| Kemi or Suella? 09:33 - Jul 5 with 10831 views | DJR |
With the demise of Mordaunt, I think the next leader of the Tory party will be Badenoch or Braverman, especially given the make-up of the membership (assuming the membership is allowed a vote).
Whilst this may help in the fight against Farage, I am not not sure a drift to the right is a winning formula.
On the other hand, if Labour do screw it up, who knows what might happen? |  | | |  |
| Kemi or Suella? on 17:13 - Jul 5 with 2272 views | pointofblue |
| Kemi or Suella? on 12:39 - Jul 5 by Churchman |
They’ll be in denial for years. They much prefer fighting amongst what’s left of their sorry party than governing. Like last time, they’ll search for all the wrong reasons get through two or three leaders before finding something nearly human. If they ever return to power it won’t be for at least 20 years.
They’re finished and can be ignored now. |
As said, it's what happened after 1997 too. In fairness, Hague himself wasn't right wing but the party was a mess after that election - very much like it is today. When he lost 2001, they then lurched further to the right under Duncan-Smith, who wasn't even allowed to fight a general election, then again under Howard.
I can see the same thing happening now, bar a relative moderate won't be allowed to try and hold things together unlike in 1997. The likes of Osborne, Warsi and Buckland were already making concerned noises about a move to the right during yesterday's election coverage. |  |
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| Kemi or Suella? on 17:14 - Jul 5 with 2270 views | chicoazul |
Gonna be Patel. |  |
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| Kemi or Suella? on 17:18 - Jul 5 with 2259 views | vapour_trail |
| Kemi or Suella? on 12:00 - Jul 5 by bluebudgie |
Stop using the term"far right" when discussing Reforms with over 4 million voters I prefer the term not far right but RIGHT. You will be coming out with nonsense that those 4 million-plus are all fascists next as that's what you ultra-lefties always retort! |
How you prefer to be described is essentially completely irrelevant to what you are. |  |
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| Kemi or Suella? on 17:43 - Jul 5 with 2215 views | monkeymagic |
Is it conceivable that Cameron will take over, in a sort of Michael Howerd steady the ship/safe pair of hands kind of way, pending a new messiah turning up over the coming years? | | | |
| Kemi or Suella? on 17:44 - Jul 5 with 2213 views | DJR |
| Kemi or Suella? on 16:51 - Jul 5 by positivity |
fair enough, i mainly hear about him as a relatively sane tory, but it is all relative! |
He certainly is pleasant but one thing that stands out for me is the fact that, despite being a Remainer, he was conspicuous by his absence from the cross-party Remain campaign I took part in his constituency.
Tory members told me it was because he didn't want to offend his Brexiter members, but I thought it showed a total lack of courage and principles for someone who bangs on so much about his military background. | | | |
| Kemi or Suella? on 17:47 - Jul 5 with 2196 views | GlasgowBlue |
| Kemi or Suella? on 14:54 - Jul 5 by positivity |
don't see where you're coming from there?
truss was the most right wing since at least thatcher, corbyn was the most left wing since foot. both within 5 years! |
Thatcher wasn't particularly right wing when she was in power. She lurched further to the right after she left. |  |
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| Kemi or Suella? on 17:57 - Jul 5 with 2156 views | positivity |
| Kemi or Suella? on 17:47 - Jul 5 by GlasgowBlue |
Thatcher wasn't particularly right wing when she was in power. She lurched further to the right after she left. |
some aspects were very right wing, others less so. definitely far too right wing for me!
