| Is that it for Woolfenden here? 02:04 - Oct 22 with 6448 views | pointofblue |
A late night thought running through my mind - is that it for Woolfenden here? Obviously Edmundson and Burgess bumped him down spots and Nsiala has found favour over him now too. So I guess, at his age where he needs football, that’s it; if he wants first team football he’ll have to move on.
And I hope Cook let’s him, especially as El Mizouni’s emergence might not mean Woolfenden is required to meet the homegrown criteria. I have to admit I do have, possibly overly, a soft spot for Woolfenden and feel he was dealt a bad hand, particularly last year, in defensive partnerships which IMO hindered his progress, but if he wants to have a chance of a decent career he probably needs to move in January. I cannot see anyway he can fight back into the side. |  |
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| Is that it for Woolfenden here? on 14:48 - Oct 22 with 1019 views | pointofblue |
| Is that it for Woolfenden here? on 14:34 - Oct 22 by J2BLUE |
Nah. You need 4 CBs. He will get a chance soon enough with injuries and suspensions.
Definitely not one to write off just yet. |
It depends whether he can afford, for the sake of his career, to wait for his chance. Admittedly he has no choice until January but then he has to decide whether he’s happy not even bench-warming or if he wants a chance elsewhere. A loan deal, possibly replacing him with a loan in return (sending Barry back) sounds like the most logical solution of he wants games.
Re mistakes - some defenders seem to be disproportionately punished for errors which others get away with, to an extent on the pitch and to an extent by the fans. | |
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| Is that it for Woolfenden here? on 14:57 - Oct 22 with 1005 views | positivity |
| Is that it for Woolfenden here? on 14:48 - Oct 22 by pointofblue |
It depends whether he can afford, for the sake of his career, to wait for his chance. Admittedly he has no choice until January but then he has to decide whether he’s happy not even bench-warming or if he wants a chance elsewhere. A loan deal, possibly replacing him with a loan in return (sending Barry back) sounds like the most logical solution of he wants games.
Re mistakes - some defenders seem to be disproportionately punished for errors which others get away with, to an extent on the pitch and to an extent by the fans. |
might not be his choice to go out on loan. he's our one academy player in the named squad.
if he goes we'll have to bring someone else into the squad (kenlock or morris), or always have an under-age academy player (probably el miz) on the bench | |
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| Is that it for Woolfenden here? on 17:41 - Oct 22 with 951 views | pointofblue |
| Is that it for Woolfenden here? on 14:57 - Oct 22 by positivity |
might not be his choice to go out on loan. he's our one academy player in the named squad.
if he goes we'll have to bring someone else into the squad (kenlock or morris), or always have an under-age academy player (probably el miz) on the bench |
That’s what I was referring to in the OP - I hope we don’t just hold on to him for quota purposes. | |
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| Is that it for Woolfenden here? on 18:19 - Oct 22 with 921 views | Burns7 |
He made a couple of mistakes and got dropped, a touch harsh that they have all had a few clangers this season. I think under Cook we've seen the fewest ever amount of academy players used which is a shame, but equally I dont think our youth system is up to much these days either and probably a factor in our decline. |  | | |
| Is that it for Woolfenden here? on 18:26 - Oct 22 with 914 views | franz_tyson |
| Is that it for Woolfenden here? on 14:57 - Oct 22 by positivity |
might not be his choice to go out on loan. he's our one academy player in the named squad.
if he goes we'll have to bring someone else into the squad (kenlock or morris), or always have an under-age academy player (probably el miz) on the bench |
There was a game earlier in the season where there was no academy players in the 18.
I mentioned it, and someone said on here there’s an EFL ruling where you can name a machday squad of 23 or whatever (with an academy player) and the last 18 doesn’t have to include an academy player.. Not sure about that…. But I’m pretty sure we’ve had an 18 without an academy player. Don’t think Bonne counts. | | | |
| Is that it for Woolfenden here? on 18:40 - Oct 22 with 904 views | positivity |
| Is that it for Woolfenden here? on 18:26 - Oct 22 by franz_tyson |
There was a game earlier in the season where there was no academy players in the 18.
