| Jaden Philogene 23:11 - Feb 27 with 6874 views | quad |
I just want to share my concerns regarding Philogene based on my observations over the last couple of games. I'm not intending to slag him off and say we wasted 20 million and that he's no better than what we already had or to stir up all the nonsense surrounding his agent etc...
BUT... he clearly needs to improve. I'll be honest and say that his performance against Spurs was very, very poor. IMO he showed no threat whatsoever. He could not beat a man, passing was poor, he looked very lightweight, he did not press with any real conviction, he looked afraid to put in a tackle etc.
Hutch is small and slight as well, but he presses and put himself about so much better. You can see how much it means to him.
On to the Man U game and Philogene was slightly improved. However, I personally feel that both his goals were extremely fortunate and clouded another somewhat abject performance. In fairness, he did well to stay on his feet and avoid being wiped out by the keeper for the 1st, and it was a decent cross to Delap for the 2nd goal. Having said that, you would be lucky to score 2 goals like that over the course of a season let alone in the same game.
There is clearly a player there and given time I am sure that there is a good chance he will shine. Likewise with Jack Clarke. But we need it NOW.
On to my main concern which is this. He barely celebrated either goal IMO, and his whole body language appeared to indicate that he wasn't overly bothered. When Delap got his first goal for Ipswich you could see his elation and how much it meant to him. With Philogene it looked like the whole of both games was a training ground practise session. I appreciate that Cajuste was supposed to be marking Maguire for their 3rd, but Philogene was in and around that area and didn't even make a token gesture to genuinely challenge for the ball.
Some players clearly give their all and would run through a brick wall for the team. You can clearly see the effort from players like Delap, Morsy, Phillips and Burgess even if they are not playing well or things aren't going their way.
Could we genuinely say the same about Philogene based on the evidence of the last couple of games? Am I being overly critical or unfair? Or do other posters feel that he would not die for the cause or does not care as much as others? Thoughts? |  | | |  |
| Jaden Philogene on 09:47 - Feb 28 with 1673 views | Swansea_Blue |
| Jaden Philogene on 09:08 - Feb 28 by NthQldITFC |
I had to log in and temporarily edit my ignore list to downvote and comment on this utterly sh!t post. Well done you. I probably shouldn't have bothered though.
Some of the sh!t on here appals me at the moment. I can't understand how actual Town fans (I know you are one, unlike some of the other fifth columnists around at the moment) can be so ungrateful and entitled and unsupportive.
This post may not go down well, but I'm thinking of leaving here anyway. |
It’s getting worse every week. We’ll be running out of players to slag off soon.
I suspect it’s a case of people slowly realising that we’re probably not good enough for this league. Stages of grief and all that. Not that I condone the ranting - it’s ridiculous. There’s no shame in not being good enough. Everyone at the club is working hard to be as successful as we can be, but we’ve not been at this level for over 20 years and so are by far the least experienced club in the division. If we’d downed tools it would be a different matter.
And it’s not over yet of course. |  |
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| Jaden Philogene on 09:47 - Feb 28 with 1662 views | Dubtractor |
| Jaden Philogene on 09:12 - Feb 28 by SomethingBlue |
Quite aside from the undertones of that post, I agree with you – we seem to have some very harsh judges nowadays. Everything has to be "poor" if it's not brilliant. Time and patience at a premium. It's baffling. The mutterings about Philogene are a case in point. |
If a player isn't pulling up trees in the first few games they are a waste of money and the worst player since whoever was last getting hammered.
The ability to apply a little bit of balanced criticism has been lost for some.
Fwiw I think philogene has struggled a bit in settling in here, and seems to lack the confidence to do his thing in attacking areas, though premier league full backs aren't as easily fooled by a step over or two!
But that doesn't make him lazy, arrogant or a waste of money. The signing we needed in January? Maybe not, but he'll be a good player for us over a longer period than 3 or 4 games. |  |
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| Dear oh dear, here we go again on 09:49 - Feb 28 with 1653 views | Dyland |
| Jaden Philogene on 08:27 - Feb 28 by ArnieM |
Philogene comes across as arrogant to me. I could be wrong of course, but personally I wouldn't have him anywhere near the first team and see that £20m as a complete and utter waste of money. |
Have a word with yourself ffs. |  |
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| Jaden Philogene on 10:27 - Feb 28 with 1578 views | LankHenners |
| Jaden Philogene on 09:47 - Feb 28 by Dubtractor |
If a player isn't pulling up trees in the first few games they are a waste of money and the worst player since whoever was last getting hammered.
