| Trump....all you need to know. 06:58 - Jan 21 with 23680 views | BanksterDebtSlave |
Trump also signed an executive order temporarily delaying the enforcement of a federal ban on TikTok for at least 75 days. “I guess I have a warm spot for TikTok that I didn’t have originally,” Trump said at the White House. |  |
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| Trump....all you need to know. on 16:28 - Jan 22 with 2140 views | DanTheMan |
| Trump....all you need to know. on 16:22 - Jan 22 by DJR |
This definition no doubt being governed by the pro-life idea that the right to life exists from conception. |
I imagine that's what they are going for.
The unfortunate side effect is that now everybody in the USA is a woman. |  |
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| Trump....all you need to know. on 16:28 - Jan 22 with 2142 views | NeverSayDie |
Haven’t read all the posts, so could be a repeat, but I see he has also now removed employment discrimination rights, apparently on the basis they are discriminatory 🙃 now people can get back to hiring white people, er, I mean people based on merit 😉
All there is left now, is to grab a few women’s ***** and get the white sheets out I guess 🤷♂️ I mean to think that many people from ethnic backgrounds voted for this guy, is just insane, but as has been voiced previously many times, Americans don’t care who runs the Country, as long as they think their bank balance will look better, very hard to have a sensible conversation with such short sighted individuals. |  | | |
| Trump....all you need to know. on 16:29 - Jan 22 with 2122 views | StokieBlue |
| Trump....all you need to know. on 16:28 - Jan 22 by DanTheMan |
I imagine that's what they are going for.
The unfortunate side effect is that now everybody in the USA is a woman. |
We've got a lot more of this to look forward to over the next few years.
Science is their enemy and they intend to battle it.
SB |  | | |
| Trump....all you need to know. on 16:31 - Jan 22 with 2117 views | DJR |
| Trump....all you need to know. on 16:19 - Jan 22 by Europablue |
Good points.
I take note of your point in the final paragraph, but would counter that however you feel about the two parties independently you could argue that the Republican appointed judges tend to have a textualist interpretation of the constitution, whereas the Democrat appointed judges tend tend to have an originalist interpretation. In my view you have to follow what the words actually say rather than what you think they mean in the modern context.
Roe v Wade was a poor ruling and was rightly repealed regardless of the moral arguments on either side. The law should be changed, and if that cannot be agreed upon, then this issue is not something that the supreme court should rule on. |
I can't say I am an expert when it comes to American judicial interpretation, but I think you may find that your view amounts to originalism.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Originalism
But whatever the case, my view as a lawyer is that political judges are wrong, and do not fit with the idea that justice must not only be done but must also be seen to be done.
I might add that I have similar issues with respect to prosecutions. [Post edited 22 Jan 16:39]
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| Trump....all you need to know. on 16:55 - Jan 22 with 2051 views | DJR |
| Trump....all you need to know. on 16:28 - Jan 22 by DanTheMan |
I imagine that's what they are going for.
The unfortunate side effect is that now everybody in the USA is a woman. |
In the world they live in, you couldn't rule out their also trying to prevent transgender foetuses!
It also makes one wonder how many other Presidential decrees will stand up to scrutiny, given they won't have been subject to the sort of attention to detail that normal legislation is. [Post edited 22 Jan 17:05]
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| Trump....all you need to know. on 18:12 - Jan 22 with 1993 views | lowhouseblue |
| Trump....all you need to know. on 16:28 - Jan 22 by DanTheMan |
I imagine that's what they are going for.
The unfortunate side effect is that now everybody in the USA is a woman. |
that's very good. |  |
| And so as the loose-bowelled pigeon of time swoops low over the unsuspecting tourist of destiny, and the flatulent skunk of fate wanders into the air-conditioning system of eternity, I notice it's the end of the show |
| |
| Trump....all you need to know. on 18:19 - Jan 22 with 1976 views | reusersfreekicks |
| Trump....all you need to know. on 15:29 - Jan 22 by LeifingLaVidaLoca |
Seeing as we are having an old timers reunion… Good to see you back Herbie.
SM x |
Seconded! |  | | |
| Trump....all you need to know. on 19:19 - Jan 22 with 1910 views | redrickstuhaart |
| Trump....all you need to know. on 16:19 - Jan 22 by Europablue |
Good points.
