| Govt plans to lower student loan repayment threshold 19:39 - Nov 13 with 3951 views | tractordownsouth |
potentially as low as 22k. This is a ridiculous decision. As someone who will (hopefully) graduate next year, I think it's fair to expect people to repay their loans (because higher education is a choice at the end of the day) but only once we reach an average income level - 27k is about right. As a generation, younger people already spend a much higher percentage of income on essentials (often paying someone else's mortgage in the form of rent), so to ask those who earn little more than the living wage to potentially stump up an extra £200-450 per year on top of the National Insurance increase is massively unfair. I shouldn't be surprised because it's yet another example of Johnson unilaterally trying to change the terms of an agreement.
It's blindingly obvious that as with the National Insurance rise, the government are getting the young working poor to foot the bill for the older generations, purely because they're the ones that vote for them. It's really not how a country should be governed.
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| Govt plans to lower student loan repayment threshold on 11:13 - Nov 14 with 960 views | Plums |
| Govt plans to lower student loan repayment threshold on 10:05 - Nov 14 by WD19 |
The whole setup is a hot mess. Universities are now businesses first and seats of education second. My eldest is currently visiting potential institutions and I have seen some that are ripping out perfectly serviceable (and relatively new) facilities and replacing them (again) purely to appeal to new customers. There is no educational merit in the changes.
In a similar vein, finding student accommodation was hard in my day. These days there are providers falling over themselves to provide shiny new accommodation to students because they see the opportunity. Given that the majority of loans will never be paid back what we are seeing is effectively the taxpayer funding a building and commercial lets business. |
I don’t agree that they are businesses first but commercial considerations have come much closer in the pecking order to education itself in recent years. The ‘student experience’ is now massive and far too many are building what they think students want than what they need - hence the waste you describe.
Accommodation is an absolute gravy train and many halls are now closer to holiday accommodation than the lifestyle the Young Ones portrayed! [Post edited 14 Nov 2021 11:14]
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| Govt plans to lower student loan repayment threshold on 12:19 - Nov 14 with 919 views | Oldboy |
| Govt plans to lower student loan repayment threshold on 09:47 - Nov 14 by Plums |
It seems a fair point but isn’t really. A graduate is likely to need a loan for a car etc too which will start immediately. Banks offer graduate loans to get you started in the workplace. Mine needed to be paid off long before I’d made much of a dent in my actual student loan. [Post edited 14 Nov 2021 13:01]
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You have answered your own post there. You choose to go to University, therefore you knew the pitfalls before you went. |  | | |
| Govt plans to lower student loan repayment threshold on 12:43 - Nov 14 with 890 views | footers |
| Govt plans to lower student loan repayment threshold on 12:19 - Nov 14 by Oldboy |
You have answered your own post there. You choose to go to University, therefore you knew the pitfalls before you went. |
HOW IS YOUR NEW PASSAT?
Sorry to shout but I'd really like an answer to this. The missus keeps nagging me about it too and our marriage is already on the rocks. |  |
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| Govt plans to lower student loan repayment threshold on 12:58 - Nov 14 with 895 views | leitrimblue |
| Govt plans to lower student loan repayment threshold on 23:21 - Nov 13 by footers |
Education of any kind, and at any level, should be free.
That is all. |
Completely agree. Would also suggest if you come from a poorer background or places like Haverhill or Jaywick,(possibly lowestoft?) then by all means do whatever it takes to get out/change the situation. Take the student loans etc, don't let the debt put you off. Hopefully your increased chance of earning more will allow/help you pay it back. If the debt worries you that much then you could always use your new found education outside of the UK and avoid paying it back that way.... |  | | |
| Govt plans to lower student loan repayment threshold on 13:02 - Nov 14 with 887 views | factual_blue |
| Govt plans to lower student loan repayment threshold on 12:43 - Nov 14 by footers |
HOW IS YOUR NEW PASSAT?
