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Venezuela under attack (n/t) on 14:38 - Jan 3 by giant_stow
Tricky one... on principle, it would be good to see Starmer stand up, but then again principles and law seem to be out the window now. Perhaps hes showing wisdom? Not sure...
Farage just has a problem as british voters hate trump.
“principles and law seem to be out the window now”
Could easily be describing our government there- designating protesters as a terrorist group and jailing them, removing juries,compulsory ID, cancelling local elections…
[Post edited 3 Jan 14:43]
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Venezuela under attack (n/t) on 14:53 - Jan 3 with 1062 views
“principles and law seem to be out the window now”
Could easily be describing our government there- designating protesters as a terrorist group and jailing them, removing juries,compulsory ID, cancelling local elections…
[Post edited 3 Jan 14:43]
A bit harsh, but i take your point.
Has anyone ever looked at their own postings for last day or so? Oh my... so sorry. Was Ullaa
Listening to the David McWilliams podcast earlier this week, they had a LATAM expert on discussing the Venezuelan situation. TL:DR it played out as forecast, a Maduro exit and the next focus said would be Cuba. Cuba is heavily reliant on Venezuelan oil.
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Venezuela under attack (n/t) on 15:06 - Jan 3 with 1015 views
There are lots of things to condemn Maduro for but the suggested rationale for US action and proposed charges, namely, narcotics trafficking and narcotic terrorism seem rather flimsy.
In this connection, it is interesting to contrast the recent Trump pardon for the former Honduran President who had been convicted of drug trafficking.
Yeah it’s more this - the stuff about oil is nonsense, the US is the world’s largest producer with a huge domestic industry, supporting huge numbers of jobs. The last thing they need is more production coming on tap at $60bbl (especially as domestic production is typically more expensive than many of their peers). Not to forget of course Venezuelan oil is sanctioned in a large part of the world, as are the tankers that export them (mostly to other dubious regimes), so quite useless to anyone.
Distraction politics and the opportunity to weaken an adversary, he’s also threatened to intervene in Iran if the regime attacks the protesters there. Not sure he’s going to get that Nobel prize…
[Post edited 3 Jan 13:43]
Whilst the US is the largest producer a lot of that is fracking which is more expensive than traditional methods. Absolutely oil plays a part in this action, Venezuelan oil is much cheaper to extract.
Trump has literally just announced that the US will be heavily involved in Venezuelan oil:
"We have the greatest oil companies in the world, the biggest, the greatest, and we’re going to be very much involved in it."
Given he's just broken international law with the attack and detainment operations I doubt he really cares much about the oil being sanctioned. He will just use it domestically.
SB
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Venezuela under attack (n/t) on 15:20 - Jan 3 with 956 views
Venezuela under attack (n/t) on 15:06 - Jan 3 by DJR
There are lots of things to condemn Maduro for but the suggested rationale for US action and proposed charges, namely, narcotics trafficking and narcotic terrorism seem rather flimsy.
In this connection, it is interesting to contrast the recent Trump pardon for the former Honduran President who had been convicted of drug trafficking.
Venezuela under attack (n/t) on 15:17 - Jan 3 by StokieBlue
Whilst the US is the largest producer a lot of that is fracking which is more expensive than traditional methods. Absolutely oil plays a part in this action, Venezuelan oil is much cheaper to extract.
Trump has literally just announced that the US will be heavily involved in Venezuelan oil:
"We have the greatest oil companies in the world, the biggest, the greatest, and we’re going to be very much involved in it."
Given he's just broken international law with the attack and detainment operations I doubt he really cares much about the oil being sanctioned. He will just use it domestically.
SB
I literally said it was more expensive to produce in the US. Hence why flooding it with Venezuelan oil would kill their own domestic industry and all the industry that supports it. The US built up its status to largest produce in the world to benefit their economy and provide energy security. Flooding it with Venezuelan reserves would end that. If you have any knowledge of the energy sector you’ll know the oil motive is an outdated and lazy conclusion. The US industry relies on a commodity price so it’s to their benefit that prices rise from where they are now. They’ve quite literally benefited from loss of Russian output and increased their exports to Europe as a consequence.
