| What is the position with El-Miz? 08:38 - Jul 21 with 4152 views | GeoffSentence |
Recallable at this point? Might be a useful understudy to Taylor and Luongo if Morsy is tempted by Saudi. |  |
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| What is the position with El-Miz? on 08:40 - Jul 21 with 3117 views | GlasgowBlue |
He’s at Orient for the season. |  |
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| What is the position with El-Miz? on 08:48 - Jul 21 with 3063 views | Rozz |
In the scenario where Morsy is tempted by a money deal and we presumably get a good fee for our club captain with 2 years on his contract, I think we could probably sign a decent replacement before we start recalling loan players. |  | | |
| What is the position with El-Miz? on 08:51 - Jul 21 with 3025 views | Metal_Hacker |
| What is the position with El-Miz? on 08:48 - Jul 21 by Rozz |
In the scenario where Morsy is tempted by a money deal and we presumably get a good fee for our club captain with 2 years on his contract, I think we could probably sign a decent replacement before we start recalling loan players. |
How much do people actually think we would get for Morsy ?
I think some might be getting carried away with the "size" of potential fee
It'd perhaps be life changing for Sam but for the club it wouldn't be that significant a fee to allow us to upgrade without a gamble as such |  |
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| What is the position with El-Miz? on 08:56 - Jul 21 with 2995 views | Westcountryblue |
| What is the position with El-Miz? on 08:51 - Jul 21 by Metal_Hacker |
How much do people actually think we would get for Morsy ?
I think some might be getting carried away with the "size" of potential fee
It'd perhaps be life changing for Sam but for the club it wouldn't be that significant a fee to allow us to upgrade without a gamble as such |
On the basis that we don't need to sell him, he has a huge impact both on and off the pitch at this club, we have MA at the negotiation table and the fact they have serious funds to spend...maybe in the region of 3-4m.
A replacement however may cost upwards of 6-7m. [Post edited 21 Jul 2023 8:58]
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| What is the position with El-Miz? on 08:58 - Jul 21 with 2977 views | Metal_Hacker |
| What is the position with El-Miz? on 08:56 - Jul 21 by Westcountryblue |
On the basis that we don't need to sell him, he has a huge impact both on and off the pitch at this club, we have MA at the negotiation table and the fact they have serious funds to spend...maybe in the region of 3-4m.
A replacement however may cost upwards of 6-7m. [Post edited 21 Jul 2023 8:58]
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Exactly my point | |
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| What is the position with El-Miz? on 08:59 - Jul 21 with 2955 views | itfcjoe |
| What is the position with El-Miz? on 08:56 - Jul 21 by Westcountryblue |
On the basis that we don't need to sell him, he has a huge impact both on and off the pitch at this club, we have MA at the negotiation table and the fact they have serious funds to spend...maybe in the region of 3-4m.
A replacement however may cost upwards of 6-7m. [Post edited 21 Jul 2023 8:58]
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But if we can get a replacement and they cost £5m, then you'd assume there is hope that that play if all goes well could be worth £20m in the future.
The reality is player trading wise Morsy's value is close to £0, if that figure can be turned into £2.5m to £3m then you have to take it really and then trust yourselves to recruit well |  |
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| What is the position with El-Miz? on 09:00 - Jul 21 with 2942 views | Westcountryblue |
| What is the position with El-Miz? on 08:58 - Jul 21 by Metal_Hacker |
Exactly my point |
Raises the question, is 2 good years from Sam Morsy worth 3-4m ?
Personally, i think he only improves our chances of making it back into the Premiership and they'd be a huge, gapping, 'leadership void on the pitch if he left the club. With some canny recruitment and scouting over the next 2 years, a successor could be found at a lower cost. | | | |
| What is the position with El-Miz? on 09:03 - Jul 21 with 2920 views | Rozz |
| What is the position with El-Miz? on 08:51 - Jul 21 by Metal_Hacker |
How much do people actually think we would get for Morsy ?
