| Why is there such a debate about the penalty decision? 22:08 - Aug 9 with 2156 views | Joey_Joe_Joe_Junior |
Do fans actually know the rule? I’m not just talking about bias from Brum either, even some experts seems to be saying it should not have been awarded.
Very much suspect that VAR would have stopped the game and awarded it in the PL if not seen live. You can use your arms to jump but can’t have your hand up like that, as soon as Greaves wins the header and it hits his hand that’s above any other part of his body it’s a penalty. Had a rather interesting game did the ref but a decent spot there and didn’t bottle it.
The first big call was more a debate on the disallowed goal but jumped into the defender with both feet off the ground. As most will know on here I’m fairly quick to point out some of our fans bias or annoyance at officiating but he’s gets both those correct for me last night. [Post edited 9 Aug 22:09]
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| Why is there such a debate about the penalty decision? on 22:14 - Aug 9 with 1833 views | Clutch |
Yeah, it was 100% a penalty. |  | | |
| Why is there such a debate about the penalty decision? on 22:17 - Aug 9 with 1810 views | RonFearonsHair |
Tangential to your point, I'm surprised at how much I am seeing reference to a 'disallowed goal'. The referee blew the whistle well before the striker popped it in. |  | | |
| Why is there such a debate about the penalty decision? on 22:17 - Aug 9 with 1806 views | LankHenners |
Couldn't catch the game live but was seeing all this stuff about the pen obviously then when I eventually caught a clip of it it made me laugh as I couldn't believe it was being considered contentious. He has his arms well above his head and the ball strikes him on the hand ffs! |  |
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| Why is there such a debate about the penalty decision? on 22:20 - Aug 9 with 1774 views | iamatractorboy |
You still hear the odd fan (and even 'expert' pundit/co-comms) saying stuff like 'he's got the ball' when a player carries out a dangerous tackle and mysteriously gets booked/sent off, so it doesn't surprise me to hear people don't know some of the fairly basic laws. [Post edited 9 Aug 22:21]
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| Why is there such a debate about the penalty decision? on 22:21 - Aug 9 with 1752 views | Joey_Joe_Joe_Junior |
| Why is there such a debate about the penalty decision? on 22:17 - Aug 9 by LankHenners |
Couldn't catch the game live but was seeing all this stuff about the pen obviously then when I eventually caught a clip of it it made me laugh as I couldn't believe it was being considered contentious. He has his arms well above his head and the ball strikes him on the hand ffs! |
Do people think you literally have to be trying to block it with your hand for it to be awarded? Everyone grew up with the phrase ‘intentional’ maybe?
Theres a reason defenders now do that annoying out your hands behind your back when blocking shots, I don’t mind debate on decisions but it’s clear people have no idea about the handball law?
It’s a nailed on penalty, all this robbed by the ref? FFS!
I still expect the manager to moan about it because I generally believe they think this gets in refs heads as the season progresses but these so called experts and general fans? [Post edited 9 Aug 22:23]
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| Why is there such a debate about the penalty decision? on 22:24 - Aug 9 with 1702 views | Joey_Joe_Joe_Junior |
| Why is there such a debate about the penalty decision? on 22:17 - Aug 9 by RonFearonsHair |
Tangential to your point, I'm surprised at how much I am seeing reference to a 'disallowed goal'. The referee blew the whistle well before the striker popped it in. |
Yes, I heard it clear as day but I don’t think Palmer was stopping it. | |
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| Why is there such a debate about the penalty decision? on 22:24 - Aug 9 with 1701 views | TresBonne |
100% a penalty, although I do sympathise with them on the disallowed goal. |  | | |
| Why is there such a debate about the penalty decision? on 22:57 - Aug 9 with 1577 views | SitfcB |
The Birmingham manager was even more annoyed it was awarded after seeing it only ‘brushed his fingers’  |  |
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| Why is there such a debate about the penalty decision? on 23:29 - Aug 9 with 1460 views | Fixed_It |
| Why is there such a debate about the penalty decision? on 22:17 - Aug 9 by RonFearonsHair |
Tangential to your point, I'm surprised at how much I am seeing reference to a 'disallowed goal'. The referee blew the whistle well before the striker popped it in. |
Referee blew. Everyone stopped. Player shot. Ball went in. That's not a 'disallowed goal'. I was surprised the crowd reacted because I heard the whistle clearly from the other end of the pitch. [Post edited 9 Aug 23:57]
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| Why is there such a debate about the penalty decision? on 23:34 - Aug 9 with 1435 views | Somersetractor |
Agree. Great spot by ref. | | | |
| Why is there such a debate about the penalty decision? on 23:43 - Aug 9 with 1396 views | badadski |
Don’t even understand the hoopla over the disallowed goal - it wasn’t disallowed as the ref had blown for the foul before he had even hit the shot. It was essentially time wasting. Not to condone the ref who was appallling for the most part but it was a pen. | | | |
| Why is there such a debate about the penalty decision? on 00:19 - Aug 10 with 1322 views | JammyDodgerrr |
Think there is genuinely a debate because the ref had a pretty bad game, but it's an unbelievable spot by him. Makes it feel worse than it is,
Penalty all day long, hands flapping in the air, looking like he is going to catch it initially. Dykes is stupid and a player of his experience should do better. |  |
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| Why is there such a debate about the penalty decision? on 01:43 - Aug 10 with 1188 views | berkstractorboy |
I think the vast majority of 'neutral' fans I have seen on social media are all of the opinion it was a clear/stonewall penalty. Only the Brum fans and their blind manager think it wasn't. Brave of the ref to give that against the home team so late in the game, however it was the right call and it shouldn't be debated.
