| Constant changes driving me mad 07:52 - Feb 15 with 4465 views | onceablue |
3-4 changes to the side every match it’s ridiculous that’s Kids football
Not only that McKenna then regularly makes at least 3 subs every match as well
Pick what you think is your best 11 and stick to it
If the players who are left out don’t like it tough
Do Plymouth, Wednesday, Derby make these amount of changes cause they don’t and that’s why there are able to put a decent run of results together
They also have experienced managers which helps.
We seriously have a chance of missing out on playoffs which I am sorry but this would rank as one of the biggest failures in the last 20 years |  | | |  |
| Constant changes driving me mad on 07:55 - Feb 15 with 2726 views | Herbivore |
Nobody was complaining when he was rotating and making subs at the start of the season. I don't think that is our main problem. |  |
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| Constant changes driving me mad on 07:58 - Feb 15 with 2708 views | onceablue |
| Constant changes driving me mad on 07:55 - Feb 15 by Herbivore |
Nobody was complaining when he was rotating and making subs at the start of the season. I don't think that is our main problem. |
But we appear to be the only side that does it in the top 6? | | | |
| Constant changes driving me mad on 07:59 - Feb 15 with 2706 views | StokieBlue |
I know most of your posts are negative but I'll humour you:
- It's said before it's a squad game, it's not kids football, it's the benefits of having squad depth and it's unlikely to change with McKenna or any other modern manager with the same resources.
- People have spent the season highlighting how the ability to make 5 subs has worked to our advantage, now it's suddenly a source of criticism?
- Not really sure what you are getting at with "experienced managers". By that logic we would run out of managers very quickly as no new managers would get jobs as they weren't experienced. We went with McKenna for a reason and that is the high potential upside.
It's a very rocky patch and the performance yesterday was awful but I don't think it's right to start cherry picking things for criticism which have historically been cited as positives.
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| Avatar - IC410 - Tadpoles Nebula |
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| Constant changes driving me mad on 08:05 - Feb 15 with 2645 views | Herbivore |
| Constant changes driving me mad on 07:58 - Feb 15 by onceablue |
But we appear to be the only side that does it in the top 6? |
So? We have the most strength in depth of the sides in the top 6 and the way we play demands a lot of the players. Our issue at the minute seems to be a lack of confidence meaning we can't execute our usual way of playing well enough. First half against Morecambe aside, we've not been at our usual standards in 2023. The rotation has been something we've done since McKenna came in, it's not something he's only just started so I think it's wrong to blame it for our recent poor form. | |
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| Constant changes driving me mad on 08:16 - Feb 15 with 2610 views | onceablue |
| Constant changes driving me mad on 07:59 - Feb 15 by StokieBlue |
I know most of your posts are negative but I'll humour you:
- It's said before it's a squad game, it's not kids football, it's the benefits of having squad depth and it's unlikely to change with McKenna or any other modern manager with the same resources.
- People have spent the season highlighting how the ability to make 5 subs has worked to our advantage, now it's suddenly a source of criticism?
- Not really sure what you are getting at with "experienced managers". By that logic we would run out of managers very quickly as no new managers would get jobs as they weren't experienced. We went with McKenna for a reason and that is the high potential upside.
It's a very rocky patch and the performance yesterday was awful but I don't think it's right to start cherry picking things for criticism which have historically been cited as positives.
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Thanks for humouring me
The high potential upside what do you mean by that?
Unless McKenna gets us out of this league and quickly I see no potential upside
McCarthy did a similar thing in 14/15 got the crowds back I remember being at the Charlton home game at Christmas and it being a sell out
We then did what is happening now hit a terrible run of form and scrapped into play offs because Derby lost on the last day. Then lost playoffs to Norwich
It then all went downhill and crowds dropped to 13,000 again within 2 seasons
If we do not got out of this league quickly I can see a similar thing happening
By the way I do not consider myself to be negative more of a realist | | | |
| Constant changes driving me mad on 08:20 - Feb 15 with 2597 views | StokieBlue |
| Constant changes driving me mad on 08:16 - Feb 15 by onceablue |
Thanks for humouring me
The high potential upside what do you mean by that?
Unless McKenna gets us out of this league and quickly I see no potential upside
McCarthy did a similar thing in 14/15 got the crowds back I remember being at the Charlton home game at Christmas and it being a sell out
We then did what is happening now hit a terrible run of form and scrapped into play offs because Derby lost on the last day. Then lost playoffs to Norwich
It then all went downhill and crowds dropped to 13,000 again within 2 seasons
If we do not got out of this league quickly I can see a similar thing happening
By the way I do not consider myself to be negative more of a realist |
"The high potential upside what do you mean by that?"
