| A comment from ITFC_Joe earlier got me thinking. 12:05 - Jan 5 with 2830 views | OriginalMarkyP |
He said (in essence) Bonne is a top league one striker, but would struggle to play in a team that plays the sophisticated football we play. He's suited to a simpler brand of football.
It made me wonder, do we play football that is too good to get you out of League One?
I mean, no doubt when it all clicks its great to watch and hard to stop.
But the level of player required in terms of ability, touch, vision, intelligence is high. And there surely aren't so many of those players who are happy to ply their trade in a division that they might see as beneath them. So perhaps in key positions we are going to struggle with recruitment because the kind of player we need is rarer than a lot of the very serviceable pros who could come in and make a big impact at some of our less elegant rivals.
Don't get me wrong. I love KmcK. I love the style. But i wonder if in some ways it's making things harder. We're building a side for the Championship but it might not be a team to scrap its way out of a league one dog fight. [Post edited 5 Jan 2023 12:09]
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| A comment from ITFC_Joe earlier got me thinking. on 12:07 - Jan 5 with 2772 views | hype313 |
There is an argument that McKenna's style of play would be far better suited to the Championship, and in this league you just need to bully your way out of it, I can see that as a valid argument to be fair. |  |
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| A comment from ITFC_Joe earlier got me thinking. on 12:08 - Jan 5 with 2725 views | FrimleyBlue |
I share similar thoughts.
I shared the below within a thread
That's us told then!! by LankHenners 30 Dec 2022 12:43It's a bit arrogant and OTT in some of the claims but essentially correct.
I also think that we're a much bigger club than Plymouth and have spent a lot more opens us up to more of the 'best, biggest team in the league' comments from other managers as part of a ploy to win the mental battle. Plymouth have a bit more of the fearless plucky underdog about them which makes them harder to undermine in the same way.
I still stand by my thoughts that KM's style is To good for this league and that in itself is a problem when having to manage league 1 players.
If you watch the top prem sides, the football and phases of play, player rotations etc etc are all a carbon copy of what town attempts to do. Our problem is that we don't have a Haaland or a De Bruyne, a Saka at Arsenal who can turn it on with a drop of a shoulder.
Man City as an example come up against teams sitting deep alot.. they don't panic, they go about there business just like we did last night. But you can always trust one of their stars to do something, we don't have that luxury and I personally feel this is what lets us down when it matters. |  |
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| A comment from ITFC_Joe earlier got me thinking. on 12:18 - Jan 5 with 2583 views | SheffordBlue |
| A comment from ITFC_Joe earlier got me thinking. on 12:08 - Jan 5 by FrimleyBlue |
I share similar thoughts.
I shared the below within a thread
That's us told then!! by LankHenners 30 Dec 2022 12:43It's a bit arrogant and OTT in some of the claims but essentially correct.
I also think that we're a much bigger club than Plymouth and have spent a lot more opens us up to more of the 'best, biggest team in the league' comments from other managers as part of a ploy to win the mental battle. Plymouth have a bit more of the fearless plucky underdog about them which makes them harder to undermine in the same way.
I still stand by my thoughts that KM's style is To good for this league and that in itself is a problem when having to manage league 1 players.
If you watch the top prem sides, the football and phases of play, player rotations etc etc are all a carbon copy of what town attempts to do. Our problem is that we don't have a Haaland or a De Bruyne, a Saka at Arsenal who can turn it on with a drop of a shoulder.
Man City as an example come up against teams sitting deep alot.. they don't panic, they go about there business just like we did last night. But you can always trust one of their stars to do something, we don't have that luxury and I personally feel this is what lets us down when it matters. |
Even City don't break down teams all the time. The one all draw with Everton had very similiar stats to some of the games where we've struggled to break down a low block.
Scoring first is the key for us as it prevents teams from having something to hang onto. |  |
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| A comment from ITFC_Joe earlier got me thinking. on 12:30 - Jan 5 with 2445 views | jayessess |
I'm always sceptical of the idea that certain styles of football are too good to be apt for lower divisions.
As you move up the divisions the levels of athleticism rise, the pace rises, the time you have to do things diminishes. It becomes much harder, not easier, to execute highly technical skills. It's the qualities of your players relative to that level that determine how you can and can't play.
I think it's hard to argue that style is our issue. The purpose of a playing style is to impose yourself on the opposition, to arrange play in such a way that you generate a lot more opportunities to score than the opposition do. We do this most weeks.
Everything beyond that is about quality, about decision-making and composure, whether your style is simple or sophisticated. |  |
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| A comment from ITFC_Joe earlier got me thinking. on 12:37 - Jan 5 with 2347 views | TractorCam |
| A comment from ITFC_Joe earlier got me thinking. on 12:18 - Jan 5 by SheffordBlue |
Even City don't break down teams all the time. The one all draw with Everton had very similiar stats to some of the games where we've struggled to break down a low block.
