| Keir Starmer's abysmal interview on BBC One 16:10 - May 7 with 5441 views | pointofblue |
Completely unable to even give a straight answer or plan - then wonder why Labour are struggling to connect with the public.
The first interview is difficult after a result like this but he looked unprepared and on the run. |  |
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| Keir Starmer's abysmal interview on BBC One on 08:31 - May 8 with 1465 views | PrideOfTheEast |
| Keir Starmer's abysmal interview on BBC One on 01:27 - May 8 by ZXBlue |
It is fascinating to see how criticism of Corbyn and his impact is now derided by many.
His impact is still very relevant to Labour;s fortunes. He divided the party horribly, such that they are mostly more interested in the fight between moderates and corbynites than in actually presenting a united front and trying to win elections. The damage done to labour credibility and the "red wall" by Corbyn's dithering on brexit and 1970s student politcs, is an enduring legacy which will be a millstone for labour for years.
Corbyn could have swung the brexit vote to remain, had he wanted to. [Post edited 8 May 2021 1:28]
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100% this. | | | |
| Keir Starmer's abysmal interview on BBC One on 08:32 - May 8 with 1462 views | vapour_trail |
| Keir Starmer's abysmal interview on BBC One on 08:11 - May 8 by BlueandTruesince82 |
The grey man. Elected purely as a Corbyn antidote, less personality and less to the left, your mum quite fancies him but she's not going to vote for him coz he doesnt stand for anything and even she needs more reason than he's bit of a dish, Labour scratch their heads because the previous bloke stood for too much and the one before that stood for being a poor imitation of his brother which ought to have been mildly inoffensive, which it was until he ate a sandwich.....
Runners and riders begin to jockey, the left begin to sharpen their knives, could Corbyn return they ask? Leading to the right digging trenches whilst they consider voting Lib Dem or Green, some may even secretly vote for Boris.... civil war within the Labour party starts to appear upon the horizon again and still no one thinks to actually ask traditional Labour voters what they think.
Its all rather watchable. |
The lib dems, I’d forgotten that was a thing until I got to the polling booth on Thursday. |  |
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| Keir Starmer's abysmal interview on BBC One on 08:39 - May 8 with 1440 views | BanksterDebtSlave |
| Keir Starmer's abysmal interview on BBC One on 08:31 - May 8 by PrideOfTheEast |
100% this. |
Funny how united fronts are back on the table with a suited grey moderate/right captain at the helm! |  |
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| Keir Starmer's abysmal interview on BBC One on 08:41 - May 8 with 1439 views | BlueandTruesince82 |
| Keir Starmer's abysmal interview on BBC One on 08:32 - May 8 by vapour_trail |
The lib dems, I’d forgotten that was a thing until I got to the polling booth on Thursday. |
As irrelevant as they ever have been ATM. Merely acting as siphon for Labour voters, esp the odd student who is v particular about their pronouns |  |
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| Keir Starmer's abysmal interview on BBC One on 08:41 - May 8 with 1438 views | pennblue |
| Keir Starmer's abysmal interview on BBC One on 17:20 - May 7 by Swansea_Blue |
Fair to say he's been a disappointment. He's an intelligent guy, but boy does he need to work on his messaging. There's obviously a reasonable argument that it's too early in the voting cycle and he should be judged on their next manifesto & election results. But how many more people will have been disenfranchised by then? He really could do with building up some momentum by using all the government scandals better. They should be an open goal. |
he seems to have just moaned since coming in | |
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| Keir Starmer's abysmal interview on BBC One on 08:45 - May 8 with 1430 views | Darth_Koont |
| Keir Starmer's abysmal interview on BBC One on 01:27 - May 8 by ZXBlue |
It is fascinating to see how criticism of Corbyn and his impact is now derided by many.
His impact is still very relevant to Labour;s fortunes. He divided the party horribly, such that they are mostly more interested in the fight between moderates and corbynites than in actually presenting a united front and trying to win elections. The damage done to labour credibility and the "red wall" by Corbyn's dithering on brexit and 1970s student politcs, is an enduring legacy which will be a millstone for labour for years.
Corbyn could have swung the brexit vote to remain, had he wanted to. [Post edited 8 May 2021 1:28]
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I think that’s ignoring the evidence.
The Leave figures haven’t wavered since 2016, no matter what has been said. And electorally it was a big mistake to embrace the second referendum given it would push many more votes away than it would attract.
