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How would you feel about a UK Identity Card? on 08:47 - Jul 11 by itfcjoe
We are so far past the need to worry about the Govt tracking you from a civil liberties stand point - everyone walks around with a smartphone now which is more than an identity card.
If serious about controlling immigration and illegal immigration an ID card is a must
So it should be a digital ID card stored on a smart device. Bet it won’t be though. It’ll be a bit of plastic that costs £100 to replace/renew every few years.
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How would you feel about a UK Identity Card? on 12:43 - Jul 11 with 437 views
How would you feel about a UK Identity Card? on 12:11 - Jul 11 by WeWereZombies
China is economically powerful and exports a great deal of equipment. I don't want to go antivax panic spreader on this but in a connected World your dismissal of my example is premature, I would prefer some reasoning rather than assumptions. Again this is what AI gives me when I look at a recent scandal (and I've probably blown my chances of visiting China next year now...)
'Huawei's involvement in global 5G networks and other telecommunications infrastructure has raised significant concerns about potential espionage and national security risks. These concerns center around the possibility that the Chinese government could leverage Huawei's technology for surveillance or sabotage. While Huawei denies these allegations, some countries have taken steps to limit or ban the company's participation in their 5G networks. Key Concerns: Chinese Intelligence Law: The 2017 Chinese National Intelligence Law requires organizations to support and collaborate with national intelligence efforts, raising concerns that Huawei could be compelled to cooperate with Chinese intelligence agencies. Potential for Backdoors: There are fears that Huawei's equipment could contain hidden backdoors or vulnerabilities that would allow for unauthorized access and data interception. Lack of Transparency: Huawei's ownership structure and its relationships with the Chinese government have been criticized as opaque, making it difficult to assess the extent of any potential influence or control. Cybersecurity Competence: Some reports have identified weaknesses in Huawei's cybersecurity practices, further fueling concerns about the potential for exploitation. Impact on 5G Networks: Huawei is a major player in 5G technology, and its involvement in critical infrastructure networks raises the stakes for potential security breaches. Responses: Bans and Restrictions: Several countries, including the United States, Australia, and Japan, have effectively banned or restricted Huawei's participation in their 5G networks. Security Reviews: The UK established the Huawei Cyber Security Evaluation Centre to monitor the company's activities and assess the security risks associated with its technology. "No-Spy" Agreements: Huawei has offered to sign "no-spy" agreements with governments, committing to ensuring its equipment meets specific security standards. Managing Risk: Some countries have adopted strategies to manage the risks associated with Huawei's involvement, such as limiting its participation in core network components or implementing multi-vendor strategies. Huawei's Response: Denials: Huawei has consistently denied all allegations of espionage and has stated that it would never compromise user privacy or national security. Commitment to Security: Huawei emphasizes its commitment to cybersecurity and has invested heavily in improving its security practices. Transparency: Huawei has expressed a willingness to be more transparent about its operations and ownership structure. Conclusion: The Huawei spying controversy highlights the complex interplay between technology, national security, and international relations. While Huawei maintains its innocence and has taken steps to address security concerns, the potential risks associated with its involvement in critical infrastructure remain a subject of ongoing debate and scrutiny.'
Er, what has that got to do with ID Cards?
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How would you feel about a UK Identity Card? on 12:51 - Jul 11 with 424 views
How would you feel about a UK Identity Card? on 11:58 - Jul 11 by Rimsy
That's exactly my point. We are the most spied upon nation on earth, all for just going about daily life. The last 30 years or so we've had all these unnecessary controls slowly foisted upon us. These are all implemented piecemeal over decades so hopefully no one notices. I already have a birth certificate, driving licence, ni number, NHS number. I don't need an I. D. Card.
But you can have all those things incorporated in an id card. Even a bus pass. Lighter wallets, less plastic. You can even have it all on a microchip in your arm in Sweden.
I don’t know about being spied on - if I am, I pity the poor s0d doing it. Must be bored senseless. So there are cameras in the streets. Why should I care unless I'm going to break in somewhere? Speed cameras are annoying, but if I break the limit, I can’t really complain. So people can see my bank accounts etc. well fine as long as they don’t rob them or start telling me how to spend my money.
As it goes, people can do what they like in this country. There’s no effective controls on anything that I can see, especially for the bad guys and those working in the black economy. We don’t have an effective police force in numbers or in allowing it to do its job. If you get burgled, the best you can hope for is to be told to leave money on the mantelpiece so that next time the crims wont soil your Axminster.