I think some might be getting carried away with the "size" of potential fee
It'd perhaps be life changing for Sam but for the club it wouldn't be that significant a fee to allow us to upgrade without a gamble as such |
I think you're probably right on the size of the fee. My head says that with his age vs his current value to the team, maybe north of 3m would maybe be where the scales tip? We're under no obligation to sell.
My point was more that relying on Luongo for the season + El-Miz as deputy is not a likely (or sensible) outcome if he were to leave. | | | |
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| What is the position with El-Miz? on 09:04 - Jul 21 with 2916 views | Westcountryblue |
| What is the position with El-Miz? on 08:59 - Jul 21 by itfcjoe |
But if we can get a replacement and they cost £5m, then you'd assume there is hope that that play if all goes well could be worth £20m in the future.
The reality is player trading wise Morsy's value is close to £0, if that figure can be turned into £2.5m to £3m then you have to take it really and then trust yourselves to recruit well |
Is Sam Morsy's contribution over the next couple of years, both on and off the pitch, worth 3-4m. I'd argue that it perhaps is !
5m won't buy us much and certainly won't bring in the leadership qualities, immediate respect and bonds that Morsy current has within the squad. If we were able to push the boat out and get someone like Flynn Downes, i'd be interested.
I personally think we should improve his terms and over the next 2 years, scout tactically for a long term successor who we won't have to pay through the nose for. | | | |
| What is the position with El-Miz? on 09:05 - Jul 21 with 2905 views | tractorboy1978 |
| What is the position with El-Miz? on 08:56 - Jul 21 by Westcountryblue |
On the basis that we don't need to sell him, he has a huge impact both on and off the pitch at this club, we have MA at the negotiation table and the fact they have serious funds to spend...maybe in the region of 3-4m.
A replacement however may cost upwards of 6-7m. [Post edited 21 Jul 2023 8:58]
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He's been a fantastic captain but I think people seriously overrate Morsy's ability on the pitch. He'd be a big loss no doubt and I wouldn't want to lose him, but if we could get £3m for him we could replace him with someone younger with a higher ceiling for that. | | | |
| What is the position with El-Miz? on 09:08 - Jul 21 with 2878 views | Westcountryblue |
| What is the position with El-Miz? on 09:03 - Jul 21 by Rozz |
I think you're probably right on the size of the fee. My head says that with his age vs his current value to the team, maybe north of 3m would maybe be where the scales tip? We're under no obligation to sell.
My point was more that relying on Luongo for the season + El-Miz as deputy is not a likely (or sensible) outcome if he were to leave. |
I reckon Luongo will be off at the end of the season. Think he was keen to return to Aus previously, but Ipswich was too good a challenge for him to turn down and we subsequently offered him another crack at the Championship. The club still rate El Miz and turned down several offers this summer. Therefore, it wouldn't surprise me if they saw 2024/2025 as the time to integrate him. | | | |
| What is the position with El-Miz? on 09:10 - Jul 21 with 2853 views | Kievthegreat |
1 thing I don't quite understand is that it would cost £5m to replace Morsy, yet we didn't pay anywhere near that to sign him? Surely if the recruitment team are up to scratch, £5m should get us an upgrade? |  | | |
| What is the position with El-Miz? on 09:10 - Jul 21 with 2835 views | Rozz |
| What is the position with El-Miz? on 09:05 - Jul 21 by tractorboy1978 |
He's been a fantastic captain but I think people seriously overrate Morsy's ability on the pitch. He'd be a big loss no doubt and I wouldn't want to lose him, but if we could get £3m for him we could replace him with someone younger with a higher ceiling for that. |
I don't think it's unwarranted. There's a McKenna factor here too - I think Morsy is probably a better player in the current system and under the current coaching staff than any of his previous stints in the Championship.
The reservations are over his age, longevity, future value.