if you asked the person on the street to give an example of the conservative party, a lot would still point to her | |
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| Kemi or Suella? on 18:18 - Jul 5 with 2128 views | wkj |
| Kemi or Suella? on 12:00 - Jul 5 by bluebudgie |
Stop using the term"far right" when discussing Reforms with over 4 million voters I prefer the term not far right but RIGHT. You will be coming out with nonsense that those 4 million-plus are all fascists next as that's what you ultra-lefties always retort! |
Its based mostly on some of the candidates behaviour in the run up to the election. Though I didn't exactly call Reform a far right party, I said the far right have their party, and to them it is Reform above any other party. |  |
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| Kemi or Suella? on 18:40 - Jul 5 with 2091 views | BlueBadger |
| Kemi or Suella? on 17:43 - Jul 5 by monkeymagic |
Is it conceivable that Cameron will take over, in a sort of Michael Howerd steady the ship/safe pair of hands kind of way, pending a new messiah turning up over the coming years? |
Cameron is a deeply unpopular fraud who as found out a decade ago, though. Plus, the surviving rump of the Tory is either feeble forelock tuggers of walking embodiments of the Dunning-Kruger curve like the aforementioned. No way are they going to tolerate someone who likes to pretend he’s a ‘moderate’. |  |
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| Kemi or Suella? on 19:46 - Jul 5 with 2029 views | USA |
| Kemi or Suella? on 09:56 - Jul 5 by GavTWTD |
What other choices do they have? Hunt? |
Edited. Hunt didn’t lose his seat. I am sure I read on BBC news he had at about 4.30am! My mistake. [Post edited 5 Jul 2024 19:51]
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| Kemi or Suella? on 19:47 - Jul 5 with 2026 views | USA |
I detest Braverman. A despicable person | |
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| Kemi or Suella? on 19:58 - Jul 5 with 1999 views | GlasgowBlue |
This is good from Eric Pickles
Ten random thoughts on the Conservative Party collapse at the GE and where we go next from an ex-Party Chairman
1. Do not assume this is rock bottom; we could face oblivion at the next election. Our fate is in the hands of our parliamentary party in a proper partnership with the voluntary party
2. Reform was not responsible for our losses - we were. The result was not an accident; the voters used their votes to remove Conservatives from government. The voters were not sending a message; they were dismissing us
3. Reform took 5 seats from us. The LibDems gained 63. There are now no safe seats
4. The digital world has eclipsed the influence of newspapers and TV. The Conservatives fought an analogue campaign on digital platforms. Our attempts at memes looked like 1990’s PPB or Posters. Labour’s and Respect’s were witty and targeted
5. Warning against a Super Majority is a two-edged sword. It tells your people you have lost and reminds your opponents to vote tactically.
6. Tactical voting will be massively influential at the next GE
7. The Conservative Party is only successful when it is a broad collection of the centre-right. We join together to promote enterprise and individual freedom within the rule of law. We can only do this together in government
8. We should take our time picking the Party's next Leader. Create time for the best person to bring us together to emerge. Treat the voluntary Party respectfully, start the process at our Annual Conference and end it in late November.
9. Do not lecture the public; listen to the wisdom of the people; in furtherance of that, adopt a PPC in every target seat by March 2026 to coordinate that engagement
10. Above all, the Conservative must unambiguously set its moral compass in the direction of public service, obligation and duty firmly based on the Nolan Principles of Public Life (selflessness, integrity, objectivity, accountability, openness, honesty and leadership) | |
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| Kemi or Suella? on 21:28 - Jul 5 with 1926 views | skankerman |
As a Conservative supporter for me none of them shape up
The Torries were arrogant when in power and these 2 were part of the problem
Internally scoring points was more important than the country itself
Life moves on we are past Jay Tabb as a standard | | | |
| Kemi or Suella? on 23:10 - Jul 5 with 1880 views | Europablue |
A move to the right is the only option for the Conservatives because they were far too left wing. People think that they voted to get rid of the Tories, but they really got a very similar option that will continue to steer the country in the wrong direction, maybe even faster because Labour have a knack of pushing away wealth creators.
I really don't understand why stopping illegal immigration has become a right wing issue. No illegal immigration should be allowed. You can be as generous or as mean as you like, but illegal immigration should not be tolerated. It enriches people traffickers, endangers lives, and punishes people who play by the rules.
The right and the left have diverged way too far.
The right shouldn't be about profit at all costs. The left shouldn't be all about individual rights and no responsibilities.
All parties should be based on building strong communities. | | | |
| Kemi or Suella? on 23:16 - Jul 5 with 1874 views | redrickstuhaart |
| Kemi or Suella? on 23:10 - Jul 5 by Europablue |
A move to the right is the only option for the Conservatives because they were far too left wing. People think that they voted to get rid of the Tories, but they really got a very similar option that will continue to steer the country in the wrong direction, maybe even faster because Labour have a knack of pushing away wealth creators.
