| Are new signings dependent on fee from selling Omari? 21:20 - Jul 16 with 2608 views | tetchris |
If we don’t sell Omari, are there further funds available to buy a least another central midfielder and a striker?
If not are we looking to dip into the loan market instead and sign the maximum loans allowed? |  | | |  |
| Are new signings dependent on fee from selling Omari? on 21:23 - Jul 16 with 2568 views | J2BLUE |
Why wouldn't there be? We have parachute payments and money from the sale of Delap. We don't seem to be on the edge with FFP either. Letting Morsy go is a big sign we are looking to invest. |  |
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| Are new signings dependent on fee from selling Omari? on 21:38 - Jul 16 with 2402 views | SimonBatfordITFC |
| Are new signings dependent on fee from selling Omari? on 21:23 - Jul 16 by J2BLUE |
Why wouldn't there be? We have parachute payments and money from the sale of Delap. We don't seem to be on the edge with FFP either. Letting Morsy go is a big sign we are looking to invest. |
Does the Delap money actually count as profit for this season PSR though? I thought they only paid £20m upfront so there’s not much in the way of profit until the next payment surely. | | | |
| Are new signings dependent on fee from selling Omari? on 21:42 - Jul 16 with 2376 views | Big_Jase |
| Are new signings dependent on fee from selling Omari? on 21:38 - Jul 16 by SimonBatfordITFC |
Does the Delap money actually count as profit for this season PSR though? I thought they only paid £20m upfront so there’s not much in the way of profit until the next payment surely. |
You declare book value for PSR calculations, how much up front only effects cash position which is obviously important but doesn’t come into PSR calcs. |  |
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| Are new signings dependent on fee from selling Omari? on 21:43 - Jul 16 with 2346 views | SimonBatfordITFC |
| Are new signings dependent on fee from selling Omari? on 21:42 - Jul 16 by Big_Jase |
You declare book value for PSR calculations, how much up front only effects cash position which is obviously important but doesn’t come into PSR calcs. |
Interesting. Thanks. | | | |
| Are new signings dependent on fee from selling Omari? on 21:57 - Jul 16 with 2200 views | FrimleyBlue |
| Are new signings dependent on fee from selling Omari? on 21:38 - Jul 16 by SimonBatfordITFC |
Does the Delap money actually count as profit for this season PSR though? I thought they only paid £20m upfront so there’s not much in the way of profit until the next payment surely. |
This is why the omari sale if happens is a massive financial plus
Our fee on him basically in book value works out something like £5 mill
If we sell him for say 35 then that in psr terms I believe at least shows a plus £30 mill inside 12 months as the sale figure counts as a whole figure and not calculated across the term of his contract which a purchase is.
I'm sht at maths so the above may be massively wrong. But it's how I understand it anyway. |  |
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| Are new signings dependent on fee from selling Omari? on 22:01 - Jul 16 with 2135 views | SimonBatfordITFC |
| Are new signings dependent on fee from selling Omari? on 21:57 - Jul 16 by FrimleyBlue |
This is why the omari sale if happens is a massive financial plus
Our fee on him basically in book value works out something like £5 mill
If we sell him for say 35 then that in psr terms I believe at least shows a plus £30 mill inside 12 months as the sale figure counts as a whole figure and not calculated across the term of his contract which a purchase is.
I'm sht at maths so the above may be massively wrong. But it's how I understand it anyway. |
Interesting that we rejected the Brentford bid that was in instalments then if it’s booked immediately. I guess the club must feel confident of achieving a higher bid in the near future in that case. | | | |
| Are new signings dependent on fee from selling Omari? on 22:14 - Jul 16 with 2008 views | jayessess |
| Are new signings dependent on fee from selling Omari? on 21:57 - Jul 16 by FrimleyBlue |
This is why the omari sale if happens is a massive financial plus
Our fee on him basically in book value works out something like £5 mill
If we sell him for say 35 then that in psr terms I believe at least shows a plus £30 mill inside 12 months as the sale figure counts as a whole figure and not calculated across the term of his contract which a purchase is.
