| Another thing about Sunderland’s recruitment 13:13 - May 26 with 2995 views | Illinoisblue |
In the Henry winter tweet below there’s a detailed list of their signings and fees paid. Given that Sunderland had been out of the prem since 2017 - and four of those subsequent seasons were in League One - how or what was their method of recruiting? Did they have a scouting network still in place from their prior stint in the prem? Or did they just throw money at agents/players and got lucky?
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| Another thing about Sunderland’s recruitment on 13:24 - May 26 with 2836 views | burnbudgiesburn |
Without looking deep into it, i'd presume a lot of it was Le Bris and his connections? |  | | |
| Another thing about Sunderland’s recruitment on 13:28 - May 26 with 2802 views | tractorboy1978 |
They did very well in the French market - which is where their owner/manager/recruitment team have good contacts. The fees also only tell part of the story as I suspect there are a couple they are paying some very chunky wages to - Mukiele and Xhaka. In Xhaka's case they gave him a 3 year deal at 33 years old. [Post edited 26 May 13:28]
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| Another thing about Sunderland’s recruitment on 13:29 - May 26 with 2770 views | TRUE_BLUE123 |
Very well connected people in high positions. Who have links across European football. |  |
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| Another thing about Sunderland’s recruitment on 13:52 - May 26 with 2595 views | Vaughan8 |
Be interesting to see how they do next season.
It might be a bity lucky, but they've done really well.
Only time will tell. | | | |
| Another thing about Sunderland’s recruitment on 13:57 - May 26 with 2516 views | FrimleyBlue |
The new owner who took them on as league 1 side made recruitment set up one of their priorities. Read it about it the other day
Which imo at least blows the water out of this whole town have grown to quick to have a decent set up. |  |
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| Another thing about Sunderland’s recruitment on 14:00 - May 26 with 2498 views | Trequartista |
Not a single signing from the Championship or Premier League. Also note how many players were signed from clubs much bigger than Sunderland or Ipswich. It doesn't take huge scouting network to find players at Atletico Madrid, Roma and Ajax. The key is to find players not getting at game at these big clubs and/or offering them big Premier League wages. |  |
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| Another thing about Sunderland’s recruitment on 15:22 - May 26 with 2140 views | tetchris |
From what I’ve read in the press, Le Bris has to take a lot of the plaudits for the recruitment. Good knowledge of European markets, particularly France. Well connected, good scouting network. There were rumours he might be sacked if Sunderland didn’t get into Europe which would have been a ridiculous decision. His stock is high so surprised he isn’t being linked with some higher profile clubs here and abroad. | | | |
| Another thing about Sunderland’s recruitment on 15:35 - May 26 with 2080 views | Joey_Joe_Joe_Junior |
People have been arguing becuase they were in the PL more recently is nonsense to be honest, they were on their knees in league 1.
They hit their jackpot with the coach his connections,including this guy that got to work right away.
https://www.safc.com/news/2025
Also I don’t often agree when people say get PL experience, those kind of players that would come to a newly promoted club are often washed. I get the logic behind Phillips but he been having a torrid time at WHU before.
Top flight European experience is where it’s at. [Post edited 26 May 15:38]
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| Another thing about Sunderland’s recruitment on 16:43 - May 26 with 1847 views | BloomBlue |
| Another thing about Sunderland’s recruitment on 13:57 - May 26 by FrimleyBlue |
The new owner who took them on as league 1 side made recruitment set up one of their priorities. Read it about it the other day
Which imo at least blows the water out of this whole town have grown to quick to have a decent set up. |
But Sunderland had a Prem stadium ready to go.
We had to spend millions in money and man-hours just to get our Media centre up to the correct standard.
Sunderland have a 48,000 seated stadium, we have some fans moaning the owners need to splash the cash now to get PR to 40,000.
That was a bid advantage to the new Sunderland owners they didn't have to spend preseason forced to get the stadium PL ready. We could have said f&&k the infrastructure we're worry about that later, moss and a tree on the NS roof who cares. Outside the stadium looks like something from the 60s who cares.
We started from a much lower base than Sunderland in terms of infrastructure |  | | |
| Another thing about Sunderland’s recruitment on 16:59 - May 26 with 1753 views | Cheltenham_Blue |
| Another thing about Sunderland’s recruitment on 13:57 - May 26 by FrimleyBlue |
The new owner who took them on as league 1 side made recruitment set up one of their priorities. Read it about it the other day
Which imo at least blows the water out of this whole town have grown to quick to have a decent set up. |
"Which imo at least blows the water out of this whole town have grown to quick to have a decent set up." Understandable why you would think that, but it doesn't really tally in truth.
