| Poor ref decisions 09:54 - Mar 14 with 1524 views | quad |
I might not be popular for saying this but I think a lot of people are making too much about the penalties not given for us and poor ref decisions in general. It's shocking, but we need to be focused on what we need to do now, not worrying about what's gone on before. It's gone, we can't change it.
Yes, it's atrocious refereeing. But it's not aimed against Ipswich. They haven't got a vendetta against us.
I watched the Boro game against Charlton. Boro had a stonewall penalty appeal turned down and in a separate incident one of the Charlton players should have been sent off for a shocking tackle and he wasn't.
As far as I've seen nobody on here has mentioned either of those incidents. Maybe the atrocious refereeing does even itself out to some extent if we take the blue tinted specs off, even if we've definitely been dealt a really bad hand just recently. |  | | |  |
| Poor ref decisions on 10:13 - Mar 14 with 1209 views | redrickstuhaart |
Id agree with you, were it not for the Leif ban out of the blue.
Which genuinely makes me question whether there is something odd happening.
Unless someone can produce video of a clear deliberate hair pull. | |
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| Poor ref decisions on 10:18 - Mar 14 with 1193 views | quad |
| Poor ref decisions on 10:13 - Mar 14 by redrickstuhaart |
Id agree with you, were it not for the Leif ban out of the blue.
Which genuinely makes me question whether there is something odd happening.
Unless someone can produce video of a clear deliberate hair pull. |
Sorry, I should have clarified that.
I agree with you. The Leif ban is different and is bang out of order. | | | |
| Poor ref decisions on 10:21 - Mar 14 with 1168 views | The_Flashing_Smile |
| Poor ref decisions on 10:13 - Mar 14 by redrickstuhaart |
Id agree with you, were it not for the Leif ban out of the blue.
Which genuinely makes me question whether there is something odd happening.
Unless someone can produce video of a clear deliberate hair pull. |
It may well be for this shove in the face afterwards;
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| Poor ref decisions on 10:27 - Mar 14 with 1142 views | quad |
| Poor ref decisions on 10:21 - Mar 14 by The_Flashing_Smile |
It may well be for this shove in the face afterwards;
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Very harsh if it was.
Their player clearly either kicks out or tries to trip Leif over.
Disappointing cos Leif didn't need to react. But then I guess most people would, it's the natural reaction. | | | |
| Poor ref decisions on 10:30 - Mar 14 with 1122 views | The_Flashing_Smile |
I disagree that we should be moving on, saying "It's gone, we can't change it."
Ashton doesn't seem to be. He's fighting it. If you don't object and fight these things then nothing gets done. Nothing changes.
And how can you be sure "it's not aimed against Ipswich"? Perhaps not consciously, but there's a very real chance refs are subconsciously trying to not favour the bigger/better/wealthier club and are therefore compensating too far the other way.
These things should be looked at and discussed, not just swept under the carpet. Equally, saying things are gone and in the past so we should just forget them is not a good argument. When things are wrong you need to look into why and if changes can be made to minimise them happening in future. | |
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| Poor ref decisions on 10:32 - Mar 14 with 1124 views | grow_our_own |
"may well be for this shove in the face" - 1) shove was in the shoulder/chest not the face, so a yellow, not a red. Not violent. And 2) Okoli kicked-out at Davis after the ball had gone, which is a red card and three match ban for violent conduct! You couldn't make it up! [Post edited 14 Mar 10:33]
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| Poor ref decisions on 10:32 - Mar 14 with 1104 views | The_Flashing_Smile |
| Poor ref decisions on 10:27 - Mar 14 by quad |
Very harsh if it was.
Their player clearly either kicks out or tries to trip Leif over.
Disappointing cos Leif didn't need to react. But then I guess most people would, it's the natural reaction. |
In football, when you raise your hands to another player's face, you know you're asking for trouble from the authorities.
That video was put up as an example of how ridiculous the decision is, but for me, if anything, it strengthens it. | |
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| Poor ref decisions on 10:36 - Mar 14 with 1078 views | The_Flashing_Smile |
| Poor ref decisions on 10:32 - Mar 14 by grow_our_own |
"may well be for this shove in the face" - 1) shove was in the shoulder/chest not the face, so a yellow, not a red. Not violent. And 2) Okoli kicked-out at Davis after the ball had gone, which is a red card and three match ban for violent conduct! You couldn't make it up! [Post edited 14 Mar 10:33]
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Not sure how you can be so sure that's shoulder/chest.