I take note of your point in the final paragraph, but would counter that however you feel about the two parties independently you could argue that the Republican appointed judges tend to have a textualist interpretation of the constitution, whereas the Democrat appointed judges tend tend to have an originalist interpretation. In my view you have to follow what the words actually say rather than what you think they mean in the modern context.
Roe v Wade was a poor ruling and was rightly repealed regardless of the moral arguments on either side. The law should be changed, and if that cannot be agreed upon, then this issue is not something that the supreme court should rule on. |
No. You couldn't. They have a political / ideological / religous interpretation and find ways of justifying it.
Roe was plainly not a poor ruling. It took a loaded court full of religous right wingers to overturn it- and even then it came as a surprise to most legal commentators. |  | | |
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| Trump....all you need to know. on 09:08 - Jan 23 with 1721 views | DJR |
| Trump....all you need to know. on 16:52 - Jan 21 by DJR |
In my view, the US ban in relation to Tik Tok is part of the hegemonic struggle between the US and China, although Trump has changed his mind because it emerged during the campaign that he was popular on it.
As it is, I am glad that Darren Jones reiterated a point I made on here a few weeks ago about people dancing in Barnsley on TIk Tok not being a national security threat.
https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/tiktok-ban-trump-china-uk-b268233
Finally, closing down Tik Tok or, as Trump suggested a couple of days ago, ensuring a US stake, would certainly appear to suit the tech bros now on board with him. [Post edited 21 Jan 17:06]
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At last! Something I agree with Trump on.
When Hannity asked Trump about the allegations made by both Democrat and Republican lawmakers that TikTok was being used as a tool for Beijing to spy on people, he shrugged off the implication.
“Is it that important for China to be spying on young people, on young kids watching crazy videos?” Trump asked. | | | |
| Trump....all you need to know. on 09:34 - Jan 23 with 1661 views | Europablue |
| Trump....all you need to know. on 19:19 - Jan 22 by redrickstuhaart |
No. You couldn't. They have a political / ideological / religous interpretation and find ways of justifying it.
Roe was plainly not a poor ruling. It took a loaded court full of religous right wingers to overturn it- and even then it came as a surprise to most legal commentators. |
Your comments are not internally consistent. It cannot be the result of religious zealotry and also a big surprise that Roe vs Wade was overturned.
Either the Republican appointed judges were obviously going to overturn the ruling, or they are not as biased as you say and they really considered all aspects before overturning the ruling.
The right to privacy is tenuous reasoning for legalizing abortion.
By the way, I believe that abortion should be legal with strict conditions with medical oversight and a reasonable, but not long term limit.
If abortion is to be legalized federally, it should be done with a federal law. I have no opinion on whether the American people should vote for that federally, because that is entirely up to them to balance both compelling sides of the argument. | | | |
| Trump....all you need to know. on 09:42 - Jan 23 with 1630 views | redrickstuhaart |
| Trump....all you need to know. on 09:34 - Jan 23 by Europablue |
Your comments are not internally consistent. It cannot be the result of religious zealotry and also a big surprise that Roe vs Wade was overturned.
Either the Republican appointed judges were obviously going to overturn the ruling, or they are not as biased as you say and they really considered all aspects before overturning the ruling.
The right to privacy is tenuous reasoning for legalizing abortion.
By the way, I believe that abortion should be legal with strict conditions with medical oversight and a reasonable, but not long term limit.
If abortion is to be legalized federally, it should be done with a federal law. I have no opinion on whether the American people should vote for that federally, because that is entirely up to them to balance both compelling sides of the argument. |
What utter tosh. The court was loaded but people were still surprised that they let their political biases so overtly override their professional integrity.
