| Anybody silent on Gaza or an apologist for the I.D.F or Israeli state.... 23:12 - Jan 4 with 8128 views | BanksterDebtSlave |
Shame on you. |  |
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| What does it mean? I’ll translate for you… on 10:31 - Jan 5 with 990 views | Bloots |
| Anybody silent on Gaza or an apologist for the I.D.F or Israeli state.... on 09:06 - Jan 5 by SuperKieranMcKenna |
What a daft post - what does it even mean - if I don’t go on to Twitter and post 20 times a day about Gaza, shame on me? What difference does it make?
Does that also include all the other atrocities and Human Rights violations in China, Yemen, Sudan Ukraine. Is it shame on you for being silent on those? 10k civilians and 100k Ukrainian defenders have been killed but everyone has lost interest now, is it shame on people for being silent on that? |
….”I haven’t had much attention for a couple of weeks, in fact I didn’t post for a few days so the forum became a far more enjoyable place to be. But I’m back now and want to create some division and as a result get the attention that I desperately crave”
“Look at me!!! Please look at me!!!!” |  |
| Enduringly lovable, intelligent and thunderingly exquisite. |
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| Anybody silent on Gaza or an apologist for the I.D.F or Israeli state.... on 10:34 - Jan 5 with 969 views | Guthrum |
| Anybody silent on Gaza or an apologist for the I.D.F or Israeli state.... on 10:23 - Jan 5 by NthQldITFC |
It goes without saying that I defer to your superior understanding in this, but could not the promised or phased withdrawal of material and diplomatic support by the US put Israel into a situation of certain future collapse unless they were to come to the table to negotiate a two state solution and accept an international peacekeeping force in perpetuity.
Such would obviously precipitate regime change in Israel, but this time we could do it with a workable plan for the aftermath, supported by the sane elements of the people of both sides. |
Israel has enough of a domestic arms industry to keep themselves going in a realtively low-level situation like this (as opposed to a multi-front war against other nation states) for a considerable time. It would need an actual blockade to stop supplies of fuel and raw materials. Plus, in a country as frequently attacked as Israel, I would expect there to be significant stockpiles and reserves.
Netanyahu will fight tooth and nail (as he has been doing) to preserve his position. A political fall could well lead to prosecution and imprisonment for him personally. That's a strong motivation to take things to the bitter end, whatever the cost.
As for peacekeepers, who provides them? They would have to be at least reasonably acceptable to both sides, while also militarily and politically strong enough to actually do the job effectively. Plus having rules of engagement sufficiently robust that they are not mere bystanders to violence. |  |
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| Anybody silent on Gaza or an apologist for the I.D.F or Israeli state.... on 10:38 - Jan 5 with 945 views | eireblue |
| Anybody silent on Gaza or an apologist for the I.D.F or Israeli state.... on 10:09 - Jan 5 by blueasfook |
Is there a column for "those who hold a balanced point of view"? |
I hope you are taking Banksters list seriously, I know on occasion you can be a bit sarcastic and flippant. |  | | |
| Anybody silent on Gaza or an apologist for the I.D.F or Israeli state.... on 10:38 - Jan 5 with 943 views | Keno |
| Anybody silent on Gaza or an apologist for the I.D.F or Israeli state.... on 10:29 - Jan 5 by redrickstuhaart |
Virtually no one I have seen or heard, bar a few extremists, say Hamas is good. Its a strawman used by IDF apologists alongside weaponised disingenuous claims of anti semitism and "blood libel" to shut down criticism. I do fully understand though, why Hamas is massively attractive to a people who's alternatives are (1) back a terrorist organisation that will stand up and fight for them; or (2) be kicked out of their homes, killed, oppressed etc.
Of course the roots are historical and (disgracefully in 2024...) religous as well as the usual political and economic stuff. In essence though, if Israel pull back their "settlers" or had not pursued that disgraceful and deliuberate policy of invasion by degrees (still in breach of UN resolutions) things might be very different now. |
Ok lets rephrase that to say "Isreal Bad"
I was trying to say there could have been a solution which was rejected and its very much a two sided situation, not as one sided as some people like to make out |  |
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| What does it mean? I’ll translate for you… on 10:38 - Jan 5 with 934 views | blueasfook |
| What does it mean? I’ll translate for you… on 10:31 - Jan 5 by Bloots |
….”I haven’t had much attention for a couple of weeks, in fact I didn’t post for a few days so the forum became a far more enjoyable place to be. But I’m back now and want to create some division and as a result get the attention that I desperately crave”
“Look at me!!! Please look at me!!!!” |
Perfect summation Mr Bloots. |  |
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| Anybody silent on Gaza or an apologist for the I.D.F or Israeli state.... on 10:45 - Jan 5 with 916 views | Guthrum |
| Anybody silent on Gaza or an apologist for the I.D.F or Israeli state.... on 10:29 - Jan 5 by redrickstuhaart |
Virtually no one I have seen or heard, bar a few extremists, say Hamas is good. Its a strawman used by IDF apologists alongside weaponised disingenuous claims of anti semitism and "blood libel" to shut down criticism. I do fully understand though, why Hamas is massively attractive to a people who's alternatives are (1) back a terrorist organisation that will stand up and fight for them; or (2) be kicked out of their homes, killed, oppressed etc.
