| That mad right winger Boris Johnson is at it again lads 12:54 - Sep 7 with 13494 views | chicoazul |
He’s putting NI contributions up! Will this crazy fascist government never learn??? |  |
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| That mad right winger Boris Johnson is at it again lads on 17:19 - Sep 8 with 1309 views | Darth_Koont |
| That mad right winger Boris Johnson is at it again lads on 17:07 - Sep 8 by chicoazul |
It’s almost as if it’s easier to order small rich societies than small complex highly populated rich ones. |
The UK could do a lot better job of looking after society and its interests. Sweden has 10 million people so it’s hardly a completely different scale. And I’d say the larger Germany has managed it even while coping with the enormous cost and turmoil of Reunification.
But anyway, while I think the UK could and should be much better, at least you’re realising Scotland would currently be better off on its own.  |  |
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| That mad right winger Boris Johnson is at it again lads on 17:24 - Sep 8 with 1293 views | chicoazul |
| That mad right winger Boris Johnson is at it again lads on 17:13 - Sep 8 by Darth_Koont |
Losing streak in the UK over the past few decades, definitely. But the UK is out of step and heading for a crash on its own.
Across humanity there’s been an overall move left since the Enlightenment. The reactionary conservatives are on the real losing streak. |
Surely you can’t believe this argument holds any weight nowadays. India and Russia and China and the Philippines and Brazil for one thing. Authoritarianism is on the rise and significant numbers of people absolutely love it or have no choice but to. I agree conservatism is in retreat. But the Tories are not conservative. | |
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| That mad right winger Boris Johnson is at it again lads on 17:25 - Sep 8 with 1294 views | Swansea_Blue |
| That mad right winger Boris Johnson is at it again lads on 14:21 - Sep 8 by GlasgowBlue |
As per my earlier link, Blair/Brown raised NIC by 1% to give the NHS a boost in 2002 and it was hailed by the left as the most Labour move of the Blair government.
That’s not support for yesterday’s policy btw. Just as 2002 it was a cowardly fudge rather than raising income tax which is seen as political suicide. |
Yep, that's the thing. It would have been political suicide then as much as it is now. Chico's right in a way that those who think we should raise taxes to fund services a bit more will always be on the losing side. It's inevitable given the lobbying and conditioning that's gone on to turn taxation into a dirty word and to almost demonise unions (not that I'm a fan myself, but appreciate their value) and to a degree turn people against public sector workers too (they're lazy, teachers don't really work, etc). |  |
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| That mad right winger Boris Johnson is at it again lads on 17:26 - Sep 8 with 1289 views | chicoazul |
| That mad right winger Boris Johnson is at it again lads on 17:19 - Sep 8 by Darth_Koont |
The UK could do a lot better job of looking after society and its interests. Sweden has 10 million people so it’s hardly a completely different scale. And I’d say the larger Germany has managed it even while coping with the enormous cost and turmoil of Reunification.
But anyway, while I think the UK could and should be much better, at least you’re realising Scotland would currently be better off on its own. |
I certainly know England would be. | |
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| That mad right winger Boris Johnson is at it again lads on 17:29 - Sep 8 with 1278 views | Darth_Koont |
| That mad right winger Boris Johnson is at it again lads on 17:24 - Sep 8 by chicoazul |
Surely you can’t believe this argument holds any weight nowadays. India and Russia and China and the Philippines and Brazil for one thing. Authoritarianism is on the rise and significant numbers of people absolutely love it or have no choice but to. I agree conservatism is in retreat. But the Tories are not conservative. |
These are growing pains of youngish democracies. And all the examples you mention are emerging from much higher levels of authoritarianism anyway.
The genie is out of the bottle. Get used to it. | |
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| That mad right winger Boris Johnson is at it again lads on 17:32 - Sep 8 with 1271 views | Darth_Koont |
| That mad right winger Boris Johnson is at it again lads on 17:26 - Sep 8 by chicoazul |
I certainly know England would be. |
Possibly. Then you’d have a majority largely in favour of the direction of travel. Until they weren’t. | |
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| That mad right winger Boris Johnson is at it again lads on 17:45 - Sep 8 with 1241 views | PassionNotAnger |
| That mad right winger Boris Johnson is at it again lads on 17:32 - Sep 8 by Darth_Koont |
Possibly. Then you’d have a majority largely in favour of the direction of travel. Until they weren’t. |
If it would stop you banging on continuously about how poor the opposition party is it will be a price well worth paying |  | | |
| That mad right winger Boris Johnson is at it again lads on 18:29 - Sep 8 with 1199 views | Dubtractor |
| That mad right winger Boris Johnson is at it again lads on 17:29 - Sep 8 by Darth_Koont |
These are growing pains of youngish democracies. And all the examples you mention are emerging from much higher levels of authoritarianism anyway.