You really do post some slippery disingenuous stuff. | | | |
| Trump....all you need to know. on 11:01 - Jan 23 with 1541 views | lowhouseblue |
| Trump....all you need to know. on 21:50 - Jan 21 by eireblue |
What would you tell a current Farage supporter that is a member of the working class, in order that they would vote for a party in the centre? |
the first thing we need to do is have an honest and open discussion of immigration and recognise that it is a top issue for many voters. it needs to be a discussion which isn't shut down by accusations of racism or that raising the issue is pandering to the far right. it needs to treat the level of immigration as something that is decided through the democratic process, controlled by voters, and not something that, as many people believe, is imposed on them regardless of what they think. if there is one issue that makes many people feel that have no control over their communities it is this.
it needs to recognise that by a very large majority most people in the uk now think current immigration is unsustainably high. it needs to recognise the experience of people who think that - and not dismiss them and belittle them.
i've previously posted the ONS statistics which show that net immigration to the uk in the last 4 years was 3 million people. (interestingly, given the extreme focus on the issue there, immigration into the usa (a country 5 times larger) in the same period was 10 million). what i hadn't seen before was these estimates of illegal migrants in the uk (ie those out staying visas) at a further 1 million.:
https://www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2025/01/22/one-in-12-in-london-is-an-illega | |
| And so as the loose-bowelled pigeon of time swoops low over the unsuspecting tourist of destiny, and the flatulent skunk of fate wanders into the air-conditioning system of eternity, I notice it's the end of the show |
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| Trump....all you need to know. on 11:28 - Jan 23 with 1456 views | StokieBlue |
| Trump....all you need to know. on 11:01 - Jan 23 by lowhouseblue |
the first thing we need to do is have an honest and open discussion of immigration and recognise that it is a top issue for many voters. it needs to be a discussion which isn't shut down by accusations of racism or that raising the issue is pandering to the far right. it needs to treat the level of immigration as something that is decided through the democratic process, controlled by voters, and not something that, as many people believe, is imposed on them regardless of what they think. if there is one issue that makes many people feel that have no control over their communities it is this.
it needs to recognise that by a very large majority most people in the uk now think current immigration is unsustainably high. it needs to recognise the experience of people who think that - and not dismiss them and belittle them.
i've previously posted the ONS statistics which show that net immigration to the uk in the last 4 years was 3 million people. (interestingly, given the extreme focus on the issue there, immigration into the usa (a country 5 times larger) in the same period was 10 million). what i hadn't seen before was these estimates of illegal migrants in the uk (ie those out staying visas) at a further 1 million.:
https://www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2025/01/22/one-in-12-in-london-is-an-illega |
Just to clarify as it's not fully clear in the post, there is no time limit on that illegal immigrant estimate. It's also a bit strange, it claims that the research implies that 1 in 12 people in London is an illegal immigrant which I find very hard to believe.
After looking into to this for just a couple of minutes the Telegraph seems to be twisting the facts to suit it's narrative:
"Section: 3.36:
"Not all population is accounted for in official statistics. To take account of “hidden” population, for short-term migrants and second addresses we apply an additional allowance, based on a study by Edge Analytics. This allowance totals an additional population of 665,170, the majority of which are within London.".
The Telegraph seems to have decided all these people are illegal immigrants which doesn't seem to be what the report says.
I wonder why they have done that?
SB | | | |
| Trump....all you need to know. on 11:53 - Jan 23 with 1408 views | lowhouseblue |
| Trump....all you need to know. on 11:28 - Jan 23 by StokieBlue |
Just to clarify as it's not fully clear in the post, there is no time limit on that illegal immigrant estimate. It's also a bit strange, it claims that the research implies that 1 in 12 people in London is an illegal immigrant which I find very hard to believe.
After looking into to this for just a couple of minutes the Telegraph seems to be twisting the facts to suit it's narrative:
"Section: 3.36:
"Not all population is accounted for in official statistics. To take account of “hidden” population, for short-term migrants and second addresses we apply an additional allowance, based on a study by Edge Analytics. This allowance totals an additional population of 665,170, the majority of which are within London.".
The Telegraph seems to have decided all these people are illegal immigrants which doesn't seem to be what the report says.
I wonder why they have done that?