The people who insisted on that position within the Labour Party are now in charge – trying to create Change UK on a national scale. We’re seeing the results. |  |
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| Keir Starmer's abysmal interview on BBC One on 08:46 - May 8 with 1430 views | Chrisd |
You’ve got to question the state Labour are in, if they can’t close the gap on a Tory party that has faced considerable criticism over their handling of the Covid pandemic. Not sure you can even consider them as serious opposition now, which is a real issue for the country’s political position. We need a strong opposition to challenge and question. Labour just look in a complete mess currently. | |
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| Keir Starmer's abysmal interview on BBC One on 08:48 - May 8 with 1427 views | BanksterDebtSlave |
| Keir Starmer's abysmal interview on BBC One on 08:45 - May 8 by Darth_Koont |
I think that’s ignoring the evidence.
The Leave figures haven’t wavered since 2016, no matter what has been said. And electorally it was a big mistake to embrace the second referendum given it would push many more votes away than it would attract.
The people who insisted on that position within the Labour Party are now in charge – trying to create Change UK on a national scale. We’re seeing the results. |
Don't let facts get in the way of blaming the Left. | |
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| Keir Starmer's abysmal interview on BBC One on 09:11 - May 8 with 1399 views | Darth_Koont |
Wow! That’s pretty damning.
There was also a quote that jumped out about the voter seeing the Conservatives as a vote for change. I’ve heard that elsewhere too. But utterly amazing that the perennial party of government that has forced the agenda for the past 4 decades and been in power for the last 10 years is seen as that party.
Very similar to how people saw Trump’s Republican Party. Which was set up the failures of a centrist and establishment Democrat Party. Biden is moving away from that (hopefully in deeds as well as words) but it’s what Labour also need to do. | |
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| Keir Starmer's abysmal interview on BBC One on 09:12 - May 8 with 1399 views | chicoazul |
| Keir Starmer's abysmal interview on BBC One on 16:50 - May 7 by hype313 |
Andy Burnham is the one guy I can see making inroads into reclaiming the red wall.
But he's far too right wing for the PLP. |
Right wing lol |  |
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| Keir Starmer's abysmal interview on BBC One on 09:26 - May 8 with 1373 views | The_Last_Baron |
| Keir Starmer's abysmal interview on BBC One on 16:47 - May 7 by gtsb1966 |
He shows no passion, no plans for the future and can only criticise without having alternatives. He simply doesn't resonate with the people. Labour desperately need a Blair type leader now. |
The last thing Labour need is a Blair. Don't usually get it yet?
A John Smith is what Labour needed some time ago but that ship has sailed. Labour sold out to the globalist and woke agenda and are reaping what they deserve.
All that awaits is further irrelevance and death for the party. They will be replaced in time. |  |
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| Keir Starmer's abysmal interview on BBC One on 10:27 - May 8 with 1343 views | ZXBlue |
| Keir Starmer's abysmal interview on BBC One on 08:45 - May 8 by Darth_Koont |
I think that’s ignoring the evidence.
The Leave figures haven’t wavered since 2016, no matter what has been said. And electorally it was a big mistake to embrace the second referendum given it would push many more votes away than it would attract.
The people who insisted on that position within the Labour Party are now in charge – trying to create Change UK on a national scale. We’re seeing the results. |
It was incredibly close. An active campaign, rather than equivocation and hiding, surely had prospects of swinging a small percentage of labour votesrs on referendum day | | | |
| Keir Starmer's abysmal interview on BBC One on 10:28 - May 8 with 1340 views | ZXBlue |
| Keir Starmer's abysmal interview on BBC One on 09:26 - May 8 by The_Last_Baron |
The last thing Labour need is a Blair. Don't usually get it yet?
A John Smith is what Labour needed some time ago but that ship has sailed. Labour sold out to the globalist and woke agenda and are reaping what they deserve.
All that awaits is further irrelevance and death for the party. They will be replaced in time. |
When was the last time someone of that type won an election for Labour? | | | |
| Keir Starmer's abysmal interview on BBC One on 10:38 - May 8 with 1331 views | Darth_Koont |
| Keir Starmer's abysmal interview on BBC One on 10:27 - May 8 by ZXBlue |
It was incredibly close. An active campaign, rather than equivocation and hiding, surely had prospects of swinging a small percentage of labour votesrs on referendum day |
Alan Johnson was leading Labour’s remain campaign wasn’t he? Stellar job.
Problem is that if the party and the pundits were committed to discrediting Corbyn at every turn, then they rather poisoned the well didn’t they?
That goes for the referendum and for 2019. Corbyn said what they wanted and then they blamed him for the lack of credibility they themselves engineered.
Ultimately, because they’re politically clueless muppets who want power, influence and money for themselves. That’s always been their vision. | |
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| Keir Starmer's abysmal interview on BBC One on 11:00 - May 8 with 1314 views | tractordownsouth |
| Keir Starmer's abysmal interview on BBC One on 08:29 - May 8 by Darth_Koont |
“They” were an awful lot closer in 2017.
Since the high of 1997, Labour has been losing ground. That move to the centre-right worked once and it’s been diminishing returns ever since.
