| New Reform MP not wasting any time to show her true colours 13:23 - Jun 4 with 5204 views | ElderGrizzly |
Calling for the burqa to be banned in her first ever comment at PMQs claiming it's an issue of 'public safety' [Post edited 4 Jun 13:25]
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| New Reform MP not wasting any time to show her true colours on 16:28 - Jun 4 with 1133 views | Swansea_Blue |
| New Reform MP not wasting any time to show her true colours on 16:19 - Jun 4 by NedPlimpton |
Can't go 2mins without being labelled a fascist nowadays! |
In all seriousness, it’s a daft thing to wear. It can’t be very empowering to women in countries where hardliners insist women wear them (not that that applies to the UK).
Yet I don’t really understand the public safety argument and where do we stop telling people what the can or can’t wear? You can cover your face with a scarf and cap combo, and many little scrotes causing trouble do, but nobody ever talks about banning them.
Calling for a ban also seems to fly in the face of personal responsibility, which I thought conservative types were all about (I know that some of those European countries where a ban was introduced was during a conservative govt, France for example).
Mostly though, who gives a monkey’s? It’s hardly a burning issue that needs addressing. If Reform’s top priorities are flags and Burkhas it shows they aren’t serious. |  |
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| New Reform MP not wasting any time to show her true colours on 16:42 - Jun 4 with 1089 views | ElderGrizzly |
| New Reform MP not wasting any time to show her true colours on 16:28 - Jun 4 by Swansea_Blue |
In all seriousness, it’s a daft thing to wear. It can’t be very empowering to women in countries where hardliners insist women wear them (not that that applies to the UK).
Yet I don’t really understand the public safety argument and where do we stop telling people what the can or can’t wear? You can cover your face with a scarf and cap combo, and many little scrotes causing trouble do, but nobody ever talks about banning them.
Calling for a ban also seems to fly in the face of personal responsibility, which I thought conservative types were all about (I know that some of those European countries where a ban was introduced was during a conservative govt, France for example).
Mostly though, who gives a monkey’s? It’s hardly a burning issue that needs addressing. If Reform’s top priorities are flags and Burkhas it shows they aren’t serious. |
For Reform it will be playing to the ignorant within their base or hoped for base, as it's an easy 'symbol' to use to play to those fears held by those people. | | | |
| New Reform MP not wasting any time to show her true colours on 17:17 - Jun 4 with 1022 views | Swansea_Blue |
| New Reform MP not wasting any time to show her true colours on 16:42 - Jun 4 by ElderGrizzly |
For Reform it will be playing to the ignorant within their base or hoped for base, as it's an easy 'symbol' to use to play to those fears held by those people. |
It’s depressing that it works. But when you’ve had decades of the press, and more recently online grifters and even the actual government, ‘othering’ minority groups for selfish reasons I suppose it’s inevitable.
I don’t know where we’re going with all this. The only certainty is that they the likes of Farage can’t stop the grift. Even if they get in power, they can’t solve the problems they’ve invented, so they have to keep blaming foreigners for everything or they will lose their supporters. A self perpetuating cycle of loathing and hate. | |
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| New Reform MP not wasting any time to show her true colours on 17:21 - Jun 4 with 1018 views | J2BLUE |
| New Reform MP not wasting any time to show her true colours on 16:26 - Jun 4 by bluelagos |
But if people are arguing against wearing a burka (for security reasons - namely that someone could mask their identity) - then how is that any difference from all face coverings and say hoodies or baseball caps?
It just doesn't stack up as a position to ban burkas but not worry about other clothing that also hides people's faces.