The ability to apply a little bit of balanced criticism has been lost for some.
Fwiw I think philogene has struggled a bit in settling in here, and seems to lack the confidence to do his thing in attacking areas, though premier league full backs aren't as easily fooled by a step over or two!
But that doesn't make him lazy, arrogant or a waste of money. The signing we needed in January? Maybe not, but he'll be a good player for us over a longer period than 3 or 4 games. |
I appreciate it's been a disappointing season, and I've certainly found myself a bit down in the dumps on more than a few occasions after matches, but some people have seemed utterly determined to not enjoy any part of it at all and would rather tie themselves up with relentless negativity instead.
Heat of the moment, immediate reactions to stuff is generally fine (though you do get the odd OTT nonsense) but some of the moaning about how rubbish the players are or how we're going to struggle in the Championship has been ridiculous. |  |
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| Jaden Philogene on 11:06 - Feb 28 with 1502 views | BarcaBlue |
| Jaden Philogene on 10:27 - Feb 28 by LankHenners |
I appreciate it's been a disappointing season, and I've certainly found myself a bit down in the dumps on more than a few occasions after matches, but some people have seemed utterly determined to not enjoy any part of it at all and would rather tie themselves up with relentless negativity instead.
Heat of the moment, immediate reactions to stuff is generally fine (though you do get the odd OTT nonsense) but some of the moaning about how rubbish the players are or how we're going to struggle in the Championship has been ridiculous. |
Completely agree. Some on here seem to revel in endless relentless negativity. It can't be healthy and I know of more than one poster giving the forum a miss just because of a few posters without a positive bone in their body or thought in their head. Impending relegation isn't fun but there's a limit to be had on the continual downers. |  | | |
| Jaden Philogene on 11:13 - Feb 28 with 1477 views | DropCliffsNotBombs |
| Jaden Philogene on 08:27 - Feb 28 by ArnieM |
Philogene comes across as arrogant to me. I could be wrong of course, but personally I wouldn't have him anywhere near the first team and see that £20m as a complete and utter waste of money. |
Yuck. |  | | |
| Jaden Philogene on 11:32 - Feb 28 with 1420 views | boccy23 |
For me I actually thought he worked really hard the other night off the ball. There was a few times, especially in the first half, when he was the full back as Axel had been dragged up the pitch by Garnacho.
I see growth here as in the first games he hardly tried at all. But he is clearly getting told to work harder and for me, he is responding. | | | |
| Jaden Philogene on 11:45 - Feb 28 with 1393 views | mellowblue |
Far to early for such judgements. We are seeing progressive improvements from a player desperately short of game time. Wingers often take time to get into their zone. I think we have over paid, as do most, but we have to trust him and give him time. It is the danger of January signings. If they do not hit the ground running, by the time they do, the season is almost gone. | | | |
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| Jaden Philogene on 11:51 - Feb 28 with 1371 views | Bellevue_Blue |
| Jaden Philogene on 11:32 - Feb 28 by boccy23 |
For me I actually thought he worked really hard the other night off the ball. There was a few times, especially in the first half, when he was the full back as Axel had been dragged up the pitch by Garnacho.
I see growth here as in the first games he hardly tried at all. But he is clearly getting told to work harder and for me, he is responding. |
I absolutely agree with this.
I can't believe the continued negativity when he is clearly improving game on game.
Yes he got lucky with the goals but where's the understanding of what he did well in the United game?! For the first he chased a completely lost cause and put the defender under enough pressure to make the mistake, then for the second he put in a really really good ball.
He's playing in a new system in a brand new style where he's being asked to do different things than was probably asked at Villa in the limited game time he got. He's not going to suddenly run rings around established PL defenders.
I thought we might have learnt from the Jack Clarke nonsense earlier in the season. Both will turn out to be really really good players for this football club. | | | |
| Jaden Philogene on 13:18 - Feb 28 with 1274 views | bsw72 |
Just to summarise.