The genie is out of the bottle. Get used to it. |
So as long as you ignore all the largest countries in the world, the right wing of politics is in retreat?
I'm nearer to you than Chico in my politics, but if that's your conclusion from the last 20 years then I'm flabbergasted. |  |
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| That mad right winger Boris Johnson is at it again lads on 19:27 - Sep 8 with 1169 views | chicoazul |
| That mad right winger Boris Johnson is at it again lads on 17:29 - Sep 8 by Darth_Koont |
These are growing pains of youngish democracies. And all the examples you mention are emerging from much higher levels of authoritarianism anyway.
The genie is out of the bottle. Get used to it. |
I’m sorry famalam but did you just call China and Russia democracies | |
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| That mad right winger Boris Johnson is at it again lads on 19:27 - Sep 8 with 1169 views | Darth_Koont |
| That mad right winger Boris Johnson is at it again lads on 18:29 - Sep 8 by Dubtractor |
So as long as you ignore all the largest countries in the world, the right wing of politics is in retreat?
I'm nearer to you than Chico in my politics, but if that's your conclusion from the last 20 years then I'm flabbergasted. |
You don’t think the right wing fight back stronger when they’re on the ropes?
Objectively and across the board the planet is getting more democratic, socially just and aware of itself.
That’s why the UK amongst others is so frustrating. We’re regressing while our influence and world position is diminishing – when we should be embracing this and leading the way. | |
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| That mad right winger Boris Johnson is at it again lads on 19:29 - Sep 8 with 1161 views | Darth_Koont |
| That mad right winger Boris Johnson is at it again lads on 19:27 - Sep 8 by chicoazul |
I’m sorry famalam but did you just call China and Russia democracies |
No, those two are certainly “democracies” but a lot better than they were which is my point. | |
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| That mad right winger Boris Johnson is at it again lads on 19:31 - Sep 8 with 1150 views | chicoazul |
| That mad right winger Boris Johnson is at it again lads on 19:29 - Sep 8 by Darth_Koont |
No, those two are certainly “democracies” but a lot better than they were which is my point. |
You…you really think China is a “democracy” and is a lot better than it was..? Due in part to leftward momentum since the Enlightenment?
I guess it’s true. The Party really does cultivate stooges everywhere. | |
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| That mad right winger Boris Johnson is at it again lads on 19:33 - Sep 8 with 1148 views | Darth_Koont |
| That mad right winger Boris Johnson is at it again lads on 17:45 - Sep 8 by PassionNotAnger |
If it would stop you banging on continuously about how poor the opposition party is it will be a price well worth paying |
I’d love to bang on less about it.
How do you just let it slide? Teach me. | |
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| That mad right winger Boris Johnson is at it again lads on 19:38 - Sep 8 with 1131 views | Darth_Koont |
| That mad right winger Boris Johnson is at it again lads on 19:31 - Sep 8 by chicoazul |
You…you really think China is a “democracy” and is a lot better than it was..? Due in part to leftward momentum since the Enlightenment?
I guess it’s true. The Party really does cultivate stooges everywhere. |
There have always been reactions against progress and knowledge. As I said, I’m talking overall.
But even your examples didn’t show a slide towards authoritarianism.
Think bigger Chico. Think about women, children, minorities, sexualities and other identities around the world and how much more power and rights they have.
Still a long way to go,mind, but it’s relentless. Out with old and in with the new. That in itself explains the need for the old guard with their old traditions and tactics to try and control power. | |
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| That mad right winger Boris Johnson is at it again lads on 19:46 - Sep 8 with 1108 views | chicoazul |
| That mad right winger Boris Johnson is at it again lads on 19:38 - Sep 8 by Darth_Koont |
There have always been reactions against progress and knowledge. As I said, I’m talking overall.
But even your examples didn’t show a slide towards authoritarianism.
Think bigger Chico. Think about women, children, minorities, sexualities and other identities around the world and how much more power and rights they have.
Still a long way to go,mind, but it’s relentless. Out with old and in with the new. That in itself explains the need for the old guard with their old traditions and tactics to try and control power. |
Do you honestly think that the examples I have given are protecting and establishing the rights and powers of the people you mention???! If so I respectfully submit you’re off your rocker pal.
If however you mean in a few countries in enlightened Northern Europe and North America then I agree. | |
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| That mad right winger Boris Johnson is at it again lads on 19:51 - Sep 8 with 1100 views | HARRY10 |
| That mad right winger Boris Johnson is at it again lads on 19:27 - Sep 8 by Darth_Koont |
You don’t think the right wing fight back stronger when they’re on the ropes?
Objectively and across the board the planet is getting more democratic, socially just and aware of itself.