No effective border force either. The country is a mess. This isn’t to do with ID cards directly but it tells me people are not being spied on. If we are, by whom? To what end? How does it stop people doing what they want? I just don’t see it.
If ID cards help by a couple of percent I am for it as long as they incorporate things like driving licence, NI, passes, medical details so actually replace some of the bits of paper and plastic. So criminals, illegal immigrants, people with false identities might not like it, but I can live with that.
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How would you feel about a UK Identity Card? on 12:55 - Jul 11 with 414 views
How would you feel about a UK Identity Card? on 09:16 - Jul 11 by Churchman
Trouble is, this government and the previous ones aren’t in the least bit serious about controlling immigration/illegal immigration. The only reason they are coming up with nonsense schemes like Ruanda etc is to make it look like they’re interested because they’re afraid of nutty protest groups like reform messing up their vote.
Back to the question, I agree - an ID card is a must. It can consolidate all sorts of stuff on it including driving licence, medical stuff, just about anything.
The only people afraid of ID cards are those with something to hide - in my opinion.
The UK is an appealing prospect for illegal migration for a few reasons. Principally:
- it's easy to work illegally - once here the asylum approval rates (including appeal) are really quite high - health care and benefits are easy and generous - English and ease of understanding of local bureaucracy make getting a foothold easier than elsewhere. Try getting a bank account in Japan! - Most people have friends or family already here from a few decades of lax approach to this topic. Blair hence basically
In reality I'm not sure we can do anything material enough to reverse the trend. Politically it is damage limitation mode. The Gov know all this so have to come up with barmy plans rather than gradually tackle all of these issues where possible, which is slow and hard.
You mans are absolutely deranged. Threads like this just prove I have no idea why the middle class intelligentsia of this country think like they do. “Papers please”
In the spirit of reconciliation and happiness at the end of the Banter Era (RIP) and as a result of promotion I have cleared out my ignore list. Look forwards to reading your posts!
How would you feel about a UK Identity Card? on 11:07 - Jul 11 by MattinLondon
How exactly will it have your liberty and freedoms eroded away?
You and I and everyone else in England are currently at liberty not to have to carry or own an ID card.
In the spirit of reconciliation and happiness at the end of the Banter Era (RIP) and as a result of promotion I have cleared out my ignore list. Look forwards to reading your posts!
How would you feel about a UK Identity Card? on 13:25 - Jul 11 by waveneyblue
Absolutely no concerns what so ever.
As far as I am concerned, if you have nothing to hide, what's the problem.
Yeah there are no miscarriages of justice whatsoever in the UK. If you have nothing to hide you have nothing to fear! Truly mental thinking.
In the spirit of reconciliation and happiness at the end of the Banter Era (RIP) and as a result of promotion I have cleared out my ignore list. Look forwards to reading your posts!
How would you feel about a UK Identity Card? on 13:31 - Jul 11 by Churchman
But miscarriages of justice are not a reason to not to have ID cards. If the former is a problem, that’s a separate issue to resolve.
There is no arguing with this depth of stupidity.
In the spirit of reconciliation and happiness at the end of the Banter Era (RIP) and as a result of promotion I have cleared out my ignore list. Look forwards to reading your posts!
How would you feel about a UK Identity Card? on 12:51 - Jul 11 by Churchman
But you can have all those things incorporated in an id card. Even a bus pass. Lighter wallets, less plastic. You can even have it all on a microchip in your arm in Sweden.
I don’t know about being spied on - if I am, I pity the poor s0d doing it. Must be bored senseless. So there are cameras in the streets. Why should I care unless I'm going to break in somewhere? Speed cameras are annoying, but if I break the limit, I can’t really complain. So people can see my bank accounts etc. well fine as long as they don’t rob them or start telling me how to spend my money.
As it goes, people can do what they like in this country. There’s no effective controls on anything that I can see, especially for the bad guys and those working in the black economy. We don’t have an effective police force in numbers or in allowing it to do its job. If you get burgled, the best you can hope for is to be told to leave money on the mantelpiece so that next time the crims wont soil your Axminster.
No effective border force either. The country is a mess. This isn’t to do with ID cards directly but it tells me people are not being spied on. If we are, by whom? To what end? How does it stop people doing what they want? I just don’t see it.