SB |
it's obviously a hard thing to estimate, so you are right that it needs to be treated with caution. but it seems a serious study for a reason and by people who have no obvious skin in the game. i suspect the 1 in 12 is just chosen as a good headline grabber. the last time an official national figure was given was early in the century with a total of approx .5 million - given that most of the people falling into this category are visa overstayers, and that visas are at a record high, it seems plausible that a larger national figure now applies. an ONS number would be very much better - but they don't estimate one. | |
| And so as the loose-bowelled pigeon of time swoops low over the unsuspecting tourist of destiny, and the flatulent skunk of fate wanders into the air-conditioning system of eternity, I notice it's the end of the show |
| |
| Trump....all you need to know. on 13:17 - Jan 23 with 1310 views | eireblue |
| Trump....all you need to know. on 11:01 - Jan 23 by lowhouseblue |
the first thing we need to do is have an honest and open discussion of immigration and recognise that it is a top issue for many voters. it needs to be a discussion which isn't shut down by accusations of racism or that raising the issue is pandering to the far right. it needs to treat the level of immigration as something that is decided through the democratic process, controlled by voters, and not something that, as many people believe, is imposed on them regardless of what they think. if there is one issue that makes many people feel that have no control over their communities it is this.
it needs to recognise that by a very large majority most people in the uk now think current immigration is unsustainably high. it needs to recognise the experience of people who think that - and not dismiss them and belittle them.
i've previously posted the ONS statistics which show that net immigration to the uk in the last 4 years was 3 million people. (interestingly, given the extreme focus on the issue there, immigration into the usa (a country 5 times larger) in the same period was 10 million). what i hadn't seen before was these estimates of illegal migrants in the uk (ie those out staying visas) at a further 1 million.:
https://www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2025/01/22/one-in-12-in-london-is-an-illega |
Who is having a dishonest and closed discussion?
How many times has a Farage talked about population demographics and what that means for pensions?
The Brexit vote was also focused on immigration, border control and sovereignty.
That jump in immigration has happened since Brexit.
Your challenge is to take someone that believes the Brexit/Farage’s rhetoric, and hasn’t even read one of his polices that does not cap migration, and convince them Farage is wrong.
The politicians being dishonest are the ones making emotional populist appeals.
When politicians have tried to out Farage, Farage, they have failed.
Your mission, is to convince someone like Benters to vote for a centrist party, and not a populist liar appealing to emotion.
As we have seen with the Tories, the only thing that will happen, is if Farage gets in power and screws it up, then people will turn against a populist party.
Meanwhile, discussions on message board conducted in a somewhat confrontational nature, aren’t going to make a difference in who gets elected. |  | | |
| Trump....all you need to know. on 13:26 - Jan 23 with 1273 views | lowhouseblue |
| Trump....all you need to know. on 13:17 - Jan 23 by eireblue |
Who is having a dishonest and closed discussion?
How many times has a Farage talked about population demographics and what that means for pensions?
The Brexit vote was also focused on immigration, border control and sovereignty.
That jump in immigration has happened since Brexit.
Your challenge is to take someone that believes the Brexit/Farage’s rhetoric, and hasn’t even read one of his polices that does not cap migration, and convince them Farage is wrong.
The politicians being dishonest are the ones making emotional populist appeals.
When politicians have tried to out Farage, Farage, they have failed.
Your mission, is to convince someone like Benters to vote for a centrist party, and not a populist liar appealing to emotion.
As we have seen with the Tories, the only thing that will happen, is if Farage gets in power and screws it up, then people will turn against a populist party.
Meanwhile, discussions on message board conducted in a somewhat confrontational nature, aren’t going to make a difference in who gets elected. |
yep, that's how it goes. rather than accepting that immigration is a serious issue for most of the electorate, and probably all of those who might vote for farage, you've gone off on some strange rant. the one thing missing from your rant is of course any recognition that the things that concern voters might be valid. | |
| And so as the loose-bowelled pigeon of time swoops low over the unsuspecting tourist of destiny, and the flatulent skunk of fate wanders into the air-conditioning system of eternity, I notice it's the end of the show |
| |
| Trump....all you need to know. on 13:30 - Jan 23 with 1258 views | DJR |
| Trump....all you need to know. on 11:01 - Jan 23 by lowhouseblue |
the first thing we need to do is have an honest and open discussion of immigration and recognise that it is a top issue for many voters. it needs to be a discussion which isn't shut down by accusations of racism or that raising the issue is pandering to the far right. it needs to treat the level of immigration as something that is decided through the democratic process, controlled by voters, and not something that, as many people believe, is imposed on them regardless of what they think. if there is one issue that makes many people feel that have no control over their communities it is this.
it needs to recognise that by a very large majority most people in the uk now think current immigration is unsustainably high. it needs to recognise the experience of people who think that - and not dismiss them and belittle them.
i've previously posted the ONS statistics which show that net immigration to the uk in the last 4 years was 3 million people. (interestingly, given the extreme focus on the issue there, immigration into the usa (a country 5 times larger) in the same period was 10 million). what i hadn't seen before was these estimates of illegal migrants in the uk (ie those out staying visas) at a further 1 million.:
https://www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2025/01/22/one-in-12-in-london-is-an-illega |
I imagine most Western countries have illegal migrants but (and probably especially so in a country like the UK without identity cards) it may be difficult to quantify.