That’s why the UK amongst others is so frustrating. We’re regressing while our influence and world position is diminishing – when we should be embracing this and leading the way. |
One of the causes of a growing rightwing is as a reaction to more tolerance and equality in society in general. It is not too difficult to foster a sense of 'them' taking stuff from you (see Germant 1930s and the Jews)
For the UK it is EU workers taking jobs .... which UK workers are all too often unable to take.
For the US it is the fear that 'non whites' are taking over
Whilst it might be difficult for normal folk to grasp how some are so easily fooled and controlled, it should be seen in the context of some being subjected to decades of subtle propaganda. The EU has consistently been portrayed as a malign force that has attempted to ban Xmas, forced the UK to ban hedgehog flavoured crisps and stop white children from eating conkers.
Any of these absurd claims never stand more than a few seconds of scrutiny, yet are routinely regurgitated by the easily led.
The question which follows, is how much of this is nature and how much nurture.
Why were so many easily able to see through the lies of Johnson, Farage, Rees-Mogg etc and so many were taken in ? | | | |
| That mad right winger Boris Johnson is at it again lads on 19:55 - Sep 8 with 1100 views | Darth_Koont |
| That mad right winger Boris Johnson is at it again lads on 19:46 - Sep 8 by chicoazul |
Do you honestly think that the examples I have given are protecting and establishing the rights and powers of the people you mention???! If so I respectfully submit you’re off your rocker pal.
If however you mean in a few countries in enlightened Northern Europe and North America then I agree. |
Yeah, that’s exactly what I’ve said.
I think you’re mostly trolling yourself right now. | |
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| That mad right winger Boris Johnson is at it again lads on 20:02 - Sep 8 with 1083 views | chicoazul |
| That mad right winger Boris Johnson is at it again lads on 19:55 - Sep 8 by Darth_Koont |
Yeah, that’s exactly what I’ve said.
I think you’re mostly trolling yourself right now. |
Like Dub says you’re carving out some of the biggest countries in the world as they don’t suit your argument | |
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| That mad right winger Boris Johnson is at it again lads on 20:16 - Sep 8 with 1053 views | Darth_Koont |
| That mad right winger Boris Johnson is at it again lads on 20:02 - Sep 8 by chicoazul |
Like Dub says you’re carving out some of the biggest countries in the world as they don’t suit your argument |
And you’re ignoring the historical direction and why it’s the old guard on the international or even national scale that is reacting to this.
The whole of the 20th century was an often traumatic reaction to progress and moving to a more democratic and informed situation. The current stuff is limp in comparison and more about posturing. But it’s the last throes for those basic manipulations around nation, race and religion.
I’m so looking forward to the world my kids and their generation build. We just need to get out of their way. | |
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| That mad right winger Boris Johnson is at it again lads on 20:21 - Sep 8 with 1043 views | Nthsuffolkblue |
| That mad right winger Boris Johnson is at it again lads on 23:17 - Sep 7 by BLUEGOLD |
Make tax dodgers actually pay tax.
Make people like you actually care about those with no arse in their trousers.
Tory boy is back |
This.
He acknowledges the overall tax burden and then persists in going back to the Income Tax figure as if is somehow more important.
I will repeat once again. It is the system that allows the richest in society to avoid paying their fair share that is the problem.
The fair share of those 1% of UK taxpayers who earn something around 13% of the nations earnings is not some percentage of the 10% who pay around 25% of the overall tax burden. That top 10% of taxpayers will also be earning at least 25% of income you can pretty sure. Those who can pay should pay.
I have no desire to stop the elite owning their own private jets/yachts/golf courses and mansions. However, I do not think it fair to expect Fred the cleaner to scratch around for an extra £20 a week just so that those rich people will still vote for the Government.
Tory boy is still a Tory at heart. |  |
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| That mad right winger Boris Johnson is at it again lads on 20:28 - Sep 8 with 1034 views | chicoazul |
| That mad right winger Boris Johnson is at it again lads on 20:16 - Sep 8 by Darth_Koont |
And you’re ignoring the historical direction and why it’s the old guard on the international or even national scale that is reacting to this.
The whole of the 20th century was an often traumatic reaction to progress and moving to a more democratic and informed situation. The current stuff is limp in comparison and more about posturing. But it’s the last throes for those basic manipulations around nation, race and religion.
I’m so looking forward to the world my kids and their generation build. We just need to get out of their way. |
Let’s hope you’re right in future because you’re wrong now since many billions of people all around the world live under backward looking harsh undemocratic authoritarian regimes, despite what you claim about the historical direction of travel and that China and Russia are democratic countries. It’s a very parochial naive view of the world which is surprising from you. | |
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| That mad right winger Boris Johnson is at it again lads on 21:56 - Sep 8 with 981 views | Darth_Koont |
| That mad right winger Boris Johnson is at it again lads on 20:28 - Sep 8 by chicoazul |
Let’s hope you’re right in future because you’re wrong now since many billions of people all around the world live under backward looking harsh undemocratic authoritarian regimes, despite what you claim about the historical direction of travel and that China and Russia are democratic countries. It’s a very parochial naive view of the world which is surprising from you. |
Sigh.