Keep hold of him for as long as we can, I say. | | | |
| What is the position with El-Miz? on 09:12 - Jul 21 with 2808 views | Metal_Hacker |
| What is the position with El-Miz? on 09:10 - Jul 21 by Kievthegreat |
1 thing I don't quite understand is that it would cost £5m to replace Morsy, yet we didn't pay anywhere near that to sign him? Surely if the recruitment team are up to scratch, £5m should get us an upgrade? |
Why would £5m just automatically get us an upgrade ?
A player's worth is just that
Spunk £5m on a player doesn't make him an instant upgrade | |
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| What is the position with El-Miz? on 09:13 - Jul 21 with 2798 views | tractorboy1978 |
| What is the position with El-Miz? on 09:10 - Jul 21 by Rozz |
I don't think it's unwarranted. There's a McKenna factor here too - I think Morsy is probably a better player in the current system and under the current coaching staff than any of his previous stints in the Championship.
The reservations are over his age, longevity, future value.
Keep hold of him for as long as we can, I say. |
He was a solid Championship player playing in L1, he's not going to be a Premier league player playing in the Championship. | | | |
| What is the position with El-Miz? on 09:13 - Jul 21 with 2792 views | HighgateBlue |
| What is the position with El-Miz? on 08:51 - Jul 21 by Metal_Hacker |
How much do people actually think we would get for Morsy ?
I think some might be getting carried away with the "size" of potential fee
It'd perhaps be life changing for Sam but for the club it wouldn't be that significant a fee to allow us to upgrade without a gamble as such |
Yes, whilst we need to be prepared to lose some really good and popular players for decent fees at some point, in order to keep the project as a whole rolling along, we're not ever going to get enough for Morsy to make it worthwhile. He is worth an awful lot to us, as the heartbeat of the side and the main leader. But he's 32, has no likely improvement left in him, and obviously has a short shelf life.
Jordan Henderson (as an example of a Saudi-bound midfielder in his 30s) has been England and Liverpool captain, won the Champions League, 77 caps for England. He may be a year older than Morsy, but with respect, their CVs are chalk and cheese. And the word is that Henderson's fee is £12m.
Clearly some of the sums being bandied around are crazy, so I guess nothing should surprise us. But it seems to me that we wouldn't be able to sign a proven replacement for a couple of million, and I can't see that even the Saudis would be paying multiples of that sum.
We've been fishing in the same sort of pond transfer-wise for a while. The Broadheads, Davises, Hirsts, Clarkes have all been in the £1m to £2m category. Whilst they've all been really good investments, we could have afforded one or two of them not quite to come off, if the value of the others keeps increasing. I can't see that it is as comfortable to take that sort of calculated risk with the club captain and heartbeat of the side.
I would trust Luongo to do a job, certainly, but I just can't see the fee being big enough for Morsy to justify it. Very few players go for big money at 32. The last two years of Morsy's contract are potentially crucial years, and it would be a shame to lose momentum now. |  | | |
| What is the position with El-Miz? on 09:17 - Jul 21 with 2747 views | the_toff |
| What is the position with El-Miz? on 08:59 - Jul 21 by itfcjoe |
But if we can get a replacement and they cost £5m, then you'd assume there is hope that that play if all goes well could be worth £20m in the future.
The reality is player trading wise Morsy's value is close to £0, if that figure can be turned into £2.5m to £3m then you have to take it really and then trust yourselves to recruit well |
I can't see us getting anything close to £3m. I'm not sure why people are assuming we will be able to pull the Saudi's pants down on any deal. They know the salaries on offer are sufficient to unsettle players, but they'll still want value for transfer fees. Mitrovic being a good example of this. | | | |
| What is the position with El-Miz? on 09:21 - Jul 21 with 2734 views | Pinewoodblue |
| What is the position with El-Miz? on 08:59 - Jul 21 by itfcjoe |
But if we can get a replacement and they cost £5m, then you'd assume there is hope that that play if all goes well could be worth £20m in the future.