As it is, it is hardly new news (subject to doubts about actual figures) given Boris Johnson talked about an amnesty for illegal migrants when he was London Mayor.
And he doubled down on this during the Brexit campaign. Indeed, what he said also presaged the large increase in legal migration we have seen.
https://www.itv.com/news/update/2016-06-19/johnson-i-am-pro-immigration-and-supp
Johnson: I am pro-immigration and support illegal migrants amnesty
As Johnny Rotten once said, "Ever get the feeling you've been cheated?" [Post edited 23 Jan 13:36]
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| Trump....all you need to know. on 13:39 - Jan 23 with 1203 views | Europablue |
| Trump....all you need to know. on 13:17 - Jan 23 by eireblue |
Who is having a dishonest and closed discussion?
How many times has a Farage talked about population demographics and what that means for pensions?
The Brexit vote was also focused on immigration, border control and sovereignty.
That jump in immigration has happened since Brexit.
Your challenge is to take someone that believes the Brexit/Farage’s rhetoric, and hasn’t even read one of his polices that does not cap migration, and convince them Farage is wrong.
The politicians being dishonest are the ones making emotional populist appeals.
When politicians have tried to out Farage, Farage, they have failed.
Your mission, is to convince someone like Benters to vote for a centrist party, and not a populist liar appealing to emotion.
As we have seen with the Tories, the only thing that will happen, is if Farage gets in power and screws it up, then people will turn against a populist party.
Meanwhile, discussions on message board conducted in a somewhat confrontational nature, aren’t going to make a difference in who gets elected. |
Brexit does not mean that we will reduce immigration. It only means that we have control of who we decide to let in. Since Brexit we have had people in power who either weren't fully behind Brexit or got distracted by other pressing issues.
It is also incumbent on the centrist politicians to be centrist enough to appeal to the voters. There are some very easy wins. There are certain positions that cut across society. There is a big reason why the working class and people living in the countryside voted for Brexit.
The centre has to appeal to people's sense of belonging, and that means coming across like you actually like our country and are proud of the character of the people. It also means not thinking that our country would be improved by mass-importing people randomly in high numbers. | | | |
| Trump....all you need to know. on 13:41 - Jan 23 with 1188 views | DJR |
| Trump....all you need to know. on 13:39 - Jan 23 by Europablue |
Brexit does not mean that we will reduce immigration. It only means that we have control of who we decide to let in. Since Brexit we have had people in power who either weren't fully behind Brexit or got distracted by other pressing issues.
It is also incumbent on the centrist politicians to be centrist enough to appeal to the voters. There are some very easy wins. There are certain positions that cut across society. There is a big reason why the working class and people living in the countryside voted for Brexit.
The centre has to appeal to people's sense of belonging, and that means coming across like you actually like our country and are proud of the character of the people. It also means not thinking that our country would be improved by mass-importing people randomly in high numbers. |
See this comment in my previous post!
Johnson: I am pro-immigration and support illegal migrants amnesty | | | |
| Trump....all you need to know. on 13:57 - Jan 23 with 1122 views | eireblue |
| Trump....all you need to know. on 13:26 - Jan 23 by lowhouseblue |
yep, that's how it goes. rather than accepting that immigration is a serious issue for most of the electorate, and probably all of those who might vote for farage, you've gone off on some strange rant. the one thing missing from your rant is of course any recognition that the things that concern voters might be valid. |
I take the time to use paragraphs, sentences, capital letters, and yet you just dismiss it is a rant.
You are not very good at finding common ground, you have simply dismissed my view as a rant.
Where have I dismissed it as not a serious issue?
Where did I dismiss immigration as not a concern?