He's 36 year old manager with excellent coaching pedigree in his first job in football management. He's learning but there is clearly lots of room for him to improve, far more than getting some 50 year old from League Two. McKenna getting us out of this league quickly is nothing to do with his longer term potential upside.
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| Avatar - IC410 - Tadpoles Nebula |
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| Constant changes driving me mad on 08:29 - Feb 15 with 2547 views | OldFart71 |
I think the trouble is I am not sure McKenna knows his best team. When we played Wednesday and I saw the team sheet I thought yes, this is our best team. Lo and behold straight after the penalty miss we were 0-2 down. I can't put my finger on the problem. Think it amounts to so many things. Slow starts, mistakes, character, injuries, chopping and changing the team. When Robson was manager for one he never had the number of players to call upon therefore players like Beattie were possibly wheeled out in important games whether 100% fit or not, but in the main the team remained pretty much the same over and over with players like Robin Turner and David Gheddis in reserve. It would be lunacy to change the manager given how far we have come. But I sometimes wonder whether this sourcing of players is the right way. I was critical of it pre Mckenna as it was obvious that many of the recruits were just topping up their pension funds. But as with Robson sometimes it's just as important to go and watch a player and track him for a while rather than this analytical approach of how often he farts. | | | |
| Constant changes driving me mad on 08:36 - Feb 15 with 2526 views | portmanking |
| Constant changes driving me mad on 08:05 - Feb 15 by Herbivore |
So? We have the most strength in depth of the sides in the top 6 and the way we play demands a lot of the players. Our issue at the minute seems to be a lack of confidence meaning we can't execute our usual way of playing well enough. First half against Morecambe aside, we've not been at our usual standards in 2023. The rotation has been something we've done since McKenna came in, it's not something he's only just started so I think it's wrong to blame it for our recent poor form. |
I do think the rotation is what's stunted our fluidity and rhythm though. You look at the likes of Bolton and Derby that have grown stronger as the season's elapsed - that's because they've found an XI and a formula that works. | | | |
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| Constant changes driving me mad on 08:52 - Feb 15 with 2489 views | Herbivore |
| Constant changes driving me mad on 08:36 - Feb 15 by portmanking |
I do think the rotation is what's stunted our fluidity and rhythm though. You look at the likes of Bolton and Derby that have grown stronger as the season's elapsed - that's because they've found an XI and a formula that works. |
We also had a formula that worked until a couple of months ago. Again, if rotation had only just started and coincided with our poor run then fair enough, but it's something McKenna has done from day 1 and until the last couple of months it's worked. | |
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| Constant changes driving me mad on 08:54 - Feb 15 with 2497 views | homer_123 |
| Constant changes driving me mad on 08:29 - Feb 15 by OldFart71 |
I think the trouble is I am not sure McKenna knows his best team. When we played Wednesday and I saw the team sheet I thought yes, this is our best team. Lo and behold straight after the penalty miss we were 0-2 down. I can't put my finger on the problem. Think it amounts to so many things. Slow starts, mistakes, character, injuries, chopping and changing the team. When Robson was manager for one he never had the number of players to call upon therefore players like Beattie were possibly wheeled out in important games whether 100% fit or not, but in the main the team remained pretty much the same over and over with players like Robin Turner and David Gheddis in reserve. It would be lunacy to change the manager given how far we have come. But I sometimes wonder whether this sourcing of players is the right way. I was critical of it pre Mckenna as it was obvious that many of the recruits were just topping up their pension funds. But as with Robson sometimes it's just as important to go and watch a player and track him for a while rather than this analytical approach of how often he farts. |
"Knows his best team" - this is being talked about a lot right now.
Football has moved on - it's no longer about the best XI - it's about the squad. Due to KMs (not just his by the way) tactics and approach - with the amount of pressing we do, high up the pitch trying to win possesion back etc. you cannot simply run with a small squad or the same XI week in week out.