Scoring first is the key for us as it prevents teams from having something to hang onto. |
Not this season, we've given up the lead so many times, in fact i reckon in the games we haven't won we scored first more than we conceded first. |  |
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| A comment from ITFC_Joe earlier got me thinking. on 12:44 - Jan 5 with 2259 views | jayessess |
| A comment from ITFC_Joe earlier got me thinking. on 12:37 - Jan 5 by TractorCam |
Not this season, we've given up the lead so many times, in fact i reckon in the games we haven't won we scored first more than we conceded first. |
Dropped points in 11 games, 6 times we scored first, 5 times after conceding first.
Won maximum points in 14 games, 13 times we scored first, 1 time we conceded first.
We win 68% of the games we score first in.
We win 17% of the games we concede first in. | |
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| A comment from ITFC_Joe earlier got me thinking. on 12:46 - Jan 5 with 2213 views | SheffordBlue |
| A comment from ITFC_Joe earlier got me thinking. on 12:37 - Jan 5 by TractorCam |
Not this season, we've given up the lead so many times, in fact i reckon in the games we haven't won we scored first more than we conceded first. |
You're right but not by much:
Went behind won 1
Went behind drew 3
Went behind lost 2
Went ahead won 13
Went ahead drew 5
Went ahead lost 1 | |
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| A comment from ITFC_Joe earlier got me thinking. on 13:02 - Jan 5 with 2074 views | TractorCam |
| A comment from ITFC_Joe earlier got me thinking. on 12:46 - Jan 5 by SheffordBlue |
You're right but not by much:
Went behind won 1
Went behind drew 3
Went behind lost 2
Went ahead won 13
Went ahead drew 5
Went ahead lost 1 |
We did hiccup in a few of those wins too, Port Vale, Portsmouth etc, but it's good that we aren't really going behind in games. | |
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| A comment from ITFC_Joe earlier got me thinking. on 13:03 - Jan 5 with 2059 views | jayessess |
| A comment from ITFC_Joe earlier got me thinking. on 13:02 - Jan 5 by TractorCam |
We did hiccup in a few of those wins too, Port Vale, Portsmouth etc, but it's good that we aren't really going behind in games. |
It's just as well really, because our record on the rare occasions we do go behind is pretty dreadful. | |
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| A comment from ITFC_Joe earlier got me thinking. on 13:29 - Jan 5 with 1931 views | SitfcB |
| A comment from ITFC_Joe earlier got me thinking. on 12:46 - Jan 5 by SheffordBlue |
You're right but not by much:
Went behind won 1
Went behind drew 3
Went behind lost 2
Went ahead won 13
Went ahead drew 5
Went ahead lost 1 |
It’s the 5 draws after going ahead that have killed us, admittedly the Barnsley one was actually the referees fault, but the others, Charlton, Cheltenham and Fleetwood (can’t remember the other) we certainly should have gone on and won! |  |
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| A comment from ITFC_Joe earlier got me thinking. on 13:33 - Jan 5 with 1898 views | jayessess |
| A comment from ITFC_Joe earlier got me thinking. on 13:29 - Jan 5 by SitfcB |
It’s the 5 draws after going ahead that have killed us, admittedly the Barnsley one was actually the referees fault, but the others, Charlton, Cheltenham and Fleetwood (can’t remember the other) we certainly should have gone on and won! |
Sheffield Wednesday is the other (also the ref's fault) | |
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| A comment from ITFC_Joe earlier got me thinking. on 13:34 - Jan 5 with 1874 views | SitfcB |
| A comment from ITFC_Joe earlier got me thinking. on 13:33 - Jan 5 by jayessess |
Sheffield Wednesday is the other (also the ref's fault) |
Ahh yes, how could I forget that one haha. We really are owed something from the officials still. | |
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| A comment from ITFC_Joe earlier got me thinking. on 13:36 - Jan 5 with 1843 views | Horsham |
| A comment from ITFC_Joe earlier got me thinking. on 12:08 - Jan 5 by FrimleyBlue |
I share similar thoughts.
I shared the below within a thread
That's us told then!! by LankHenners 30 Dec 2022 12:43It's a bit arrogant and OTT in some of the claims but essentially correct.
I also think that we're a much bigger club than Plymouth and have spent a lot more opens us up to more of the 'best, biggest team in the league' comments from other managers as part of a ploy to win the mental battle. Plymouth have a bit more of the fearless plucky underdog about them which makes them harder to undermine in the same way.
I still stand by my thoughts that KM's style is To good for this league and that in itself is a problem when having to manage league 1 players.
If you watch the top prem sides, the football and phases of play, player rotations etc etc are all a carbon copy of what town attempts to do. Our problem is that we don't have a Haaland or a De Bruyne, a Saka at Arsenal who can turn it on with a drop of a shoulder.
