| Everyone who has gone Cook Out has boxed themselves into a corner 14:26 - Oct 18 with 19669 views | MaySixth |
when we do win a game under Cook there can be no bandwagon jumping or changing their minds
no coming back now though for those who have nailed their colours to the mast
[Post edited 18 Oct 2021 14:27]
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| Everyone who has gone Cook Out has boxed themselves into a corner on 10:27 - Oct 20 with 1520 views | Herbivore |
| Everyone who has gone Cook Out has boxed themselves into a corner on 10:25 - Oct 20 by TooManyCooks |
Ok, I get what you're saying, so the idea is that we are better off financially, as a club, than a lot of the other teams in the division. I don't know that for certain as I have no view of other clubs finances, but it doesn't seem an unreasonable suggestion on the face of it. I'm still not sure whether the fact we have better backing enables us to wangle more cash into wages as the limit is based on Turnover, which you'd think is a difficult number to "fudge", but again, I don't really know and nothing would surprise me on the creative accounting front where football clubs are concerned. |
As I said, fees coming in count as turnover so we had a £3m or so boost to our turnover. That's why people are saying if we don't go up this season it'll likely be a summer of upheaval as we'll have to generate transfer revenue to create enough turnover to keep within wage spending rules next season. I genuinely don't know how anyone can look at the business we've done this summer though relative to every other side at this level and not conclude that we've invested heavily relative to the division we're in. |  |
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| Everyone who has gone Cook Out has boxed themselves into a corner on 10:35 - Oct 20 with 1501 views | The_Flashing_Smile |
| Everyone who has gone Cook Out has boxed themselves into a corner on 06:23 - Oct 20 by Keaneish |
On the flip side some fail to see progression or when certain things are happening on the pitch to be able to spot when a corner might be turned or when it might improve. Doncaster was a turning point, no doubt about it and I said at the time there was something different in the air that night (without sounding like Phil Collins); last night was yet another milestone and everyone at Fratton felt it.
The main point is that patience and a collective understanding of how easily things can turn to our advantage have been missing for too long. We will lose some more games but we have most definitely clicked now, and I’ll say what I’ve been saying for a long time, Cook is and was the right appointment and this club is back on the way up. If some want to wait for their own personal mini milestones to be achieved to be able to say that then fair enough. |
I don't think it's as simple and definite as a corner being turned, I think it's more of a gradual thing than that. I'm not sure we've totally clicked yet, but the upturn in results generally suggests the players are gaining a better understanding of Cook's tactics and each other. |  |
| Trust the process. Trust Phil. |
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| Everyone who has gone Cook Out has boxed themselves into a corner on 10:36 - Oct 20 with 1500 views | positivity |
| Everyone who has gone Cook Out has boxed themselves into a corner on 10:35 - Oct 20 by The_Flashing_Smile |
I don't think it's as simple and definite as a corner being turned, I think it's more of a gradual thing than that. I'm not sure we've totally clicked yet, but the upturn in results generally suggests the players are gaining a better understanding of Cook's tactics and each other. |
and you can add gaining fitness to that, so many didn't have a proper pre-season |  |
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| Everyone who has gone Cook Out has boxed themselves into a corner on 10:40 - Oct 20 with 1494 views | The_Flashing_Smile |
| Everyone who has gone Cook Out has boxed themselves into a corner on 07:40 - Oct 20 by portmanking |
This. With bells on.
I'd argue the last 20 years have actually meant our fanbase are less patient than ever before. Every defeat is microanalysed to the inch of its life. Why certain fans simply cannot get on board with the project and accept it was never going to be an overnight process beggars belief.