Look at Broady as a really good example. He's come from Wigan who's style is a lot more slow paced, sitting back and as a forward player wasn't being asked to put in the work rate he is now and he's struggling. He cannot play at that tempo 3 times in a 7 days. [Post edited 15 Feb 2023 8:57]
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| Constant changes driving me mad on 09:05 - Feb 15 with 2449 views | hype313 |
| Constant changes driving me mad on 08:05 - Feb 15 by Herbivore |
So? We have the most strength in depth of the sides in the top 6 and the way we play demands a lot of the players. Our issue at the minute seems to be a lack of confidence meaning we can't execute our usual way of playing well enough. First half against Morecambe aside, we've not been at our usual standards in 2023. The rotation has been something we've done since McKenna came in, it's not something he's only just started so I think it's wrong to blame it for our recent poor form. |
Agreed, but I do find it a bit of a head scratcher when he leaves Chaplin on the bench, our top scorer, and 3 heavily funded January signings sat there.
To play Aluko who hasn't even been in the 18 for a long period and has been in the stands doing analytics. |  |
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| Constant changes driving me mad on 09:12 - Feb 15 with 2426 views | Herbivore |
| Constant changes driving me mad on 09:05 - Feb 15 by hype313 |
Agreed, but I do find it a bit of a head scratcher when he leaves Chaplin on the bench, our top scorer, and 3 heavily funded January signings sat there.
To play Aluko who hasn't even been in the 18 for a long period and has been in the stands doing analytics. |
I definitely agree that some of the particular decisions have been baffling - Hirst starting over Ladapo on Saturday was another one I didn't agree with - and starting Harness at all at the moment feels like a bad call as he's in shocking form, but in principle there's not much wrong with rotation and it's served us well for most of McKenna's 14 months here. | |
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| 100% agree with this. on 09:20 - Feb 15 with 2403 views | Marshalls_Mullet |
And to be fair, its usually 5 subs, which really doesnt seem to help us.
I wonder if the players get fed up playing 60 mins. |  |
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| Constant changes driving me mad on 09:24 - Feb 15 with 2375 views | Marshalls_Mullet |
| Constant changes driving me mad on 08:54 - Feb 15 by homer_123 |
"Knows his best team" - this is being talked about a lot right now.
Football has moved on - it's no longer about the best XI - it's about the squad. Due to KMs (not just his by the way) tactics and approach - with the amount of pressing we do, high up the pitch trying to win possesion back etc. you cannot simply run with a small squad or the same XI week in week out.
Look at Broady as a really good example. He's come from Wigan who's style is a lot more slow paced, sitting back and as a forward player wasn't being asked to put in the work rate he is now and he's struggling. He cannot play at that tempo 3 times in a 7 days. [Post edited 15 Feb 2023 8:57]
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Look at Liverpool when they were at their best under Klopp, probably the most energetic club in the country, running more than most at high intensity.
Yet, Klopp had a pretty consistent first XI.
And frankly, recruitment should be in sync with our style of play and sign players who can play to that level of intensity week in, week out.
KM tinkers more than he needs to. | |
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| Constant changes driving me mad on 09:36 - Feb 15 with 2337 views | Marshalls_Mullet |
| Constant changes driving me mad on 07:59 - Feb 15 by StokieBlue |
I know most of your posts are negative but I'll humour you:
- It's said before it's a squad game, it's not kids football, it's the benefits of having squad depth and it's unlikely to change with McKenna or any other modern manager with the same resources.
- People have spent the season highlighting how the ability to make 5 subs has worked to our advantage, now it's suddenly a source of criticism?
- Not really sure what you are getting at with "experienced managers". By that logic we would run out of managers very quickly as no new managers would get jobs as they weren't experienced. We went with McKenna for a reason and that is the high potential upside.
It's a very rocky patch and the performance yesterday was awful but I don't think it's right to start cherry picking things for criticism which have historically been cited as positives.
SB |
Out of interest, do Plymouth, Sheff Wed, Bolton or Derby make as many changes as we do?
I doubt Plymouth and Bolton have the same squad depth? | |
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| Constant changes driving me mad on 09:39 - Feb 15 with 2341 views | PhilTWTD |
Why's it kids football? Not sure KMc is doing anything most managers with the wherewithall to make changes don't do these days. |  | | |
| 100% agree with this. on 09:40 - Feb 15 with 2330 views | FromReuserWithLove |
| 100% agree with this. on 09:20 - Feb 15 by Marshalls_Mullet |
And to be fair, its usually 5 subs, which really doesnt seem to help us.
I wonder if the players get fed up playing 60 mins. |
Yep, this. The subs were working when we were winning as they were killing games off. Now they're killing games off when we need to kick-on and grab a goal. Any momentum that was simmering is stopped dead in its tracks. Sheff Weds game was a perfect example of that.
