| Hope everyone is ready 08:06 - Sep 27 with 8837 views | chicoazul |
…for the rolling blackouts, meat rationing, bins collected once a month, fuel shortages, price inflation, and materials shortages of the next 7 months.
Never mind petrol; start panic buying warm blankets.
Still at least Greta will be happy. |  |
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| Hope everyone is ready on 19:50 - Sep 27 with 900 views | monytowbray |
| Hope everyone is ready on 19:44 - Sep 27 by jonbull88 |
It is IF produced locally. That is the point! To produce the amount of plant based food we would need to cover large areas of the uk in similar pollytunnels, would you be happy with that? |
Provide evidence of this… |  |
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| Hope everyone is ready on 19:53 - Sep 27 with 891 views | monytowbray |
You’re localish ain’t ya? When you coming over (on yer bike) for a smoke, dinner and some Adam Curtis?! | |
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| Hope everyone is ready on 19:53 - Sep 27 with 892 views | Bluedicea |
| Hope everyone is ready on 19:33 - Sep 27 by monytowbray |
I’d say that’s pretty sustainable and as a vegan I couldn’t fault it.
Not for me though, I’m well over meat and dairy. Literally flogging a dead horse for me. |
The problem with veganism, is it's not really safe for most people on it's own, which is a shame.
Vegans need to take certain supplements to make up for deficiencies in their diet, and as everyone needs different amounts of nutrients every day, the only way to ensure that is by having a balanced diet, unless you have regular blood tests to check what your body is deficient in.
It terrible for kids too, affecting their development, so much so many governments around the world are looking into ways to possibly ban it for kids despitenot wanting to intervene in family lifestyles, so they can ensure the children stay healthy and aren't disadvantaged.
https://www.ucl.ac.uk/child-health/news/2021/jun/vegan-diets-children-may-bring- |  |
| What is the use of knowing about everything else, when you do not yet know who you are. |
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| Hope everyone is ready on 19:55 - Sep 27 with 888 views | bazza |
| Hope everyone is ready on 19:43 - Sep 27 by Herbivore |
I'm well up for full scale re-wilding, including reintroducing wolves. That would reduce the need for culling deer. We've destroyed so many ecosystems, we need to start reintroducing and nurturing them, try to bring the planet back into some semblance of balance. It is only livestock farmers that really object to this because reintroducing wolves would be a threat to their animals. |
Only thing that would balance things back in to nature’s favour would be another asteroid.. |  | | |
| Hope everyone is ready on 19:55 - Sep 27 with 886 views | BanksterDebtSlave |
| Hope everyone is ready on 19:10 - Sep 27 by Herbivore |
From a purely eco point of view probably the local game but if you've ever seen Bambi I'm not sure how you can sleep at night. |
My late 80's spell as a vegan was ended during a Winter on a horse drawn travellers site when my dog and some others came back after a meat eaters' venture with a deer...I ate only a small amount and after years of not eating that texture it was my last flirt with meat too.
To add to the surrealism of it all the only vehicle on site suitable for butchering and hanging was an old post office EA van belonging to a French vegan! Twtd. |  |
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| Hope everyone is ready on 19:57 - Sep 27 with 880 views | The_Last_Baron |
| Hope everyone is ready on 08:11 - Sep 27 by Herbivore |
Meat rationing should have started years ago. Current levels of meat consumption are killing the planet. |
The views of a man who lives life to the full. |  |
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| Hope everyone is ready on 19:58 - Sep 27 with 879 views | Herbivore |
| Hope everyone is ready on 19:44 - Sep 27 by jonbull88 |
It is IF produced locally. That is the point! To produce the amount of plant based food we would need to cover large areas of the uk in similar pollytunnels, would you be happy with that? |
It's sustainable regardless. The carbon footprint for food imported in shipping containers and then distributed in the UK is relatively small and it likely to get smaller with the advances in electric transport technology. |  |
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| Hope everyone is ready on 20:01 - Sep 27 with 869 views | monytowbray |
| Hope everyone is ready on 19:53 - Sep 27 by Bluedicea |
The problem with veganism, is it's not really safe for most people on it's own, which is a shame.