The only US involvement would be contracts to its producers, Venezuela kicked out all the Western expertise and have subsequently struggled to reach capacity output.
I literally said it was more expensive to produce in the US. Hence why flooding it with Venezuelan oil would kill their own domestic industry and all the industry that supports it. The US built up its status to largest produce in the world to benefit their economy and provide energy security. Flooding it with Venezuelan reserves would end that. If you have any knowledge of the energy sector you’ll know the oil motive is an outdated and lazy conclusion. The US industry relies on a commodity price so it’s to their benefit that prices rise from where they are now. They’ve quite literally benefited from loss of Russian output and increased their exports to Europe as a consequence.
The only US involvement would be contracts to its producers, Venezuela kicked out all the Western expertise and have subsequently struggled to reach capacity output.
[Post edited 3 Jan 15:27]
Trump doesn't seem to be listening, it's not like he really understands the domestic economy or he wouldn't be so keen on his tariff policies.
Why would the US contractors be keen to get involved if the oil can't be sold anywhere. This would indicate:
- They will be involved (Trump has just said so). - The oil will be used domestically in the US or they will attempt to get the sanctions lifted.
Either way, the Republicans seem upset that the oil assets were seized during nationalisation and want them back.
SB
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Venezuela under attack (n/t) on 15:35 - Jan 3 with 879 views
I literally said it was more expensive to produce in the US. Hence why flooding it with Venezuelan oil would kill their own domestic industry and all the industry that supports it. The US built up its status to largest produce in the world to benefit their economy and provide energy security. Flooding it with Venezuelan reserves would end that. If you have any knowledge of the energy sector you’ll know the oil motive is an outdated and lazy conclusion. The US industry relies on a commodity price so it’s to their benefit that prices rise from where they are now. They’ve quite literally benefited from loss of Russian output and increased their exports to Europe as a consequence.
The only US involvement would be contracts to its producers, Venezuela kicked out all the Western expertise and have subsequently struggled to reach capacity output.
[Post edited 3 Jan 15:27]
Crude oil isn't the same the world over. It varies from thick and heavy to light and viscous.
Venezuelan oil is the former, that's why they import quite a bit of naptha (when the US lets them). Currently most US production is the latter. The US refineries, especially on the Gulf of Mexico, are all set up to refine the heavy stuff rather than the light stuff so they want to keep the Venezuelan oil flowing in their direction.
For all his talk of re-shoring production of various things, Trump isn't about to oversee the building of a load of new refineries when exactly what they need for the existing ones is a few hundred miles away across the sea.
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Venezuela under attack (n/t) on 15:42 - Jan 3 with 830 views
Venezuela under attack (n/t) on 15:33 - Jan 3 by StokieBlue
Trump doesn't seem to be listening, it's not like he really understands the domestic economy or he wouldn't be so keen on his tariff policies.
Why would the US contractors be keen to get involved if the oil can't be sold anywhere. This would indicate:
- They will be involved (Trump has just said so). - The oil will be used domestically in the US or they will attempt to get the sanctions lifted.
Either way, the Republicans seem upset that the oil assets were seized during nationalisation and want them back.
SB
They can certainly make money from the E&P they just won’t be able to export in huge volumes due to most of the wealthiest economies having sanctions on it. I doubt many of those assets are still in good order (and most will certainly be outdated technology). He could of course use it domestically, but bear in mind that would be pretty stupid since it would hardest hit the states where he draws support.
Sounds like a Bush-esque revenge mission to me!
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TRUMP has just lied through his teeth on FOX… 300k?! on 16:09 - Jan 3 with 789 views
Venezuela under attack (n/t) on 15:06 - Jan 3 by DJR
There are lots of things to condemn Maduro for but the suggested rationale for US action and proposed charges, namely, narcotics trafficking and narcotic terrorism seem rather flimsy.
In this connection, it is interesting to contrast the recent Trump pardon for the former Honduran President who had been convicted of drug trafficking.
Trump just justified bombing a country and extracting its leader on a massive lie!
It’s unbelievable.
He stated that Venezuela are directly responsible for 300k drug deaths annually, this is no longer normal.
