| The rise of ignorance and misinformation 12:24 - Aug 4 with 8751 views | FromReuserWithLove |
In this country is really frightening and depressing. People quoting Enoch Powell and the likes as fact and the total freedom some feel to be openly racist is quite disturbing. As someone who is of mixed race, I'm genuinely quite worried about where we're heading as a country and as a world. I hope humanity can get a grip on social media and start educating again. [Post edited 4 Aug 2024 13:02]
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| The rise if ignorance and misinformation on 12:33 - Aug 4 with 4949 views | noggin |
They're just ordinary people with very real concerns, apparently 🙄 |  |
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| The rise if ignorance and misinformation on 12:34 - Aug 4 with 4952 views | lowhouseblue |
perhaps social media makes ignorance and misinformation more visible. some people have always been gullible - 'i saw it on facebook' has just replaced 'i heard it in the pub'. idiots have always been attracted to nonsense. |  |
| And so as the loose-bowelled pigeon of time swoops low over the unsuspecting tourist of destiny, and the flatulent skunk of fate wanders into the air-conditioning system of eternity, I notice it's the end of the show |
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| The rise if ignorance and misinformation on 12:39 - Aug 4 with 4907 views | Bobbychase |
My experience last night makes me feel it's going to get worse before it gets better. Was invited to drinks in the city centre as a friend had got a work promotion. One of the protests/rallies was planned for nearby. There were small groups of "stop the boats" types roaming around, mostly just chanting but I did see some chucking cones into the road to stop traffic, for some reason.
Later in the evening as I was walking home there was a small group of Asian lads walking parrallel shouting "alluha Ahkbar" (sorry if I've spelt that wrong) I saw them surround a couple of girls on a hen do and intimidate them before a cop car came past and they moved off.
Further towards home, came across the epicentre of where the stop the boats crowd and the counter protest had clashed outside a hotel that houses asylum seekers. Counted about 40 riot vans, some from forces outside the area, and there was broken glass everywhere. Had to ask a riot cop's permission to walk the final half a mile to home.
Feels like battle lines are drawn and we're going to see a lot more days like yesterday. |  |
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| The rise if ignorance and misinformation on 12:42 - Aug 4 with 4847 views | The_Flashing_Smile |
The social media companies should have a role to play here, and while we want to keep freedom of speech to a certain extent, it doesn't mean freedom of hate speech. So if the social media companies refuse to do anything about it (in some cases they even encourage it) then we need laws being brought in - where the social media company is responsible. Before social media the only way for the public to get their voices heard was through interviews in or letters to newspapers, and those views will obviously have been vetted (and if they weren't then the authorities would come down on the publisher). Something similar needs to happen here.
And in the bigger picture, a better education system. But that obviously takes a long time to filter through. |  |
| Trust the process. Trust Phil. |
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| The rise if ignorance and misinformation on 12:48 - Aug 4 with 4776 views | SuperKieranMcKenna |
Personally I don’t really use any social media - there are more downsides that upsides in my opinion. If you want news, finance, football there’s a wealth of websites out there. In fact football is a good example - usually anything on social media is lowest common denominator type stuff. The racism , hatred (and general abuse) on SM is just encouraged by the anonymity of it, there’s the conspiracy theory type sh1te as well - if you report any of those things it rarely seems to get taken down.
I guess no surprise a platform run by someone as obnoxious as Musk is as toxic as it is, Twitter is as sh1te as the badly built cars he churns out at a loss. |  | | |
| The rise if ignorance and misinformation on 12:49 - Aug 4 with 4777 views | TresBonne |
X in particular is seeming to be a really dangerous platform. I get having a platform where free speech can be obtained, and I support that. However it should not be free of consequences and the misinformation spread on there is absolutely off the charts.
The algorithms on there seem to be absolutely barmy and all. Not once before this week had I ever clicked on a 'far right' page or such, I literally use it for football news and banter all surrounding FOOTBALL, yet my feed is flooded with posts from the far-right! Why?! Because it is the trending thing I assume, so they push it onto my feed too? [Post edited 4 Aug 2024 12:51]
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| The rise if ignorance and misinformation on 12:50 - Aug 4 with 4769 views | J2BLUE |
| The rise if ignorance and misinformation on 12:42 - Aug 4 by The_Flashing_Smile |
The social media companies should have a role to play here, and while we want to keep freedom of speech to a certain extent, it doesn't mean freedom of hate speech. So if the social media companies refuse to do anything about it (in some cases they even encourage it) then we need laws being brought in - where the social media company is responsible. Before social media the only way for the public to get their voices heard was through interviews in or letters to newspapers, and those views will obviously have been vetted (and if they weren't then the authorities would come down on the publisher). Something similar needs to happen here.