We were not debating immigration, we were debating you being able to find common ground and wrestle someone from a populist leader that lies. | | | |
| Trump....all you need to know. on 13:57 - Jan 23 with 1122 views | LeifingLaVidaLoca |
| Trump....all you need to know. on 13:26 - Jan 23 by lowhouseblue |
yep, that's how it goes. rather than accepting that immigration is a serious issue for most of the electorate, and probably all of those who might vote for farage, you've gone off on some strange rant. the one thing missing from your rant is of course any recognition that the things that concern voters might be valid. |
perhaps you could provide a demonstration of how this works then? a fun experiment! you could have between now and the next set of elections to listen to the concerns of benters , engage him and combat them respectfully, and ultimately convince him to vote more moderately?
the confidence with which you speak on this subject leads me to believe that you would find this extremely easy to do. one would assume however, that the tactic doesn’t involve offering up wonky statistics from questionable sources that you immediately cave in on when challenged by someone more knowledgeable? | | | |
| Trump....all you need to know. on 14:05 - Jan 23 with 1086 views | eireblue |
| Trump....all you need to know. on 13:39 - Jan 23 by Europablue |
Brexit does not mean that we will reduce immigration. It only means that we have control of who we decide to let in. Since Brexit we have had people in power who either weren't fully behind Brexit or got distracted by other pressing issues.
It is also incumbent on the centrist politicians to be centrist enough to appeal to the voters. There are some very easy wins. There are certain positions that cut across society. There is a big reason why the working class and people living in the countryside voted for Brexit.
The centre has to appeal to people's sense of belonging, and that means coming across like you actually like our country and are proud of the character of the people. It also means not thinking that our country would be improved by mass-importing people randomly in high numbers. |
You weren’t around during the Brexit debates.
Plenty of people pre-Brexit made the point that Brexit wasn’t going to control the borders, but just change the type of immigration from free movement of labour from people that may pop over for a few years, to more permanent immigration.
It was incumbent on people promoting Brexit to be honest.
They weren’t. | | | |
| Trump....all you need to know. on 14:11 - Jan 23 with 1051 views | lowhouseblue |
| Trump....all you need to know. on 13:57 - Jan 23 by LeifingLaVidaLoca |
perhaps you could provide a demonstration of how this works then? a fun experiment! you could have between now and the next set of elections to listen to the concerns of benters , engage him and combat them respectfully, and ultimately convince him to vote more moderately?
the confidence with which you speak on this subject leads me to believe that you would find this extremely easy to do. one would assume however, that the tactic doesn’t involve offering up wonky statistics from questionable sources that you immediately cave in on when challenged by someone more knowledgeable? |
if you think the ONS a questionable source providing wonky statistics then that's your problem.
the first step in rebuilding trust in politics and avoiding farage as pm is for the current government to very substantially reduce net immigration before the next election. all the evidence shows that is a priority for a majority of voters. is that clear enough?
which former poster are you - just so that i know where the aggression is coming from. [Post edited 23 Jan 14:20]
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| And so as the loose-bowelled pigeon of time swoops low over the unsuspecting tourist of destiny, and the flatulent skunk of fate wanders into the air-conditioning system of eternity, I notice it's the end of the show |
| |
| Trump....all you need to know. on 14:14 - Jan 23 with 1016 views | LeifingLaVidaLoca |
| Trump....all you need to know. on 14:11 - Jan 23 by lowhouseblue |
if you think the ONS a questionable source providing wonky statistics then that's your problem.
the first step in rebuilding trust in politics and avoiding farage as pm is for the current government to very substantially reduce net immigration before the next election. all the evidence shows that is a priority for a majority of voters. is that clear enough?
which former poster are you - just so that i know where the aggression is coming from. [Post edited 23 Jan 14:20]
|
there was no aggression! shall I put you down as a maybe? | | | |
| Trump....all you need to know. on 14:19 - Jan 23 with 980 views | lowhouseblue |
| Trump....all you need to know. on 14:14 - Jan 23 by LeifingLaVidaLoca |
there was no aggression! shall I put you down as a maybe? |
i'm certain i recognise the posting style. something a little cervine about it. | |
| And so as the loose-bowelled pigeon of time swoops low over the unsuspecting tourist of destiny, and the flatulent skunk of fate wanders into the air-conditioning system of eternity, I notice it's the end of the show |
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