I really don't understand why stopping illegal immigration has become a right wing issue. No illegal immigration should be allowed. You can be as generous or as mean as you like, but illegal immigration should not be tolerated. It enriches people traffickers, endangers lives, and punishes people who play by the rules.
The right and the left have diverged way too far.
The right shouldn't be about profit at all costs. The left shouldn't be all about individual rights and no responsibilities.
All parties should be based on building strong communities. |
What utter nonsense.
Boris, Sunak, Truss et al too far left? They have lost the centrists because they are nasty self interested bigots. | | | |
| Kemi or Suella? on 23:20 - Jul 5 with 1870 views | redrickstuhaart |
| Kemi or Suella? on 12:00 - Jul 5 by bluebudgie |
Stop using the term"far right" when discussing Reforms with over 4 million voters I prefer the term not far right but RIGHT. You will be coming out with nonsense that those 4 million-plus are all fascists next as that's what you ultra-lefties always retort! |
I will continue using it, because it is accurate.
Xenophobic, purposely divisive, obsessed with johnny foreigner and to the right of an already heavily right lenaing tory party. Full of bigots, racists.
Reform is basically Ukip and BNP reloaded. Regardless of who voted for it.
On your logic, the nazi party were never far right, because they got lots of votes. Absurd. | | | |
| Kemi or Suella? on 23:30 - Jul 5 with 1863 views | positivity |
| Kemi or Suella? on 23:10 - Jul 5 by Europablue |
A move to the right is the only option for the Conservatives because they were far too left wing. People think that they voted to get rid of the Tories, but they really got a very similar option that will continue to steer the country in the wrong direction, maybe even faster because Labour have a knack of pushing away wealth creators.
I really don't understand why stopping illegal immigration has become a right wing issue. No illegal immigration should be allowed. You can be as generous or as mean as you like, but illegal immigration should not be tolerated. It enriches people traffickers, endangers lives, and punishes people who play by the rules.
The right and the left have diverged way too far.
The right shouldn't be about profit at all costs. The left shouldn't be all about individual rights and no responsibilities.
All parties should be based on building strong communities. |
far too left wing?! that's the bizarrest take i've seen. they made the "nasty party" of theresa may look like cuddly liberals.
what would be the "move to the right wing" alternative to rwanda? sending asylum seekers to the moon? taking the reform route and shooting them? the mind boggles | |
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| Kemi or Suella? on 23:31 - Jul 5 with 1860 views | Europablue |
| Kemi or Suella? on 10:02 - Jul 5 by wkj |
From what I am seeing, cut you losses and stop trying to be reform. The far right have their party now, the conservatives need to go back to being the centre right party with a knack for fiscal control, without austerity being the go to.
Trying to run the party instead of the country is 100% why the Tories lost. They can ill afford to go to war with Reform while maintaining their own division, otherwise they will continue to fade while Labour grows as the centre right choice and reform grows as the far right choice. |
In what world are Labour centre right? The Conservatives are centre left, and Labour are further left of them. | | | |
| Kemi or Suella? on 23:38 - Jul 5 with 1837 views | positivity |
| Kemi or Suella? on 23:31 - Jul 5 by Europablue |
In what world are Labour centre right? The Conservatives are centre left, and Labour are further left of them. |
as blackadder might say, wibble | |
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| Kemi or Suella? on 00:49 - Jul 6 with 1810 views | reusersfreekicks |
| Kemi or Suella? on 12:00 - Jul 5 by bluebudgie |
Stop using the term"far right" when discussing Reforms with over 4 million voters I prefer the term not far right but RIGHT. You will be coming out with nonsense that those 4 million-plus are all fascists next as that's what you ultra-lefties always retort! |
They are |  | | |
| Kemi or Suella? on 05:27 - Jul 6 with 1765 views | WeWereZombies |
| Kemi or Suella? on 23:31 - Jul 5 by Europablue |
In what world are Labour centre right? The Conservatives are centre left, and Labour are further left of them. |
Perceptions differ from person to person and across the vectors of all the different influences on our daily lives. I see Starmer's centralising control of Labour as a centre right device to ensure that a uniform power prevails in the party and extends into government and the wider establishment. I would regard the Green Party as a centre ground approach to the challenges the United Kingdom faces over the coming centuries and the Conservative/Reform bunfight as a thoroughly unBritish far right puppet with the strings being pulled by foreign powers.