And in the bigger picture, a better education system. But that obviously takes a long time to filter through. |
Not sure how it can be regulated. Musk and Trump will move their platforms to some random country and people will just use VPNs to spread the same things. A sort of dark web light.
I really think social media is toxic to society. I said that a few years ago and took quite a bit of stick but I really think we will look back on the creation of social media as a turning point and not for the better. |  |
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| The rise if ignorance and misinformation on 12:50 - Aug 4 with 4762 views | Bobbychase |
| The rise if ignorance and misinformation on 12:49 - Aug 4 by TresBonne |
X in particular is seeming to be a really dangerous platform. I get having a platform where free speech can be obtained, and I support that. However it should not be free of consequences and the misinformation spread on there is absolutely off the charts.
The algorithms on there seem to be absolutely barmy and all. Not once before this week had I ever clicked on a 'far right' page or such, I literally use it for football news and banter all surrounding FOOTBALL, yet my feed is flooded with posts from the far-right! Why?! Because it is the trending thing I assume, so they push it onto my feed too? [Post edited 4 Aug 2024 12:51]
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I think even if people like Musk cared, I don't know they would keep up with the volume of posts. The lies travel very fast these days. | |
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| The rise if ignorance and misinformation on 12:52 - Aug 4 with 4749 views | TresBonne |
| The rise if ignorance and misinformation on 12:50 - Aug 4 by Bobbychase |
I think even if people like Musk cared, I don't know they would keep up with the volume of posts. The lies travel very fast these days. |
Yes you are spot on. It seems to be a never ending spiral of a lack of care that has got entirely out of control and can't be moderated.
It p1sses me off when I log in and see far right misinformation, all these grifters spouting nonsense from each side of the spectrum, followed by Astrid Wett's ham sarnie! I just want to see who Town are in for next...! [Post edited 4 Aug 2024 12:55]
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| The rise if ignorance and misinformation on 12:55 - Aug 4 with 4727 views | Bobbychase |
| The rise if ignorance and misinformation on 12:52 - Aug 4 by TresBonne |
Yes you are spot on. It seems to be a never ending spiral of a lack of care that has got entirely out of control and can't be moderated.
It p1sses me off when I log in and see far right misinformation, all these grifters spouting nonsense from each side of the spectrum, followed by Astrid Wett's ham sarnie! I just want to see who Town are in for next...! [Post edited 4 Aug 2024 12:55]
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It's enough to make someone close all their accounts.
But then it will just be idiots left | |
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| The rise if ignorance and misinformation on 13:01 - Aug 4 with 4659 views | WD19 |
| The rise if ignorance and misinformation on 12:34 - Aug 4 by lowhouseblue |
perhaps social media makes ignorance and misinformation more visible. some people have always been gullible - 'i saw it on facebook' has just replaced 'i heard it in the pub'. idiots have always been attracted to nonsense. |
Whilst I agree with you, I think there is a dangerous difference these days. In the past an idiot in the pub was just an idiot in the pub. Now all the pub idiots are linked by social media and their idiot views are being validated and reinforced by a wider army of idiots. I think that’s the dangerous difference - the idiots now think they have a point because they have found others that agree with them.
Plus the education system and society has broken down to such an extent that there are more idiots to start with. |  | | |
| The rise of ignorance and misinformation on 13:17 - Aug 4 with 4509 views | iamatractorboy |
People always seem to conflate 'free speech' with 'saying whatever I want in public'. Free speech should mean you can protest (peacefully) and criticise the government, authorities, leaders etc without being arrested or facing violence or intimidation from said authorities. It does not mean being able to use someone's website to spout racist hateful rubbish. There is a line and if people cross it they should be banned from sites like X. If you hired out megaphones for people to use, wouldn't you be perfectly justified in taking the megaphone back off someone if they stood on the high street shouting racist stuff at people? Same applies to social media owners. Make the terms and conditions clear. | | | |
| The rise of ignorance and misinformation on 13:21 - Aug 4 with 4473 views | ITFC_Forever |
| The rise of ignorance and misinformation on 13:17 - Aug 4 by iamatractorboy |
People always seem to conflate 'free speech' with 'saying whatever I want in public'. Free speech should mean you can protest (peacefully) and criticise the government, authorities, leaders etc without being arrested or facing violence or intimidation from said authorities. It does not mean being able to use someone's website to spout racist hateful rubbish. There is a line and if people cross it they should be banned from sites like X. If you hired out megaphones for people to use, wouldn't you be perfectly justified in taking the megaphone back off someone if they stood on the high street shouting racist stuff at people? Same applies to social media owners. Make the terms and conditions clear. |
Surely those banging on about free speech have a duty to at least make it accurate…. |  |
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| The rise of ignorance and misinformation on 13:24 - Aug 4 with 4438 views | TresBonne |
| The rise of ignorance and misinformation on 13:17 - Aug 4 by iamatractorboy |
People always seem to conflate 'free speech' with 'saying whatever I want in public'. Free speech should mean you can protest (peacefully) and criticise the government, authorities, leaders etc without being arrested or facing violence or intimidation from said authorities. It does not mean being able to use someone's website to spout racist hateful rubbish. There is a line and if people cross it they should be banned from sites like X. If you hired out megaphones for people to use, wouldn't you be perfectly justified in taking the megaphone back off someone if they stood on the high street shouting racist stuff at people? Same applies to social media owners. Make the terms and conditions clear. |
I wouldn't hold your breath on either of our points about X mind you. The literal owner of it is tweeting absolute rubbish like this...