Over to ChatGPT:
Trump’s claim that Venezuela is responsible for “300,000 civilian drug deaths” is factually incorrect or massively overstated: 🔹 The overdose statistics don’t support it: The highest recent annual drug overdose figures in the U.S. are around 90,000-100,000 deaths, not 300,000, according to reliable public health data (e.g., CDC timing and PolitiFact reporting on Trump’s inflated claims). The Washington Post 🔹 Venezuela isn’t a major source for most drugs killing Americans: Experts and fact-checkers note that most fentanyl and other lethal drugs entering the United States come via Mexico over the southern land border, and not from Venezuelan maritime routes. Venezuela plays a minor role in the overall drug trafficking picture compared with Colombia (for cocaine) and Mexico (for fentanyl distribution). PolitiFact 🔹 Conflating seizures or interdictions with deaths is misleading: Even if small boats off Venezuela carried drugs, there’s no credible method to translate drug seizures or destroyed shipments into the number of overdose deaths prevented — and Trump’s specific figure (e.g., “25,000 lives per boat”) has been rated false by independent fact-checkers. PBS In short: Venezuela is often a transit route for some cocaine shipments and has had problems with trafficking networks, but it is not responsible for hundreds of thousands of civilian drug deaths, and claims making that direct causal link do not align with independent data or expert analysis.
Venezuela under attack (n/t) on 15:39 - Jan 3 by soupytwist
Crude oil isn't the same the world over. It varies from thick and heavy to light and viscous.
Venezuelan oil is the former, that's why they import quite a bit of naptha (when the US lets them). Currently most US production is the latter. The US refineries, especially on the Gulf of Mexico, are all set up to refine the heavy stuff rather than the light stuff so they want to keep the Venezuelan oil flowing in their direction.
For all his talk of re-shoring production of various things, Trump isn't about to oversee the building of a load of new refineries when exactly what they need for the existing ones is a few hundred miles away across the sea.
Yes it will benefit a handful of refineries but it will damage the domestic E&P sector which is where th money is. They won’t be able to export it, and domestic use will mean cutting their ow production and masses of jobs it’s all mothballed.
The inverse is true in that the US oil and gas industry will likely benefit from reduced Venezuelan output (albeit its tiny), more so the instability increasing oil prices at least in the short term.
[Post edited 3 Jan 17:07]
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This is just surreal.. I just listened to the full Fox Trump interview on 16:43 - Jan 3 with 729 views
TRUMP has just lied through his teeth on FOX… 300k?! on 16:09 - Jan 3 by unstableblue
Trump just justified bombing a country and extracting its leader on a massive lie!
It’s unbelievable.
He stated that Venezuela are directly responsible for 300k drug deaths annually, this is no longer normal.
Over to ChatGPT:
Trump’s claim that Venezuela is responsible for “300,000 civilian drug deaths” is factually incorrect or massively overstated: 🔹 The overdose statistics don’t support it: The highest recent annual drug overdose figures in the U.S. are around 90,000-100,000 deaths, not 300,000, according to reliable public health data (e.g., CDC timing and PolitiFact reporting on Trump’s inflated claims). The Washington Post 🔹 Venezuela isn’t a major source for most drugs killing Americans: Experts and fact-checkers note that most fentanyl and other lethal drugs entering the United States come via Mexico over the southern land border, and not from Venezuelan maritime routes. Venezuela plays a minor role in the overall drug trafficking picture compared with Colombia (for cocaine) and Mexico (for fentanyl distribution). PolitiFact 🔹 Conflating seizures or interdictions with deaths is misleading: Even if small boats off Venezuela carried drugs, there’s no credible method to translate drug seizures or destroyed shipments into the number of overdose deaths prevented — and Trump’s specific figure (e.g., “25,000 lives per boat”) has been rated false by independent fact-checkers. PBS In short: Venezuela is often a transit route for some cocaine shipments and has had problems with trafficking networks, but it is not responsible for hundreds of thousands of civilian drug deaths, and claims making that direct causal link do not align with independent data or expert analysis.
It’s just surreal
Firstly he’s continuing to say 300k drug deaths. Despite 100k being the official numbers.