If Labour are going to emerge from this then they need to be honest about what stopped that slide and brought voters back in their millions. It was having a positive vision for the country. |
I think you're right that the communication of policy wasn't good enough, and hopefully there will be more of an appetite for that post-pandemic. I'm sure there will be a positive vision in the next election, rather than Miliband-esque triangulation. Keir clearly does need to take a sizeable chunk of the blame for what happened in England and I'm glad he's said so.
However, we also need to learn the lessons from Wales, where Labour has succeeded because it had popular (and costed) policies and is also seen as patriotic. Of course the vaccine bounce has helped but it also helped the Tories in England. The attitude espoused by Labour MPs like Lloyd Russell Moyle and Clive Lewis about "flag shagging" is part of the problem completely. Part of the successful Welsh Labour narrative was about how the Tories weren't proud of Welsh identity and that Labour was standing for Welsh values and difference in the pandemic. This is also part of a long term trend where Labour has endorsed devolution more enthusiastically than in Scotland. In the leave-voting vallies Plaid and the Tories didn't even come close and lost on big swings in some cases.
The big takeaway (and what I've been banging on about for ages) is that left-wing policy and patriotism aren't mutually exclusive. Clearly we haven't communicated the first one well enough (although no leader actually releases a manifesto till an election) which is the big improvement but the second part really really isn't the problem. It's not a case of throwing minorities under the bus or anything like that - it's about being positive and patriotic. |  |
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| Keir Starmer's abysmal interview on BBC One on 11:02 - May 8 with 1310 views | pointofblue |
| Keir Starmer's abysmal interview on BBC One on 10:38 - May 8 by Darth_Koont |
Alan Johnson was leading Labour’s remain campaign wasn’t he? Stellar job.
Problem is that if the party and the pundits were committed to discrediting Corbyn at every turn, then they rather poisoned the well didn’t they?
That goes for the referendum and for 2019. Corbyn said what they wanted and then they blamed him for the lack of credibility they themselves engineered.
Ultimately, because they’re politically clueless muppets who want power, influence and money for themselves. That’s always been their vision. |
If Corbyn was a passionate Remainer then he could have spoken passionately about Remain. He was practically non-existent in the campaign and never seemed to be strong enough on the topic of the generation. My opinion is that he wanted to Leave but realised he would isolate the younger generation and many in the party if he came out and said what he wanted. He got what he wanted but found himself in charge of a party that didn’t agree with his view and, although he didn’t really care about that, also leading a group of people (students etc) who also disagreed with this approach. This led to the mess of 2019 where the policy was muddled at best.
The strength and weakness of Corbyn’s Labour was exposed in 2017 - a stunning performance in the vote which outpolled every winning party since 2001 but, in turn, also created an anti-Corbyn vote of such ferocity the Conservatives pulled in more despite running what is widely agreed to be one of the most suicidal campaigns ever (although give me May over Johnson any day of the week. When the messaging became mixed and the Conservatives became focused and coherent everything was lost.
Labour need to decide what they stand for and find a figure out who can deliver that message to the populace as a whole rather than not being able to break through beyond the converted. For me, Andy Burnham would be perfect though, despite what Lord Adonis said yesterday, I think whoever leads the party needs to be in the Commons. | |
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| Keir Starmer's abysmal interview on BBC One on 11:11 - May 8 with 1296 views | itfcjoe |
| Keir Starmer's abysmal interview on BBC One on 17:34 - May 7 by gtsb1966 |
No disrespect but I disagree with the argument that it is too early in the voting cycle. When people in some of the poorest places in Britain vote Conservative you have a massive problem. The face of any party , forget the policies for a minute, is the leader and Starmer doesn't do it for the people and if he doesn't do it now he never will do. Many many voters vote for the leader and not the policies. Starmer will never be prime minister and considering how utterly awful this government are that says everything. |
We aren’t even in a voting cycle though, covid has totally frozen everything so it really isn’t a normal by election, if one exists, in any way at all.
Hopefully a proper wake up call for Starmer, but always felt likely he’d be the one to clear the way for the next person |  |
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| Keir Starmer's abysmal interview on BBC One on 11:17 - May 8 with 1277 views | ZXBlue |
| Keir Starmer's abysmal interview on BBC One on 10:38 - May 8 by Darth_Koont |
Alan Johnson was leading Labour’s remain campaign wasn’t he? Stellar job.
Problem is that if the party and the pundits were committed to discrediting Corbyn at every turn, then they rather poisoned the well didn’t they?
That goes for the referendum and for 2019. Corbyn said what they wanted and then they blamed him for the lack of credibility they themselves engineered.