If ID cards help by a couple of percent I am for it as long as they incorporate things like driving licence, NI, passes, medical details so actually replace some of the bits of paper and plastic. So criminals, illegal immigrants, people with false identities might not like it, but I can live with that.
But I should be able to go about my business freely, we live in a free country afterall. Being stopped in the street and asked to show your i.d card smacks of a fascist police state to me, not Great Britain. This would have no effect on the bad guys and black economy, they would find a work round in no time. And it would likely cost the government millions, if not billions to implement. Still, each to their own, if you're happy with these controls, fair enough, but i'm not. We'll have to beg to differ (which is still allowed).
BlueBlood
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How would you feel about a UK Identity Card? on 13:44 - Jul 11 with 343 views
How would you feel about a UK Identity Card? on 13:39 - Jul 11 by Rimsy
But I should be able to go about my business freely, we live in a free country afterall. Being stopped in the street and asked to show your i.d card smacks of a fascist police state to me, not Great Britain. This would have no effect on the bad guys and black economy, they would find a work round in no time. And it would likely cost the government millions, if not billions to implement. Still, each to their own, if you're happy with these controls, fair enough, but i'm not. We'll have to beg to differ (which is still allowed).
But why would you be stopped in the street and asked to provide an ID card? Just because you are carrying a card that IDs you, you are only going to be asked to show it if you, for example, run over a lollipop lady or are jemmying open a window. You never see any police on the street anyway.
In what way would an ID card inhibit you going about your lawful business? I don’t think ‘controls’ come into it. Your point re cost and effectiveness is relevant though and I only see it as feasible if it contains other still like medical records, DL etc.
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How would you feel about a UK Identity Card? on 13:51 - Jul 11 with 328 views
How would you feel about a UK Identity Card? on 13:24 - Jul 11 by chicoazul
You and I and everyone else in England are currently at liberty not to have to carry or own an ID card.
But the same information is carried across numerous other forms of ID already. Consolidating some of those data onto one card or app changes nothing in terms of freedoms. If the fear is you have to carry ID at all times for spot checks, Gestapo style, they could do that already.
The personal data and card aren’t an issue, it’s the intent and laws of a government that leads to freedoms and rights being restricted (e.g. the clamp down on peaceful protests that’s already happened, removing our rights to freely travel and work across the EU, etc).
A real problem is the consideration of security. Everything in one place on a card/app you’re likely to carry because it’s convenient would be an obvious weakness fraudsters could exploit. Plus data handling at the govt’s end, but that happens already and by centralising data could bring security benefits and not just risks.
How would you feel about a UK Identity Card? on 13:37 - Jul 11 by eireblue
If the problem is employers making money out of illegal workers, then make sure more employers are punished for it.
Not sure having an ID card solves the issue. Law abiding people will carry one, should they have to, and rights to privacy will be dissolved.
Meanwhile the sort of employers employing illegals will continue.
Just enforce existing legislation, don’t just do fines, send people to prison.
Seems to me you should solve the problem, not have U.K. tax payers, pay more money and lose some privacy, for very little benefit.
The best argument I heard was having an (electronic) "right-to-work" card. This could be part of the new gov.uk app.
Then, when you went to an employer and they asked if you were allowed to work in the UK, you'd show them the card and you are allowed to work.
The problem isn't entirely that rogue employers don't bother checking. It is at least as much that papers can be forged ... and also that employers don't know what do look for.
The rules governing who has the right to work in the UK are actually pretty complicated. If someone who isn't a British passport holder is over here, how do you know that they can work here? How long can they work for? They can produce papers from some government departments, but would you know if they are legit? Would a small business?
At the moment the cost of evaluating the application is passed onto the business and if they make an honest mistake they are on the hook for huge fine. We *do* clamp down on this.
Instead if we moved the validation of people's right-to-work to a central body they'd easily know whether the paperwork was genuine and sufficient. It would also be easy for any British citizen to get a card. They'd just enter their NI number of passport or whatever.
This isn't really a UK identity card, but every job I've started has required me to show my passport and/or driving license so it is no different really.