(Note there are 47,000 gun deaths in the USA annually, alcohol 178,000)
But this was a press conference to justify the delta force removal of a foreign president, but the justification turned to some generic drug trafficking issues - and talking about ramping the pressure on Mexico?! So it isn’t Venezuela?!
Weird.
Also the Fox News presenters are just sycophants. They’re like Pravda. “Unlike Biden, this shows our foreign adversaries like Russia that we mean business” (not sure they’d be following Ukraine very closely)
This is just surreal.. I just listened to the full Fox Trump interview on 16:43 - Jan 3 by unstableblue
It’s just surreal
Firstly he’s continuing to say 300k drug deaths. Despite 100k being the official numbers.
(Note there are 47,000 gun deaths in the USA annually, alcohol 178,000)
But this was a press conference to justify the delta force removal of a foreign president, but the justification turned to some generic drug trafficking issues - and talking about ramping the pressure on Mexico?! So it isn’t Venezuela?!
Weird.
Also the Fox News presenters are just sycophants. They’re like Pravda. “Unlike Biden, this shows our foreign adversaries like Russia that we mean business” (not sure they’d be following Ukraine very closely)
Now saying they will run Venezuela until a new leader installed who is friendly. Incredible really.
This is just surreal.. I just listened to the full Fox Trump interview on 16:48 - Jan 3 by LeoMuff
Now saying they will run Venezuela until a new leader installed who is friendly. Incredible really.
(In New York)
A DOJ that by its own whistleblowers is now deeply corrupt and operating beyond the rule of law.
So he’s been extracted illegally by international law. Under a justification that is blatantly false. And will be tried by a deeply questionable legal team.
This is just surreal.. I just listened to the full Fox Trump interview on 16:43 - Jan 3 by unstableblue
It’s just surreal
Firstly he’s continuing to say 300k drug deaths. Despite 100k being the official numbers.
(Note there are 47,000 gun deaths in the USA annually, alcohol 178,000)
But this was a press conference to justify the delta force removal of a foreign president, but the justification turned to some generic drug trafficking issues - and talking about ramping the pressure on Mexico?! So it isn’t Venezuela?!
Weird.
Also the Fox News presenters are just sycophants. They’re like Pravda. “Unlike Biden, this shows our foreign adversaries like Russia that we mean business” (not sure they’d be following Ukraine very closely)
Presumably his 300k figure is some arbitrary percentage of all deaths (not just ODs) where 'drugs' can in some way be said to have played a part.
I'm all for putting in a heavy tackle on the stupid orange bastard, but we've got to be careful that we're not playing by the same (lack of) rules that he doesn't adhere to.
Good work by Philogene...... GREAT WORK BY PHILOGENE!!!
Venezuela under attack (n/t) on 07:33 - Jan 3 by Axeldalai_lama
I don't know much at all about the country or politics of Venezuela, so should probably stop there but... Didn't the opposition leader win the Nobel Peace Prize for fighting a dodgy rigged election against a corrupt regime?
I obviously realise that Trump is complete scum and it's nothing to do with that necessarily, but is there any tiny bit of this having some vague positive? Probably not and it's just another sh1t show attempt to pseudo colonise the place and/ or just have a war to show America is big and tough. Just a thought.
,...... So he'll hand it over to the nobel Peace Prize winning opposition leader now then..... Right??...... Right?!
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Venezuela under attack (n/t) on 17:38 - Jan 3 with 497 views
Venezuela under attack (n/t) on 07:33 - Jan 3 by Axeldalai_lama
I don't know much at all about the country or politics of Venezuela, so should probably stop there but... Didn't the opposition leader win the Nobel Peace Prize for fighting a dodgy rigged election against a corrupt regime?
I obviously realise that Trump is complete scum and it's nothing to do with that necessarily, but is there any tiny bit of this having some vague positive? Probably not and it's just another sh1t show attempt to pseudo colonise the place and/ or just have a war to show America is big and tough. Just a thought.
For it’s size, it’s technically one only the richest countries in the world and has one of the poorest standard of living. It had a government that wasn’t democratically elected, it’s corrupt and exploits its people. Many have labeled it a narco-state.
It likely is a good thing for the Venezuelan people longer term if that’s your question, hence the expat celebrations in places like Miami at the moment.
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