If you carry on like this, you’re going to be an even more grumpy old man than you are now. Look at the data re: democratisation and cheer up.
And rather than your fake moral/ideological crusade, get concerned about the environment instead. | |
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| That mad right winger Boris Johnson is at it again lads on 22:18 - Sep 8 with 953 views | tractordownsouth |
| That mad right winger Boris Johnson is at it again lads on 14:23 - Sep 8 by baxterbasics |
I preferred the May "dementia tax" plan personally. They just made the mistake of announcing it before the election. |
The issue with her plan was that it was a lottery - those who needed care couldn’t pass on as much of their inheritance whilst those who didn’t could pass on a lot more.
At first glance, I like what Andy Burnham proposed yesterday. Having a 10% levy on all estates seems like a fair way of doing things and is less of a lottery than the dementia tax idea (which was still much better than this shambles). Perhaps the tax could be 15% on estates over £1m to make it more progressive but the general idea is one I support.
It’s difficult because the emotional attachment for parents to pass stuff on to their kids trumps rational thinking on this issue in many cases. I’ve seen examples on social media of middle aged and OAPs stating how they’ve worked hard for their homes so should be able to pass on to their kids, and that millennials who can’t afford homes should work harder and cut down on takeaways. To which the obvious response is why do their family need inheritance if getting on the housing ladder only requires a bit of hard work?
Nobody’s denying that boomers have worked hard but my generation will have to work all our lives too, with the added obstacles of spiralling housing costs, a Brexit we didn’t vote for and now this NI hike on top. Social care wasn’t part of the post war settlement so it seems logical for the elderly to pay most of the cost and then my generation will pay it when it’s our turn in 40/50 years. At the very least it should be equal among the generations. [Post edited 8 Sep 2021 22:22]
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| That mad right winger Boris Johnson is at it again lads on 22:32 - Sep 8 with 941 views | GlasgowBlue |
| That mad right winger Boris Johnson is at it again lads on 20:21 - Sep 8 by Nthsuffolkblue |
This.
He acknowledges the overall tax burden and then persists in going back to the Income Tax figure as if is somehow more important.
I will repeat once again. It is the system that allows the richest in society to avoid paying their fair share that is the problem.
The fair share of those 1% of UK taxpayers who earn something around 13% of the nations earnings is not some percentage of the 10% who pay around 25% of the overall tax burden. That top 10% of taxpayers will also be earning at least 25% of income you can pretty sure. Those who can pay should pay.
I have no desire to stop the elite owning their own private jets/yachts/golf courses and mansions. However, I do not think it fair to expect Fred the cleaner to scratch around for an extra £20 a week just so that those rich people will still vote for the Government.
Tory boy is still a Tory at heart. |
I voted Labour at the last election I was entitled to vote in. Another edit for you to cover up your embarrassment like your JVCI post. |  |
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| That mad right winger Boris Johnson is at it again lads on 22:56 - Sep 8 with 908 views | BanksterDebtSlave |
| That mad right winger Boris Johnson is at it again lads on 22:18 - Sep 8 by tractordownsouth |
The issue with her plan was that it was a lottery - those who needed care couldn’t pass on as much of their inheritance whilst those who didn’t could pass on a lot more.
At first glance, I like what Andy Burnham proposed yesterday. Having a 10% levy on all estates seems like a fair way of doing things and is less of a lottery than the dementia tax idea (which was still much better than this shambles). Perhaps the tax could be 15% on estates over £1m to make it more progressive but the general idea is one I support.
It’s difficult because the emotional attachment for parents to pass stuff on to their kids trumps rational thinking on this issue in many cases. I’ve seen examples on social media of middle aged and OAPs stating how they’ve worked hard for their homes so should be able to pass on to their kids, and that millennials who can’t afford homes should work harder and cut down on takeaways. To which the obvious response is why do their family need inheritance if getting on the housing ladder only requires a bit of hard work?
Nobody’s denying that boomers have worked hard but my generation will have to work all our lives too, with the added obstacles of spiralling housing costs, a Brexit we didn’t vote for and now this NI hike on top. Social care wasn’t part of the post war settlement so it seems logical for the elderly to pay most of the cost and then my generation will pay it when it’s our turn in 40/50 years. At the very least it should be equal among the generations. [Post edited 8 Sep 2021 22:22]
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Stop being so nice about boomers...a largely odious, self serving, self centred mob, fed on free further education and then sucking at the nipple of the property owning bubble unleashed by Thatcher and preaching about living within your means to those trailing in their wake. |  |
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