I find it interesting there was very little mention of the O'Shea penalty incident, Brum fans, manager and Sky seem to keep very quiet on that, but guess that was an NFL influenced block being introduced to 'soccer'. Thanks Tom. | | | |
| Why is there such a debate about the penalty decision? on 07:31 - Aug 10 with 908 views | bsw72 |
| Why is there such a debate about the penalty decision? on 22:24 - Aug 9 by TresBonne |
100% a penalty, although I do sympathise with them on the disallowed goal. |
What disallowed goal? The foul was given against the forward before the shot was made.
As for the foul itself, forward jumps into defender with no attempt for the ball, foul, no question.
I don’t get what people don’t understand about the laws of the game. [Post edited 10 Aug 7:32]
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| Why is there such a debate about the penalty decision? on 07:46 - Aug 10 with 835 views | Swansea_Blue |
100% pen and I’d say the same if it was awarded against us. It’s funny how the ref got the two big decisions right (also push for their disallowed goal), but otherwise pretty much ruined the game between the boxes.
Saints had one denied where the defender’s arm was out to the side, so that’s the big frustration for me - it can be so inconsistent in the EFL. But that’s a separate point that alao then goes down the rabbit hole of the need (or not) for the VAR. |  |
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| Why is there such a debate about the penalty decision? on 07:54 - Aug 10 with 802 views | Swansea_Blue |
| Why is there such a debate about the penalty decision? on 07:31 - Aug 10 by bsw72 |
What disallowed goal? The foul was given against the forward before the shot was made.
As for the foul itself, forward jumps into defender with no attempt for the ball, foul, no question.
I don’t get what people don’t understand about the laws of the game. [Post edited 10 Aug 7:32]
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Yep. As clear a push as you’ll ever see. Maybe In the context of the game people are thinking there was nothing wrong with it - I hadn’t realised we’re allowed to rugby tackle now! | |
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| Why is there such a debate about the penalty decision? on 08:15 - Aug 10 with 721 views | Alberto_the_frog |
| Why is there such a debate about the penalty decision? on 22:24 - Aug 9 by Joey_Joe_Joe_Junior |
Yes, I heard it clear as day but I don’t think Palmer was stopping it. |
If I were the keeper, I'd be saying that I would have made a great save, but didn't bother, the whistle already having gone before their player decided to boot it. |  | | |
| Why is there such a debate about the penalty decision? on 08:16 - Aug 10 with 711 views | Nthsuffolkblue |
I get Curtis Davies’ view that it was a clear penalty but he doesn’t like the rule. That is, of course, an entirely different debate. He and Chambers were laughing at Clinton Morrison suggesting it was debatable at all. |  |
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| Why is there such a debate about the penalty decision? on 08:21 - Aug 10 with 670 views | Len_Brennan |
| Why is there such a debate about the penalty decision? on 07:31 - Aug 10 by bsw72 |
What disallowed goal? The foul was given against the forward before the shot was made.
As for the foul itself, forward jumps into defender with no attempt for the ball, foul, no question.
I don’t get what people don’t understand about the laws of the game. [Post edited 10 Aug 7:32]
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It was amazing that Goodman & his co-commentator continued to say it wasn't a foul, & that the 'goal' should have stood, after the multiple replays. Thankfully Chambo & even Clinton Morrisson on the panel, acknowledged the foul at half time.