Why can't we just enjoy growing as a team and club again? We'd all like to be winning week in, week out, but there are so many variables involved with rebuilding a squad and club. As various players have intimated in press interviews of late, many have had their own personal issues/battles off the field to contend with too. It's not always so black and white. Just stick with them. Don't be part of the Sky Sports generation. |
Excellent post. | |
| Trust the process. Trust Phil. |
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| Everyone who has gone Cook Out has boxed themselves into a corner on 10:44 - Oct 20 with 1482 views | TooManyCooks |
| Everyone who has gone Cook Out has boxed themselves into a corner on 10:27 - Oct 20 by Herbivore |
As I said, fees coming in count as turnover so we had a £3m or so boost to our turnover. That's why people are saying if we don't go up this season it'll likely be a summer of upheaval as we'll have to generate transfer revenue to create enough turnover to keep within wage spending rules next season. I genuinely don't know how anyone can look at the business we've done this summer though relative to every other side at this level and not conclude that we've invested heavily relative to the division we're in. |
We've done very well to put together the squad we have tbf, hats off to Ashton and Cook there. Pretty amazing what you can achieve in this league from the sale of just 2 young and relatively unproven players. The wealth divide on display even at this level is not a good omen for the sport moving forward.
Is there anybody that would say that we've not invested a decent sum relative to other teams in the division? I think that's a fair shout, let's hope we get up this season and don't have to worry about wages. | |
| hedgehog flavoured cucumbers |
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| Everyone who has gone Cook Out has boxed themselves into a corner on 10:51 - Oct 20 with 1457 views | The_Flashing_Smile |
| Everyone who has gone Cook Out has boxed themselves into a corner on 08:50 - Oct 20 by Herbivore |
We're 6th in the form table. Remaining 6th in the form table for the rest of the season may or may not see us squeak into 6th place, our early season form means we're playing catch up. That would still be a disappointing season given what we spent in the summer and that the aim was to be challenging for automatic promotion. We are still a way off where we want to be and whilst last night looks like progress the three performances that prfceded it very much didn't. Let's see if we can string together a run of better performances and better results. That's what we all want to see. And the notion that it's fine to start the season badly because we started the last two seasons well and then faded is ridiculous. |
He's not saying that, he's saying the start isn't necessarily an indicator to the rest of the season. | |
| Trust the process. Trust Phil. |
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| Everyone who has gone Cook Out has boxed themselves into a corner on 11:34 - Oct 20 with 1415 views | OsborneOneNil |
| Everyone who has gone Cook Out has boxed themselves into a corner on 07:40 - Oct 20 by portmanking |
This. With bells on.
I'd argue the last 20 years have actually meant our fanbase are less patient than ever before. Every defeat is microanalysed to the inch of its life. Why certain fans simply cannot get on board with the project and accept it was never going to be an overnight process beggars belief.
Why can't we just enjoy growing as a team and club again? We'd all like to be winning week in, week out, but there are so many variables involved with rebuilding a squad and club. As various players have intimated in press interviews of late, many have had their own personal issues/battles off the field to contend with too. It's not always so black and white. Just stick with them. Don't be part of the Sky Sports generation. |
Great post, exactly right, well said. |  | | |
| Everyone who has gone Cook Out has boxed themselves into a corner on 11:36 - Oct 20 with 1409 views | OsborneOneNil |
| Everyone who has gone Cook Out has boxed themselves into a corner on 09:10 - Oct 20 by Herbivore |
Why are you telling me to give it time? I've not called for Cook to be sacked. But we need to put a genuine run together quickly. Teams that start as poorly as us rarely go on to win promotion. You will point to Blackpool I'm sure but the vast majority of sides that go up are top half or top 8 at least at this stage of the season 9 times out of 10. That doesn't mean we can't still get promoted, although automatic looks out of reach already, but it needs a run of promotion form for us to get there and that needs to start ASAP. We can't afford much more of the season to pass with us not able to win games back to back. And I disagree that Cambridge wasn't bad, we threw away a two goal lead and lost control of the game in the final quarter. That is bad and the sort of performance we can't afford too often. Same goes for the Accrington game. The Shrewsbury game wasn't loads better either performance wise. We've got to string performances and results together if we don't want to write off yet another season in League 1. Last night was encouraging but we've got to back it up. And Cook has been here 8 months now, it's not like people are getting on his back after 3 games. |
‘Last night was encouraging’.