Of course the roots are historical and (disgracefully in 2024...) religous as well as the usual political and economic stuff. In essence though, if Israel pull back their "settlers" or had not pursued that disgraceful and deliuberate policy of invasion by degrees (still in breach of UN resolutions) things might be very different now. |
Tho the settler expansion has little direct influence in the Gaza situation. It only affects the other Palestinian Territory of the West Bank (run by Hamas' bitter rival Fatah).
What has been more significant is the long-term semi-siege of Gaza, the prevention of the import of raw materials (e.g. concrete) on the pretext it could be used to build fortifications (not entirely incorrect, judging by the tunnel network). Also the economic strangulation, which has actually fuelled backing for Hamas and hard-line groups, as the only hope for unemployed youths is working for the authorities or joining militias. | |
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| Anybody silent on Gaza or an apologist for the I.D.F or Israeli state.... on 10:47 - Jan 5 with 906 views | BanksterDebtSlave |
| Anybody silent on Gaza or an apologist for the I.D.F or Israeli state.... on 10:14 - Jan 5 by BiGDonnie |
Thoughts on the Travis signing? |
Sounds a good fit. | |
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| Anybody silent on Gaza or an apologist for the I.D.F or Israeli state.... on 10:50 - Jan 5 with 901 views | Ryorry |
| Anybody silent on Gaza or an apologist for the I.D.F or Israeli state.... on 10:23 - Jan 5 by NthQldITFC |
It goes without saying that I defer to your superior understanding in this, but could not the promised or phased withdrawal of material and diplomatic support by the US put Israel into a situation of certain future collapse unless they were to come to the table to negotiate a two state solution and accept an international peacekeeping force in perpetuity.
Such would obviously precipitate regime change in Israel, but this time we could do it with a workable plan for the aftermath, supported by the sane elements of the people of both sides. |
I'd add that there is plenty of opposition & dissent to Netanyahu & other govt. hawks amongst Israeli voters & younger people generally. Not sure what the current, up-to-date balance of thought is within the country, but I'd bet my bottom dollar that there's a large minority, if not a majority, who want to see them & their aggressive policies booted out.
Same applies to many Jewish people around the world. |  |
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| What does it mean? I’ll translate for you… on 10:51 - Jan 5 with 899 views | BanksterDebtSlave |
| What does it mean? I’ll translate for you… on 10:31 - Jan 5 by Bloots |
….”I haven’t had much attention for a couple of weeks, in fact I didn’t post for a few days so the forum became a far more enjoyable place to be. But I’m back now and want to create some division and as a result get the attention that I desperately crave”
“Look at me!!! Please look at me!!!!” |
Bless you Bloots that you perceive people interacting with you on here as attention. | |
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| What does it mean? I’ll translate for you… on 10:53 - Jan 5 with 890 views | MattinLondon |
| What does it mean? I’ll translate for you… on 10:31 - Jan 5 by Bloots |
….”I haven’t had much attention for a couple of weeks, in fact I didn’t post for a few days so the forum became a far more enjoyable place to be. But I’m back now and want to create some division and as a result get the attention that I desperately crave”
“Look at me!!! Please look at me!!!!” |
Whereas there are a few things in which I don’t agree with the OP, he is not an attention seeker and your post is a tad unnecessary. Agree or disagree with him but no need to make it personal. |  | | |
| What does it mean? I’ll translate for you… on 10:54 - Jan 5 with 884 views | BanksterDebtSlave |
| What does it mean? I’ll translate for you… on 10:38 - Jan 5 by blueasfook |
Perfect summation Mr Bloots. |
It's probably reassuring for you apologists to stick together. | |
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| What does it mean? I’ll translate for you… on 10:54 - Jan 5 with 891 views | blueasfook |
| What does it mean? I’ll translate for you… on 10:51 - Jan 5 by BanksterDebtSlave |
Bless you Bloots that you perceive people interacting with you on here as attention. |
Well I think he's right in that your OP was designed to be a little provocative - calling out people who don't buy the Corbyn brand of terrorist support. | |
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| Anybody silent on Gaza or an apologist for the I.D.F or Israeli state.... on 10:55 - Jan 5 with 878 views | NthQldITFC |
| Anybody silent on Gaza or an apologist for the I.D.F or Israeli state.... on 10:45 - Jan 5 by Guthrum |
Tho the settler expansion has little direct influence in the Gaza situation. It only affects the other Palestinian Territory of the West Bank (run by Hamas' bitter rival Fatah).
