| The Tories are dead aren't they? on 21:00 - Oct 9 with 1305 views | reusersfreekicks |
| The Tories are dead aren't they? on 14:25 - Oct 8 by lowhouseblue |
that is misrepresenting and distorting what he actually said though. you are just ascribing to him a narrative which is entirely your own creation. attacking an argument you have invented and which is different from the one he made is known as straw manning. the version in your imagination may be very clearly racist but it's not what he said. |
No white faces - ffs - didn't think even you would defend this but there you go.
His claw it back caveating after is a pathetic attempt at non racism
He is a very very nasty piece of work |  | |  |
| The Tories are dead aren't they? on 21:05 - Oct 9 with 1286 views | reusersfreekicks |
| The Tories are dead aren't they? on 18:22 - Oct 8 by buoyant |
His observation was that he didn't see another white person and concluded that this was why he was concerned about lack of integration in that community.
He didn't draw that conclusion when he last went out in his predominantly white populated constituency.
That's why it's clear that his comments were indeed racist. |
Precisely - not hard is it
Unless you hold certain views.... [Post edited 9 Oct 21:05]
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| The Tories are dead aren't they? on 21:07 - Oct 9 with 1276 views | vapour_trail |
| The Tories are dead aren't they? on 21:00 - Oct 9 by reusersfreekicks |
No white faces - ffs - didn't think even you would defend this but there you go.
His claw it back caveating after is a pathetic attempt at non racism
He is a very very nasty piece of work |
It was entirely predictable. |  |
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| The Tories are dead aren't they? on 21:25 - Oct 9 with 1197 views | lowhouseblue |
| The Tories are dead aren't they? on 21:00 - Oct 9 by reusersfreekicks |
No white faces - ffs - didn't think even you would defend this but there you go.
His claw it back caveating after is a pathetic attempt at non racism
He is a very very nasty piece of work |
i can't really be bothered with this - these threads always turn unpleasant. i've said that handsworth is ethnically diverse. i've said that even in a perfectly integrated society there will of course be areas which aren't by themselves entirely representative of the country as a whole. i've said that he chose the wrong example to make his point. i don't think raising the issue of social integration is racist. i don't think that commenting on what he saw is racist. or that commenting on theabsence of the national 80% majority group, if that is what he saw, is inherently racist.
there are people who are more focused on shouting 'racist' than ever engaging with these issues. it's very unhealthy. in a confident, well integrated, non-racist community it should be possible to discuss things without being shouted down. much the public see these things, if politicians are deaf to it you'll get farage.
but i really can't be bothered with the usual name calling so I'll leave the thread there. |  |
| And so as the loose-bowelled pigeon of time swoops low over the unsuspecting tourist of destiny, and the flatulent skunk of fate wanders into the air-conditioning system of eternity, I notice it's the end of the show |
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| The Tories are dead aren't they? on 21:38 - Oct 9 with 1186 views | buoyant |
| The Tories are dead aren't they? on 21:25 - Oct 9 by lowhouseblue |
i can't really be bothered with this - these threads always turn unpleasant. i've said that handsworth is ethnically diverse. i've said that even in a perfectly integrated society there will of course be areas which aren't by themselves entirely representative of the country as a whole. i've said that he chose the wrong example to make his point. i don't think raising the issue of social integration is racist. i don't think that commenting on what he saw is racist. or that commenting on theabsence of the national 80% majority group, if that is what he saw, is inherently racist.
there are people who are more focused on shouting 'racist' than ever engaging with these issues. it's very unhealthy. in a confident, well integrated, non-racist community it should be possible to discuss things without being shouted down. much the public see these things, if politicians are deaf to it you'll get farage.
but i really can't be bothered with the usual name calling so I'll leave the thread there. |
The Tories are dead aren't they? by buoyant 8 Oct 14:40Surely you cannot deny that using terms such as slum and ghetto when also referring to a population that is entirely non white, all his words, will be parroted by the people that this type of rhetoric is aimed at?
It doesn't take much to join the dots does it and it is extremely distasteful. He knows exactly what he's doing and I would have thought someone as intelligent as you would also.
I really don't understand why you have become so contrary these past years other than to provoke a repetitive argument which you will call a debate that you will then claim to be right.
Textbook [Post edited 9 Oct 21:38]
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| The Tories are dead aren't they? on 22:15 - Oct 11 with 1014 views | DJR |
I went to Shoreham in Kent today and it was appalling. The thing I noticed there was that it was one of the worst integrated places I’ve ever been to. In fact, in the hour and a half I was there I didn’t see a single non-white face.
That’s not the kind of country I want to live in. I want to live in a country where people are properly integrated. It’s not about the colour of your skin or your faith, of course it isn’t. But I want people to be living alongside each other, not parallel lives. That’s not the right way we want to live as a country. [Post edited 12 Oct 7:48]
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| The Tories are dead aren't they? on 13:32 - Oct 12 with 806 views | redrickstuhaart |
I know precisely that location. Lived very close to that and walked that road every day as a first year student.