We won 4-0 away at Portsmouth……the gradual improvement over the past 7-10 games is clear to see, no?
Lolzzzzzz….you crack me up. | | | |
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| Everyone who has gone Cook Out has boxed themselves into a corner on 11:41 - Oct 20 with 1395 views | The_Flashing_Smile |
| Everyone who has gone Cook Out has boxed themselves into a corner on 09:10 - Oct 20 by Herbivore |
Why are you telling me to give it time? I've not called for Cook to be sacked. But we need to put a genuine run together quickly. Teams that start as poorly as us rarely go on to win promotion. You will point to Blackpool I'm sure but the vast majority of sides that go up are top half or top 8 at least at this stage of the season 9 times out of 10. That doesn't mean we can't still get promoted, although automatic looks out of reach already, but it needs a run of promotion form for us to get there and that needs to start ASAP. We can't afford much more of the season to pass with us not able to win games back to back. And I disagree that Cambridge wasn't bad, we threw away a two goal lead and lost control of the game in the final quarter. That is bad and the sort of performance we can't afford too often. Same goes for the Accrington game. The Shrewsbury game wasn't loads better either performance wise. We've got to string performances and results together if we don't want to write off yet another season in League 1. Last night was encouraging but we've got to back it up. And Cook has been here 8 months now, it's not like people are getting on his back after 3 games. |
We're one place and one point off "top half". | |
| Trust the process. Trust Phil. |
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| Everyone who has gone Cook Out has boxed themselves into a corner on 11:44 - Oct 20 with 1385 views | Herbivore |
| Everyone who has gone Cook Out has boxed themselves into a corner on 11:36 - Oct 20 by OsborneOneNil |
‘Last night was encouraging’.
We won 4-0 away at Portsmouth……the gradual improvement over the past 7-10 games is clear to see, no?
Lolzzzzzz….you crack me up. |
Pompey are bottom 4 in the form table. It was a good win but we didn't go to a Pompey side flying high, they've been in worse form than us. It's good to get a big win but we will also need to eek out spawny wins in games as well, like the ones at Cambridge and Accrington where we failed to win. The improvements remain patchy, that's why we've still not won back to back games. Prior to last night there'd not been too much evidence of improvement in our previous three games. Let's see what happens in the coming fixtures. Back to back wins would be most welcome at this point. | |
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| Everyone who has gone Cook Out has boxed themselves into a corner on 11:52 - Oct 20 with 1375 views | The_Flashing_Smile |
| Everyone who has gone Cook Out has boxed themselves into a corner on 11:44 - Oct 20 by Herbivore |
Pompey are bottom 4 in the form table. It was a good win but we didn't go to a Pompey side flying high, they've been in worse form than us. It's good to get a big win but we will also need to eek out spawny wins in games as well, like the ones at Cambridge and Accrington where we failed to win. The improvements remain patchy, that's why we've still not won back to back games. Prior to last night there'd not been too much evidence of improvement in our previous three games. Let's see what happens in the coming fixtures. Back to back wins would be most welcome at this point. |
As I've said elsewhere, before the game I judged last night as a tough one and certainly not one many thought ought to be an easy win. I think it's unfair to temper wins with "well they're not very good" generally as you can only beat what's in front of you and also there's the point that your own team's performance can make the opposition poor. Whilst Pompey may be bottom 4 in the form table, their home form before last night was pretty good.