Regardless, raising your hands anywhere near a player's face can get you in hot water. | |
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| Poor ref decisions on 10:41 - Mar 14 with 1051 views | Benters |
| Poor ref decisions on 10:21 - Mar 14 by The_Flashing_Smile |
It may well be for this shove in the face afterwards;
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Did old matey kick out on the floor? |  |
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| Poor ref decisions on 10:41 - Mar 14 with 1049 views | grow_our_own |
| Poor ref decisions on 10:36 - Mar 14 by The_Flashing_Smile |
Not sure how you can be so sure that's shoulder/chest.
Regardless, raising your hands anywhere near a player's face can get you in hot water. |
Push is a yellow card. Period. Kicking someone when the ball has gone is a red. EFL disciplinary committee are on crack. | | | |
| Poor ref decisions on 10:42 - Mar 14 with 1026 views | The_Flashing_Smile |
| Poor ref decisions on 10:41 - Mar 14 by Benters |
Did old matey kick out on the floor? |
Hmm, he wraps his leg around Leif a bit. "Kick out" is probably a bit strong. | |
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| Poor ref decisions on 10:44 - Mar 14 with 1026 views | Benters |
| Poor ref decisions on 10:42 - Mar 14 by The_Flashing_Smile |
Hmm, he wraps his leg around Leif a bit. "Kick out" is probably a bit strong. |
Still shouldn’t have shoved him like that though. | |
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| Poor ref decisions on 10:48 - Mar 14 with 1002 views | quad |
| Poor ref decisions on 10:30 - Mar 14 by The_Flashing_Smile |
I disagree that we should be moving on, saying "It's gone, we can't change it."
Ashton doesn't seem to be. He's fighting it. If you don't object and fight these things then nothing gets done. Nothing changes.
And how can you be sure "it's not aimed against Ipswich"? Perhaps not consciously, but there's a very real chance refs are subconsciously trying to not favour the bigger/better/wealthier club and are therefore compensating too far the other way.
These things should be looked at and discussed, not just swept under the carpet. Equally, saying things are gone and in the past so we should just forget them is not a good argument. When things are wrong you need to look into why and if changes can be made to minimise them happening in future. |
I completely understand what you're saying.
If Ashton wants to fight against it then fair enough. I'm not convinced it will change anything, but it's worthwhile if he can discuss it with the powers that be.
I just think it's important to consider the impact this has had on the players mentally. I don't think it helps for them to dwell on the injustice of it all. Far better if they give all their focus on the up coming games. If I was McKenna, I would be using it as a huge motivational tool for the players. If that doesn't help to fire them up for the full 90 minutes, then nothing will.
I won't go in to detail but I've had some work-related issues recently, and I've found that holding on to thoughts of things that are unfair doesn't do your long term mental health much good. So that's influenced how I feel about it.
And also make the point that Boro players and fans are probably feeling just as hard done by for the 2 big decisions that didn't go their way against Charlton. We need to consider that too. | | | |
| Poor ref decisions on 11:04 - Mar 14 with 947 views | Churchman |
| Poor ref decisions on 10:30 - Mar 14 by The_Flashing_Smile |
I disagree that we should be moving on, saying "It's gone, we can't change it."
Ashton doesn't seem to be. He's fighting it. If you don't object and fight these things then nothing gets done. Nothing changes.
And how can you be sure "it's not aimed against Ipswich"? Perhaps not consciously, but there's a very real chance refs are subconsciously trying to not favour the bigger/better/wealthier club and are therefore compensating too far the other way.
These things should be looked at and discussed, not just swept under the carpet. Equally, saying things are gone and in the past so we should just forget them is not a good argument. When things are wrong you need to look into why and if changes can be made to minimise them happening in future. |
Regarding your middle paragraph, I do think weak refs over compensate to ensure they are seen to be being ‘fair’. I have noticed that a lot at Portman Road this season where the opposition have been allowed to do what they like while our players have been penalised for just about everything. Somehow, it feels like we’ve not had a fair share of the breaks.
The only way to deal with it is to put the game beyond the opposition. It’s no good complaining when you are playing half a game each week. Robins was right. Stoke Reserves more than deserved their point and that’s because we were farcically bad in the first half and wide open at times in the second. Leicester? Took it too them second half, but where were we for the first 45 mins?