Since Town were last in the PL, Sunderland have spent 15 of 25 seasons in the top flight (60% of all their available seasons). They last dropped out of it, 9 years ago, ending a run of 10 consecutive seasons in the Premier League. If they didn't already have the building blocks in place to return to the Premier League, particularly from a recruitment perspective, I would be astonished. They were as would be described now, an 'established Premier League club' when they were relegated.
Then look at Town, who in the 10 years prior to the GC20 takeover, had every conceivable department, (including scouting and recruitment) cut to the bone by Evans. Leif said, just last week that when he joined, the club were aiming to get out of League one and into the Championship in four years.
Four years later we had been promoted to the Premier League twice. We absolutely grew and got promoted too fast for back offices to catch up. [Post edited 26 May 17:31]
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| Another thing about Sunderland’s recruitment on 17:32 - May 26 with 1647 views | Churchman |
| Another thing about Sunderland’s recruitment on 16:43 - May 26 by BloomBlue |
But Sunderland had a Prem stadium ready to go.
We had to spend millions in money and man-hours just to get our Media centre up to the correct standard.
Sunderland have a 48,000 seated stadium, we have some fans moaning the owners need to splash the cash now to get PR to 40,000.
That was a bid advantage to the new Sunderland owners they didn't have to spend preseason forced to get the stadium PL ready. We could have said f&&k the infrastructure we're worry about that later, moss and a tree on the NS roof who cares. Outside the stadium looks like something from the 60s who cares.
We started from a much lower base than Sunderland in terms of infrastructure |
The problem with f the infrastructure is that had we done that we wouldn’t have been playing Premier League home games at Portman Road. It was explained two years ago that the PL visits every Championship club in the running for promotion early in the new year and lays down requirements for tv points to media to dressing rooms. That’s where the 100+ projects came from.
That the club delivered most of them was an achievement. We started with very little infrastructure at all beyond Lee O’N rushing around with a broom up his #@£&.
McKenna after the QPR game said (paraphrasing) that while there was obviously a lot to do we were far better placed than we were two years ago. Is he deluded, a liar or telling it as it is? Personally I’ve no reason to doubt his word. Others on here might and probably will.
This fixation with Sunderland is not a good thing in my view. There will be plenty of things to learn from them, Leeds and Burnley along with our experience and that of Leicester and Southampton before they bought the binos. |  | | |
| Another thing about Sunderland’s recruitment on 20:54 - May 26 with 1351 views | peterleeblue |
| Another thing about Sunderland’s recruitment on 13:29 - May 26 by TRUE_BLUE123 |
Very well connected people in high positions. Who have links across European football. |
Is the correct answer.
Chasing the likes of Hackney wont cut it. It didn't last time.
The step up that the likes of Roefs, Mukiele ,Sadiki, Reinildo, Alderete, Tailbi and last but not Least Xhaka brought to the team was mind blowing. Sunderland at no time failed to look the level (Forest at home aside). Whilst Ipswich wilted from 70 minutes (in 23/24) on Sunderland generally finished strongly. We simply lacked the quality required. |  | | |
| Another thing about Sunderland’s recruitment on 21:40 - May 26 with 1261 views | pointofblue |
There is one thing to add - based on xG they should have finished eighteenth in 2025/26. That's not to say they didn't do brilliantly, but it shows the value in taking chances when they come, which is what we struggled to do in the Premier League and, to an extent, the following Championship season. In all likelihood they'll regress to the mean next season. The question is by how much. | |
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| Another thing about Sunderland’s recruitment on 09:06 - May 27 with 789 views | darkhorse28 |
| Another thing about Sunderland’s recruitment on 13:57 - May 26 by FrimleyBlue |
The new owner who took them on as league 1 side made recruitment set up one of their priorities. Read it about it the other day
Which imo at least blows the water out of this whole town have grown to quick to have a decent set up. |
You can’t go comparing out off the field quality to other clubs, with the same or fewer resources. Even when we’re in direct competition with them.
It’s the law. It makes some people feel bad.
The yardstick is Sunderland, Brentford, Brighton Bournemouth.
Many would prefer it was Oxford and Morecombe.
We’ve done fantastically well, there’s no debate. It’s an easy measure. But have we done well relative to this level, to our completion, well that’s also obvious, so far, no, we really haven’t bit in terms of results, league position, and especially recruitment.
McKenna and Ashton need to be at least at that level, and that’s just to stay up, we’ll need to finish above a Fulham or Sunderland etc to have a chance.
That won’t happen with this squad, or with our talent ID. We’ve signed one player of the quality they have, and we spent just as much, slightly more.