I haven't looked at the prediction league but I suspect there were very few 0-4's for last night. Let's have less of this "yeah but they were rubbish" after the event and more appreciation for what was a very professional, and indeed ruthless, job. Whilst also hoping for more to come. | |
| Trust the process. Trust Phil. |
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| Everyone who has gone Cook Out has boxed themselves into a corner on 11:56 - Oct 20 with 1364 views | OsborneOneNil |
| Everyone who has gone Cook Out has boxed themselves into a corner on 11:44 - Oct 20 by Herbivore |
Pompey are bottom 4 in the form table. It was a good win but we didn't go to a Pompey side flying high, they've been in worse form than us. It's good to get a big win but we will also need to eek out spawny wins in games as well, like the ones at Cambridge and Accrington where we failed to win. The improvements remain patchy, that's why we've still not won back to back games. Prior to last night there'd not been too much evidence of improvement in our previous three games. Let's see what happens in the coming fixtures. Back to back wins would be most welcome at this point. |
Ok, but then they smashed high flying Sunderland 4-0 in their last home game.
It’s a tough gig, Pompey away, and last night is a cracking result. Not just the result, but the performance too. | | | |
| Everyone who has gone Cook Out has boxed themselves into a corner on 12:02 - Oct 20 with 1355 views | jayessess |
| Everyone who has gone Cook Out has boxed themselves into a corner on 11:52 - Oct 20 by The_Flashing_Smile |
As I've said elsewhere, before the game I judged last night as a tough one and certainly not one many thought ought to be an easy win. I think it's unfair to temper wins with "well they're not very good" generally as you can only beat what's in front of you and also there's the point that your own team's performance can make the opposition poor. Whilst Pompey may be bottom 4 in the form table, their home form before last night was pretty good.
I haven't looked at the prediction league but I suspect there were very few 0-4's for last night. Let's have less of this "yeah but they were rubbish" after the event and more appreciation for what was a very professional, and indeed ruthless, job. Whilst also hoping for more to come. |
Yeah, I'm not sure why we need the contortions around Pompey's quality. They were 12th at kick-off and on paper a tricky game to negotiate, especially given our away form and our record against top half sides (2 points from 5 games). Every team looks rubbish when you're busy battering them!
Last night was genuine progress, the high point of Cook's tenure so far. |  |
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| Everyone who has gone Cook Out has boxed themselves into a corner on 12:26 - Oct 20 with 1336 views | Herbivore |
| Everyone who has gone Cook Out has boxed themselves into a corner on 11:56 - Oct 20 by OsborneOneNil |
Ok, but then they smashed high flying Sunderland 4-0 in their last home game.
It’s a tough gig, Pompey away, and last night is a cracking result. Not just the result, but the performance too. |
It was a good win and a good performance, especially second half. I've said so in a number of threads. We now need to back it up with more wins and not do what we did after smashing Donny and put in a few mediocre to poor performances. | |
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| Everyone who has gone Cook Out has boxed themselves into a corner on 12:48 - Oct 20 with 1309 views | Geomorph |
| Everyone who has gone Cook Out has boxed themselves into a corner on 11:44 - Oct 20 by Herbivore |
Pompey are bottom 4 in the form table. It was a good win but we didn't go to a Pompey side flying high, they've been in worse form than us. It's good to get a big win but we will also need to eek out spawny wins in games as well, like the ones at Cambridge and Accrington where we failed to win. The improvements remain patchy, that's why we've still not won back to back games. Prior to last night there'd not been too much evidence of improvement in our previous three games. Let's see what happens in the coming fixtures. Back to back wins would be most welcome at this point. |
You've gone from 1) 3 poor performances after Donny to 2) need to eek out some spawny wins. I'm assuming you therefore feel we played crap against Shrewsbury - is that not eeking out a spawny win? Lincoln perhaps similar...
I've only seen a couple of games - Morecambe and the Accrington debacle - but generally it looks like the big issue we had was developing a semblance of defensive organisation so that we stop looking like conceding every time we lose the ball. It is looking like that process is under way - not sorted - but in progress.
Oil tankers take time to turn... |  | | |
| Everyone who has gone Cook Out has boxed themselves into a corner on 12:48 - Oct 20 with 1309 views | J2BLUE |
People were/are right to have concerns.