Ultimately, because they’re politically clueless muppets who want power, influence and money for themselves. That’s always been their vision. |
You are diverting. Corbyn's supporters are not affected by supposed well-poisoning, and a small percentage of those turning out for remain would have swung it. But he prevaricated, hid, and wanted brexit (but wouldnt say so). | | | |
| Keir Starmer's abysmal interview on BBC One on 11:19 - May 8 with 1271 views | ZXBlue |
| Keir Starmer's abysmal interview on BBC One on 11:02 - May 8 by pointofblue |
If Corbyn was a passionate Remainer then he could have spoken passionately about Remain. He was practically non-existent in the campaign and never seemed to be strong enough on the topic of the generation. My opinion is that he wanted to Leave but realised he would isolate the younger generation and many in the party if he came out and said what he wanted. He got what he wanted but found himself in charge of a party that didn’t agree with his view and, although he didn’t really care about that, also leading a group of people (students etc) who also disagreed with this approach. This led to the mess of 2019 where the policy was muddled at best.
The strength and weakness of Corbyn’s Labour was exposed in 2017 - a stunning performance in the vote which outpolled every winning party since 2001 but, in turn, also created an anti-Corbyn vote of such ferocity the Conservatives pulled in more despite running what is widely agreed to be one of the most suicidal campaigns ever (although give me May over Johnson any day of the week. When the messaging became mixed and the Conservatives became focused and coherent everything was lost.
Labour need to decide what they stand for and find a figure out who can deliver that message to the populace as a whole rather than not being able to break through beyond the converted. For me, Andy Burnham would be perfect though, despite what Lord Adonis said yesterday, I think whoever leads the party needs to be in the Commons. |
Burnham would not bring any of the middle ground on board. Without scotland, I can't see how they can get anywhere without appealing to centrists | | | |
| Keir Starmer's abysmal interview on BBC One on 11:23 - May 8 with 1260 views | Darth_Koont |
| Keir Starmer's abysmal interview on BBC One on 11:17 - May 8 by ZXBlue |
You are diverting. Corbyn's supporters are not affected by supposed well-poisoning, and a small percentage of those turning out for remain would have swung it. But he prevaricated, hid, and wanted brexit (but wouldnt say so). |
That’s certainly the narrative. But the evidence says he was out there campaigning for Remain. But as the leader of the left and the opposition he got precious little coverage as the media story was that this was a right-wing Conservative government and UKIP drama.
But whatever you need to tell yourself. | |
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| Keir Starmer's abysmal interview on BBC One on 11:48 - May 8 with 1245 views | tractordownsouth |
| Keir Starmer's abysmal interview on BBC One on 11:23 - May 8 by Darth_Koont |
That’s certainly the narrative. But the evidence says he was out there campaigning for Remain. But as the leader of the left and the opposition he got precious little coverage as the media story was that this was a right-wing Conservative government and UKIP drama.
But whatever you need to tell yourself. |
His most memorable moment of the campaign was going on The Last Leg in a silly coat and giving "7.5 out of 10" support for Remain. | |
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| Keir Starmer's abysmal interview on BBC One on 12:04 - May 8 with 1233 views | ZXBlue |
| Keir Starmer's abysmal interview on BBC One on 11:23 - May 8 by Darth_Koont |
That’s certainly the narrative. But the evidence says he was out there campaigning for Remain. But as the leader of the left and the opposition he got precious little coverage as the media story was that this was a right-wing Conservative government and UKIP drama.
But whatever you need to tell yourself. |
You are very blinkered about Corbyn. he was a brexiter, he did not campaign in any real way.
It is pretty feeble to blame the media for that and claim its not true. | | | |
| Keir Starmer's abysmal interview on BBC One on 12:09 - May 8 with 1226 views | Darth_Koont |
| Keir Starmer's abysmal interview on BBC One on 12:04 - May 8 by ZXBlue |
You are very blinkered about Corbyn. he was a brexiter, he did not campaign in any real way.
It is pretty feeble to blame the media for that and claim its not true. |
Back at you.
I’m sure you’ll be able to contrast Corbyn’s personal campaigning over Remain with the activity and profile of the Labour Remain campaign itself? | |
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| Keir Starmer's abysmal interview on BBC One on 12:13 - May 8 with 1211 views | lowhouseblue |
| Keir Starmer's abysmal interview on BBC One on 12:04 - May 8 by ZXBlue |
You are very blinkered about Corbyn. he was a brexiter, he did not campaign in any real way.
It is pretty feeble to blame the media for that and claim its not true. |
he actually went on holiday for a fortnight in the middle of the referendum campaign. that's not 'went on holiday' in the sense of was invisible and ineffective, it's 'went on holiday' as in booking the time off and putting the out of office thing on his email and going to a hotel. half arsed gives him too much credit. |  |
| And so as the loose-bowelled pigeon of time swoops low over the unsuspecting tourist of destiny, and the flatulent skunk of fate wanders into the air-conditioning system of eternity, I notice it's the end of the show |
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