I mentioned it, and someone said on here there’s an EFL ruling where you can name a machday squad of 23 or whatever (with an academy player) and the last 18 doesn’t have to include an academy player.. Not sure about that…. But I’m pretty sure we’ve had an 18 without an academy player. Don’t think Bonne counts. |
it's a confusing one. how i understand it is... (please correct if wrong!)
i think we have to have at least one homegrown player in our name squad of 22. woolf is the only one, kenlock and morris are the only other options (bonne doesn't count unfortunately).
if we didn't have one in the named squad *then* we would have to have an underage academy player on the bench (or name just 6 subs)
we should get promoted just to not have to try and get our heads round these arcane rules! | |
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| Is that it for Woolfenden here? on 18:46 - Oct 22 with 896 views | itfcjoe |
| Is that it for Woolfenden here? on 18:40 - Oct 22 by positivity |
it's a confusing one. how i understand it is... (please correct if wrong!)
i think we have to have at least one homegrown player in our name squad of 22. woolf is the only one, kenlock and morris are the only other options (bonne doesn't count unfortunately).
if we didn't have one in the named squad *then* we would have to have an underage academy player on the bench (or name just 6 subs)
we should get promoted just to not have to try and get our heads round these arcane rules! |
Same rules in the Championship |  |
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| Is that it for Woolfenden here? on 22:27 - Oct 22 with 829 views | positivity |
| Is that it for Woolfenden here? on 18:46 - Oct 22 by itfcjoe |
Same rules in the Championship |
ok, ta, we'll have to settle for the prem then! | |
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| Is that it for Woolfenden here? on 01:58 - Oct 23 with 798 views | pointofblue |
So the options seem to be we hold on and his only hope is injuries or suspension to two centre backs or we loan him out and then have to consider covering his departure. Admittedly there is still over two months to go before the transfer window opens so time for Cook and Woolfenden to come to a decision. | |
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| Is that it for Woolfenden here? on 06:56 - Oct 23 with 751 views | FPL_Tractor |
| Is that it for Woolfenden here? on 07:57 - Oct 22 by Mookamoo |
I think his best position would be in a back 3, which isn't likely to happen anytime soon.
I'd quite like to see how he could do further up the pitch in front of a back 4. He's got the skills, just needs a little urgency. |
I agree here. I think he’d do excellently in a Chris Wilder team in the right of 3 centre backs. |  |
| For more ITFC chat and some fantasy football mutterings follow me on twitter @fpl_tractor. |
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| Is that it for Woolfenden here? on 09:30 - Oct 23 with 717 views | blueislander |
| Is that it for Woolfenden here? on 06:56 - Oct 23 by FPL_Tractor |
I agree here. I think he’d do excellently in a Chris Wilder team in the right of 3 centre backs. |
Cook has shown no inclination to change the system, but I do think we have the players who would fit into into a 3 at the back. KVY is much better suited to a role with less defensive duties, but at the moment to drop Donacien would be unfair..
I am very much pro Woolfenden, and don’t think he is much more error prone than the other three. He is probably not as physical as them ,but he is a much better footballer . There is an argument that in the third division a Centre back need physicality over football skills. | | | |
| Is that it for Woolfenden here? on 09:39 - Oct 23 with 711 views | pointofblue |
| Is that it for Woolfenden here? on 09:30 - Oct 23 by blueislander |
Cook has shown no inclination to change the system, but I do think we have the players who would fit into into a 3 at the back. KVY is much better suited to a role with less defensive duties, but at the moment to drop Donacien would be unfair..
I am very much pro Woolfenden, and don’t think he is much more error prone than the other three. He is probably not as physical as them ,but he is a much better footballer . There is an argument that in the third division a Centre back need physicality over football skills. |
We do have the squad to switch to a wing back system should we wish to do so, though maybe a lacking back up in defence.