Sorry to shout but I'd really like an answer to this. The missus keeps nagging me about it too and our marriage is already on the rocks. |
You want a nice Skoda Octavia, not a Passat. |  |
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| Govt plans to lower student loan repayment threshold on 13:05 - Nov 14 with 867 views | footers |
| Govt plans to lower student loan repayment threshold on 13:02 - Nov 14 by factual_blue |
You want a nice Skoda Octavia, not a Passat. |
This is the fourth time I've had to ask about it and it's a wonder how I'm able to sleep at night really. | |
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| Govt plans to lower student loan repayment threshold on 13:05 - Nov 14 with 876 views | Plums |
| Govt plans to lower student loan repayment threshold on 12:19 - Nov 14 by Oldboy |
You have answered your own post there. You choose to go to University, therefore you knew the pitfalls before you went. |
Sorry, that really doesn’t make sense. You described a person getting a car loan to begin work (good luck with that with no credit history but that’s another point), I was simply pointing out that a graduate needs the same facility under the same terms. You cannot compare that to a student loan. | |
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| Govt plans to lower student loan repayment threshold on 13:10 - Nov 14 with 844 views | footers |
| Govt plans to lower student loan repayment threshold on 12:58 - Nov 14 by leitrimblue |
Completely agree. Would also suggest if you come from a poorer background or places like Haverhill or Jaywick,(possibly lowestoft?) then by all means do whatever it takes to get out/change the situation. Take the student loans etc, don't let the debt put you off. Hopefully your increased chance of earning more will allow/help you pay it back. If the debt worries you that much then you could always use your new found education outside of the UK and avoid paying it back that way.... |
Completely, buh. I was lucky in that I was purely academic and got a good schooling which suited me and meant I got into a good uni. Coming from a very working class family I was the first to even go to college, let alone anything else. I'd hate to think kids from similar backgrounds are put off due to money. The tax take should more than make up for the cost eventually.
What concerns me more is education for the trades and non-university courses where more needs to be done for those who don't fancy uni and want to pick up a skill or trade. Seems quite inadequate from what I know.
Adult education too needs a boost. Never too late for folk to learn something new or switch profession. | |
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| Govt plans to lower student loan repayment threshold on 13:10 - Nov 14 with 856 views | Oldboy |
| Govt plans to lower student loan repayment threshold on 13:02 - Nov 14 by factual_blue |
You want a nice Skoda Octavia, not a Passat. |
The Octavia is a nice car, just a bit too plasticy inside. | | | |
| Govt plans to lower student loan repayment threshold on 13:12 - Nov 14 with 844 views | factual_blue |
| Govt plans to lower student loan repayment threshold on 13:10 - Nov 14 by Oldboy |
The Octavia is a nice car, just a bit too plasticy inside. |
Not when Overfinch work their magic on it.... | |
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| Govt plans to lower student loan repayment threshold on 13:13 - Nov 14 with 843 views | Oldboy |
| Govt plans to lower student loan repayment threshold on 13:05 - Nov 14 by Plums |
Sorry, that really doesn’t make sense. You described a person getting a car loan to begin work (good luck with that with no credit history but that’s another point), I was simply pointing out that a graduate needs the same facility under the same terms. You cannot compare that to a student loan. |
The point is that you knew you were going to leave University with a debt. No point in anybody moaning about it. So the terms and conditions have changed, welcome to life. | | | |
| Govt plans to lower student loan repayment threshold on 13:21 - Nov 14 with 816 views | Oldboy |
| Govt plans to lower student loan repayment threshold on 13:12 - Nov 14 by factual_blue |
Not when Overfinch work their magic on it.... |
They only do range/land rover don't they? | | | |
| Govt plans to lower student loan repayment threshold on 13:25 - Nov 14 with 792 views | chicoazul |
| Govt plans to lower student loan repayment threshold on 12:19 - Nov 14 by Oldboy |
You have answered your own post there. You choose to go to University, therefore you knew the pitfalls before you went. |
You probably don’t know this, but many employers won’t consider anyone for an entry level role without a degree. So it’s not a question of choice. |  |
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| Govt plans to lower student loan repayment threshold on 13:29 - Nov 14 with 798 views | leitrimblue |
| Govt plans to lower student loan repayment threshold on 13:10 - Nov 14 by footers |
Completely, buh. I was lucky in that I was purely academic and got a good schooling which suited me and meant I got into a good uni. Coming from a very working class family I was the first to even go to college, let alone anything else. I'd hate to think kids from similar backgrounds are put off due to money. The tax take should more than make up for the cost eventually.
What concerns me more is education for the trades and non-university courses where more needs to be done for those who don't fancy uni and want to pick up a skill or trade. Seems quite inadequate from what I know.
Adult education too needs a boost. Never too late for folk to learn something new or switch profession. |
I come from similar background, grew up in a very working class Haverhill family. Had no interest in education, bummed around for many years did the odd crap job before going to uni in mid 20,s. Didn't even really know anyone who had been to uni.