Vegans need to take certain supplements to make up for deficiencies in their diet, and as everyone needs different amounts of nutrients every day, the only way to ensure that is by having a balanced diet, unless you have regular blood tests to check what your body is deficient in.
It terrible for kids too, affecting their development, so much so many governments around the world are looking into ways to possibly ban it for kids despitenot wanting to intervene in family lifestyles, so they can ensure the children stay healthy and aren't disadvantaged.
https://www.ucl.ac.uk/child-health/news/2021/jun/vegan-diets-children-may-bring- |
I know plenty of vegans since birth who are fine. We’re at a generational point where they do exist.
My friend has a kid who is around 4-5 now and she has the widest pallet for food I’ve ever seen for a kid (most are fussy). She eats a metric s**t-ton of veg too. Last time I checked the government hadn’t launched a 5-a-day chicken nugget campaign.
Sorry but the health side of things is the large ditch of a dying industry to keep you on board.
On the supplements front, most the population has a vitamin deficiency of sorts, that’s nothing to fo with ethical choice and more to do with food education. I don’t take supplements for years and I’m fine. So is every other vegan I know.
The press love to jump on a good “I went vegan and nearly died” story from personal conclusion and no evidence, yet seem to skip the fact most vegans don’t. | |
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| Hope everyone is ready on 20:02 - Sep 27 with 862 views | monytowbray |
| Hope everyone is ready on 19:57 - Sep 27 by The_Last_Baron |
The views of a man who lives life to the full. |
I forgot eating meat made people interesting and fun.
Oh wait… | |
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| Hope everyone is ready on 20:03 - Sep 27 with 862 views | jonbull88 |
| Hope everyone is ready on 19:50 - Sep 27 by monytowbray |
Provide evidence of this… |
The latest figures we talk about in the job is the uk is 18% sufficient in fruit, 55% in veg and overall about 60% for all food products. All these are easily researched. We were up near 80% in the 80s but we had 10m less population back then. Truth of the matter is food is far too cheap. For me to really help the world we need to reduce meat consumption whilst eating more locally sourced, seasonal produce |  | | |
| Hope everyone is ready on 20:03 - Sep 27 with 861 views | Herbivore |
| Hope everyone is ready on 19:53 - Sep 27 by Bluedicea |
The problem with veganism, is it's not really safe for most people on it's own, which is a shame.
Vegans need to take certain supplements to make up for deficiencies in their diet, and as everyone needs different amounts of nutrients every day, the only way to ensure that is by having a balanced diet, unless you have regular blood tests to check what your body is deficient in.
It terrible for kids too, affecting their development, so much so many governments around the world are looking into ways to possibly ban it for kids despitenot wanting to intervene in family lifestyles, so they can ensure the children stay healthy and aren't disadvantaged.
https://www.ucl.ac.uk/child-health/news/2021/jun/vegan-diets-children-may-bring- |
That study says nothing about banning kids being vegan and presents a mixed picture in terms of health benefits and risks. The risks can easily be overcome with ensuring that children take Vitamin D and B12 supplements.
I'm vegan and I don't take any supplements and have been in good health for years. The idea that veganism is not safe is a nonsense. | |
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| Hope everyone is ready on 20:06 - Sep 27 with 855 views | Herbivore |
| Hope everyone is ready on 19:57 - Sep 27 by The_Last_Baron |
The views of a man who lives life to the full. |
The views of a man who would rather we stopped killing the planet, actually. | |
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| Hope everyone is ready on 20:07 - Sep 27 with 847 views | monytowbray |
| Hope everyone is ready on 20:03 - Sep 27 by jonbull88 |
The latest figures we talk about in the job is the uk is 18% sufficient in fruit, 55% in veg and overall about 60% for all food products. All these are easily researched. We were up near 80% in the 80s but we had 10m less population back then. Truth of the matter is food is far too cheap. For me to really help the world we need to reduce meat consumption whilst eating more locally sourced, seasonal produce |
That’s a completely different thing. You said the UK would be covered in polytunnels.
Again, provide evidence of this…
You can try or I can save you time if you admit you can’t, and explain why you’re wrong.
