| Far right politico Charlie Kirk just shot in the neck in Utah 20:24 - Sep 10 with 60405 views | ElderGrizzly |
Was speaking at a University event and appears to have been shot (from distance) in the neck.
And actually shot, not the Donald Trump kind.
Horrific whatever your political views and has no place in politics
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| Far right politico Charlie Kirk just shot in the neck in Utah on 20:13 - Sep 13 with 1892 views | Libero |
| Far right politico Charlie Kirk just shot in the neck in Utah on 20:10 - Sep 13 by lowhouseblue |
who have i defended? you're imagining things. asking questions and trying to get someone to explain the label they are applying isn't defending anything. "right wing christian nationalist and social conservative" isn't a character reference. you seem to find questions strangely threatening. |
We can all see right through you. |  | | |
| Far right politico Charlie Kirk just shot in the neck in Utah on 20:19 - Sep 13 with 1853 views | DropCliffsNotBombs |
| Far right politico Charlie Kirk just shot in the neck in Utah on 20:10 - Sep 13 by lowhouseblue |
who have i defended? you're imagining things. asking questions and trying to get someone to explain the label they are applying isn't defending anything. "right wing christian nationalist and social conservative" isn't a character reference. you seem to find questions strangely threatening. |
There isn't a single person on here who can't see what you're doing. Again. |  | | |
| Far right politico Charlie Kirk just shot in the neck in Utah on 20:19 - Sep 13 with 1847 views | vapour_trail |
| Far right politico Charlie Kirk just shot in the neck in Utah on 20:11 - Sep 13 by Swailsey |
Why do you always do this?
You try and derail threads by playing devil’s advocate and using language which you think makes you sound clever.
You know exactly what you’re doing - you do it all the time whenever there is a controversial topic.
What you do adds absolutely nothing to the debate, despite you thinking it does. It’s so tiresome. |
You’ve answered your own questions swallsey.
It’s pretty clear what it is. I’m not sure it’s ever posted anything about ITFC. Just leave it alone. |  |
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| Far right politico Charlie Kirk just shot in the neck in Utah on 21:38 - Sep 13 with 1600 views | reusersfreekicks |
| Far right politico Charlie Kirk just shot in the neck in Utah on 20:11 - Sep 13 by Swailsey |
Why do you always do this?
You try and derail threads by playing devil’s advocate and using language which you think makes you sound clever.
You know exactly what you’re doing - you do it all the time whenever there is a controversial topic.
What you do adds absolutely nothing to the debate, despite you thinking it does. It’s so tiresome. |
Really tedious isn't it.
Completely disingenuous apologist for the far right on a regular basis.
Thankfully more and more people on here can see right through him |  | | |
| Far right politico Charlie Kirk just shot in the neck in Utah on 21:38 - Sep 13 with 1593 views | GlasgowBlue |
| Far right politico Charlie Kirk just shot in the neck in Utah on 20:19 - Sep 13 by vapour_trail |
You’ve answered your own questions swallsey.
It’s pretty clear what it is. I’m not sure it’s ever posted anything about ITFC. Just leave it alone. |
In a thread where posters have discussed dehumanising other people, to refer to a fellow poster as "it" four times is absolutely disgusting in my opinion.
And I'm particularly saddened to see one poster I hold in high regard giving such dehumanisation an up arrow.
I think I'll bail from this thread as some of the language is straight out of the Charlie Kirk playbook. Very Alanis Morissette. [Post edited 13 Sep 21:38]
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| Far right politico Charlie Kirk just shot in the neck in Utah on 21:40 - Sep 13 with 1586 views | Libero |
| Far right politico Charlie Kirk just shot in the neck in Utah on 21:38 - Sep 13 by GlasgowBlue |
In a thread where posters have discussed dehumanising other people, to refer to a fellow poster as "it" four times is absolutely disgusting in my opinion.
And I'm particularly saddened to see one poster I hold in high regard giving such dehumanisation an up arrow.
I think I'll bail from this thread as some of the language is straight out of the Charlie Kirk playbook. Very Alanis Morissette. [Post edited 13 Sep 21:38]
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Upset about anything but the fascism, hey? Fair play. | | | |
| Far right politico Charlie Kirk just shot in the neck in Utah on 21:51 - Sep 13 with 1524 views | GlasgowBlue |
| Far right politico Charlie Kirk just shot in the neck in Utah on 21:40 - Sep 13 by Libero |
Upset about anything but the fascism, hey? Fair play. |
I was out of this thread but I'll take the bait one last time. Not that it will make the slightest difference.