You're "not intending to slag him off", but he has been "very, very poor", "no threat whatsoever", "could not beat a man", "very lightweight", "afraid to put in a tackle", "barely celebrated either goal IMO, and his whole body language appeared to indicate that he wasn't overly bothered"
I'd hate to see what you write when you do intend to slag someone off. |  | | |
| Jaden Philogene on 13:30 - Feb 28 with 1239 views | Woolfenthen |
what a nonsense take, the lad has been here little over 4 weeks, not played much football this season, started 4 games for us and go himself 3 goals, probably living out of a hotel and not yet settled and getting to know his teammates. Think of the likes of Walton, Davis, Burgess, Aluko and even Morsy who didn't exactly start their careers greatly with us but have proved to be valuable members. Clearly a very talented individual who like other youngsters in particular need time to bed in and show their worth, his confidence will pick up when he settles down I have no doubt. |  | | |
| Jaden Philogene on 19:44 - Feb 28 with 1049 views | quad |
| Jaden Philogene on 13:18 - Feb 28 by bsw72 |
Just to summarise.
You're "not intending to slag him off", but he has been "very, very poor", "no threat whatsoever", "could not beat a man", "very lightweight", "afraid to put in a tackle", "barely celebrated either goal IMO, and his whole body language appeared to indicate that he wasn't overly bothered"
I'd hate to see what you write when you do intend to slag someone off. |
I don't know how anyone could have watched the Spurs game and thought he wasn't poor. It's beyond me. I'm not saying he's a bad player, I'm saying he had a bad game. He was not able to have any affect on the game and showed little attacking threat. The only good thing I can remember him doing in the whole game was winning a free kick in the 2nd half in a dangerous position near the edge of their area.
I don't know why I got so many downvotes for saying that, it was true. I also said that he improved in the Man Utd game, but was fortunate with the goals. Which was also true.
From these two games I've watched him play, he hasn't looked 100% committed to me in the same way other players have. I simply asked others their opinion on this and have been met with the usual arsy replies from some.
It's supposed to be a football forum. But can't discuss anything without being shot down in flames. Unless you're only saying positive things, which is difficult to do when it looks like we are gonna fall short of being able to stay up. | | | |
| Jaden Philogene on 21:02 - Feb 28 with 992 views | DropCliffsNotBombs |
| Jaden Philogene on 19:44 - Feb 28 by quad |
I don't know how anyone could have watched the Spurs game and thought he wasn't poor. It's beyond me. I'm not saying he's a bad player, I'm saying he had a bad game. He was not able to have any affect on the game and showed little attacking threat. The only good thing I can remember him doing in the whole game was winning a free kick in the 2nd half in a dangerous position near the edge of their area.
I don't know why I got so many downvotes for saying that, it was true. I also said that he improved in the Man Utd game, but was fortunate with the goals. Which was also true.
From these two games I've watched him play, he hasn't looked 100% committed to me in the same way other players have. I simply asked others their opinion on this and have been met with the usual arsy replies from some.
It's supposed to be a football forum. But can't discuss anything without being shot down in flames. Unless you're only saying positive things, which is difficult to do when it looks like we are gonna fall short of being able to stay up. |
You had two options.
1 - reflect upon the pushback against your ridiculous OP and consider why so many people disagreed with your damning, unfair lunge at a player who is getting to grips with a new team, returning from injury, yet has scored 3 goals in 4 starts.
Or
2 - bitch and whinge about 'not being able to post anything unless it's positive etc etc like a spoilt, impotent man-baby.
Good choice there, champ. | | | |
| Jaden Philogene on 22:28 - Feb 28 with 935 views | benrhyddingblue |
| Jaden Philogene on 09:08 - Feb 28 by NthQldITFC |
I had to log in and temporarily edit my ignore list to downvote and comment on this utterly sh!t post. Well done you. I probably shouldn't have bothered though.
Some of the sh!t on here appals me at the moment. I can't understand how actual Town fans (I know you are one, unlike some of the other fifth columnists around at the moment) can be so ungrateful and entitled and unsupportive.
This post may not go down well, but I'm thinking of leaving here anyway. |
I totally agree with you. It seems far worse on here now than when we were heading to League One. The vitriol to a player who has only played a handful of games for the club is something I’d don’t remember seeing ever on here. What that is down to is don’t know - there’s certainly a lot of posters here now who have a short posting history, although not the one spouting about a player being arrogant without any evidence to back it up.