It’s really up to us. We have the players. |  | | |
| Poor ref decisions on 11:24 - Mar 14 with 870 views | Pinewoodblue |
| Poor ref decisions on 10:30 - Mar 14 by The_Flashing_Smile |
I disagree that we should be moving on, saying "It's gone, we can't change it."
Ashton doesn't seem to be. He's fighting it. If you don't object and fight these things then nothing gets done. Nothing changes.
And how can you be sure "it's not aimed against Ipswich"? Perhaps not consciously, but there's a very real chance refs are subconsciously trying to not favour the bigger/better/wealthier club and are therefore compensating too far the other way.
These things should be looked at and discussed, not just swept under the carpet. Equally, saying things are gone and in the past so we should just forget them is not a good argument. When things are wrong you need to look into why and if changes can be made to minimise them happening in future. |
Agree. The thing I would like to know is why was the incident reviewed? I suspect it only came to light when they reviewed the performance of the referee. Effectively post match VAR which serves no purpose whatsoever.
Realistically we have only ourselves to blame for dropping four points. We should have won both gsmes comfortably, neither decision should have resulted in dropping points. Going forward no reason why this incidents should have an adverse impact on future results. |  |
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| Poor ref decisions on 11:25 - Mar 14 with 860 views | billlm |
| Poor ref decisions on 10:13 - Mar 14 by redrickstuhaart |
Id agree with you, were it not for the Leif ban out of the blue.
Which genuinely makes me question whether there is something odd happening.
Unless someone can produce video of a clear deliberate hair pull. |
It's harsh for sure but there's no where to hide these days if your putting your hands on another player off the ball,
Just shows the intellect of some players, granted it's in the heat but your not getting away with it, |  | | |
| Poor ref decisions on 11:25 - Mar 14 with 860 views | ottovonbismark |
| Poor ref decisions on 10:30 - Mar 14 by The_Flashing_Smile |
I disagree that we should be moving on, saying "It's gone, we can't change it."
Ashton doesn't seem to be. He's fighting it. If you don't object and fight these things then nothing gets done. Nothing changes.
And how can you be sure "it's not aimed against Ipswich"? Perhaps not consciously, but there's a very real chance refs are subconsciously trying to not favour the bigger/better/wealthier club and are therefore compensating too far the other way.
These things should be looked at and discussed, not just swept under the carpet. Equally, saying things are gone and in the past so we should just forget them is not a good argument. When things are wrong you need to look into why and if changes can be made to minimise them happening in future. |
ashton is doing that to deflect from very poor performances of late. | | | |
| Poor ref decisions on 11:28 - Mar 14 with 854 views | stonojnr |
well most of us arent going to bother watching other games in the championship, all it shows is the quality of the referees is shocking across the board, to think this lot are 1 level below taking on an Arsenal game with all their rolling around on the floor and wrestling at corners to deal with, think how many free kicks Busby would be giving in one of those games, be more like 45mins with the ball out of play.
but its hard not to feel some of these refs are unconciously biased against us, when theyll give free kicks, like the one Busby gave Leicester that led to their goal, whilst Town players were getting kicked, head locked, tackled from behind and we're getting nothing.
its like be a rubbish ref, but be consistently rubbish for both sides at the very least, then we can work on improving your decision making in these circumstances. | | | |
| Poor ref decisions on 11:30 - Mar 14 with 848 views | Swansea_Blue |
| Poor ref decisions on 10:21 - Mar 14 by The_Flashing_Smile |
It may well be for this shove in the face afterwards;
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Phil said he was told it was for pulling his hair, so it would have been when they first came together and before the Dtoke player kicked out. It was still incredibly harsh as the replay from the goal came shows Leif wasn’t looking at the player. But then he’s admitted the charge, so it is what it is. |  |
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| Poor ref decisions on 11:33 - Mar 14 with 839 views | Ryorry |
| Poor ref decisions on 11:04 - Mar 14 by Churchman |
Regarding your middle paragraph, I do think weak refs over compensate to ensure they are seen to be being ‘fair’. I have noticed that a lot at Portman Road this season where the opposition have been allowed to do what they like while our players have been penalised for just about everything. Somehow, it feels like we’ve not had a fair share of the breaks.