I'm sht at maths so the above may be massively wrong. But it's how I understand it anyway. |
The book value is what remains of his fee to be amortised.
We signed OH for £22.5m on a 5 year contract. We'll apparently pay Chelsea £2.5m of the actual profit. So that's now OH's full fee booked as £25m. We take off £5m for the first year amortisation to make his current book value (£20m) and book our profit based on that.
£35m - £20m = £15m book profit for FFP purposes.
Oh, and if we keep him, we'd have had to amortise another £4.5m this season. So you can chuck that in as extra head room for spending this season too. |  |
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| Are new signings dependent on fee from selling Omari? on 22:15 - Jul 16 with 2002 views | PioneerBlue |
The bigger issue more than cash is targeting players that want to come and squad spaces which are at a premium. | |
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| Are new signings dependent on fee from selling Omari? on 22:22 - Jul 16 with 1918 views | burnbudgiesburn |
| Are new signings dependent on fee from selling Omari? on 22:14 - Jul 16 by jayessess |
The book value is what remains of his fee to be amortised.
We signed OH for £22.5m on a 5 year contract. We'll apparently pay Chelsea £2.5m of the actual profit. So that's now OH's full fee booked as £25m. We take off £5m for the first year amortisation to make his current book value (£20m) and book our profit based on that.
£35m - £20m = £15m book profit for FFP purposes.
Oh, and if we keep him, we'd have had to amortise another £4.5m this season. So you can chuck that in as extra head room for spending this season too. |
Are we certain we met all the 'add ons' in the deal to take it up to £22m? I'd be surprised if after 30 odd appearances since signing we hit every add on point.
I remember it being reported as 18-20m + 2-4m add ons (take your pick!) | | | |
| Are new signings dependent on fee from selling Omari? on 08:29 - Jul 17 with 1330 views | OldFart71 |
Why it was good to sell Delap to Chelsea when we did was that the transfer took place before the financial year for fair play rules closed on the 30th of June. Part of the reason I suspect that we made no early move for incoming players when the transfer window opened.
Of course it may make a difference if Omari left, but only in respect of getting a replacement.
If there is a real need to push for promotion this coming season then I cannot see why we would let four midfield players go and one forward and not look to replace them.
Maybe although we have one new midfielder it may be that we don't bring in three more.
I would see us getting one more as a purchase and one as a lone and unless we can get someone that fits in with what we need financially I could see a loan player in the forward line as well. | | | |
| Are new signings dependent on fee from selling Omari? on 08:33 - Jul 17 with 1303 views | Metal_Hacker |
My thoughts this morning being we won’t let Omari go until we’ve got a replacement so ……. |  |
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| Are new signings dependent on fee from selling Omari? on 08:38 - Jul 17 with 1253 views | Herbivore |
Seems highly doubtful, otherwise we'd have accepted Brentford's offer. Much as I'd love to keep him £35m is far from being a low ball offer for him, it's a good fee. If our ability to spend was dependent on selling him, we'd absolutely have accepted that offer. |  |
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| Are new signings dependent on fee from selling Omari? on 08:43 - Jul 17 with 1199 views | LegendofthePhoenix |
From the BBC:
All 20 clubs earn a share of Premier League prize money. The amount each club receives depends on their league position and number of televised matches.
Prize money consists of UK and international merit broadcast payments, equal shares, commercial revenues and facility fees.
All clubs received a central commercial payment of £7.9m and equal shares from UK (£29.8m) and international (£59.2m) revenues.
Clubs are also paid a facility fee for matches broadcast on domestic TV. Liverpool had 30 of their 38 league matches televised - more than any other club.