One thing I would love to see is the small minority of people on both sides who react purely to the last game and call the other side out give it a rest. This is incredibly tedious and happens after every single game.
Sadly, at the end of season, whether it ends in glory or failure, the first thing a minority of people will do is log on to TWTD to score points.
If we don't nip this in the bud now then we're going to have 'outers' turn quicker and quicker in future wanting to be the first to 'see' that it's not going to work.
If your opinion right now is anything other than some variation of Cook has underperformed for a long time and the jury is well and truly out then you probably need to calm down. [Post edited 20 Oct 2021 12:49]
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| Everyone who has gone Cook Out has boxed themselves into a corner on 12:57 - Oct 20 with 1276 views | Herbivore |
| Everyone who has gone Cook Out has boxed themselves into a corner on 12:48 - Oct 20 by Geomorph |
You've gone from 1) 3 poor performances after Donny to 2) need to eek out some spawny wins. I'm assuming you therefore feel we played crap against Shrewsbury - is that not eeking out a spawny win? Lincoln perhaps similar...
I've only seen a couple of games - Morecambe and the Accrington debacle - but generally it looks like the big issue we had was developing a semblance of defensive organisation so that we stop looking like conceding every time we lose the ball. It is looking like that process is under way - not sorted - but in progress.
Oil tankers take time to turn... |
What oil tanker? It's not like Cook has been trying to get last year's squad to perform much better than they did last year, he was backed to sign a whole new squad of his own choosing. Did that squad really become an oil tanker in those first few games? I'm not having that. Large turnover of players is common at this level and plenty of sides with fewer resources have made better starts after comparable levels of squad churn.
We're literally one game removed from throwing away a 2 goal lead at Cambridge following some abject defending so progress on that front needs works, it's notable we changed the goalie and one of our CBs for last night's game so clearly Cook felt the back 5 needed changes to make it more solid which suggests those issues still exist. | |
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| Everyone who has gone Cook Out has boxed themselves into a corner on 13:33 - Oct 20 with 1237 views | MaySixth |
| Everyone who has gone Cook Out has boxed themselves into a corner on 10:16 - Oct 20 by WilbrahamBlue |
Special mention for those pushing Danny Cowley as the right choice instead of Cook until about 2 weeks ago.... |
We have some fans that are wise beyond their years. | |
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| Everyone who has gone Cook Out has boxed themselves into a corner on 14:35 - Oct 20 with 1197 views | The_Flashing_Smile |
| Everyone who has gone Cook Out has boxed themselves into a corner on 12:26 - Oct 20 by Herbivore |
It was a good win and a good performance, especially second half. I've said so in a number of threads. We now need to back it up with more wins and not do what we did after smashing Donny and put in a few mediocre to poor performances. |
You have an unerring ability to always put a negative slant on things. You can't just stop at "It was a good win and a good performance, especially second half" you have to add (and you've done it in almost every post today) "but we need to do it back to back." Yes we know already. You don't need to keep saying it over and over and over and over. The fact that we need to do it has no baring on last night's performance or result. We could've won 15-0 last night and it still wouldn't be 2 wins in a row, so why the need to keep adding it as a caveat to last night?
And if we win Saturday, the whole "we need back to back wins" will change to "yeah, but, we haven't gone on a run..." | |
| Trust the process. Trust Phil. |
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| Everyone who has gone Cook Out has boxed themselves into a corner on 14:43 - Oct 20 with 1180 views | jayessess |
| Everyone who has gone Cook Out has boxed themselves into a corner on 14:35 - Oct 20 by The_Flashing_Smile |
You have an unerring ability to always put a negative slant on things. You can't just stop at "It was a good win and a good performance, especially second half" you have to add (and you've done it in almost every post today) "but we need to do it back to back." Yes we know already. You don't need to keep saying it over and over and over and over. The fact that we need to do it has no baring on last night's performance or result. We could've won 15-0 last night and it still wouldn't be 2 wins in a row, so why the need to keep adding it as a caveat to last night?