Seems clear that those proposing it are far more interested in targeting Muslim women rather than having a genuine concern re public safety. If the police were arguing for a ban - on the back of increased crimes by burka clad criminals - I could see the argument. But as far as I know- they're not! |
I have agreed with all that above. |  |
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| New Reform MP not wasting any time to show her true colours on 17:30 - Jun 4 with 1001 views | bluelagos |
| New Reform MP not wasting any time to show her true colours on 17:21 - Jun 4 by J2BLUE |
I have agreed with all that above. |
Great minds think alike J2 :-)
MInd you - so do rubbish ones! |  |
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| New Reform MP not wasting any time to show her true colours on 17:39 - Jun 4 with 966 views | reusersfreekicks |
| New Reform MP not wasting any time to show her true colours on 14:37 - Jun 4 by blueasfook |
It is currently banned in all the extreme right European countries such as Austria, Belgium, Bulgaria, Denmark, France, Luxembourg, the Netherlands, Switzerland. |
Bit more nuanced than just being banned per se in those countries but hey ho |  | | |
| New Reform MP not wasting any time to show her true colours on 17:41 - Jun 4 with 965 views | bluejacko |
It’s fairly straightforward surely? Any place that requires you take off a motorcycle helmet or balaclava etc for security reasons then a burqa has to be removed doesn’t it? [Post edited 4 Jun 17:41]
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| New Reform MP not wasting any time to show her true colours on 17:49 - Jun 4 with 935 views | reusersfreekicks |
| New Reform MP not wasting any time to show her true colours on 16:26 - Jun 4 by bluelagos |
But if people are arguing against wearing a burka (for security reasons - namely that someone could mask their identity) - then how is that any difference from all face coverings and say hoodies or baseball caps?
It just doesn't stack up as a position to ban burkas but not worry about other clothing that also hides people's faces.
Seems clear that those proposing it are far more interested in targeting Muslim women rather than having a genuine concern re public safety. If the police were arguing for a ban - on the back of increased crimes by burka clad criminals - I could see the argument. But as far as I know- they're not! |
Of course they are - protecting Reform mps is an interesting angle.
Remember others, mostly no longer on here, endorsing democrat / Trump equivalence inthings like freedom of speech.
That's going well | | | |
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| New Reform MP not wasting any time to show her true colours on 17:53 - Jun 4 with 916 views | J2BLUE |
| New Reform MP not wasting any time to show her true colours on 17:30 - Jun 4 by bluelagos |
Great minds think alike J2 :-)
MInd you - so do rubbish ones! |
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| New Reform MP not wasting any time to show her true colours on 17:58 - Jun 4 with 907 views | iamatractorboy |
| New Reform MP not wasting any time to show her true colours on 17:17 - Jun 4 by Swansea_Blue |
It’s depressing that it works. But when you’ve had decades of the press, and more recently online grifters and even the actual government, ‘othering’ minority groups for selfish reasons I suppose it’s inevitable.
I don’t know where we’re going with all this. The only certainty is that they the likes of Farage can’t stop the grift. Even if they get in power, they can’t solve the problems they’ve invented, so they have to keep blaming foreigners for everything or they will lose their supporters. A self perpetuating cycle of loathing and hate. |
Yep, rule number one in the right wing grifter handbook: it's always someone* else's fault.
*=some form of minority group or groups | | | |
| New Reform MP not wasting any time to show her true colours on 18:05 - Jun 4 with 893 views | lowhouseblue |
| New Reform MP not wasting any time to show her true colours on 14:53 - Jun 4 by NedPlimpton |
What are the security concerns? Why the Burkha and not Balaclavas? [Post edited 4 Jun 14:53]
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yes balaclavas are banned in public places in france. |  |
| And so as the loose-bowelled pigeon of time swoops low over the unsuspecting tourist of destiny, and the flatulent skunk of fate wanders into the air-conditioning system of eternity, I notice it's the end of the show |
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| New Reform MP not wasting any time to show her true colours on 18:12 - Jun 4 with 891 views | DJR |
According to Wikipedia, the French ban on face coverings was the result of an act of parliament passed in 2010 banning the wearing of face-covering headgear, including masks, helmets, balaclavas, niqābs and other veils covering the face, and full body costumes and zentais (skin-tight garments covering entire body) in public places, except under specified circumstances.