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| The rise if ignorance and misinformation on 13:25 - Aug 4 with 4430 views | NthQldITFC |
| The rise if ignorance and misinformation on 12:34 - Aug 4 by lowhouseblue |
perhaps social media makes ignorance and misinformation more visible. some people have always been gullible - 'i saw it on facebook' has just replaced 'i heard it in the pub'. idiots have always been attracted to nonsense. |
Maybe, but social media is a MASSIVE magnifier. It's not really just a worse version of the same thing, because the reach and the anonymity and the ease with which the unscrupulous tech savvy can bypass any capacity for internal validation in so many people, young and old. It can be sheer poison, but people will hungrily lap it up, even elderly relatives who used to be meek and mild can turn into rabid racists because they don't understand that not everything that gets fed to them on their smartphone has the authority of the 1950s BBC behind it! |  |
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| The rise if ignorance and misinformation on 13:31 - Aug 4 with 4354 views | lowhouseblue |
| The rise if ignorance and misinformation on 13:01 - Aug 4 by WD19 |
Whilst I agree with you, I think there is a dangerous difference these days. In the past an idiot in the pub was just an idiot in the pub. Now all the pub idiots are linked by social media and their idiot views are being validated and reinforced by a wider army of idiots. I think that’s the dangerous difference - the idiots now think they have a point because they have found others that agree with them.
Plus the education system and society has broken down to such an extent that there are more idiots to start with. |
"Plus the education system and society has broken down to such an extent that there are more idiots to start with." you do know that that's what old people have always said, generation after generation. | |
| And so as the loose-bowelled pigeon of time swoops low over the unsuspecting tourist of destiny, and the flatulent skunk of fate wanders into the air-conditioning system of eternity, I notice it's the end of the show |
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| The rise if ignorance and misinformation on 13:32 - Aug 4 with 4344 views | The_Flashing_Smile |
| The rise if ignorance and misinformation on 12:50 - Aug 4 by J2BLUE |
Not sure how it can be regulated. Musk and Trump will move their platforms to some random country and people will just use VPNs to spread the same things. A sort of dark web light.
I really think social media is toxic to society. I said that a few years ago and took quite a bit of stick but I really think we will look back on the creation of social media as a turning point and not for the better. |
Just forcing it into a dark web lite via VPNs would cut it down massively though, so that would help. At the moment it's too easy, too accessible, no real barriers such as the swear filter on here, the moderation is pretty poor, they're slow to take stuff down... the list just goes on and on.
The authorities seem to be able to clamp down on plenty of other unsavoury stuff so I'm not sure why we couldn't here. If other countries allow it there's not much we can do there, but that shouldn't stop us being the change we want to see. | |
| Trust the process. Trust Phil. |
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| The rise if ignorance and misinformation on 13:34 - Aug 4 with 4288 views | The_Flashing_Smile |
| The rise if ignorance and misinformation on 12:50 - Aug 4 by Bobbychase |
I think even if people like Musk cared, I don't know they would keep up with the volume of posts. The lies travel very fast these days. |
This ought to be the job of AI if ever there was one. Coupled with a delay between posting and it appearing. | |
| Trust the process. Trust Phil. |
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| The rise if ignorance and misinformation on 13:36 - Aug 4 with 4221 views | WD19 |
| The rise if ignorance and misinformation on 13:31 - Aug 4 by lowhouseblue |
"Plus the education system and society has broken down to such an extent that there are more idiots to start with." you do know that that's what old people have always said, generation after generation. |
Perhaps. But I also know what older people around me would have done when I was younger if I had started running around, lobbing bricks and burning things. | | | |
| The rise if ignorance and misinformation on 13:38 - Aug 4 with 4165 views | WD19 |
| The rise if ignorance and misinformation on 13:32 - Aug 4 by The_Flashing_Smile |
Just forcing it into a dark web lite via VPNs would cut it down massively though, so that would help. At the moment it's too easy, too accessible, no real barriers such as the swear filter on here, the moderation is pretty poor, they're slow to take stuff down... the list just goes on and on.