I am offended by Charlie Kirk's ultra conservative right wing Christian views and I find his beliefs absolutely abhorrent.
Just because I don't subscribe to inaccurate and childish name calling doesn't mean I support his views in any way whatsoever.
Bye! | |
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| Far right politico Charlie Kirk just shot in the neck in Utah on 21:53 - Sep 13 with 1500 views | Bigalhunter |
| Far right politico Charlie Kirk just shot in the neck in Utah on 21:40 - Sep 13 by Libero |
Upset about anything but the fascism, hey? Fair play. |
Too busy cosying up to the backing singers in the old band to notice anything untoward.
It’s been an awkwardly embarrassing return. One tour too many, perhaps. |  |
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| Far right politico Charlie Kirk just shot in the neck in Utah on 21:54 - Sep 13 with 1492 views | Libero |
| Far right politico Charlie Kirk just shot in the neck in Utah on 21:53 - Sep 13 by Bigalhunter |
Too busy cosying up to the backing singers in the old band to notice anything untoward.
It’s been an awkwardly embarrassing return. One tour too many, perhaps. |
OK, who had him down as only lasting 15 minutes? | | | |
| Far right politico Charlie Kirk just shot in the neck in Utah on 22:10 - Sep 13 with 1405 views | Bigalhunter |
| Far right politico Charlie Kirk just shot in the neck in Utah on 21:54 - Sep 13 by Libero |
OK, who had him down as only lasting 15 minutes? |
Finally made it back on stage, mumbled the wrong lyrics over a couple of backing tracks before chucking the mike and shambling off to an awkward silence. | |
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| Far right politico Charlie Kirk just shot in the neck in Utah on 22:17 - Sep 13 with 1346 views | GlasgowBlue |
| Far right politico Charlie Kirk just shot in the neck in Utah on 22:10 - Sep 13 by Bigalhunter |
Finally made it back on stage, mumbled the wrong lyrics over a couple of backing tracks before chucking the mike and shambling off to an awkward silence. |
Nah. Just had a lovely day out with the family and have better things to do on a Saturday night than argue the toss with total strangers on a football message board about things happening over the pond that none of us can influence.
I put my point of view. You may disagree. That's cool, but neither of us will have our lives enhanced by going back and forward trying to win the internet. It may give you some joy but it's really not my scene mate.
But you boys crack on if you want. I'm sure the next few pages of mutual backslapping and up arrowing will make riveting reading when I take my morning dump [Post edited 13 Sep 22:18]
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| Far right politico Charlie Kirk just shot in the neck in Utah on 22:20 - Sep 13 with 1329 views | Swailsey |
Not sure Glassers should be bearing the brunt of people’s frustrations really. He is entitled to his opinion, and he’s actually supporting the point of view that the vast majority of us are in relation to CK’s opinions. [Post edited 13 Sep 22:22]
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| Who said: "Colin Healy made Cesc Fabregas look like Colin Healy"? | We miss you TLA |
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| Far right politico Charlie Kirk just shot in the neck in Utah on 22:21 - Sep 13 with 1318 views | Kropotkin123 |
| Far right politico Charlie Kirk just shot in the neck in Utah on 16:52 - Sep 13 by lowhouseblue |
i know little about him and next to nothing before he was murdered. can you be specific about which of his views were 'fascist' and how you distinguish them from hard right or christian nationalist or social conservative etc views? and are fascist views distinct from advocating fascism as a political programme - and did he do that? genuinely know next to nothing about him. |
If you know next to nothing about him, then perhaps this debate isn't the best for you as it relies on that context. Go educate yourself, it's not the responsibility of those 15 pages into a thread to give you that. |  |
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| Far right politico Charlie Kirk just shot in the neck in Utah on 22:21 - Sep 13 with 1314 views | Swailsey |
| Far right politico Charlie Kirk just shot in the neck in Utah on 22:21 - Sep 13 by Kropotkin123 |
If you know next to nothing about him, then perhaps this debate isn't the best for you as it relies on that context. Go educate yourself, it's not the responsibility of those 15 pages into a thread to give you that. |
Exactly. | |
| Who said: "Colin Healy made Cesc Fabregas look like Colin Healy"? | We miss you TLA |
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| Far right politico Charlie Kirk just shot in the neck in Utah on 22:21 - Sep 13 with 1304 views | Mullet |
| Far right politico Charlie Kirk just shot in the neck in Utah on 18:01 - Sep 13 by Trequartista |
I do like the way you frame things “you seem to be denying” as though the next thing you say is a fact not an opinion. From what I have seen he is a right wing conservative who likes to debate people, I don’t think fascists like to debate they just use violence. |
It’s not an opinion. It’s very odd how yourself and lowhouse are posting in this thread, albeit in fairly different ways.