And if we win Saturday, the whole "we need back to back wins" will change to "yeah, but, we haven't gone on a run..." |
Judging by the multiple "ahurhurhur, where are the Cook Out brigade now, I told you so" threads, clearly people do need to keep saying it.
No-one wins the league in October, but equally you don't get that much credit for a 1 game winning streak. | |
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| Everyone who has gone Cook Out has boxed themselves into a corner on 14:48 - Oct 20 with 1175 views | The_Flashing_Smile |
| Everyone who has gone Cook Out has boxed themselves into a corner on 14:43 - Oct 20 by jayessess |
Judging by the multiple "ahurhurhur, where are the Cook Out brigade now, I told you so" threads, clearly people do need to keep saying it.
No-one wins the league in October, but equally you don't get that much credit for a 1 game winning streak. |
There's only a couple of those threads. It seems to have been exaggerated as much as the Cook Out threads.
I've not suggested 1 game is a winning streak. Quite the opposite, I'm suggesting the result in isolation doesn't need streaks or runs attached as caveats. Just be happy with a great result. So much negativity in here the night after a 4-0 away win! | |
| Trust the process. Trust Phil. |
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| Everyone who has gone Cook Out has boxed themselves into a corner on 14:57 - Oct 20 with 1157 views | Herbivore |
| Everyone who has gone Cook Out has boxed themselves into a corner on 14:43 - Oct 20 by jayessess |
Judging by the multiple "ahurhurhur, where are the Cook Out brigade now, I told you so" threads, clearly people do need to keep saying it.
No-one wins the league in October, but equally you don't get that much credit for a 1 game winning streak. |
Precisely. Nobody is saying don't be pleased with the win or indeed don't be optimistic that it's not another false dawn. My posts have largely been in response to the kinds of threads and posts that you mention, where one win - albeit a very good one - is seen as some sort of vindication of Cook and that those who expressed doubts about him were fools. Let's see how things go over the coming games. Everyone wants us to go on a run and push up the table but one off wins won't be how we achieve it and it won't really alter that we've made a poor start to the season either. [Post edited 20 Oct 2021 14:58]
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| Everyone who has gone Cook Out has boxed themselves into a corner on 15:00 - Oct 20 with 1155 views | jayessess |
| Everyone who has gone Cook Out has boxed themselves into a corner on 14:48 - Oct 20 by The_Flashing_Smile |
There's only a couple of those threads. It seems to have been exaggerated as much as the Cook Out threads.
I've not suggested 1 game is a winning streak. Quite the opposite, I'm suggesting the result in isolation doesn't need streaks or runs attached as caveats. Just be happy with a great result. So much negativity in here the night after a 4-0 away win! |
The dynamic after we win at the moment is:
Phase (1) Everyone is happy about the win.
Phase (2) Someone starts a thread like this one.
Phase (3) People react to those threads.
I would suggest that phase two is the issue. | |
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| Everyone who has gone Cook Out has boxed themselves into a corner on 15:39 - Oct 20 with 1117 views | The_Flashing_Smile |
| Everyone who has gone Cook Out has boxed themselves into a corner on 15:00 - Oct 20 by jayessess |
The dynamic after we win at the moment is:
Phase (1) Everyone is happy about the win.
Phase (2) Someone starts a thread like this one.
Phase (3) People react to those threads.
I would suggest that phase two is the issue. |
Except this thread was started before the win... | |
| Trust the process. Trust Phil. |
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| Everyone who has gone Cook Out has boxed themselves into a corner on 16:00 - Oct 20 with 1098 views | DanTheMan |
| Everyone who has gone Cook Out has boxed themselves into a corner on 15:39 - Oct 20 by The_Flashing_Smile |
Except this thread was started before the win... |
But it was specifically bumped after the win by the OP, so it's still the same point really. |  |
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