Just as well the French don't have Halloween as a tradition, or engage in carnival Venice-style. |  | | |
| New Reform MP not wasting any time to show her true colours on 18:32 - Jun 4 with 853 views | NedPlimpton |
| New Reform MP not wasting any time to show her true colours on 18:05 - Jun 4 by lowhouseblue |
yes balaclavas are banned in public places in france. |
Cool, I've not said otherwise
The reform MP specifically mentioned the burka though, hence the question around other head coverings which has now been discussed at length |  | | |
| New Reform MP not wasting any time to show her true colours on 18:57 - Jun 4 with 820 views | mellowblue |
| New Reform MP not wasting any time to show her true colours on 16:26 - Jun 4 by bluelagos |
But if people are arguing against wearing a burka (for security reasons - namely that someone could mask their identity) - then how is that any difference from all face coverings and say hoodies or baseball caps?
It just doesn't stack up as a position to ban burkas but not worry about other clothing that also hides people's faces.
Seems clear that those proposing it are far more interested in targeting Muslim women rather than having a genuine concern re public safety. If the police were arguing for a ban - on the back of increased crimes by burka clad criminals - I could see the argument. But as far as I know- they're not! |
my position is follow the French lead. Not from any crime perspective but so girls in their teens are not pressured into wearing them for the rest of their lives. Shoot me down if you like, really don't care. | | | |
| New Reform MP not wasting any time to show her true colours on 19:22 - Jun 4 with 777 views | DJR |
| New Reform MP not wasting any time to show her true colours on 18:57 - Jun 4 by mellowblue |
my position is follow the French lead. Not from any crime perspective but so girls in their teens are not pressured into wearing them for the rest of their lives. Shoot me down if you like, really don't care. |
That though would only mean they replace the burka with another head covering and would have no impact on other any aspect of their life.
Incidentally, and I may be wrong, but I see a lot of parallels between orthodox Islam and orthodox Judaism when it comes to the treatment of women (and indeed in relation to integration) but no one ever criticises orthodox Judaism, and nor should they. [Post edited 4 Jun 20:58]
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| New Reform MP not wasting any time to show her true colours on 21:38 - Jun 4 with 691 views | DJR |
| New Reform MP not wasting any time to show her true colours on 19:22 - Jun 4 by DJR |
That though would only mean they replace the burka with another head covering and would have no impact on other any aspect of their life.
Incidentally, and I may be wrong, but I see a lot of parallels between orthodox Islam and orthodox Judaism when it comes to the treatment of women (and indeed in relation to integration) but no one ever criticises orthodox Judaism, and nor should they. [Post edited 4 Jun 20:58]
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As if to prove my point about different attitudes to Islam and Judaism, this is a top-rated comment from Mailonline, which mentions halal but not kosher, even thought the slaughter methods are the same.
"The Burqa in the UK is nothing but a political statement!! Ban it & ban halal slaughter as well."
Of course there is a case for objecting to both in terms of the methods of slaughter, but interesting to note that the person commenting only seems angered by one. [Post edited 4 Jun 21:40]
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| New Reform MP not wasting any time to show her true colours on 21:51 - Jun 4 with 675 views | mellowblue |
| New Reform MP not wasting any time to show her true colours on 21:38 - Jun 4 by DJR |
As if to prove my point about different attitudes to Islam and Judaism, this is a top-rated comment from Mailonline, which mentions halal but not kosher, even thought the slaughter methods are the same.
"The Burqa in the UK is nothing but a political statement!! Ban it & ban halal slaughter as well."