1st: Liverpool - £174.9m
2nd: Arsenal - £171.5m
3rd: Manchester City - £165.5m
4th: Chelsea - £163.7m
5th: Newcastle United - £160.2m
6th: Aston Villa - £159.3m
7th: Nottingham Forest - £152.5m
8th: Brighton - £145.1m
9th: Bournemouth - £143.4m
10th: Brentford - £138.9m
11th: Fulham - £135.5m
12th: Crystal Palace - £136.1m
13th: Everton - £131.8m
14th: West Ham - £130.9m
15th: Manchester United - £136.2m
16th: Wolves - £123.1m
17th: Tottenham - £127.8m
18th: Leicester - £116.9m
19th: Ipswich Town - £111.1m
20th: Southampton - £109.2m
Then there are parachute payments on top. Obviously the overheads we incurred were huge, and player wages went up enormously. But that has put us in a great position, so we have cash to splash, without selling Omari. [Post edited 17 Jul 8:46]
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| Are new signings dependent on fee from selling Omari? on 08:57 - Jul 17 with 1095 views | _clive_baker_ |
| Are new signings dependent on fee from selling Omari? on 21:57 - Jul 16 by FrimleyBlue |
This is why the omari sale if happens is a massive financial plus
Our fee on him basically in book value works out something like £5 mill
If we sell him for say 35 then that in psr terms I believe at least shows a plus £30 mill inside 12 months as the sale figure counts as a whole figure and not calculated across the term of his contract which a purchase is.
I'm sht at maths so the above may be massively wrong. But it's how I understand it anyway. |
That's not strictly correct.
I think what you're saying is if we buy someone for £20m on a 4 year contract, then £5m is 'unwound' / amortised annually to the P&L for PSR calculations (£20m divided by the length of the contract), which is accurate.
However if we sell him (or anyone else for that matter) we can't carry an asset value on the balance sheet for someone we no longer own and amortise that over future years. Its effectively an asset disposal calculation that takes what we get for him (let's keep the maths simple and say we get £30m after Chelsea take their cut), we would then have to amortise the remainder of his book value immediately (£15m) giving us +£15m of PSR upside in this year, and then nothing moving forward as we've sold him and his registration rights are no longer our asset.
It works the other way too. We paid, what, £8m for Muric. Lets say his book value is still £6m assuming he was a 4 year contract, if we sell him for £4m that a loss on disposal and we would actually take a -£2m hit. Not saying its necessarily the wrong thing to do, but from a PSR point of view that's not going to help us. |  | | |
| Are new signings dependent on fee from selling Omari? on 09:02 - Jul 17 with 1022 views | tractorboy1978 |
| Are new signings dependent on fee from selling Omari? on 08:57 - Jul 17 by _clive_baker_ |
That's not strictly correct.
I think what you're saying is if we buy someone for £20m on a 4 year contract, then £5m is 'unwound' / amortised annually to the P&L for PSR calculations (£20m divided by the length of the contract), which is accurate.
However if we sell him (or anyone else for that matter) we can't carry an asset value on the balance sheet for someone we no longer own and amortise that over future years. Its effectively an asset disposal calculation that takes what we get for him (let's keep the maths simple and say we get £30m after Chelsea take their cut), we would then have to amortise the remainder of his book value immediately (£15m) giving us +£15m of PSR upside in this year, and then nothing moving forward as we've sold him and his registration rights are no longer our asset.
It works the other way too. We paid, what, £8m for Muric. Lets say his book value is still £6m assuming he was a 4 year contract, if we sell him for £4m that a loss on disposal and we would actually take a -£2m hit. Not saying its necessarily the wrong thing to do, but from a PSR point of view that's not going to help us. |
I'd be interested to know if we actually NEED to sell Omari for PSR purposes and what sort of headroom we actually have. If we don't need to sell (which noises seem to be we don't) then I don't understand why we would countenance it. | | | |
| Are new signings dependent on fee from selling Omari? on 09:07 - Jul 17 with 966 views | topguy |
| Are new signings dependent on fee from selling Omari? on 21:38 - Jul 16 by SimonBatfordITFC |
Does the Delap money actually count as profit for this season PSR though? I thought they only paid £20m upfront so there’s not much in the way of profit until the next payment surely. |
and as PSR is a 3 year rolling cycle any losses/profit will affect this year too so if we made profit last year still gives us more headroom this year under PSR | | | |
| Are new signings dependent on fee from selling Omari? on 09:10 - Jul 17 with 940 views | _clive_baker_ |
| Are new signings dependent on fee from selling Omari? on 09:02 - Jul 17 by tractorboy1978 |
I'd be interested to know if we actually NEED to sell Omari for PSR purposes and what sort of headroom we actually have. If we don't need to sell (which noises seem to be we don't) then I don't understand why we would countenance it. |
I'd be interested too. The reality is nobody will be able to reliably answer that as its not publicly available information, and our accounts for season ending June 2025 wont be published for a while so its pure speculation.