I suppose that leaves Bankster's anarchist tendency as the only truly left wing voice in this forum but I subscribe to the view that anarchists appears left wing when the going is easy but become hyper authoritarian and right wing when the going gets tough. Still, no Bankster, no party... |  |
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| Kemi or Suella? on 07:47 - Jul 6 with 1698 views | Buhrer |
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| Kemi or Suella? on 07:59 - Jul 6 with 1671 views | bluelagos |
| Kemi or Suella? on 19:58 - Jul 5 by GlasgowBlue |
This is good from Eric Pickles
Ten random thoughts on the Conservative Party collapse at the GE and where we go next from an ex-Party Chairman
1. Do not assume this is rock bottom; we could face oblivion at the next election. Our fate is in the hands of our parliamentary party in a proper partnership with the voluntary party
2. Reform was not responsible for our losses - we were. The result was not an accident; the voters used their votes to remove Conservatives from government. The voters were not sending a message; they were dismissing us
3. Reform took 5 seats from us. The LibDems gained 63. There are now no safe seats
4. The digital world has eclipsed the influence of newspapers and TV. The Conservatives fought an analogue campaign on digital platforms. Our attempts at memes looked like 1990’s PPB or Posters. Labour’s and Respect’s were witty and targeted
5. Warning against a Super Majority is a two-edged sword. It tells your people you have lost and reminds your opponents to vote tactically.
6. Tactical voting will be massively influential at the next GE
7. The Conservative Party is only successful when it is a broad collection of the centre-right. We join together to promote enterprise and individual freedom within the rule of law. We can only do this together in government
8. We should take our time picking the Party's next Leader. Create time for the best person to bring us together to emerge. Treat the voluntary Party respectfully, start the process at our Annual Conference and end it in late November.
9. Do not lecture the public; listen to the wisdom of the people; in furtherance of that, adopt a PPC in every target seat by March 2026 to coordinate that engagement
10. Above all, the Conservative must unambiguously set its moral compass in the direction of public service, obligation and duty firmly based on the Nolan Principles of Public Life (selflessness, integrity, objectivity, accountability, openness, honesty and leadership) |
Htf can anyone who supported Boris Johnson's election to the office of PM even mention the Nolan principles?
The problem Eric Pickles has got is that he was happy supporting a deceitful, dishonest piece of sht like Johnson so how can he now expect to be taken seriously when raising the need to consider those principles now?
What he says is fair - but all a bit hypocritical given his previous stance which is basically we will turn the other cheek to Johnson's character when he is winning elections for us.
Unless you were a Tory who actually rejected Johnson and all he stood for in politics then I think it's a bit rich.
Tories need a major reset - it's taken the Liberals 14 years (Since 2010) to be forgiven for their deceit - suspect the Tories may have to wait some time before anyone trusts them again. |  |
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| Kemi or Suella? on 08:01 - Jul 6 with 1658 views | GlasgowBlue |
| Kemi or Suella? on 07:59 - Jul 6 by bluelagos |
Htf can anyone who supported Boris Johnson's election to the office of PM even mention the Nolan principles?
The problem Eric Pickles has got is that he was happy supporting a deceitful, dishonest piece of sht like Johnson so how can he now expect to be taken seriously when raising the need to consider those principles now?
What he says is fair - but all a bit hypocritical given his previous stance which is basically we will turn the other cheek to Johnson's character when he is winning elections for us.
Unless you were a Tory who actually rejected Johnson and all he stood for in politics then I think it's a bit rich.
Tories need a major reset - it's taken the Liberals 14 years (Since 2010) to be forgiven for their deceit - suspect the Tories may have to wait some time before anyone trusts them again. |
So you agree with the points he makes just not the person making them?
Edit. I’m not sure Pickles has ever been a Johnson supporter. [Post edited 6 Jul 2024 8:07]
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