Forum | I make a similar point every time I visit by Illinoisblue

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I make a similar point every time I visit 09:16 - Dec 5 with 4513 views

And not to state the obvious. Norwich is a really decent city. Hardly any vacant shops, two department stores, a bustling market. Superior in almost every way to the decaying town center of Ipswich.

Assume there wasn’t always such a disparity… what caused it?

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Poll:	What sport is the most corrupt?

I make a similar point every time I visit on 09:21 - Dec 5 with 3224 views

Dubtractor

I think there always has been a bit of a disparity to be honest. Norwich is much more remote, so not as easy for people to go elsewhere, plus the student population makes a difference too.

Ipswich has been kneecapped by lots of out of town retail parks over the last 20-30 years too.

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I make a similar point every time I visit on 09:22 - Dec 5 with 3213 views

bluefunk

A Norwich based ex colleague used to say that Norwich is isolated, so every service it requires has to be based in and around the city.

I make a similar point every time I visit on 09:24 - Dec 5 with 3191 views

_clive_baker_

Funny you should say that as I went to Norwich a few weeks ago and was a bit underwhelmed. Clearly it offers way more than Ipswich, there's no doubt about that, but I thought it lacked an atmosphere. Might have been because I went on a Sunday but it was absolutely dead. Perhaps because its less touristy than some other cities in the UK, maybe Saturday is a better day to visit.

I make a similar point every time I visit on 09:28 - Dec 5 with 3153 views

Swansea_Blue

There was a similar disparity between the two places between the late 70s and early 00s. It’s probably been that way constantly over the last 20 years too.

Ipswich gets an undeserved bad rap on here though. If you want to see real decay, visit some of the former industrial towns of the midlands, north and over here in South Wales. Swansea centre makes Ipswich look like San Tropez.

Poll:

Do you think Pert is key to all of this?

I make a similar point every time I visit on 09:31 - Dec 5 with 3128 views

IPS_wich

Probably something to do with the cathedral...

I make a similar point every time I visit on 09:36 - Dec 5 with 3089 views

EJP

I make a similar point every time I visit on 09:31 - Dec 5 by IPS_wich
Probably something to do with the cathedral...

And the airport. Don't forget the airport.

I make a similar point every time I visit on 09:37 - Dec 5 with 3087 views

Basuco

There is no competition anywhere close for shopping which make it a very attractive location for a shop. Also apart from the A11 it is a long, slow, difficult journey to and from Norwich so they have a captive audience.

Cambridge - 64 miles - 90 minutes away
Peterborough - 78 miles - 2 hours away
Nottingham - 120 miles - 3 hr 10 mins
Leicester - 132 miles - 2 hr 50 mins away
London Blue Water - 120 miles - 2 hr 15 mins.

I make a similar point every time I visit on 09:40 - Dec 5 with 3056 views

nodge_blue

I make a similar point every time I visit on 09:24 - Dec 5 by _clive_baker_
Funny you should say that as I went to Norwich a few weeks ago and was a bit underwhelmed. Clearly it offers way more than Ipswich, there's no doubt about that, but I thought it lacked an atmosphere. Might have been because I went on a Sunday but it was absolutely dead. Perhaps because its less touristy than some other cities in the UK, maybe Saturday is a better day to visit.

I went into the city on Monday and it was rammed. Christmas probably contributed to it I guess. Then I went to the cinema at 1.30 and that was 90% full.

Poll:

best attacking central midfielder?

I make a similar point every time I visit on 09:43 - Dec 5 with 3025 views

Swansea_Blue

I make a similar point every time I visit on 09:37 - Dec 5 by Basuco

Yep, huge catchment up there. I suspect that’s got a lot to do with it. They also had a decent uni long before Ipswich went in that direction too, which certainly helps (we’ve seen the benefits of the development around the docks once ours grew).

Poll:

Do you think Pert is key to all of this?