I hate the idea of other people from similar backgrounds being put off. Most if the lads I grew up with who wanted to work are in construction and financially doing ok. But there is/ was very little opportunity for the rest of um. It's very easy for these lads then to fall through the gaps... [Post edited 14 Nov 2021 13:30]
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| Govt plans to lower student loan repayment threshold on 13:39 - Nov 14 with 768 views | eireblue |
| Govt plans to lower student loan repayment threshold on 09:08 - Nov 14 by tractordownsouth |
It would be nice, but I don’t see it as a progressive idea. Higher education is a choice so I think it’s fair for students to pay their loan back once they’re financially stable. Removing fees altogether would only benefit those who will pay off the majority of their loans, who are those on the highest incomes. It would effectively become a middle class tax subsidy.
Healthcare is different obviously because it’s not a choice to need it. |
Healthcare is an interesting example.
There are other things that are also choices, that others, that don’t make that choice, still have to pay for.
Education, especially when the government want a high wage high skill economy, is really an investment, not a choice. |  | | |
| Govt plans to lower student loan repayment threshold on 13:43 - Nov 14 with 758 views | Oldboy |
| Govt plans to lower student loan repayment threshold on 13:25 - Nov 14 by chicoazul |
You probably don’t know this, but many employers won’t consider anyone for an entry level role without a degree. So it’s not a question of choice. |
You are right, I didn't know that. I just had a look on indeed for financial and commercial work. Whilst there are some with that requirement, most are asking for good school grades as training and advancement will be ongoing. I am not against anyone who wants to go to University or try to make a better life for themselves, I am all for that. You go into these things with your eyes wide open. The rules have to be the same for those who don't go into higher education. It is a choice which ever way you dress it up. | | | |
| Govt plans to lower student loan repayment threshold on 13:46 - Nov 14 with 754 views | XYZ |
| Govt plans to lower student loan repayment threshold on 13:39 - Nov 14 by eireblue |
Healthcare is an interesting example.
There are other things that are also choices, that others, that don’t make that choice, still have to pay for.
Education, especially when the government want a high wage high skill economy, is really an investment, not a choice. |
The higher the level of education across society, the better off that society will be.
Everyone gains from people being better educated, not just those being educated.
It's an investment in one's society. |  | | |
| Govt plans to lower student loan repayment threshold on 14:12 - Nov 14 with 717 views | Darth_Koont |
| Govt plans to lower student loan repayment threshold on 13:39 - Nov 14 by eireblue |
Healthcare is an interesting example.
There are other things that are also choices, that others, that don’t make that choice, still have to pay for.
Education, especially when the government want a high wage high skill economy, is really an investment, not a choice. |
Exactly.
In the 21st century, disincentivising higher education seems a poor route for a developed country and society. And I wonder if it doesn’t have some connection now to our worryingly low productivity. Or perhaps even negative social effects like our growing distrust of experts.
To butcher an Oscar Wilde quote, the UK seems to have become a cynical country that knows the price of everything and the value of nothing. |  |
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| Govt plans to lower student loan repayment threshold on 14:22 - Nov 14 with 689 views | Herbivore |
| Govt plans to lower student loan repayment threshold on 21:49 - Nov 13 by XYZ |
A 2% graduate tax paid by all graduates (i.e including us old fogies who had no fees, a grant and the dole in the holidays) would raise about the same and be much fairer. |
Sod that, I had a student loan that I've subsequently repaid. Fooked if I'm paying twice. |  |
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| Govt plans to lower student loan repayment threshold on 14:23 - Nov 14 with 686 views | lowhouseblue |
| Govt plans to lower student loan repayment threshold on 14:12 - Nov 14 by Darth_Koont |
Exactly.
In the 21st century, disincentivising higher education seems a poor route for a developed country and society. And I wonder if it doesn’t have some connection now to our worryingly low productivity. Or perhaps even negative social effects like our growing distrust of experts.