Its quite a long way from Handsworth. And very very Asian in makeup- other than the odd student. Its been that way for 40 years. |  | | |
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| The Tories are dead aren't they? on 15:27 - Oct 12 with 736 views | Nthsuffolkblue |
| The Tories are dead aren't they? on 13:32 - Oct 12 by redrickstuhaart |
I know precisely that location. Lived very close to that and walked that road every day as a first year student.
Its quite a long way from Handsworth. And very very Asian in makeup- other than the odd student. Its been that way for 40 years. |
Is it also a poor urban area so could accurately be described as a ghetto (although that is itself creating further negative images which won't have been accidental)?
Even if that is true, Jenrick then described it as a slum. Again, this won't have been accidental. The definition of a slum is "a squalid and overcrowded urban street or district inhabited by very poor people." I wonder how Aston compares to real slums.
Now, let's add together this. A group of non-white people is being equated with poverty and overcrowding in the context of a culture of demonising immigrants.
None of this choice of language is accidental.
The overall outcome. Compassionate people pick up on the overt racism and decry it. Those who agree with current culture to demonise immigrants, see it as speaking the truth despite the risk of being denounced as racist.
But the underlying point that is designed to sink in: those immigrants are causing poverty and overcrowding. |  |
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| The Tories are dead aren't they? on 16:51 - Oct 12 with 675 views | Swansea_Blue |
| The Tories are dead aren't they? on 15:27 - Oct 12 by Nthsuffolkblue |
Is it also a poor urban area so could accurately be described as a ghetto (although that is itself creating further negative images which won't have been accidental)?
Even if that is true, Jenrick then described it as a slum. Again, this won't have been accidental. The definition of a slum is "a squalid and overcrowded urban street or district inhabited by very poor people." I wonder how Aston compares to real slums.
Now, let's add together this. A group of non-white people is being equated with poverty and overcrowding in the context of a culture of demonising immigrants.
None of this choice of language is accidental.
The overall outcome. Compassionate people pick up on the overt racism and decry it. Those who agree with current culture to demonise immigrants, see it as speaking the truth despite the risk of being denounced as racist.
But the underlying point that is designed to sink in: those immigrants are causing poverty and overcrowding. |
For sure, it’s not accidental in the slightest. I feel sorry for Badenoch. I don’t really have the words to describe how small and lacking in self-respect she must be to defend his overt racism here. It’s fascinating though watching the Tories self-implode in real time. We’re very close to them dropping into 5th place in voting intention polls after both the Lib Dem’s and Greens (although why we’re having these polls 4 years out from an election is another question, so it’s all largely meaningless right now). |  |
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| The Tories are dead aren't they? on 20:11 - Oct 12 with 598 views | BanksterDebtSlave |
| The Tories are dead aren't they? on 16:51 - Oct 12 by Swansea_Blue |
For sure, it’s not accidental in the slightest. I feel sorry for Badenoch. I don’t really have the words to describe how small and lacking in self-respect she must be to defend his overt racism here. It’s fascinating though watching the Tories self-implode in real time. We’re very close to them dropping into 5th place in voting intention polls after both the Lib Dem’s and Greens (although why we’re having these polls 4 years out from an election is another question, so it’s all largely meaningless right now). |
#pray4Lowers |  |
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| The Tories are dead aren't they? on 20:36 - Oct 12 with 553 views | mutters |
| The Tories are dead aren't they? on 22:15 - Oct 11 by DJR |
I went to Shoreham in Kent today and it was appalling. The thing I noticed there was that it was one of the worst integrated places I’ve ever been to. In fact, in the hour and a half I was there I didn’t see a single non-white face.
That’s not the kind of country I want to live in. I want to live in a country where people are properly integrated. It’s not about the colour of your skin or your faith, of course it isn’t. But I want people to be living alongside each other, not parallel lives. That’s not the right way we want to live as a country. [Post edited 12 Oct 7:48]
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Whilst I completely agree with your sentiments here about wanting an integrated society, there will probably always be pockets where one section of the population (being grouped. Be it by colour, or religion or nationality or even just langauge) is incredibly dominate.
London for example is predominantly non white now, though integration was always relatively fine from what I recall when I lived there for 20 years (left about 10 years ago). Brixton years ago was a very different area years ago due to the influx of immigrants and that's where they went and settled.
My sister lives in the Midlands and there are areas where you won't see many white faces if any at all, it's just how humans are. We group together especially when going to a different country to the ones of our origin. Sydney was a great example, lots of Brits living in the same areas, even in Paris I found ex pats often lived in the same arrondissement.