I make a similar point every time I visit on 09:44 - Dec 5 with 3021 views

nodge_blue

Ipswich centre seems to suffer from a spiral of it looks run down so why would any vibrant business want to go there and not enough high end shoppers through to why would shoppers want to go there when there's no decent shops and it feels run down.

Poll:

best attacking central midfielder?

I make a similar point every time I visit on 10:10 - Dec 5 with 2922 views

jontysnut

Norwich is a cathedral city with an established university. Ipswich was traditionally a working town, docks, factories, power station etc. Norwich was always was a 'nicer' place to go. Changes over the past 30 years have hit places like Ipswich a bit more and, compared to places like Norwich, the decline has been more noticeable. I used to like to think we were the Rotterdam compared to their Amsterdam - a bit grittier and more real. TWTD.

I make a similar point every time I visit on 10:23 - Dec 5 with 2843 views

Illinoisblue

I make a similar point every time I visit on 09:40 - Dec 5 by nodge_blue
I went into the city on Monday and it was rammed. Christmas probably contributed to it I guess. Then I went to the cinema at 1.30 and that was 90% full.

Was there most of yesterday, shops rammed, pubs busy. Sense of life. A place you’d want to stay for a few hours.

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Poll:	What sport is the most corrupt?

I make a similar point every time I visit on 10:41 - Dec 5 with 2779 views

homer_123

I've never understood 'shopping' as a pastime.

The thought of aimlessly walking around town looking at lots and lots of things you don't need or buy has never appealed.

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I make a similar point every time I visit on 11:00 - Dec 5 with 2723 views

SitfcB

We’re not allowed to talk about why Ipswich town centre has gone downhill.

Even Bury St Edmunds is far superior.

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I make a similar point every time I visit on 11:54 - Dec 5 with 2634 views

jontysnut

I make a similar point every time I visit on 11:00 - Dec 5 by SitfcB
We’re not allowed to talk about why Ipswich town centre has gone downhill. Even Bury St Edmunds is far superior.

It's either decades of failed macro-economic policy or some Romanians - I can't quite decide.

I make a similar point every time I visit on 12:02 - Dec 5 with 2593 views

catch74

My grandad grew up in Ipswich in the early part of the last century, he moved away to Brighton before the Second World War. My dad then moved to Suffolk in the 60’s.My grandfather came to visit and was pretty scathing about what had been done to Ipswich. A large number of lovely old buildings gone and the road cutting the town off from the docks. Some pretty poor planning it feels like, in the 60’s.

Poll:

Who are the Numbskulls?

I make a similar point every time I visit on 12:07 - Dec 5 with 2580 views

Churchman

I make a similar point every time I visit on 09:28 - Dec 5 by Swansea_Blue
There was a similar disparity between the two places between the late 70s and early 00s. It’s probably been that way constantly over the last 20 years too. Ipswich gets an undeserved bad rap on here though. If you want to see real decay, visit some of the former industrial towns of the midlands, north and over here in South Wales. Swansea centre makes Ipswich look like San Tropez.

I agree - Ipswich isn’t so bad. If you want to stumble round a real dump, try Northampton for size. It’s all relative. Yarmouth is worthy of derision (I’m allowed to slag it off - my mum was born and grew up there) but I went to Blackpool last year and that sh£thole makes Yarmouth look like Venice.

But Ipswich town centre could have course do with improving / investment and has suffered as most have over the last few decades.

As for Norwich, I like it. It’s always had more to it than Ipswich (bar a dreadful football club) for the reasons others have given. Not least how remote it is.

I make a similar point every time I visit on 12:18 - Dec 5 with 2551 views

leitrimblue

I make a similar point every time I visit on 11:00 - Dec 5 by SitfcB
We’re not allowed to talk about why Ipswich town centre has gone downhill. Even Bury St Edmunds is far superior.