Kirk literally incited violence against minorities and people he hated. Whether it was public executions, dismissing the mass shootings of schoolchildren or peddling racist tropes towards minorities and the lgbtq community.
Maybe you haven’t seen all that much before defending him? |  |
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| Far right politico Charlie Kirk just shot in the neck in Utah on 22:27 - Sep 13 with 1250 views | vapour_trail |
| Far right politico Charlie Kirk just shot in the neck in Utah on 22:20 - Sep 13 by Swailsey |
Not sure Glassers should be bearing the brunt of people’s frustrations really. He is entitled to his opinion, and he’s actually supporting the point of view that the vast majority of us are in relation to CK’s opinions. [Post edited 13 Sep 22:22]
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He proactively jumped on this evening to have a pop at someone else.
Anyway, as he’s stated this evening and as everyone who’s been here for some time will recognise, he’s well above arguing with strangers on the internet. | |
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| Far right politico Charlie Kirk just shot in the neck in Utah on 22:30 - Sep 13 with 1238 views | positivity |
| Far right politico Charlie Kirk just shot in the neck in Utah on 22:20 - Sep 13 by Swailsey |
Not sure Glassers should be bearing the brunt of people’s frustrations really. He is entitled to his opinion, and he’s actually supporting the point of view that the vast majority of us are in relation to CK’s opinions. [Post edited 13 Sep 22:22]
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that's fair, gb's been away a while, and probably not seen much of lowhouse's descent into disingenuous trolling.
i sometimes disagree with gb, but he's generally sincere and able to explain why he holds the views; polar opposite to some other posters who seem to get off on trolling and amplifying divisive messages |  |
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| Far right politico Charlie Kirk just shot in the neck in Utah on 22:38 - Sep 13 with 1196 views | Swailsey |
| Far right politico Charlie Kirk just shot in the neck in Utah on 22:30 - Sep 13 by positivity |
that's fair, gb's been away a while, and probably not seen much of lowhouse's descent into disingenuous trolling.
i sometimes disagree with gb, but he's generally sincere and able to explain why he holds the views; polar opposite to some other posters who seem to get off on trolling and amplifying divisive messages |
I agree.
We’re politically quite far apart, but in relation to things such as human rights, mental health, racism, sexuality, I can’t ever remember him saying anything which I fundamentally thought was abhorrent.
I do think too much was put on calling someone “it” - tbh I didn’t even see it at first, and then thought perhaps VT was using a neutral gender, but maybe I’m missing something. | |
| Who said: "Colin Healy made Cesc Fabregas look like Colin Healy"? | We miss you TLA |
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| Far right politico Charlie Kirk just shot in the neck in Utah on 22:46 - Sep 13 with 1156 views | Libero |
| Far right politico Charlie Kirk just shot in the neck in Utah on 22:17 - Sep 13 by GlasgowBlue |
Nah. Just had a lovely day out with the family and have better things to do on a Saturday night than argue the toss with total strangers on a football message board about things happening over the pond that none of us can influence.
I put my point of view. You may disagree. That's cool, but neither of us will have our lives enhanced by going back and forward trying to win the internet. It may give you some joy but it's really not my scene mate.
But you boys crack on if you want. I'm sure the next few pages of mutual backslapping and up arrowing will make riveting reading when I take my morning dump [Post edited 13 Sep 22:18]
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and yet here you are… again… | | | |
| Far right politico Charlie Kirk just shot in the neck in Utah on 22:51 - Sep 13 with 1131 views | Xatticus |
| Far right politico Charlie Kirk just shot in the neck in Utah on 15:13 - Sep 13 by Trequartista |
??? You challenged me and I rebuffed it. |
I’m not letting you off the hook here. This didn’t happen. Your indignation is a product of your tenuous understanding of either vocabulary or the logic that underpins your argument, though I’m not entirely certain this isn’t feigned.
Consider for just a moment… why would those that are in favor of firearms regulation and opposed to capital punishment consider an extrajudicial murder justified? | | | |
| Far right politico Charlie Kirk just shot in the neck in Utah on 23:27 - Sep 13 with 1004 views | Xatticus |
| Far right politico Charlie Kirk just shot in the neck in Utah on 18:40 - Sep 13 by Trequartista |
I’d say right wing authoritarianism Hitler, Mussolini, Pinochet etc. Banning opposition parties, killing or abducting those who dissent, that sort of thing.