My instinct is we probably don't NEED to sell at this stage. We got the Delap deal in to last season so no doubt we're in a healthy spot there, and our league 1 season is now dropping out of the rolling 3 year view moving forward.
Everyone has a price though and it would obviously give us a lot more headroom to do other deals. | | | |
| Are new signings dependent on fee from selling Omari? on 09:10 - Jul 17 with 935 views | Horsham |
| Are new signings dependent on fee from selling Omari? on 08:29 - Jul 17 by OldFart71 |
Why it was good to sell Delap to Chelsea when we did was that the transfer took place before the financial year for fair play rules closed on the 30th of June. Part of the reason I suspect that we made no early move for incoming players when the transfer window opened.
Of course it may make a difference if Omari left, but only in respect of getting a replacement.
If there is a real need to push for promotion this coming season then I cannot see why we would let four midfield players go and one forward and not look to replace them.
Maybe although we have one new midfielder it may be that we don't bring in three more.
I would see us getting one more as a purchase and one as a lone and unless we can get someone that fits in with what we need financially I could see a loan player in the forward line as well. |
Why was it good to get the Delap money in last season’s books? Makes no sense unless you’re saying we without that sale we’d have in breach of PSR and I’m pretty sure that isn’t even remotely likely.
We’re much better making sales with profits in this seasons books. |  | | |
| Are new signings dependent on fee from selling Omari? on 09:27 - Jul 17 with 843 views | SuffolkPunchFC |
| Are new signings dependent on fee from selling Omari? on 09:10 - Jul 17 by Horsham |
Why was it good to get the Delap money in last season’s books? Makes no sense unless you’re saying we without that sale we’d have in breach of PSR and I’m pretty sure that isn’t even remotely likely.
We’re much better making sales with profits in this seasons books. |
My guess (and it's based on a lot of assumptions) is that we didn't need to, and would have preferred it to have been transacted in this financial year, but Chelsea insisted on having him available for the World Club tournament.
Why do I say it would have been better for us to transact it this financial year? Well, I don't think we're at risk of breaching FFP/PSR requirements for 22/23-24/25 without the Delap sale. By transacting it last accounting year, the Delap positive impact will now benefit us for the period 24/25-26/27, and we lost the first year's benefit of that on July 1st.
Had we transacted the Delap sale after July 1st, we would have benefited from the upside for the period 25/26-27/28 - a full extra year of it positively impacting our profit/loss accounting. | | | |
| Are new signings dependent on fee from selling Omari? on 09:44 - Jul 17 with 751 views | monty_radio |
| Are new signings dependent on fee from selling Omari? on 09:27 - Jul 17 by SuffolkPunchFC |
My guess (and it's based on a lot of assumptions) is that we didn't need to, and would have preferred it to have been transacted in this financial year, but Chelsea insisted on having him available for the World Club tournament.
Why do I say it would have been better for us to transact it this financial year? Well, I don't think we're at risk of breaching FFP/PSR requirements for 22/23-24/25 without the Delap sale. By transacting it last accounting year, the Delap positive impact will now benefit us for the period 24/25-26/27, and we lost the first year's benefit of that on July 1st.