To butcher an Oscar Wilde quote, the UK seems to have become a cynical country that knows the price of everything and the value of nothing. |
"In the 21st century, disincentivising higher education seems a poor route for a developed country and society. And I wonder if it doesn’t have some connection now to our worryingly low productivity. Or perhaps even negative social effects like our growing distrust of experts."
but in fact we now have a record proportion of the population going into higher education - more than 50 per cent of 17- to 30-year-olds have participated in higher education. |  |
| And so as the loose-bowelled pigeon of time swoops low over the unsuspecting tourist of destiny, and the flatulent skunk of fate wanders into the air-conditioning system of eternity, I notice it's the end of the show |
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| Govt plans to lower student loan repayment threshold on 14:32 - Nov 14 with 670 views | Herbivore |
| Govt plans to lower student loan repayment threshold on 13:43 - Nov 14 by Oldboy |
You are right, I didn't know that. I just had a look on indeed for financial and commercial work. Whilst there are some with that requirement, most are asking for good school grades as training and advancement will be ongoing. I am not against anyone who wants to go to University or try to make a better life for themselves, I am all for that. You go into these things with your eyes wide open. The rules have to be the same for those who don't go into higher education. It is a choice which ever way you dress it up. |
So we should put things in place that make life harder for doctors, nurses, teachers, social workers, paramedics and so on purely through some cockeyed notion of fairness? All of those professions require a university education. | |
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| Govt plans to lower student loan repayment threshold on 14:32 - Nov 14 with 656 views | chicoazul |
| Govt plans to lower student loan repayment threshold on 13:43 - Nov 14 by Oldboy |
You are right, I didn't know that. I just had a look on indeed for financial and commercial work. Whilst there are some with that requirement, most are asking for good school grades as training and advancement will be ongoing. I am not against anyone who wants to go to University or try to make a better life for themselves, I am all for that. You go into these things with your eyes wide open. The rules have to be the same for those who don't go into higher education. It is a choice which ever way you dress it up. |
I worked in commercial recruitment for 18 years. In a fight between a grad and a non grad for a role in almost every financial insurance and manufacturing organisation the grad will win always, unless it’s a white guy against an Asian guy in my experience. So the choice as you put it is either debt as a grad or massively restricted employment opportunities and I don’t mean “try other jobs” I mean “think about moving to Cuba”. It’s not a choice. | |
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| Govt plans to lower student loan repayment threshold on 14:42 - Nov 14 with 638 views | Darth_Koont |
| Govt plans to lower student loan repayment threshold on 14:23 - Nov 14 by lowhouseblue |
"In the 21st century, disincentivising higher education seems a poor route for a developed country and society. And I wonder if it doesn’t have some connection now to our worryingly low productivity. Or perhaps even negative social effects like our growing distrust of experts."
but in fact we now have a record proportion of the population going into higher education - more than 50 per cent of 17- to 30-year-olds have participated in higher education. |
Who are they? And what are they studying if they know they have to pay it off? How does the extra cost/disincentive to the individual affect things in economists’ terms?
Serious question as I don’t know. | |
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| Govt plans to lower student loan repayment threshold on 14:42 - Nov 14 with 637 views | Durovigutum |
| Govt plans to lower student loan repayment threshold on 13:25 - Nov 14 by chicoazul |
You probably don’t know this, but many employers won’t consider anyone for an entry level role without a degree. So it’s not a question of choice. |
Sadly. And it removes the opportunity to hire many talented individuals.
I graduated in 1995 and had a tiny student loan that I'd used to help out with some expenses. I can't believe what it's become - it's absolutely criminal and massively disadvantages those from poorer backgrounds who are (almost always) stuck with this debt for life, where rich families pay their kids through and avoid any sort of graduate tax.
But, let's be clear, the entire tax system is an unfair mess for anyone earning over 9k and less than "I can afford an offshore tax vehicle". I read somewhere recently that the tax regulations for 2017 were longer than the King James Bible but Singapore's equivalent were shorter than Genesis. We'd do well to address the key problem rather than tack another poorly thought through tax on bits of the population. |  | | |
| Govt plans to lower student loan repayment threshold on 14:47 - Nov 14 with 613 views | lowhouseblue |
| Govt plans to lower student loan repayment threshold on 14:42 - Nov 14 by Darth_Koont |
Who are they? And what are they studying if they know they have to pay it off? How does the extra cost/disincentive to the individual affect things in economists’ terms?
Serious question as I don’t know. |
https://www.hesa.ac.uk/data-and-analysis/students | |
| And so as the loose-bowelled pigeon of time swoops low over the unsuspecting tourist of destiny, and the flatulent skunk of fate wanders into the air-conditioning system of eternity, I notice it's the end of the show |
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