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How would you feel about a UK Identity Card? on 13:59 - Jul 11 with 315 views
How would you feel about a UK Identity Card? on 13:39 - Jul 11 by Rimsy
But I should be able to go about my business freely, we live in a free country afterall. Being stopped in the street and asked to show your i.d card smacks of a fascist police state to me, not Great Britain. This would have no effect on the bad guys and black economy, they would find a work round in no time. And it would likely cost the government millions, if not billions to implement. Still, each to their own, if you're happy with these controls, fair enough, but i'm not. We'll have to beg to differ (which is still allowed).
We're one of a handful of countries not to have an ID card. Are all the rest fascist police states? Interestingly the US doesn't have one.
How would you feel about a UK Identity Card? on 13:39 - Jul 11 by Rimsy
But I should be able to go about my business freely, we live in a free country afterall. Being stopped in the street and asked to show your i.d card smacks of a fascist police state to me, not Great Britain. This would have no effect on the bad guys and black economy, they would find a work round in no time. And it would likely cost the government millions, if not billions to implement. Still, each to their own, if you're happy with these controls, fair enough, but i'm not. We'll have to beg to differ (which is still allowed).
You seem to be under the same assumption as Chico that, for some reason, having an ID card means there will be spot checks and you’ll be dragged off to the gulag if you haven’t got one. Where does that idea come from? It makes no sense. We could be expected to carry our driver’s license now as in the case for several other countries, but aren’t.
How would you feel about a UK Identity Card? on 13:44 - Jul 11 by waveneyblue
What makes you the authority on what is "mental thinking"
Let me know your workings out
You could google the Post Office?
In the spirit of reconciliation and happiness at the end of the Banter Era (RIP) and as a result of promotion I have cleared out my ignore list. Look forwards to reading your posts!
How would you feel about a UK Identity Card? on 13:51 - Jul 11 by Swansea_Blue
But the same information is carried across numerous other forms of ID already. Consolidating some of those data onto one card or app changes nothing in terms of freedoms. If the fear is you have to carry ID at all times for spot checks, Gestapo style, they could do that already.
The personal data and card aren’t an issue, it’s the intent and laws of a government that leads to freedoms and rights being restricted (e.g. the clamp down on peaceful protests that’s already happened, removing our rights to freely travel and work across the EU, etc).
A real problem is the consideration of security. Everything in one place on a card/app you’re likely to carry because it’s convenient would be an obvious weakness fraudsters could exploit. Plus data handling at the govt’s end, but that happens already and by centralising data could bring security benefits and not just risks.
[Post edited 11 Jul 14:12]
But but but but That’s all I hear about this argument Ohhh Chico I suppose you don’t have a phone?? Or a library card or a passport hmmmm??? I have no idea whatsoever why you people want to give away yet more of your freedoms and no doubt have to pay £20 for the privilege It’s utterly mad Nobody cares about retaining our ancient hard-won rights and freedoms. Nobody in the middle class brainstrust cares. I get that now. Give it five years and you’ll all be agitating with replacing the judiciary with chat gpt.
In the spirit of reconciliation and happiness at the end of the Banter Era (RIP) and as a result of promotion I have cleared out my ignore list. Look forwards to reading your posts!
How would you feel about a UK Identity Card? on 12:46 - Jul 11 by MattinLondon
Er, what has that got to do with ID Cards?
You expect ID cards to be divorced from technology ? I expect you are also unaware that Chinese security agents operate in the United Kingdom seeking out pro-democracy activists who have legitimately used their United Kingdom passports to settle here but are at risk of kidnapping or worse, and have their ability to speak out against authoritarianism curtailed either by location devices or threats to their families still in Honk Kong. Effectively you are in favour of coming up with a new security system that could potentially hand a doorway to all citizens' personal information and whereabouts (or an even more powerful doorway if you take Dan's stance that we are already tracked to nth degree.)
And if you exclude the contractors mentioned by hype313 as unsuitable then that leaves G4S, yep they have never run into problems in the past, have they ?
How would you feel about a UK Identity Card? on 14:15 - Jul 11 by Swansea_Blue
You seem to be under the same assumption as Chico that, for some reason, having an ID card means there will be spot checks and you’ll be dragged off to the gulag if you haven’t got one. Where does that idea come from? It makes no sense. We could be expected to carry our driver’s license now as in the case for several other countries, but aren’t.
Then whats the point in having an ID card? If it’s not going to be subject to checks?
In the spirit of reconciliation and happiness at the end of the Banter Era (RIP) and as a result of promotion I have cleared out my ignore list. Look forwards to reading your posts!
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