And everyone knows Burys just a sh1te satellite town of the far superior Haverhill

I make a similar point every time I visit on 12:21 - Dec 5 with 2528 views

Benters

I make a similar point every time I visit on 10:41 - Dec 5 by homer_123
I've never understood 'shopping' as a pastime. The thought of aimlessly walking around town looking at lots and lots of things you don't need or buy has never appealed.

Yep I’m the same I can’t stand it.

Although I do have a nice day out in Norwich when I go,and from Benters it’s 90 mins on the train which is nice.

I usually last about an hour with Lady B shopping that is,then laden with bags I go and sit in a pub and let her carry on shopping.

But Norwich is a fine city.

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I make a similar point every time I visit on 12:29 - Dec 5 with 2491 views

iamatractorboy

I make a similar point every time I visit on 09:36 - Dec 5 by EJP
And the airport. Don't forget the airport.

Pedestrianisation of the city centre has done wonders for Norwich, or so I've heard.

I make a similar point every time I visit on 13:10 - Dec 5 with 2388 views

Bent_double

I make a similar point every time I visit on 09:37 - Dec 5 by Basuco

Don't know how you've missed Gt Yarmouth AND Lowestoft off that list...

Poll:

So what do we think will happen with MM and the Aston Villa job?

I make a similar point every time I visit on 13:20 - Dec 5 with 2328 views

OldFart71

I lived and worked in Norwich from 1969 to 1973. As Del Boy once said to Rodney " When we are millionaires we will get our clothes at Man at C & A" , I wasn't a millionaire but did shop at C & A in Norwich, they had some decent clothes at good prices. I used to love going to Wimpey and have a cheeseburger and chips followed by flapjacks with maple syrup and ice cream. Just as now the market was vibrant. Maybe a few more small clothing shops. The last time I went was around a year ago and although it is spread out a bit more than Ipswich it certainly has the edge. Since Ipswich lost the Debenhams shop it has definitely suffered. I remember Debenhams before it was Debenhams. For those that are younger it was called Footmans and had a lift attendant to take you to the floor of your choice. It also had a proper restaurant with waitresses.

I make a similar point every time I visit on 15:44 - Dec 5 with 2134 views

Illinoisblue

I make a similar point every time I visit on 11:54 - Dec 5 by jontysnut
It's either decades of failed macro-economic policy or some Romanians - I can't quite decide.

Are there are any data on the demographic breakdown of Ipswich? Would be interesting to see the changes over the years.

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Poll:	What sport is the most corrupt?

I make a similar point every time I visit on 16:04 - Dec 5 with 2095 views

itfcjoe

All the surrounding councils putting everything on the edge of Ipswich can't help - if you come in down the A14 you have good shops at Anglia Retail Park, A12 south has Copdock, A12 North has Martlesham, A14 East has Ransomes Europark.

So you have the choice of out of town shopping, with higher quality shops, free parking etc or heading into town where destination shops like Debenhams have been lost.

The Town Centre is too sprawling now, would be better if cut off at White Horse Hotel, and shaped down to St Nicholas Street more to make it more compact.

But people are too down on Ipswich, because the football team is so good we are used to travelling to places like Norwich, Nottingham, Southampton, etc and treating them as equals when they are just much bigger cities - the L1 tour showed us what similar sized towns are like and we come off pretty well in that regard

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I make a similar point every time I visit on 16:08 - Dec 5 with 2061 views

lowhouseblue

I make a similar point every time I visit on 15:44 - Dec 5 by Illinoisblue
Are there are any data on the demographic breakdown of Ipswich? Would be interesting to see the changes over the years.

https://www.ons.gov.uk/visualisations/censusareachanges/E07000202/

doesn't suggest any dramatic changes between the last 2 censuses.

And so as the loose-bowelled pigeon of time swoops low over the unsuspecting tourist of destiny, and the flatulent skunk of fate wanders into the air-conditioning system of eternity, I notice it's the end of the show

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