Had we transacted the Delap sale after July 1st, we would have benefited from the upside for the period 25/26-27/28 - a full extra year of it positively impacting our profit/loss accounting. |
Was there not some talk of Chelsea paying an extra amount because we let him go before the June 30th deadline, up till which he would have been our player? | |
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| Are new signings dependent on fee from selling Omari? on 09:47 - Jul 17 with 717 views | Herbivore |
| Are new signings dependent on fee from selling Omari? on 09:44 - Jul 17 by monty_radio |
Was there not some talk of Chelsea paying an extra amount because we let him go before the June 30th deadline, up till which he would have been our player? |
Don't think so. They paid £20m up front with £10m to come later which it looks like we agreed to (rather than it all being up front) on the basis of negotiating a sell on. | |
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| Are new signings dependent on fee from selling Omari? on 09:49 - Jul 17 with 710 views | jayessess |
| Are new signings dependent on fee from selling Omari? on 22:22 - Jul 16 by burnbudgiesburn |
Are we certain we met all the 'add ons' in the deal to take it up to £22m? I'd be surprised if after 30 odd appearances since signing we hit every add on point.
I remember it being reported as 18-20m + 2-4m add ons (take your pick!) |
Good point, seen £22m going around as the figure, but if we'd actually paid £18m, the calculation would be.
£17m actual profit
£3.4m to Chelsea.
=
£20.4m booked original fee.
£4.08m year 1 amortised
£16.32m un-amortised fee
Book profit £18.68m
2025-26 amortisation avoided £3.6m**
Extra 2025-26 FFP head room £22.28m
That head room would also be bigger than it seemed, assuming we give 5-year contracts to any big money moves, that would technically enable to you to spend £111.4m in fees without making your FFP position worse this year.*
*You wouldn't do that obviously because the wages would kill you and you'd be on the hook for £22.28m amortisation each of the next 4 years, which could come back and bite you.
**This bit would enable you to spend £14.4m on a player on a 4-year contract and it would be financially neutral because you'd just be matching the payment you made for Omari that was already due to be on the books. [Post edited 17 Jul 9:52]
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| Are new signings dependent on fee from selling Omari? on 09:51 - Jul 17 with 678 views | topguy |
| Are new signings dependent on fee from selling Omari? on 09:10 - Jul 17 by Horsham |
Why was it good to get the Delap money in last season’s books? Makes no sense unless you’re saying we without that sale we’d have in breach of PSR and I’m pretty sure that isn’t even remotely likely.
We’re much better making sales with profits in this seasons books. |
we wouldnt our biggest expenses last year would be wages and it was circa 40m pa and ammourtised transfers was circa 30m we took in 111m from tv alone which simple math says after wages and transfers we were still 40m in the black before other income and expenses and i doubt any of that would result in a 40m net loss so with the sale of delap last year we were prob in a good place anyway. | | | |
| Are new signings dependent on fee from selling Omari? on 10:14 - Jul 17 with 564 views | ArnoldMoorhen |
| Are new signings dependent on fee from selling Omari? on 09:02 - Jul 17 by tractorboy1978 |
I'd be interested to know if we actually NEED to sell Omari for PSR purposes and what sort of headroom we actually have. If we don't need to sell (which noises seem to be we don't) then I don't understand why we would countenance it. |
Reason for not selling Omari: he is our best attacking player, with future upside
Reason for selling Omari: we have several good attacking options
Reason for not selling Omari: most of those options are coming back from serious injuries
Reason for selling Omari: it's the operating model we now follow, and he is the player who has a bid in for him
Reason for not selling Omari: keeping him is a signal of intent to help attract other good young players with potential
Reason for selling Omari: selling him (and Delap) after one season to established Premier League clubs shows that we are great at player development which will help attract other good young players with potential
Reason for not selling Omari: we are solvent and may meet Fair Play requirements without his sale
Reason for selling Omari: £35 million would be enough to bring in two, or possibly three, players who improve the team | | | |
| Are new signings dependent on fee from selling Omari? on 10:24 - Jul 17 with 510 views | SuffolkPunchFC |
| Are new signings dependent on fee from selling Omari? on 09:47 - Jul 17 by Herbivore |
Don't think so. They paid £20m up front with £10m to come later which it looks like we agreed to (rather than it all being up front) on the basis of negotiating a sell on. |
This.
We agreed to not take the £30M as one lumpsum up-front but had a sell-on clause added to the deal. This would have been an entirely separate agreement to the timing. | | | |
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