange times, because no one knows the character of new owners and how much patience they have - Yanks are seen as corporate and ruthless and won't wait....Ashton gave Johnson lots of time at BC......Cook was the incumbent rather than specifically their man.....who knows.
One thing I do know though is that we have backed Cook heavily, we've given him the players he wants, we've given them big 3 or 4 year deals - so it is everyone's best interests for him to get this right.
I just hope if there are things wrong, lots of comments on coaching staff for example, that he has the humility and reflective abaility to make changes beofre it's too late - as really don't want to have to see a manager go and a new one come in and start again | |
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| Our fan base on 15:16 - Aug 18 with 812 views | Chrisd |
| Our fan base on 15:06 - Aug 18 by itfcjoe |
The Feeguson example is covered - he came in when they were 2nd bottom in November, they finished 11th, they then finished second - ergo he earned a load of credit in the bank. He then burned through that and nearly lost his job
But managers have to get credit in the bank, in the first instance - this is the point.
Look at Lambert here, came in and no bounce to avoid relegation, missing play offs, then given another go - then failed again.
You have to hit some of your short and medium term goals on the pitch if you want to keep your job in the long term, you have to have success to get credit in the bank.
Cook taking us from brink of play offs to where we finished was a failure, he can't afford another one. |
What you fail to mention about Ferguson is after his United side finished 2nd in 1987-88, they then finished 11th and 13th in the following seasons!!! They had a really good reason to sack him. Over a 4 season stretch they finished 2nd once and the rest of the time mid table. Credit in the bank? Not too sure he did. He must be thanking Mark Robins winner at the City Ground in the FA Cup, that was the beginning of the change at United.
I do understand what you are saying, but equally Cook has had a huge change of players. Last season doesn’t count for me because they weren’t his players and we weren’t a particularly good side either regardless that we were x amount of points away from the play offs. For me, it’s this season. Yes it’s been hugely disappointing so far, but I’m still prepared to give him the time at least the first 10 league games of this campaign. It could quite possibly be me that ends up with egg in my face, but I do want to give him longer with these group of players to see if he can turn it around. [Post edited 18 Aug 2021 15:21]
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| Our fan base on 15:19 - Aug 18 with 797 views | itfcjoe |
| Our fan base on 15:16 - Aug 18 by Chrisd |
What you fail to mention about Ferguson is after his United side finished 2nd in 1987-88, they then finished 11th and 13th in the following seasons!!! They had a really good reason to sack him. Over a 4 season stretch they finished 2nd once and the rest of the time mid table. Credit in the bank? Not too sure he did. He must be thanking Mark Robins winner at the City Ground in the FA Cup, that was the beginning of the change at United.
I do understand what you are saying, but equally Cook has had a huge change of players. Last season doesn’t count for me because they weren’t his players and we weren’t a particularly good side either regardless that we were x amount of points away from the play offs. For me, it’s this season. Yes it’s been hugely disappointing so far, but I’m still prepared to give him the time at least the first 10 league games of this campaign. It could quite possibly be me that ends up with egg in my face, but I do want to give him longer with these group of players to see if he can turn it around. [Post edited 18 Aug 2021 15:21]
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I don't fail to mention it - it is literally a totally different point to what I made and was replying to:
"Some of the greatest managers in the game had very slow starts at their clubs."
That really isn't the case | |
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| Our fan base on 15:23 - Aug 18 with 780 views | _sanctimoanious_ |
| Our fan base on 15:16 - Aug 18 by itfcjoe |
I really think his mitigating circumstances are overplayed, most managers take a job on which is far from perfect or wouldn't be a vacancy.
We are in strange times, because no one knows the character of new owners and how much patience they have - Yanks are seen as corporate and ruthless and won't wait....Ashton gave Johnson lots of time at BC......Cook was the incumbent rather than specifically their man.....who knows.
One thing I do know though is that we have backed Cook heavily, we've given him the players he wants, we've given them big 3 or 4 year deals - so it is everyone's best interests for him to get this right.
I just hope if there are things wrong, lots of comments on coaching staff for example, that he has the humility and reflective abaility to make changes beofre it's too late - as really don't want to have to see a manager go and a new one come in and start again |
Possibly, but there was an unturnable malaise at the club which was deeply ingrained from the very top. I get why you say Cook wasn't the owners choice but I do think he would have been given the job by them as Appleton was out of reach. He has been backed with the players he wants on long contracts so that's why we need to see the bigger picture and think long term. I think he has two seasons to get us up - IF he at least shows good progress this year.
Agree an experienced assistant would help. | | | |
| Our fan base on 15:28 - Aug 18 with 763 views | Chrisd |
| Our fan base on 15:19 - Aug 18 by itfcjoe |
I don't fail to mention it - it is literally a totally different point to what I made and was replying to:
"Some of the greatest managers in the game had very slow starts at their clubs."