It's one thing for a commentator or pundit to disagree with a rule, or think that 'common sense' should apply in certain circumstances of a match, but it is straight up incompetence (or bias) for them not to recognise or acknowledge, for the viewers benefit, what the current laws of the game actially state. The reason that there is even a debate about either decision, is because these 2 sub standard commentators failed to properly inform (misinformed) their viewers. | | | |
| Why is there such a debate about the penalty decision? on 08:24 - Aug 10 with 647 views | HighgateBlue |
I have seen plenty of neutrals, including journalists, saying it was harsh.
Playing devil's advocate, and actually considering the wording of the rule:
(a) It seems to me that it's well arguable that he didn't touch the ball "deliberately"; and
(b) it seems to me that it's well arguable that the position of his hand/arm was a consequence of, or justifiable by, the player’s body movement for that specific situation. If that's right then his hand/arm has is not considered to have made his body unnaturally bigger.
I don't think it's a remarkable decision at all. These days that sort of penalty gets given an awful lot. I wouldn't be outraged if we were the defending team and it was given against us. But for the above reasons, it seems to me that the contrary is well arguable.
For those who think it's a stonewall pen, or its cousin, the penalty all day long, which limb of the handball offence is 100% clear, and why? |  | | |
| Why is there such a debate about the penalty decision? on 08:25 - Aug 10 with 639 views | Guthrum |
Semantic vagueness.
When people say "It shouldn't have been given", what they actually mean is "We think the way that law of the game is currently worded and interpreted is unreasonable/unfair". Which is a different thing. |  |
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| Why is there such a debate about the penalty decision? on 08:30 - Aug 10 with 602 views | Wickets |
TV just loves to drum I controversies simple as . Disallowed goal both feet off the ground as he jumps into Greaves. Penalty obviously a handball as Dykes jumps with his arm above his head . |  | | |
| Why is there such a debate about the penalty decision? on 09:11 - Aug 10 with 458 views | RIPbobby |
| Why is there such a debate about the penalty decision? on 08:24 - Aug 10 by HighgateBlue |
I have seen plenty of neutrals, including journalists, saying it was harsh.
Playing devil's advocate, and actually considering the wording of the rule:
(a) It seems to me that it's well arguable that he didn't touch the ball "deliberately"; and
(b) it seems to me that it's well arguable that the position of his hand/arm was a consequence of, or justifiable by, the player’s body movement for that specific situation. If that's right then his hand/arm has is not considered to have made his body unnaturally bigger.
I don't think it's a remarkable decision at all. These days that sort of penalty gets given an awful lot. I wouldn't be outraged if we were the defending team and it was given against us. But for the above reasons, it seems to me that the contrary is well arguable.
For those who think it's a stonewall pen, or its cousin, the penalty all day long, which limb of the handball offence is 100% clear, and why? |
I think he did do it on purpose. Watch it back he jumps up and uses both arms to spring up into the air. Nothing wrong with that, perfectly natural. Then watch as one arm comes down naturally and the other stays above his head. Some referees still don't give these so I can see why he did it.
Same with the pushing at corners. Most teams do it all over the box, all the time and they are hardly ever given. Brum played the ref well. That kept fouling us and got away with it time and again, until they didn't. |  | | |
| Why is there such a debate about the penalty decision? on 09:17 - Aug 10 with 430 views | Paramedic |
Spot on mate. Neither decision was “harsh” they were correct within the rules of the game. If pundits and commentators question decisions like that they shouldn’t be in the jobs they are. |  |
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| Why is there such a debate about the penalty decision? on 09:29 - Aug 10 with 398 views | olimar |
| Why is there such a debate about the penalty decision? on 09:11 - Aug 10 by RIPbobby |
I think he did do it on purpose. Watch it back he jumps up and uses both arms to spring up into the air. Nothing wrong with that, perfectly natural. Then watch as one arm comes down naturally and the other stays above his head. Some referees still don't give these so I can see why he did it.
Same with the pushing at corners. Most teams do it all over the box, all the time and they are hardly ever given. Brum played the ref well. That kept fouling us and got away with it time and again, until they didn't. |
Four players all jumped for the ball at the same time. I get the argument that players need to use their arms to jump, but all of the other three already had their arms back down and Greaves had already won the header.
Yet Dykes was the only one with an arm still above his head, facing the ball too.
Hard to judge if he did it deliberately, but it was definitely a poorly executed jump if being kind and at the very least, more likely that he realised he wasn't close to the ball so just tried to get as much as he could in Greaves way.
i think they are trying to take interpretation out of these decisions, which means we get some really unfair decisions when it's clearly accidental, but in this case it is definitely much closer to a deliberate attempt anyway so, either way, it's a pen. | | | |
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