Man City as an example come up against teams sitting deep alot.. they don't panic, they go about there business just like we did last night. But you can always trust one of their stars to do something, we don't have that luxury and I personally feel this is what lets us down when it matters. |
I don’t think there is an issue with our style as such but it would be good if we could change it up a bit when it’s not working. Thinking along the Netherlands change of tactics in going direct against Argentina. We could do with a big physical penalty box presence sometimes.
If I could profile 2 striker signings I’d be hoping for one in the mould of David Johnson and the other in the mould of Duncan Ferguson (minus a bit of the psycho) | | | |
| A comment from ITFC_Joe earlier got me thinking. on 13:38 - Jan 5 with 1814 views | BlueBlood90 |
Can't disagree with that.
I think the football we play nowadays is superb and it's the best style we've played in years. However I still feel that we lack a basic Plan B option where someone like Bonne would be a great option from the bench in games where we need to be more physical and direct if our natural game isn't going to plan. |  |
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| A comment from ITFC_Joe earlier got me thinking. on 13:41 - Jan 5 with 1762 views | PioneerBlue |
We have three options
1 Rip it all up and start again
2 Buy better /coach to play the system and style, buying accelerates
3 Organise for a change option, buying accelerates the change option
1-Out of the question, not even preferred
2-is what we are doing, we have the players, they are winning most games but not converting all
3-is where the discuss should be, buying players that enable subtle changes to system and or style style according to the opposition and the way the game is going
All of this is underway.
Arguably, Bonne could be exactly the kind of player that provides a change option but this doesn’t appear to be the kind of change option favoured by the current leadership set up. I’m behind them on whichever way they go, they are paid the money to make the decisions, I’m the supporter! | |
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| A comment from ITFC_Joe earlier got me thinking. on 13:50 - Jan 5 with 1677 views | You_Bloo_Right |
I don't think there's anything wrong with the way we play nor do I think it is not conducive to getting out of the division - I just think at times that we need to do what we do quicker. |  |
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| A comment from ITFC_Joe earlier got me thinking. on 14:00 - Jan 5 with 1598 views | C_Jam_Blue |
I think it was identified at the end of last season that we would require a more physical team to get out of this league. Ball, Ahadme and Camara would all seem to fit this criteria and it's unfortunate that they have all suffered from injuries. I would not be surprised to see one or two more robust players join during this transfer window. | | | |
| A comment from ITFC_Joe earlier got me thinking. on 14:33 - Jan 5 with 1403 views | breedalot |
| A comment from ITFC_Joe earlier got me thinking. on 14:00 - Jan 5 by C_Jam_Blue |
I think it was identified at the end of last season that we would require a more physical team to get out of this league. Ball, Ahadme and Camara would all seem to fit this criteria and it's unfortunate that they have all suffered from injuries. I would not be surprised to see one or two more robust players join during this transfer window. |
Other teams have got out while playing at least ok football, them up the road, Sheff u, as examples. Also, I think long ball physical football would see the crowds fall. | | | |
| A comment from ITFC_Joe earlier got me thinking. on 14:54 - Jan 5 with 1316 views | Westcountryblue |
In response to the opening post, i'd argue that the brand of football we play is outstanding. However, i'm not too sure if we currently have the pedigree and type of players needed in all areas of the pitch to fully execute it.
For example, i don't really think our strikers have the intelligence in terms of their movement when teams sit deep to really make it effective. Most of our forwards thrive on balls over the top. | | | |
| A comment from ITFC_Joe earlier got me thinking. on 14:58 - Jan 5 with 1292 views | OldFart71 |
Seeing as a majority of that play in this league only seem intent on grabbing the glory by taking a point from us of heaven forbid three is it much wonder that sophistication doesn't always pay. The problem we have a supporters of ITFC is that for years we have yearned for more attractive football and now we have it this style may not be what this muck and bullets league requires. I thought the type of forward that we had in Norwood would be exactly right type for this league. But sadly he was more interested in outside activities than putting in a shift for us. I do believe we have what is need to get the right players in, but January windows are notoriously hard as you have teams wanting reinforcement to stay in a league and you have those such as ourselves trying to get out and that works out at a lot of competition and in turn make getting a player harder due to costs. What I do not, under any circumstances want to see are players coming in that do nothing to make us a better team. | | | |
| A comment from ITFC_Joe earlier got me thinking. on 16:25 - Jan 5 with 1109 views | ArnieM |
OP: absolutely 100% spot on!
We need to modify our approach at times. It’s too fancy for league one. Get promoted to Championship snd I reckon we’d fly up that division as the style is more compatible. Failure to adapt in anything is what finishes things off. In retail, so many companies snd top brand names have fallen by the wayside because they failed to adapt to a changing market, ( Blockbusters being just one example) . I’d suggest a football team’s adaptability is no different. |  |
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