The reality is player trading wise Morsy's value is close to £0, if that figure can be turned into £2.5m to £3m then you have to take it really and then trust yourselves to recruit well |
Should the situation arise would hope the club did what was best for everyone, especially the player.
Not only would a move to Saudi benefit Sam financially but it would likely improve his chances of playing for his Country.
In Ashton we trust. |  |
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| What is the position with El-Miz? on 09:22 - Jul 21 with 2730 views | Guthrum |
Having signed a loan deal, El Mizouni cannot be recalled until January. Attempting to get him back now would destroy our credibility. |  |
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| What is the position with El-Miz? on 09:24 - Jul 21 with 2708 views | FrimleyBlue |
Wouldn't this just give Humphreys the opportunity to develop further.
Luongo becomes the Morsy and Taylor and Humphreys rotatw the other central position with Ball and Evans as backups. [Post edited 21 Jul 2023 9:30]
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| What is the position with El-Miz? on 09:27 - Jul 21 with 2680 views | Kieran_Knows |
Even if he came back he’d still be nowhere near the first team. |  |
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| What is the position with El-Miz? on 09:31 - Jul 21 with 2630 views | Churchman |
| What is the position with El-Miz? on 09:10 - Jul 21 by Rozz |
I don't think it's unwarranted. There's a McKenna factor here too - I think Morsy is probably a better player in the current system and under the current coaching staff than any of his previous stints in the Championship.
The reservations are over his age, longevity, future value.
Keep hold of him for as long as we can, I say. |
He fits how McKenna wants the team to play and if he wants to stay, brilliant. Keep him. He’s a great character and good for us.
If though he wants the Saudi challenge and the money that goes with it and they offer enough money for him, he should go with our thanks for a job well done. Age and longevity are a factor here and nobody is irreplaceable. |  | | |
| What is the position with El-Miz? on 09:35 - Jul 21 with 2615 views | GeoffSentence |
| What is the position with El-Miz? on 09:22 - Jul 21 by Guthrum |
Having signed a loan deal, El Mizouni cannot be recalled until January. Attempting to get him back now would destroy our credibility. |
Thanks Guthers, no recall until January, that was what I wanted to know.
As for the loss of reputation for trying to get him back now, where on the Ian Crook scale would that fall? | |
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| What is the position with El-Miz? on 09:37 - Jul 21 with 2594 views | itfcjoe |
| What is the position with El-Miz? on 09:04 - Jul 21 by Westcountryblue |
Is Sam Morsy's contribution over the next couple of years, both on and off the pitch, worth 3-4m. I'd argue that it perhaps is !
5m won't buy us much and certainly won't bring in the leadership qualities, immediate respect and bonds that Morsy current has within the squad. If we were able to push the boat out and get someone like Flynn Downes, i'd be interested.
I personally think we should improve his terms and over the next 2 years, scout tactically for a long term successor who we won't have to pay through the nose for. |
We bought Morsy for £150k when he was already a well known and well established Champ player (and we were a L1 club), you'd expect that with the budget we'd have you could replace him
The only way he is worth £3-4m to us is if he is the difference between getting in the PL and not | |
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| What is the position with El-Miz? on 09:41 - Jul 21 with 2564 views | Metal_Hacker |
| What is the position with El-Miz? on 09:37 - Jul 21 by itfcjoe |
We bought Morsy for £150k when he was already a well known and well established Champ player (and we were a L1 club), you'd expect that with the budget we'd have you could replace him
The only way he is worth £3-4m to us is if he is the difference between getting in the PL and not |
Joe you seemingly have a different view on how easy / hard it would be to replace Morsy ?
Who would you expect to pick up " with the budget we'd have" to replace Sam in all departments and to be able to hit the ground running bearing in mind how close we are to the start of the season ? | |
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