What has been more significant is the long-term semi-siege of Gaza, the prevention of the import of raw materials (e.g. concrete) on the pretext it could be used to build fortifications (not entirely incorrect, judging by the tunnel network). Also the economic strangulation, which has actually fuelled backing for Hamas and hard-line groups, as the only hope for unemployed youths is working for the authorities or joining militias. |
Whilst not direct in material terms, I would think that the illegal and violent settler expansion in the West Bank has had a huge psychological and emotional impact on the people of Gaza, even before the bombing and herding started. |  |
| # WE ARE STEALING THE FUTURE FROM OUR CHILDREN --- WE MUST CHANGE COURSE # | | Poll: | It's driving me nuts |
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| Anybody silent on Gaza or an apologist for the I.D.F or Israeli state.... on 10:55 - Jan 5 with 870 views | BanksterDebtSlave |
| Anybody silent on Gaza or an apologist for the I.D.F or Israeli state.... on 10:38 - Jan 5 by eireblue |
I hope you are taking Banksters list seriously, I know on occasion you can be a bit sarcastic and flippant. |
There's a special, 'likes a vegan beach holiday' column for you. So looks like a result! | |
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| What does it mean? I’ll translate for you… on 10:57 - Jan 5 with 866 views | blueasfook |
| What does it mean? I’ll translate for you… on 10:53 - Jan 5 by MattinLondon |
Whereas there are a few things in which I don’t agree with the OP, he is not an attention seeker and your post is a tad unnecessary. Agree or disagree with him but no need to make it personal. |
Calling people who hold a different view "apologists" isn't exactly helpful either. | |
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| What does it mean? I’ll translate for you… on 10:58 - Jan 5 with 856 views | BanksterDebtSlave |
| What does it mean? I’ll translate for you… on 10:54 - Jan 5 by blueasfook |
Well I think he's right in that your OP was designed to be a little provocative - calling out people who don't buy the Corbyn brand of terrorist support. |
Lol!! | |
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| Anybody silent on Gaza or an apologist for the I.D.F or Israeli state.... on 11:08 - Jan 5 with 805 views | Guthrum |
| Anybody silent on Gaza or an apologist for the I.D.F or Israeli state.... on 10:55 - Jan 5 by NthQldITFC |
Whilst not direct in material terms, I would think that the illegal and violent settler expansion in the West Bank has had a huge psychological and emotional impact on the people of Gaza, even before the bombing and herding started. |
Yes, certainly it adds to the atmosphere of oppression against Palestinians.
Of perhaps more significance, but little mentioned, is what's been happening at the Al-Aqsa Mosque/Dome of the Rock complex in Jerusalem. It is of great importance as the third holiest site in Islam, plus the spiritual heart of Palestine. The Israeli govenment has brought in more restrictions for Muslim worshippers, while controversially not taking action against hard-line Jewish groups who persist in going up there to conduct (nominally illegal) acts of worship on the Temple site*. Visits by fairly senior figures have led to often violent protest.
* Not the same as the Western (or Wailing) Wall, part of the external retaining wall of the Temple Mount and outside of the area exclusively reserved for Muslim worship. | |
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| He’s literally called out…. on 11:09 - Jan 5 with 802 views | Bloots |
| What does it mean? I’ll translate for you… on 10:53 - Jan 5 by MattinLondon |
Whereas there are a few things in which I don’t agree with the OP, he is not an attention seeker and your post is a tad unnecessary. Agree or disagree with him but no need to make it personal. |
….anyone that doesn’t condemn Israel/IDF on a football forum as “apologists”.
I’d suggest that was “totally unnecessary”, not me calling him a massive attention seeker.
Which he plainly is.
Cheers. | |
| Enduringly lovable, intelligent and thunderingly exquisite. |
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| Anybody silent on Gaza or an apologist for the I.D.F or Israeli state.... on 11:18 - Jan 5 with 743 views | Guthrum |
| Anybody silent on Gaza or an apologist for the I.D.F or Israeli state.... on 10:50 - Jan 5 by Ryorry |
I'd add that there is plenty of opposition & dissent to Netanyahu & other govt. hawks amongst Israeli voters & younger people generally. Not sure what the current, up-to-date balance of thought is within the country, but I'd bet my bottom dollar that there's a large minority, if not a majority, who want to see them & their aggressive policies booted out.