And imo Chaplin should start every game. |  | | |
| 100% agree with this. on 09:42 - Feb 15 with 2305 views | Marshalls_Mullet |
| 100% agree with this. on 09:40 - Feb 15 by FromReuserWithLove |
Yep, this. The subs were working when we were winning as they were killing games off. Now they're killing games off when we need to kick-on and grab a goal. Any momentum that was simmering is stopped dead in its tracks. Sheff Weds game was a perfect example of that.
And imo Chaplin should start every game. |
To be honest, I wasnt a fan of 5 subs at any point. | |
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| Constant changes driving me mad on 09:44 - Feb 15 with 2285 views | StokieBlue |
| Constant changes driving me mad on 09:36 - Feb 15 by Marshalls_Mullet |
Out of interest, do Plymouth, Sheff Wed, Bolton or Derby make as many changes as we do?
I doubt Plymouth and Bolton have the same squad depth? |
I'm not sure what your point is though?
There was no complaints about making changes when we were winning, it's a convenient thing to point at now for those that wish to.
It's clearly a squad game if you can afford it and we can, I think our squad is deeper than Plymouth of Sheff Wed so not sure any comparisons are valid.
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| Avatar - IC410 - Tadpoles Nebula |
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| Constant changes driving me mad on 09:46 - Feb 15 with 2270 views | Marshalls_Mullet |
| Constant changes driving me mad on 09:39 - Feb 15 by PhilTWTD |
Why's it kids football? Not sure KMc is doing anything most managers with the wherewithall to make changes don't do these days. |
I actually enjoyed the Merseyside derby, where by 80 mins Klopp had made just one sub.
He made a further two on 80 mins. Then a final two on 90 mins.
It was good to see a settled side for 80 mins in a game. | |
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| Constant changes driving me mad on 09:50 - Feb 15 with 2242 views | Marshalls_Mullet |
| Constant changes driving me mad on 09:44 - Feb 15 by StokieBlue |
I'm not sure what your point is though?
There was no complaints about making changes when we were winning, it's a convenient thing to point at now for those that wish to.
It's clearly a squad game if you can afford it and we can, I think our squad is deeper than Plymouth of Sheff Wed so not sure any comparisons are valid.
SB |
My point is you said its a squad game.
My counter was to ask whether the more successful teams with smaller squads make as many changes. They prove you can have success with a small squad. Perfectly valid.
Its our choice to have a deeper squad, and if it is causing us problems then thats of our own making.
I've always preferred a settled side. | |
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| Constant changes driving me mad on 09:57 - Feb 15 with 2198 views | FrimleyBlue |
| Constant changes driving me mad on 09:50 - Feb 15 by Marshalls_Mullet |
My point is you said its a squad game.
My counter was to ask whether the more successful teams with smaller squads make as many changes. They prove you can have success with a small squad. Perfectly valid.
Its our choice to have a deeper squad, and if it is causing us problems then thats of our own making.
I've always preferred a settled side. |
Also.
Since we were winning we've added more players to the squad so theres been ever more rotation, and will have even more when Ball. JJ. Return.
The simplest example of changes for changes sake..
Wednesday... we dropped Ladapo. For what reason? |  |
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| Constant changes driving me mad on 09:57 - Feb 15 with 2197 views | Herbivore |
| Constant changes driving me mad on 09:50 - Feb 15 by Marshalls_Mullet |
My point is you said its a squad game.
My counter was to ask whether the more successful teams with smaller squads make as many changes. They prove you can have success with a small squad. Perfectly valid.
Its our choice to have a deeper squad, and if it is causing us problems then thats of our own making.
I've always preferred a settled side. |
It seems unlikely that rotation is now the source of our problems when it hasn't been for 12 of the 14 month McKenna has been in charge. | |
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| Constant changes driving me mad on 10:02 - Feb 15 with 2171 views | Marshalls_Mullet |
| Constant changes driving me mad on 09:57 - Feb 15 by Herbivore |
It seems unlikely that rotation is now the source of our problems when it hasn't been for 12 of the 14 month McKenna has been in charge. |
I think it is a current problem, and our form has been poor for 4 months now. | |
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| Constant changes driving me mad on 10:20 - Feb 15 with 2102 views | Herbivore |
| Constant changes driving me mad on 10:02 - Feb 15 by Marshalls_Mullet |
I think it is a current problem, and our form has been poor for 4 months now. |
Why has it become a problem now when it hasn't been for most of McKenna's tenure? | |
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