McKenna hasn’t ever thrived in recruitment, and he didn’t need to, Ashton should have worked that out year one and built talent ID around the clubs needs at this level…, they’ve earned the right to go again, so let’s see.
Who knows. Sometimes two or three players can make the world of difference, look at when we signed Marcus - game changer.., so it’s VERY possible.
I just get a feeling it won’t happen. Ashton doesn’t like hugely talented people in his wheelhouse, and recruitment is his wheelhouse…, he loves it, it’s a weakness for the club, because he’s good at it, he’s certainly very good at the deal aspect, but the quality of the outcomes is a million miles off those clubs…, and that’s his measure.
Spending huge sums to be slightly better than Boro and Millwall, this year, that would get us about 18 points at this level.
The improvements required aren’t small, they aren’t physical.
It’s really simple, and it always was, it takes three seconds to fix.
You need the right bums on seats…, and I still don’t think Ashton has worked that out …, I’d be shocked if a 65 year old, with a poor record, at the time of his clubs worst recruitment in their history, and held up as some of the worst spending in football history, it would be a shock if that was the answer.
But football is full of shocks…, can’t remember been impressed when we signed Mark Venus.., he was a giant…., we’re going to need luck though, and after 5 years and hundreds of millions our recruitment could be world class.., I’d say we’re EFL level, and that’s a massive failure.
When you list the players other clubs sign for £10-15 million and no, they aren’t all on massive wages either, our wage bill will be very competitive.
That’s what we’ve spent on about a dozen players that WE have already determined were never at the level…, WE think we’re poor at talent ID, that’s the litmus test.., McKenna doesn’t think many of his signings are at the level. Time will tell but in the modern game it’s where you stand and fall…, McKenna coaching the gap doesn’t work against world class talent. | | | |
| Another thing about Sunderland’s recruitment on 09:36 - May 27 with 743 views | SuffolkPunchFC |
| Another thing about Sunderland’s recruitment on 15:35 - May 26 by Joey_Joe_Joe_Junior |
People have been arguing becuase they were in the PL more recently is nonsense to be honest, they were on their knees in league 1.
They hit their jackpot with the coach his connections,including this guy that got to work right away.
https://www.safc.com/news/2025
Also I don’t often agree when people say get PL experience, those kind of players that would come to a newly promoted club are often washed. I get the logic behind Phillips but he been having a torrid time at WHU before.
Top flight European experience is where it’s at. [Post edited 26 May 15:38]
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Sunderland were, as you say, on their knees financially. However, in the past 25 years they have spent 15 in the PL, and that was not run into the ground in the same way as everything was at Town.
Take the Academy as just one example - Category 1 since 2012, even through their downturn in finance and relegations of the first team. I only use this as an easily verifiable reference. It's not unreasonable to assume their other support functions, such as scouting and recruitment also retained benefit from so many PL years.
I'm not taking anything away from Le Bris - he's a good manager, and has the right contacts to help, but he did have a much better infrastructure to work with when he came in. | | | |
| Another thing about Sunderland’s recruitment on 10:26 - May 28 with 360 views | darkhorse28 |
| Another thing about Sunderland’s recruitment on 16:59 - May 26 by Cheltenham_Blue |
"Which imo at least blows the water out of this whole town have grown to quick to have a decent set up." Understandable why you would think that, but it doesn't really tally in truth.
Since Town were last in the PL, Sunderland have spent 15 of 25 seasons in the top flight (60% of all their available seasons). They last dropped out of it, 9 years ago, ending a run of 10 consecutive seasons in the Premier League. If they didn't already have the building blocks in place to return to the Premier League, particularly from a recruitment perspective, I would be astonished. They were as would be described now, an 'established Premier League club' when they were relegated.
Then look at Town, who in the 10 years prior to the GC20 takeover, had every conceivable department, (including scouting and recruitment) cut to the bone by Evans. Leif said, just last week that when he joined, the club were aiming to get out of League one and into the Championship in four years.
Four years later we had been promoted to the Premier League twice. We absolutely grew and got promoted too fast for back offices to catch up. [Post edited 26 May 17:31]
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That’s a staggering take.
Leeds were established and champions league semi finalists. And then almost bankrupt. So were WE.
If your out 9 years, down in league one for many of them you may retain the physical infrastructure but the bums of seats change by definition. All of them when it’s that long.
You seem to want it both ways.
Ipswich are a little league one club, lucky to be at this level, and without Ashton couldn’t dream of being at this level, in spite of winning league titles. Fa cups, European trophies, and having England’s best two ever managers.