Same applies to many Jewish people around the world. |
From recent election results, direct voter support for Netanyahu appears to be only around 25%. However he can rely on certain hard-line parties (with fanatical, if small, supporter bases and whose demands he has no bother about allowing) to get him just over the line. | |
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| Anybody silent on Gaza or an apologist for the I.D.F or Israeli state.... on 11:44 - Jan 5 with 700 views | BlueForYou |
It is a football forum, you should be expressing your frustrations elsewhere. Perhaps set up a Politics section? |  | | |
| Anybody silent on Gaza or an apologist for the I.D.F or Israeli state.... on 11:46 - Jan 5 with 670 views | redrickstuhaart |
| Anybody silent on Gaza or an apologist for the I.D.F or Israeli state.... on 11:44 - Jan 5 by BlueForYou |
It is a football forum, you should be expressing your frustrations elsewhere. Perhaps set up a Politics section? |
You realise that this is in the non football section right? |  | | |
| Anybody silent on Gaza or an apologist for the I.D.F or Israeli state.... on 11:51 - Jan 5 with 648 views | eireblue |
| Anybody silent on Gaza or an apologist for the I.D.F or Israeli state.... on 10:55 - Jan 5 by BanksterDebtSlave |
There's a special, 'likes a vegan beach holiday' column for you. So looks like a result! |
Tel Aviv is one of the best places for Vegans and has a lovely beach, really enjoyed my time out there, thoroughly recommend it, so happy to be in that column.
But, I am not entirely sure you are doing enough for the Palestinians. | | | |
| Anybody silent on Gaza or an apologist for the I.D.F or Israeli state.... on 11:52 - Jan 5 with 640 views | DJR |
| Anybody silent on Gaza or an apologist for the I.D.F or Israeli state.... on 11:18 - Jan 5 by Guthrum |
From recent election results, direct voter support for Netanyahu appears to be only around 25%. However he can rely on certain hard-line parties (with fanatical, if small, supporter bases and whose demands he has no bother about allowing) to get him just over the line. |
Netanyahu is doomed but the following from Haaretz suggests little chance of a move away from a hard-line approach to Gaza.
"Two polls from A-Chord found only 11 and 10 percent of Israeli Jews who identified as left-wing in mid- and late-October, respectively. In those polls, 54-55 percent of the total population is right-wing, and fully two-thirds of Israeli Jews say they are right-wing at present – consistent with recent years, but creeping up."
I also posted this back on 17 December based on something I read in Haaretz.
"Recent polling indicates that National Unity is the beneficiary of anti-Netanyahu sentiment. And with it being part of the unity government, and with it having two members in the war cabinet, it is difficult to see any change of approach with a change of government.
That polling indicates a hardening of opinion more generally, with the two left wing parties, Labour and Meretz predicted to get no seats in the Knesset." |  | | |
| Anybody silent on Gaza or an apologist for the I.D.F or Israeli state.... on 12:12 - Jan 5 with 608 views | factual_blue |
You little tinker.
Phil's inbox will be alight. |  |
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| Anybody silent on Gaza or an apologist for the I.D.F or Israeli state.... on 12:22 - Jan 5 with 583 views | Guthrum |
| Anybody silent on Gaza or an apologist for the I.D.F or Israeli state.... on 11:52 - Jan 5 by DJR |
Netanyahu is doomed but the following from Haaretz suggests little chance of a move away from a hard-line approach to Gaza.
"Two polls from A-Chord found only 11 and 10 percent of Israeli Jews who identified as left-wing in mid- and late-October, respectively. In those polls, 54-55 percent of the total population is right-wing, and fully two-thirds of Israeli Jews say they are right-wing at present – consistent with recent years, but creeping up."
I also posted this back on 17 December based on something I read in Haaretz.
"Recent polling indicates that National Unity is the beneficiary of anti-Netanyahu sentiment. And with it being part of the unity government, and with it having two members in the war cabinet, it is difficult to see any change of approach with a change of government.
That polling indicates a hardening of opinion more generally, with the two left wing parties, Labour and Meretz predicted to get no seats in the Knesset." |
Indeed. Much like the US, Russia (and several other places*) the opposition is considerably more right wing/nationalist than anything like the UK's norms.
* Aung Sung Su Kyi might be pro-democracy, but she turned out to as hardline on the Rohingya as the Burmese military. | |
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