I remember Rik from the young ones calling any Tory a fascist. It was a parody. |
So they didn’t earn their certificates in fascism until they’d consolidated power enough to perpetrate these particular offenses? How would you have characterized them before they acquired the proper title? Fascist apprentices perhaps?
This entire debate is absurd. He wasn’t killed because someone called him a fascist. A lot of people get called fascists that are still walking around. A lot of people that have never been called fascists have been killed. You are trying to ascribe blame for this event to anyone that has ever labeled anyone a fascist and I feel a little dirty for indulging you. | | | |
| Far right politico Charlie Kirk just shot in the neck in Utah on 00:22 - Sep 14 with 903 views | BanksterDebtSlave |
| Far right politico Charlie Kirk just shot in the neck in Utah on 16:30 - Sep 13 by BanksterDebtSlave |
"Man forments division and reaps what he sows."
How have you managed to turn this to 'man deserves to get shot' or even "the killing is justified" in your head? [Post edited 13 Sep 16:32]
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Still waiting. |  |
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| Far right politico Charlie Kirk just shot in the neck in Utah on 08:41 - Sep 14 with 419 views | Herbivore |
| Far right politico Charlie Kirk just shot in the neck in Utah on 18:30 - Sep 13 by lowhouseblue |
mullet made a statement - i asked him to explain it. he can't. asking for an explanation isn't defending anything. asking questions only becomes controversial when someone can't answer.
as i've said i've read the media coverage following the murder - that suggests that he was a right wing, socially conservative christian nationalist, not a fascist. again, caring about correct definitions doesn't involve defending anything. |
When I've pointed out your pathological dishonesty in the past you've asked for examples, and I've given some (that you usually then ignore) but here is yet another exhibit to add to the collection. You are claiming Mullet "can't" explain his position. That's not the case. Mullet has given you clear reasons why he won't indulge you and none of them relate to his inability to do so, but instead those reasons relate to you and your conduct. He stated those reasons clearly, but let me summarise them for you again as you seem to have missed them:
(a) You engage in bad faith and he has no time for that anymore.
(b) You are full of sh!te (his words) and he has no time for that anymore.
(c) You admit you know nothing about Charlie Kirk and yet see fit to question someone's framing of his views when they do actually know about him. You can do your own research and form your own view on Kirk, but you've chosen not to, yet you've chosen to enter a discussion about him. The alternative is that you do actually know a bit about him and disagree with Mullet's framing but if that is the case then that's a textbook example of being disingenuous and you get very upset when people suggest you are being disingenuous so I'm sure it's not that.
Instead of constantly twisting people's refusal to engage with you as being about their inability to do so, try listening to what those people are telling you. Frankly, your response of claiming people aren't able to debate only serves to confirm the reasons why people are done with you. People have very, very clearly told you why they don't want to engage with you. Those people all give very similar reasons. When a dozen people who don't know each other independently form a view about you and how you conduct yourself, it might be worth listening to them and reflecting on why they see you that way. It's not that you are a superior debater and they simply can't handle your incredible debating skills, it's that you are consistently dishonest, disingenuous, and acting in bad faith. That you can't see it or even entertain that there might be something in it shows how deep in the mire you've found yourself. |  |
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| Far right politico Charlie Kirk just shot in the neck in Utah on 09:22 - Sep 14 with 327 views | lowhouseblue |
| Far right politico Charlie Kirk just shot in the neck in Utah on 08:41 - Sep 14 by Herbivore |
When I've pointed out your pathological dishonesty in the past you've asked for examples, and I've given some (that you usually then ignore) but here is yet another exhibit to add to the collection. You are claiming Mullet "can't" explain his position. That's not the case. Mullet has given you clear reasons why he won't indulge you and none of them relate to his inability to do so, but instead those reasons relate to you and your conduct. He stated those reasons clearly, but let me summarise them for you again as you seem to have missed them:
(a) You engage in bad faith and he has no time for that anymore.
(b) You are full of sh!te (his words) and he has no time for that anymore.
(c) You admit you know nothing about Charlie Kirk and yet see fit to question someone's framing of his views when they do actually know about him. You can do your own research and form your own view on Kirk, but you've chosen not to, yet you've chosen to enter a discussion about him. The alternative is that you do actually know a bit about him and disagree with Mullet's framing but if that is the case then that's a textbook example of being disingenuous and you get very upset when people suggest you are being disingenuous so I'm sure it's not that.