In modern Britain, especially with the changing makeup of society, I'd imagine Shoreham being an outliner whereas more non white areas becoming more prominent as the years pass. |  |
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| The Tories are dead aren't they? on 23:54 - Oct 12 with 472 views | Broadbent23 |
The Tories failed to tell us fully about leaving the EU and what the future could be. Labour promises and fails spectacularly. Now the country is left with ever growing problems. | |
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| The Tories are dead aren't they? on 08:32 - Oct 13 with 364 views | MVBlue |
| The Tories are dead aren't they? on 15:22 - Oct 7 by Radlett_blue |
Well, it's easy to criticise the Tories because they were in power for 14 years & didn't do a good job. And the result (driven also by uncontrolled immigration) is the rise of Reform. This must be far less palatable to most reasonable people. T
As with the rise of Trump, it's more sensible to ask why large proportions of both the USA & much of Europe are now supporting populists/extremists. I think it's largely because the life of Mr Average has become worse & that is likely to continue to do so, given low economic growth & poor demographics. And at a time when the top few percent (in USA more so, but also in Britain) are getting even richer. |
Its caused by the take over of social media and limited newspaper ownership by Billionaires chasing stories driven by social media.
The sensible dialogue of the past seems gone, social media is driven by attention of clicks. It used to be extreme stunts and fails but then politicians and new journalists arrived and now it's quite extreme views caused by Boris's failure to run the country and boarders properly, removing us from the EU and leaving people with huge inflation and the highest energy prices IN THE WORLD. These 2 things are driving it, our only saving grace is that the General Election is years away. |  |
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| The Tories are dead aren't they? on 08:32 - Oct 13 with 363 views | The_Flashing_Smile |
| The Tories are dead aren't they? on 23:54 - Oct 12 by Broadbent23 |
The Tories failed to tell us fully about leaving the EU and what the future could be. Labour promises and fails spectacularly. Now the country is left with ever growing problems. |
Anyone with half a brain knew what the future could be if we left the EU, and many of us were saying so at the time.
In what way have Labour spectacularly failed, given they've only been in office 18 months? Did you expect 14 years of Tory mismangaement at best and corruption at worst, to be fixed by now? |  |
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| The Tories are dead aren't they? on 08:52 - Oct 13 with 337 views | DJR |
| The Tories are dead aren't they? on 20:36 - Oct 12 by mutters |
Whilst I completely agree with your sentiments here about wanting an integrated society, there will probably always be pockets where one section of the population (being grouped. Be it by colour, or religion or nationality or even just langauge) is incredibly dominate.
London for example is predominantly non white now, though integration was always relatively fine from what I recall when I lived there for 20 years (left about 10 years ago). Brixton years ago was a very different area years ago due to the influx of immigrants and that's where they went and settled.
My sister lives in the Midlands and there are areas where you won't see many white faces if any at all, it's just how humans are. We group together especially when going to a different country to the ones of our origin. Sydney was a great example, lots of Brits living in the same areas, even in Paris I found ex pats often lived in the same arrondissement.
In modern Britain, especially with the changing makeup of society, I'd imagine Shoreham being an outliner whereas more non white areas becoming more prominent as the years pass. |
Sorry, I was being ironic by quoting with slight modifications Jenrick's words.
Of course, it is understandable that certain groups may congregate in certain areas.
Take Stamford Hill, which has the largest Haredi community in Europe.
No-one ever criticises that, and in my view nor should they.
The fact though is that as wealth increases, people may move out of the area they initially settled in but in today's hostile climate (and given the number of reports I have heard of non-white people feeling fearful) that is probably less likely than was once the case.
Putting it another way those decrying a lack of integration are effectively doing everything they can to prevent it. | | | |
| The Tories are dead aren't they? on 10:03 - Oct 13 with 275 views | vapour_trail |
| The Tories are dead aren't they? on 23:54 - Oct 12 by Broadbent23 |
The Tories failed to tell us fully about leaving the EU and what the future could be. Labour promises and fails spectacularly. Now the country is left with ever growing problems. |
Hmm. Think you need to take some personal accountability if you believed what you were sold on Brexit mate.
It was fcking obvious it would be a disaster. | |
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| The Tories are dead aren't they? on 10:12 - Oct 13 with 263 views | MattinLondon |
| The Tories are dead aren't they? on 10:03 - Oct 13 by vapour_trail |
Hmm. Think you need to take some personal accountability if you believed what you were sold on Brexit mate.
It was fcking obvious it would be a disaster. |
And to be fair to the Tories not all of them were Brexiters and a fair few Labour MPs were in favour of leaving.
But it was obvious that leaving the EU would be disastrous for the EU. |  | | |
| The Tories are dead aren't they? on 11:14 - Oct 13 with 202 views | eireblue |
| The Tories are dead aren't they? on 23:54 - Oct 12 by Broadbent23 |
The Tories failed to tell us fully about leaving the EU and what the future could be. Labour promises and fails spectacularly. Now the country is left with ever growing problems. |
That’s your issue, listening to one opinion.
Some on here during the great TWTD Brexit debates, talked about the difference between free movement of labour and immigration, and what that would mean. |  | | |
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