I too am thinking about leaving here too. It’s become very unpleasant. | | | |
| Jaden Philogene on 01:24 - Mar 1 with 861 views | quad |
| Jaden Philogene on 21:02 - Feb 28 by DropCliffsNotBombs |
You had two options.
1 - reflect upon the pushback against your ridiculous OP and consider why so many people disagreed with your damning, unfair lunge at a player who is getting to grips with a new team, returning from injury, yet has scored 3 goals in 4 starts.
Or
2 - bitch and whinge about 'not being able to post anything unless it's positive etc etc like a spoilt, impotent man-baby.
Good choice there, champ. |
Lol. It wasn't a damning, unfair lunge. I was just saying it as I've seen it so far. I said in my OP that he is clearly a player and needs time, just a bit disappointed if he is not giving 100% because I was hoping that we all pull together and somehow manage to stay up.
That's my opinion and if you and the rest of the forum police don't like it, you can foxtrot oscar as far as I'm concerned, champ. I don't think much of the personal insults, dickhead. | | | |
| Jaden Philogene on 09:22 - Mar 1 with 763 views | Dubtractor |
| Jaden Philogene on 01:24 - Mar 1 by quad |
Lol. It wasn't a damning, unfair lunge. I was just saying it as I've seen it so far. I said in my OP that he is clearly a player and needs time, just a bit disappointed if he is not giving 100% because I was hoping that we all pull together and somehow manage to stay up.
That's my opinion and if you and the rest of the forum police don't like it, you can foxtrot oscar as far as I'm concerned, champ. I don't think much of the personal insults, dickhead. |
The whole second half of you OP was suggesting that Philogene isn't trying, doesn't care, has an attitude problem.
If you just commented on his performances, then fine, but half of your whole post was just unfounded nonsense. That's why your OP got a kicking. | |
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| Jaden Philogene on 09:30 - Mar 1 with 747 views | brogansnose |
| Jaden Philogene on 08:27 - Feb 28 by ArnieM |
Philogene comes across as arrogant to me. I could be wrong of course, but personally I wouldn't have him anywhere near the first team and see that £20m as a complete and utter waste of money. |
I don't come on here to have a pop at people but with this post I'm going to make an exception.
What a load of complete and utter toss. You ain't looking good with this schiess. |  | | |
| Jaden Philogene on 12:11 - Mar 1 with 627 views | SuffolkPunchFC |
| Jaden Philogene on 01:24 - Mar 1 by quad |
Lol. It wasn't a damning, unfair lunge. I was just saying it as I've seen it so far. I said in my OP that he is clearly a player and needs time, just a bit disappointed if he is not giving 100% because I was hoping that we all pull together and somehow manage to stay up.
That's my opinion and if you and the rest of the forum police don't like it, you can foxtrot oscar as far as I'm concerned, champ. I don't think much of the personal insults, dickhead. |
Maybe take a look in the mirror.
You really are doubling down on defending a post that was primarily a long, personal criticism of a young, potentially talented player, who needs time to gel with the team. | | | |
| Jaden Philogene on 12:32 - Mar 1 with 565 views | mellowblue |
| Jaden Philogene on 22:28 - Feb 28 by benrhyddingblue |
I totally agree with you. It seems far worse on here now than when we were heading to League One. The vitriol to a player who has only played a handful of games for the club is something I’d don’t remember seeing ever on here. What that is down to is don’t know - there’s certainly a lot of posters here now who have a short posting history, although not the one spouting about a player being arrogant without any evidence to back it up.
I too am thinking about leaving here too. It’s become very unpleasant. |
I am with you on this. It is like the floodgate have opened. When you look at the age/experience profile of the players we have employed, it is clear it is part of a long term plan, which included likely relegation. If we finish 17th or higher, happy days. dole out some bonuses, but I believe it is a wider plan to keep a squad intact for the Championship battle ahead and as the players develop a proper crack at the Premier in time. Re Philogene, I don't think he is pacy as I had thought. The Prem is a great levellr and his physicality is not upto much. And he fades out alittle bit as the match wears on. But his workrate is improving all the time, particularly his tracking back and there is definitely a good footballer there. A good rest and a summer in the gym would help, I think. | | | |
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