Instead of constantly twisting people's refusal to engage with you as being about their inability to do so, try listening to what those people are telling you. Frankly, your response of claiming people aren't able to debate only serves to confirm the reasons why people are done with you. People have very, very clearly told you why they don't want to engage with you. Those people all give very similar reasons. When a dozen people who don't know each other independently form a view about you and how you conduct yourself, it might be worth listening to them and reflecting on why they see you that way. It's not that you are a superior debater and they simply can't handle your incredible debating skills, it's that you are consistently dishonest, disingenuous, and acting in bad faith. That you can't see it or even entertain that there might be something in it shows how deep in the mire you've found yourself. |
the people who are saying these things all share your political views and act together. everyone knows that. like you, rather than ever defend or even explain those views they instead rely on constant pathetic ad hominem attacks. like you, rather than respond reasonably to challenge and alternative political views they whinge about it being unfair and involving debating trickery. that fact that a group on here who all agree with each other do it doesn't make it any more true. a group being pathetic is no more impressive than just you being pathetic.
i asked mullet a question - which specific views did he consider to be fascist. he was using the term it's legitimate for someone to ask him to justify it. that's not clever debating skills or tricks - it's a challenge for him to justify his views. like you, he doesn't answer and instead we get the usual scripted nonsense about the question being unfair. take a look at your self- individually and as a part of your little gang on here - why won't you debate and respond to alternative views, questions and challenges. the fact is that a group has decided that this is the way to deal with political challenges. it is genuinely pathetic for a group of adults who are interested in politics to refuse to engage with criticism and critiques of their views - and the smokescreen about me not arguing fairly is just astonishingly juvenile.
this is the post which has panicked your little group into collective blubbing and bosom clutching:
"i know little about him and next to nothing before he was murdered. can you be specific about which of his views were 'fascist' and how you distinguish them from hard right or christian nationalist or social conservative etc views? and are fascist views distinct from advocating fascism as a political programme - and did he do that? genuinely know next to nothing about him."
can not one of you provide an answer? |  |
| And so as the loose-bowelled pigeon of time swoops low over the unsuspecting tourist of destiny, and the flatulent skunk of fate wanders into the air-conditioning system of eternity, I notice it's the end of the show |
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| Far right politico Charlie Kirk just shot in the neck in Utah on 09:29 - Sep 14 with 298 views | Herbivore |
| Far right politico Charlie Kirk just shot in the neck in Utah on 09:22 - Sep 14 by lowhouseblue |
the people who are saying these things all share your political views and act together. everyone knows that. like you, rather than ever defend or even explain those views they instead rely on constant pathetic ad hominem attacks. like you, rather than respond reasonably to challenge and alternative political views they whinge about it being unfair and involving debating trickery. that fact that a group on here who all agree with each other do it doesn't make it any more true. a group being pathetic is no more impressive than just you being pathetic.
i asked mullet a question - which specific views did he consider to be fascist. he was using the term it's legitimate for someone to ask him to justify it. that's not clever debating skills or tricks - it's a challenge for him to justify his views. like you, he doesn't answer and instead we get the usual scripted nonsense about the question being unfair. take a look at your self- individually and as a part of your little gang on here - why won't you debate and respond to alternative views, questions and challenges. the fact is that a group has decided that this is the way to deal with political challenges. it is genuinely pathetic for a group of adults who are interested in politics to refuse to engage with criticism and critiques of their views - and the smokescreen about me not arguing fairly is just astonishingly juvenile.
this is the post which has panicked your little group into collective blubbing and bosom clutching:
"i know little about him and next to nothing before he was murdered. can you be specific about which of his views were 'fascist' and how you distinguish them from hard right or christian nationalist or social conservative etc views? and are fascist views distinct from advocating fascism as a political programme - and did he do that? genuinely know next to nothing about him."
can not one of you provide an answer? |
I don't know any of the other posters who have formed a particular view of you but I know my politics are quite different to several of the posters who you seem to think form some sort of gang. I guess it's easier to dismiss a group as acting as a collective rather than seeing it for what it is, a large number of unconnected people growing tired of your constant dishonesty and bad faith.
I'll spell this out for you quite clearly. When someone only ever engages in bad faith and when they are constantly dishonest, refusing to engage in debate with them is a perfectly legitimate response. That is what is happening here. | |
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