Then again if you actually bothered reading you can see your point disproven multiple times on previous pages so why bother? | |
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| Hope everyone is ready on 20:13 - Sep 27 with 828 views | Bluedicea |
| Hope everyone is ready on 20:03 - Sep 27 by Herbivore |
That study says nothing about banning kids being vegan and presents a mixed picture in terms of health benefits and risks. The risks can easily be overcome with ensuring that children take Vitamin D and B12 supplements.
I'm vegan and I don't take any supplements and have been in good health for years. The idea that veganism is not safe is a nonsense. |
I have nothing against veganism.
It was something I looked into, but unfortunately for my wife and myself it wouldn't be a healthy option, unless we take lots of supplements.
I know the UK it is under discussion from the medical bodies,but they are dealing with covid still so it's on the back burner as far as I know.
Italy and Belgium it's a criminal offense to force your child to be vegan.
https://www.google.co.uk/amp/s/www.independent.co.uk/news/world/europe/italy-veg
https://www.google.co.uk/amp/s/qz.com/1622642/making-your-kids-go-vegan-can-mean [Post edited 27 Sep 2021 20:14]
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| What is the use of knowing about everything else, when you do not yet know who you are. |
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| Hope everyone is ready on 20:15 - Sep 27 with 820 views | The_Last_Baron |
I'll do a deal with you men. If you want to go meatless I'll support you 100%. However for those of those who are carnivores, get your nose out of our business and we will get along fine. | |
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| Hope everyone is ready on 20:17 - Sep 27 with 810 views | Herbivore |
Neither of those articles show veganism being banned if you actually read them, they are proposals/opinions being offered by individuals or organisations. There are plenty of kids eating omnivorous diets who are malnourished in the UK. This strikes me as something of a non-issue. And in any case, why would taking supplements mean you can't be vegan? I'm not following the logic. If there are vitamins or nutrients you feel you wouldn't be able to get through your diet then what's the issue with taking a supplement? | |
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| Hope everyone is ready on 20:21 - Sep 27 with 787 views | monytowbray |
| Hope everyone is ready on 20:15 - Sep 27 by The_Last_Baron |
I'll do a deal with you men. If you want to go meatless I'll support you 100%. However for those of those who are carnivores, get your nose out of our business and we will get along fine. |
The business of innocent animals is all our business.
So no. | |
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| Hope everyone is ready on 20:25 - Sep 27 with 781 views | Herbivore |
| Hope everyone is ready on 20:15 - Sep 27 by The_Last_Baron |
I'll do a deal with you men. If you want to go meatless I'll support you 100%. However for those of those who are carnivores, get your nose out of our business and we will get along fine. |
You're not a carnivore and I won't be doing any deals with you. All I've done on this thread is present some facts about how ruinous for the environment meat and dairy consumption is. If that makes you feel uncomfortable you might want to reflect on why that is. | |
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| Hope everyone is ready on 20:25 - Sep 27 with 779 views | jonbull88 |
| Hope everyone is ready on 20:07 - Sep 27 by monytowbray |
That’s a completely different thing. You said the UK would be covered in polytunnels.
Again, provide evidence of this…
You can try or I can save you time if you admit you can’t, and explain why you’re wrong.
Then again if you actually bothered reading you can see your point disproven multiple times on previous pages so why bother? |
To produce enough food to make us truly self sufficient we’d have to step up our growing capacity. Also certain foods don’t grow unless in certain conditions, something pollytunnels or glass houses provide.
I appreciate you don’t eat meat, but you must see that it’s a bit double standard to say that eating a grass fed cow from within 15 miles is killing the world yet eating an apple flown in from New Zealand is ok. | | | |
| Hope everyone is ready on 20:27 - Sep 27 with 772 views | bazza |
| Hope everyone is ready on 20:25 - Sep 27 by Herbivore |
You're not a carnivore and I won't be doing any deals with you. All I've done on this thread is present some facts about how ruinous for the environment meat and dairy consumption is. If that makes you feel uncomfortable you might want to reflect on why that is. |
Yea, but medium rare rib eye tho … | | | |
| Hope everyone is ready on 20:28 - Sep 27 with 770 views | Herbivore |
| Hope everyone is ready on 20:25 - Sep 27 by jonbull88 |
To produce enough food to make us truly self sufficient we’d have to step up our growing capacity. Also certain foods don’t grow unless in certain conditions, something pollytunnels or glass houses provide.