Yet other clubs.., if they had a whiff of the top flight at any point, then it’s understandable and allowable that they’ve done much better than we have (in a period where we’ve spent more money than any club in Europe .., almost).
Make it make sense.
Your optics seem to be opaque, based on your attachment to Mark Ashton. And McKenna.
Why don’t you just accept what’s 100% true. Off and on the pitch they’ve been Mitch better than us. Better coached, better managed, and much better talent id.
That’s ok. It’s even good to see out weaknesses and where we have to improve.
But something something they were in the premier league 9 years ago…, with different staff, different owners, different players, managers and even tea ladies, is absurd. ADSURD.
They’ve been better than us the last couple of seasons…, much better…, every metric. Not 9 years ago…, NOW
That’s ok. Pretending it’s not and trying to measure us against Millwall because it feels better, that’s no ok, that’s not how we grow and develop, pretending we’re perfect just to protect fragile egos.
They’re better. Fine. We can learn from them. See what they do well. Same with Bournemouth, Brighton, Leeds, Brentford. Fulham, even Burnley and their 100 points, they’d beat us if we played tomorrow, and comfortably too.
That’s the challenge. I don’t now how you think pretending we’re better than we are helps? Wanting to make excuse after excuse helps?
How did ignorance and avoidance ever help anything grow and develop?
It’s sad. We don’t need to be perfect.
We do need to stop pretending we’re a teeny tiny league one club. Unless you’re 12, in which case fine. That’s all you know.
But WE have a great and proud history too.
Can you stop pretending we’re DON’T just to protect your ego. Please. Sunderland were MILES behind us two seasons ago…, so where was their premier league experience then? On snooze???
They’ve sailed past us for one reason alone…, in the here and now, they’re better at everything on and off the pitch than we are.
Doesn’t make us bad. Does make us miles behind Sunderland. And them having talented people in the building 10 years ago isn’t the reason, not even 1%.
Although Coventry’s success is pretty obviously because they win the FA Cup in the 80’s …, they win it more recently than we did. That’s why they’re better than us.
Time to put the big boy pants on and adult.
Some owners, and managers. Even in the EFL are better than ours. That’s the reality.., again, doesn’t make us bad, but dear god your excuses are bordering delusional.
If even recent history not a decade old was instructive, how are Leicester a league one club???
You’re as good as your players, manager, CEO, talent id in the here and now and from the last 2-3 years.., the rest is window dressing. Ask Lincoln!!! They’ve never had resources.., ever .., doesn’t seem to stop them having success - more than we did in league one too.
Were the sum of all those decisions you make excuses for. All of them. The successes AND the failures.
The way you burry your head and reach for any made up excuse.
Sunderland. They’re much better than we are. Because they’ve had better on and off field people than we have in the last two season, not rocket science, and fewer resources to do it.
They’re a product of elite decision making…., not the cups and sources being the same as when they were in the prem a decade ago - by your metric Watford should be European champions!!
Makes my tits ache to see you rip out history away, and build others clubs histories in to something they never were, just to protect your ego. | | | |
| Another thing about Sunderland’s recruitment on 10:46 - May 28 with 304 views | HighgateBlue |
| Another thing about Sunderland’s recruitment on 21:40 - May 26 by pointofblue |
There is one thing to add - based on xG they should have finished eighteenth in 2025/26. That's not to say they didn't do brilliantly, but it shows the value in taking chances when they come, which is what we struggled to do in the Premier League and, to an extent, the following Championship season. In all likelihood they'll regress to the mean next season. The question is by how much. |
Their secret?
Their top scorer had 4 names, the second of which is Ebenezer!!!
And as it happens, his surname begins with B...
Given that he's Dutch, which of course holds a special place in Town's hearts, and given that he was signed from Ajax, maybe we should have gone for that guy, rather than Akpom!
Seriously though, beating their xG by so much, without having a scorer scoring more than 7 in the league is an incredible team effort. Xhaka's creativity is part of it, but that recruitment and amazing team spirit creation within a short period of time is seriously impressive.
A few more stats to note:
- their goal difference was worse than Forest's (who finished 16th)
- 10 of their 14 wins were by a single goal
- if 5 of those 10 winning goals don't go in, they finish 16th (not even accounting for the points gained by others)
- but the bigger overperformance was actually vs their xGA. They conceded 5.9 goals fewer than they "should" have. Maybe they got lucky with opposition finishing in key games. If the opposition had got 5 equalisers, for example, again they would have finished 16th at best.
So yeah, regression to the mean is very possible, although as a neutral, it was nice to see their success story last year. Maybe it's something we can hope to replicate in our own way. Kieran will have been a student of this story, that's for sure. |  | | |
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