Walton - Nsiala, Edmundson, Burgess - Burns, Morsy, Evans, Coulsen - Celina - Aluko, Bonne
Hladky - Donacien, Woolfenden, Armin - Vincent-Young, Harper, Carroll, Penney - Fraser - Norwood, Pigott | |
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| Is that it for Woolfenden here? on 09:41 - Oct 23 with 700 views | chrismakin |
| Is that it for Woolfenden here? on 09:39 - Oct 23 by pointofblue |
We do have the squad to switch to a wing back system should we wish to do so, though maybe a lacking back up in defence.
Walton - Nsiala, Edmundson, Burgess - Burns, Morsy, Evans, Coulsen - Celina - Aluko, Bonne
Hladky - Donacien, Woolfenden, Armin - Vincent-Young, Harper, Carroll, Penney - Fraser - Norwood, Pigott |
It's interesting as there was a poster saying we don't have the defenders for 3 at the back.
However didn't Burgess play in a back 3?
Then you've got wolfy and Toto or edmundson.. think it could do a job personally. |  |
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| Is that it for Woolfenden here? on 09:44 - Oct 23 with 705 views | pointofblue |
| Is that it for Woolfenden here? on 09:41 - Oct 23 by chrismakin |
It's interesting as there was a poster saying we don't have the defenders for 3 at the back.
However didn't Burgess play in a back 3?
Then you've got wolfy and Toto or edmundson.. think it could do a job personally. |
Yes, Burgess played on the left of a back three at Accrington. It was why I had concerns about signing him - he’s required to adjust to a new system as well as new team mates. I’d have been happier with someone who was playing 4-2-3-1 week in, week out. | |
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| Is that it for Woolfenden here? on 09:47 - Oct 23 with 695 views | chrismakin |
| Is that it for Woolfenden here? on 09:44 - Oct 23 by pointofblue |
Yes, Burgess played on the left of a back three at Accrington. It was why I had concerns about signing him - he’s required to adjust to a new system as well as new team mates. I’d have been happier with someone who was playing 4-2-3-1 week in, week out. |
Yeah agree with that. | |
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| Is that it for Woolfenden here? on 10:06 - Oct 23 with 685 views | Herbivore |
| Is that it for Woolfenden here? on 09:39 - Oct 23 by pointofblue |
We do have the squad to switch to a wing back system should we wish to do so, though maybe a lacking back up in defence.
Walton - Nsiala, Edmundson, Burgess - Burns, Morsy, Evans, Coulsen - Celina - Aluko, Bonne
Hladky - Donacien, Woolfenden, Armin - Vincent-Young, Harper, Carroll, Penney - Fraser - Norwood, Pigott |
That back 3 would be horrific on the ball in that first line up and we'd be dropping an effective attacking player in Chaplin to bring in another CB. This squad has been signed to play Cook's system, the balance is all wrong to switch to three at the back effectively. |  |
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| Is that it for Woolfenden here? on 10:11 - Oct 23 with 680 views | pointofblue |
| Is that it for Woolfenden here? on 10:06 - Oct 23 by Herbivore |
That back 3 would be horrific on the ball in that first line up and we'd be dropping an effective attacking player in Chaplin to bring in another CB. This squad has been signed to play Cook's system, the balance is all wrong to switch to three at the back effectively. |
Worrying I completely forgot about Chaplin! I’d have him at ten ahead of Celina. Agree with the ball retention for the first XI at the back but they seem to be Cook’s preferred centre backs at the moment. | |
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| Is that it for Woolfenden here? on 10:17 - Oct 23 with 671 views | Herbivore |
| Is that it for Woolfenden here? on 10:11 - Oct 23 by pointofblue |
Worrying I completely forgot about Chaplin! I’d have him at ten ahead of Celina. Agree with the ball retention for the first XI at the back but they seem to be Cook’s preferred centre backs at the moment. |
In a two they are his preferred CBs, not in a three. Burgess may well have played in a three for Accrington but they play very direct. What role is Aluko playing in that first line up if Chaplin is a 10 and Bonne is up front? Is he playing wide and we're just having one wide player or is he in a midfield three? This is what I mean, we don't really have the players for 3-5-2 at all, imo. Any line up we name using that system for me doesn't look as effective as using Cook's preferred system. Moving to three at the back means most of Celina, Chaplin, Fraser, Edwards, and Aluko miss out and they miss out for an extra CB which is madness. Being able to name 11 players that could play in the positions invovled in a 3-5-2 doesn't mean we can play it effectively or that we should be considering playing it when it means sacrificing many of our better players purely to bring in another CB. | |
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| Is that it for Woolfenden here? on 10:20 - Oct 23 with 665 views | textbackup |
if we consider that we might need a better footballing CB next season if we are in the championship i'd suggest LW is far from done here.