Of course there is a case for objecting to both in terms of the methods of slaughter, but interesting to note that the person commenting only seems angered by one. [Post edited 4 Jun 21:40]
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the 2 religions are more alike than they would both be comfortable with. Neither have evolved to society's needs in a millenium or more. | | | |
| New Reform MP not wasting any time to show her true colours on 03:57 - Jun 5 with 553 views | Benters |
| New Reform MP not wasting any time to show her true colours on 14:37 - Jun 4 by blueasfook |
It is currently banned in all the extreme right European countries such as Austria, Belgium, Bulgaria, Denmark, France, Luxembourg, the Netherlands, Switzerland. |
It won’t be banned here the current government are gutless mate. |  |
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| New Reform MP not wasting any time to show her true colours on 03:58 - Jun 5 with 552 views | Benters |
| New Reform MP not wasting any time to show her true colours on 14:51 - Jun 4 by blueasfook |
Well many countries who have banned it have cited security concerns. Incidentally the ban has been challenged in the ECHR (in Switzerland and France) and been upheld each time. Interestingly its also banned in many muslim countries. The only 2 countries in the world where it is enforced are Iran and Afghanistan. |
This. | |
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| New Reform MP not wasting any time to show her true colours on 06:23 - Jun 5 with 500 views | The_Flashing_Smile |
| New Reform MP not wasting any time to show her true colours on 14:37 - Jun 4 by blueasfook |
It is currently banned in all the extreme right European countries such as Austria, Belgium, Bulgaria, Denmark, France, Luxembourg, the Netherlands, Switzerland. |
Do we want to be extreme right? |  |
| Trust the process. Trust Phil. |
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| New Reform MP not wasting any time to show her true colours on 07:18 - Jun 5 with 451 views | StokieBlue |
| New Reform MP not wasting any time to show her true colours on 03:57 - Jun 5 by Benters |
It won’t be banned here the current government are gutless mate. |
I'm sure it's a huge issue on Bentley green.
SB |  | | |
| New Reform MP not wasting any time to show her true colours on 07:50 - Jun 5 with 414 views | The_Flashing_Smile |
| New Reform MP not wasting any time to show her true colours on 15:41 - Jun 4 by blueasfook |
I don't have either pro or anti views to be honest. But I am happy with the public safety reason for it to be banned and don't see it as islamophobic. You will doubtless come back with "why not balaclavas or other face coverings?" I expect? |
LOL. | |
| Trust the process. Trust Phil. |
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| New Reform MP not wasting any time to show her true colours on 08:26 - Jun 5 with 370 views | GeoffSentence |
| New Reform MP not wasting any time to show her true colours on 16:02 - Jun 4 by J2BLUE |
How many people have you seen in person wearing a balaclava? |
I used to wear a balaclava as a child to keep warm whilst waiting for the bus on freezing cold days.
THEY WANT TO CRIMINALISE OUR YOUNG!!!!!!! |  |
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| New Reform MP not wasting any time to show her true colours on 08:51 - Jun 5 with 326 views | reusersfreekicks |
| New Reform MP not wasting any time to show her true colours on 03:57 - Jun 5 by Benters |
It won’t be banned here the current government are gutless mate. |
If they were gutless they would ban it to try and placate the potential reform voters of covert, and sometimes overt, racist persuasion.
See this thread | | | |
| New Reform MP not wasting any time to show her true colours on 09:18 - Jun 5 with 292 views | Whos_blue |
Been busy so just catching up with this.
I responded quite early.
My main disgust is that Sarah Poaching chose this question as the most pressing issue affecting her constituents in Runcorn and Helsby as suitable for her maiden speech. Remember. Poachin won this seat by 6 votes. 6. Yes, a win is a win, but hardly a ringing endorsement.
Is it the biggest issue there? I don't live there, but I very much doubt it. I doubt Poachin or Reform have much genuine interest in Runcorn and Helsby other than it gives them an additional mouthpiece in parliament.
In a pre by election debate, the wearing of the burka didn't seem to come up once. Now it's Poachin's biggest issue.
BBC News - Runcorn and Helsby debate: Five things we learned - BBC News
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/c1jxk87n0ego
I'm no great fan of Starmer, but he swatted away the question well.
https://www.independent.co.uk/tv/news/sarah-pochin-reform-burqa-ban-starmer-vide
How long before we see the trumpeting of the recent Trump travel ban. Republican congressman Clay Higgins said yesterday "Americans have "had enough of immigrants coming to our country, violating our laws and committing violence among our people".". [Post edited 5 Jun 9:20]
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| Distortion becomes somehow pure in its wildness. |
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