That really isn't the case |
It’s not though. Did Ferguson have a poor start as manager of United? Yes, without doubt. A good second season I’ll acknowledge that, but then two very mediocre ones for their standards. Why would they think he could turn it round with 3 failed seasons out of 4? They had good reason to sack him, that’s probably 120+ games they could judge him on. So he’s a very good example of where managers have turned it round from a poor start and a poor start over a sustained period of time - not 20+ games and 3 or 4 those with a completely different squad of players. | |
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| Our fan base on 15:32 - Aug 18 with 744 views | jayessess |
| Our fan base on 15:16 - Aug 18 by Chrisd |
What you fail to mention about Ferguson is after his United side finished 2nd in 1987-88, they then finished 11th and 13th in the following seasons!!! They had a really good reason to sack him. Over a 4 season stretch they finished 2nd once and the rest of the time mid table. Credit in the bank? Not too sure he did. He must be thanking Mark Robins winner at the City Ground in the FA Cup, that was the beginning of the change at United.
I do understand what you are saying, but equally Cook has had a huge change of players. Last season doesn’t count for me because they weren’t his players and we weren’t a particularly good side either regardless that we were x amount of points away from the play offs. For me, it’s this season. Yes it’s been hugely disappointing so far, but I’m still prepared to give him the time at least the first 10 league games of this campaign. It could quite possibly be me that ends up with egg in my face, but I do want to give him longer with these group of players to see if he can turn it around. [Post edited 18 Aug 2021 15:21]
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That Ferguson survived 2 bad seasons because he had some credit in the bank is literally the point being made though? If this was Cook's 3rd season, and season 1 we'd made the play-offs and season 2 we'd finished 2nd, then he'd have more leeway!
A better point to be made here is just that 3 games is nothing and it's not uncommon at all for teams to start with 3 bad results and go on to have a successful season. On xG you'd expect us to have 5 points rather than 1 and you'd expect that to average out over time more or less. | |
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| Our fans have a glass jaw.... on 15:36 - Aug 18 with 737 views | unstableblue |
... we've lost all confidence in our club and team
Probably quite rightly, given what we've subjected to.
Its a fact that our fans were poor against Morecombe is a fact - funnily they were better against Newport, where there was kind of nothing to lose.
But following a rapturous welcome onto the pitch, but once the team didn't immediatly score and pepper the opposition goal, its slowly dimmed, then they score and we hit the canvas.... out of it. We didn't even really rally after the goal..
Now twitter and alike are awash with huge negativity to Cook, the project, our state.
It will all channel through to the players and atmosphere on Saturday, the MK Dons coaches (ex-Ipswich to boot with a point to prove) will just be chipping the players to go hard and fast first to put us on the back foot - a right hook to our glass jaw and the stand will go silent.
So its down to the players to stand up and the manager to fire up and set-up.
I'm already not confident.
Horrible, horrible, horrible. |  |
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| Our fan base on 15:42 - Aug 18 with 718 views | itfcjoe |
| Our fan base on 15:28 - Aug 18 by Chrisd |
It’s not though. Did Ferguson have a poor start as manager of United? Yes, without doubt. A good second season I’ll acknowledge that, but then two very mediocre ones for their standards. Why would they think he could turn it round with 3 failed seasons out of 4? They had good reason to sack him, that’s probably 120+ games they could judge him on. So he’s a very good example of where managers have turned it round from a poor start and a poor start over a sustained period of time - not 20+ games and 3 or 4 those with a completely different squad of players. |
1st season
Appointed when 21st in league in November - finished 11th
How is that a poor season?!
2nd season finished 2nd
So he had 2 good seasons to start with, he did not have a poor start as United manager he had 50-60 games of really good form to give him credit in the bank | |
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| Our fan base on 15:45 - Aug 18 with 701 views | Chrisd |
| Our fan base on 15:32 - Aug 18 by jayessess |
That Ferguson survived 2 bad seasons because he had some credit in the bank is literally the point being made though? If this was Cook's 3rd season, and season 1 we'd made the play-offs and season 2 we'd finished 2nd, then he'd have more leeway!
A better point to be made here is just that 3 games is nothing and it's not uncommon at all for teams to start with 3 bad results and go on to have a successful season. On xG you'd expect us to have 5 points rather than 1 and you'd expect that to average out over time more or less. |
The credit in the bank is utter BS. Winning the FA Cup in 1990 was the huge thing for Fergie and it saved his job, but it was the league title they dearly wanted, so based on his league campaigns they would’ve been well in their rights to sack him. The board gave him the time, but he needed to get Atkinson’s lads out of the club and change the culture and that took time. I think they hung their hat on the fact he was a successful manager at Aberdeen and in a way I think that’s why I’m prepared to give Cook more time. | |
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