I appreciate you don’t eat meat, but you must see that it’s a bit double standard to say that eating a grass fed cow from within 15 miles is killing the world yet eating an apple flown in from New Zealand is ok. |
In terms of the overall carbon footprint the apple from New Zealand is still way, way better than the local cow. The data is all readily available. Plant based diets are far more environmentally friendly even with pricing in the need to import much of it. | |
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| Hope everyone is ready on 20:29 - Sep 27 with 766 views | monytowbray |
| Hope everyone is ready on 20:25 - Sep 27 by jonbull88 |
To produce enough food to make us truly self sufficient we’d have to step up our growing capacity. Also certain foods don’t grow unless in certain conditions, something pollytunnels or glass houses provide.
I appreciate you don’t eat meat, but you must see that it’s a bit double standard to say that eating a grass fed cow from within 15 miles is killing the world yet eating an apple flown in from New Zealand is ok. |
Okay, let me explain (again)…
We already have the growing capacity to feed the world a plant diet multiple times over. Much of that crop goes on feeding animals for a lower food yield and more land usage from the animals.
Data shows that if we all went vegan tomorrow we’d actually use less land for food than we do now.
https://ourworldindata.org/land-use-diets
Glad I could help. | |
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| Hope everyone is ready on 20:30 - Sep 27 with 761 views | monytowbray |
| Hope everyone is ready on 20:28 - Sep 27 by Herbivore |
In terms of the overall carbon footprint the apple from New Zealand is still way, way better than the local cow. The data is all readily available. Plant based diets are far more environmentally friendly even with pricing in the need to import much of it. |
Also most decent vegans are equally already well aware of their carbon footprint and still try do to better.
The myth we all eat avocados and pat ourselves on the back needs to get in the bin. | |
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| Hope everyone is ready on 20:31 - Sep 27 with 758 views | Bluedicea |
| Hope everyone is ready on 20:17 - Sep 27 by Herbivore |
Neither of those articles show veganism being banned if you actually read them, they are proposals/opinions being offered by individuals or organisations. There are plenty of kids eating omnivorous diets who are malnourished in the UK. This strikes me as something of a non-issue. And in any case, why would taking supplements mean you can't be vegan? I'm not following the logic. If there are vitamins or nutrients you feel you wouldn't be able to get through your diet then what's the issue with taking a supplement? |
As the articles state if the child has regular tests and is given the supplements it's fine. But considering how stretched health services are, and parents ability to disregard what doctors and 'the man' says as oblivious because they know best.
Even you should see that as a potential future health time bomb there. How many vegans will willingly walk or bike to their doctor once a month for a test as they feel ok so nothing can be wrong......
As I said nothing against the proper vegan lifestyle, no car, no leather or wool, no plastic products, only living off the land. It greatly appeals to me, so I try to include as much of that in my life as I can, yet medically I need to eat some animal products, so I do.
I just believe in being open and honest. Being a vegan isn't good for everyone, it has a lot of benefits, yet also has some problems. And deliberately ignoring that is wrong in my book.
There's good in every bad and bad in every good. | |
| What is the use of knowing about everything else, when you do not yet know who you are. |
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| Hope everyone is ready on 20:42 - Sep 27 with 723 views | Darth_Koont |
| Hope everyone is ready on 20:25 - Sep 27 by jonbull88 |
To produce enough food to make us truly self sufficient we’d have to step up our growing capacity. Also certain foods don’t grow unless in certain conditions, something pollytunnels or glass houses provide.
I appreciate you don’t eat meat, but you must see that it’s a bit double standard to say that eating a grass fed cow from within 15 miles is killing the world yet eating an apple flown in from New Zealand is ok. |
Local, organic and free range doesn’t mean sustainable when it comes to most meat and dairy products. And transport is surprisingly negligible overall.
With certain foods, beef being easily the worst, it’s the excessive energy and emissions you put in for the relatively few calories you get out that’s the big problem.
You get the same calories, but some meal choices are the equivalent of turning on your oven, opening the door and just heating the air for a day. That’s the sort of bill with nature we’re racking up. |  |
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