The only way to deal with it is to put the game beyond the opposition. It’s no good complaining when you are playing half a game each week. Robins was right. Stoke Reserves more than deserved their point and that’s because we were farcically bad in the first half and wide open at times in the second. Leicester? Took it too them second half, but where were we for the first 45 mins?
It’s really up to us. We have the players. |
Nope, sorry, that just doesn’t do it for me.
Whatever we could have, should have, would have done ourselves, the facts are that even the EFL admit that we weren’t given 2 penalties that we should have had. Goals change games (if we’d put them away, which with Clarke’s record you’d assume would be the case if he were on the pitch), giving the whole team a lift & new zest.
And Cun*a got less punishment for his outrageous assault in cold blood on a match official than Leif’s retaliation against an opponent on the pitch, who’d initiated the infringement on Leif but got away scott free (as I understand it, happy to be corrected). One law for us …. Glad Ashton’s fighting it, maybe it’ll encourage the EFL to be more careful, including in the selection of match officials and the scrutiny of them. |  |
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| Poor ref decisions on 11:34 - Mar 14 with 834 views | Millsey |
| Poor ref decisions on 10:21 - Mar 14 by The_Flashing_Smile |
It may well be for this shove in the face afterwards;
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I saw it live and David pushed on the shoulders and the scripted went down holding his face ffs |  | | |
| Poor ref decisions on 11:39 - Mar 14 with 821 views | Guthrum |
| Poor ref decisions on 10:30 - Mar 14 by The_Flashing_Smile |
I disagree that we should be moving on, saying "It's gone, we can't change it."
Ashton doesn't seem to be. He's fighting it. If you don't object and fight these things then nothing gets done. Nothing changes.
And how can you be sure "it's not aimed against Ipswich"? Perhaps not consciously, but there's a very real chance refs are subconsciously trying to not favour the bigger/better/wealthier club and are therefore compensating too far the other way.
These things should be looked at and discussed, not just swept under the carpet. Equally, saying things are gone and in the past so we should just forget them is not a good argument. When things are wrong you need to look into why and if changes can be made to minimise them happening in future. |
More than that, it's part of Ashton's job to push and challenge on any issue which potentially damages Ipswich's chances. Both as the lead administrator for the club liasing with the authorities and as guardian of investors' interests. |  |
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| Poor ref decisions on 11:46 - Mar 14 with 807 views | Guthrum |
Thing is, despite the saying, there is no guarantee that things will even themselves out.
While there will theoretically be some reversion to the mean over a 46-game season, they are all discrete events, overseen by a number of individuals, with one instance having little or no influence over any other. A poor decision which happens to go against Ipswich in no way means there will be another which goes in our favour on a different occasion.
It's a cliche, but very unlikely to actually be true. | |
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| Poor ref decisions on 12:29 - Mar 14 with 712 views | The_Flashing_Smile |
| Poor ref decisions on 10:48 - Mar 14 by quad |
I completely understand what you're saying.
If Ashton wants to fight against it then fair enough. I'm not convinced it will change anything, but it's worthwhile if he can discuss it with the powers that be.
I just think it's important to consider the impact this has had on the players mentally. I don't think it helps for them to dwell on the injustice of it all. Far better if they give all their focus on the up coming games. If I was McKenna, I would be using it as a huge motivational tool for the players. If that doesn't help to fire them up for the full 90 minutes, then nothing will.
I won't go in to detail but I've had some work-related issues recently, and I've found that holding on to thoughts of things that are unfair doesn't do your long term mental health much good. So that's influenced how I feel about it.
And also make the point that Boro players and fans are probably feeling just as hard done by for the 2 big decisions that didn't go their way against Charlton. We need to consider that too. |
I don't think there's any evidence the players are dwelling on it.
And you kind of contradict yourself by saying they should use it as motivation (albeit I agree on that part). | |
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| Poor ref decisions on 12:33 - Mar 14 with 695 views | The_Flashing_Smile |
| Poor ref decisions on 11:25 - Mar 14 by ottovonbismark |
ashton is doing that to deflect from very poor performances of late. |
Well that's clearly nonsense. For one thing, poor performances are nothing to do with Ashton. And but for two last min soft pen decisions we could quite easily be sitting on 5 wins from 5. If that's poor performances then bring on another 10! | |
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