because theres no a hope in hell toto should be playing championship football. |  |
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| Is that it for Woolfenden here? on 10:28 - Oct 23 with 656 views | pointofblue |
| Is that it for Woolfenden here? on 10:17 - Oct 23 by Herbivore |
In a two they are his preferred CBs, not in a three. Burgess may well have played in a three for Accrington but they play very direct. What role is Aluko playing in that first line up if Chaplin is a 10 and Bonne is up front? Is he playing wide and we're just having one wide player or is he in a midfield three? This is what I mean, we don't really have the players for 3-5-2 at all, imo. Any line up we name using that system for me doesn't look as effective as using Cook's preferred system. Moving to three at the back means most of Celina, Chaplin, Fraser, Edwards, and Aluko miss out and they miss out for an extra CB which is madness. Being able to name 11 players that could play in the positions invovled in a 3-5-2 doesn't mean we can play it effectively or that we should be considering playing it when it means sacrificing many of our better players purely to bring in another CB. |
I guess our current system is starting to look more effective now but for a while it wasn’t really doing much for us. I’d have Aluko as second striker in the system though Pigott may also benefit from playing that role.
I’m not saying we should switch to a 3-5-2, or variants thereof - I’m saying the options are there should, say, Cook is axed after a horrific run and we somehow get Wilder through the door who we know likes using the system. I think he could utilise the players at his disposal and get them to work in that system. | |
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| Is that it for Woolfenden here? on 11:03 - Oct 23 with 648 views | Herbivore |
| Is that it for Woolfenden here? on 10:28 - Oct 23 by pointofblue |
I guess our current system is starting to look more effective now but for a while it wasn’t really doing much for us. I’d have Aluko as second striker in the system though Pigott may also benefit from playing that role.
I’m not saying we should switch to a 3-5-2, or variants thereof - I’m saying the options are there should, say, Cook is axed after a horrific run and we somehow get Wilder through the door who we know likes using the system. I think he could utilise the players at his disposal and get them to work in that system. |
Not sure who the overlapping CBs would be. Woolf possibly but no other options. | |
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| Is that it for Woolfenden here? on 11:09 - Oct 23 with 644 views | pointofblue |
| Is that it for Woolfenden here? on 11:03 - Oct 23 by Herbivore |
Not sure who the overlapping CBs would be. Woolf possibly but no other options. |
I wonder if Edmundson could be too, though I may be just projecting that on him because he’s young. | |
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| Is that it for Woolfenden here? on 13:23 - Oct 23 with 617 views | Herbivore |
| Is that it for Woolfenden here? on 11:09 - Oct 23 by pointofblue |
I wonder if Edmundson could be too, though I may be just projecting that on him because he’s young. |
He looks fairly ropey on the ball to me. Not a full blown clogger but not comfortable with it especially either. He got himself in a pickle the other night trying to play a relatively simple pass in midfield and ended up getting booked recovering his error. Can't see him being someone to carry or play the ball out with any real consistency. | |
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| Is that it for Woolfenden here? on 14:49 - Oct 23 with 596 views | TheBoyBlue |
Ideally need four CB. He may get a chance at some point, especially when the games come in thick and fast. | |
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| Is that it for Woolfenden here? on 14:51 - Oct 23 with 596 views | Nthsuffolkblue |
Yes, that's it for him. Just like it has been for Donacien, Nsiala and others in the past. No chance he could develop or be given another chance. |  |
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