The authorities seem to be able to clamp down on plenty of other unsavoury stuff so I'm not sure why we couldn't here. If other countries allow it there's not much we can do there, but that shouldn't stop us being the change we want to see. |
Harsh on Mark. | | | |
| The rise if ignorance and misinformation on 13:39 - Aug 4 with 4146 views | The_Flashing_Smile |
| The rise if ignorance and misinformation on 12:42 - Aug 4 by The_Flashing_Smile |
The social media companies should have a role to play here, and while we want to keep freedom of speech to a certain extent, it doesn't mean freedom of hate speech. So if the social media companies refuse to do anything about it (in some cases they even encourage it) then we need laws being brought in - where the social media company is responsible. Before social media the only way for the public to get their voices heard was through interviews in or letters to newspapers, and those views will obviously have been vetted (and if they weren't then the authorities would come down on the publisher). Something similar needs to happen here.
And in the bigger picture, a better education system. But that obviously takes a long time to filter through. |
Why the downarrow lowhouse? You don't think SM companies should be held accountable or you don't believe in better education? | |
| Trust the process. Trust Phil. |
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| The rise if ignorance and misinformation on 13:43 - Aug 4 with 4072 views | lowhouseblue |
| The rise if ignorance and misinformation on 12:42 - Aug 4 by The_Flashing_Smile |
The social media companies should have a role to play here, and while we want to keep freedom of speech to a certain extent, it doesn't mean freedom of hate speech. So if the social media companies refuse to do anything about it (in some cases they even encourage it) then we need laws being brought in - where the social media company is responsible. Before social media the only way for the public to get their voices heard was through interviews in or letters to newspapers, and those views will obviously have been vetted (and if they weren't then the authorities would come down on the publisher). Something similar needs to happen here.
And in the bigger picture, a better education system. But that obviously takes a long time to filter through. |
"while we want to keep freedom of speech to a certain extent" ... to a certain extent! would you add 'to a certain extent' to the case for any other human right? 'while we want to prevent discrimination to a certain extent'?? ... all human rights can conflict and there are always balancing exercises to resolve those conflicts. free speech is no different - the law relating to 'hate speech' is that balancing exercise where someone's right to free speech is set against any harms caused. 'hate speech' can already be prosecuted - but it has to be proven to be that, it can't just be people you disagree with or find offensive. for example, people discussing immigration policy, however much you may disagree with their position, is unlikely to amount to 'hate speech'. someone calling for an attack on a mosque probably would. if social media companies more actively vetted content with the threat of prosecution they would err on the side of caution and would take things down just because they were controversial or unpopular or minority views. free speech is a foundational human right - it can be difficult to live with but it doesn't need any caveats any greater than are already in the law. | |
| And so as the loose-bowelled pigeon of time swoops low over the unsuspecting tourist of destiny, and the flatulent skunk of fate wanders into the air-conditioning system of eternity, I notice it's the end of the show |
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| The rise if ignorance and misinformation on 13:50 - Aug 4 with 4015 views | The_Flashing_Smile |
| The rise if ignorance and misinformation on 13:38 - Aug 4 by WD19 |
Harsh on Mark. |
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| Trust the process. Trust Phil. |
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| The rise of ignorance and misinformation on 13:52 - Aug 4 with 3996 views | victorywilhappen |
The news has so many folks waving flags this summer—the Olympics and Euros and now in riots.
Nativism, colonialism (global north & south), flags, and borders are creating a (new) twisted sense of identity & entitlement.
And corporations are making money out of it- division is a commodity for social media. [Post edited 4 Aug 2024 14:00]
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| The rise if ignorance and misinformation on 13:59 - Aug 4 with 3934 views | The_Flashing_Smile |
| The rise if ignorance and misinformation on 13:43 - Aug 4 by lowhouseblue |
"while we want to keep freedom of speech to a certain extent" ... to a certain extent! would you add 'to a certain extent' to the case for any other human right? 'while we want to prevent discrimination to a certain extent'?? ... all human rights can conflict and there are always balancing exercises to resolve those conflicts. free speech is no different - the law relating to 'hate speech' is that balancing exercise where someone's right to free speech is set against any harms caused. 'hate speech' can already be prosecuted - but it has to be proven to be that, it can't just be people you disagree with or find offensive. for example, people discussing immigration policy, however much you may disagree with their position, is unlikely to amount to 'hate speech'. someone calling for an attack on a mosque probably would. if social media companies more actively vetted content with the threat of prosecution they would err on the side of caution and would take things down just because they were controversial or unpopular or minority views. free speech is a foundational human right - it can be difficult to live with but it doesn't need any caveats any greater than are already in the law. |
Jesus, talk about taking what's actually written and twisting it into something completely different!
I qualified what I meant by "to a certain extent", literally in the same sentence "to a certain extent, it doesn't mean freedom of hate speech". How you've conflated that to "prevent discrimination to a certain extent" is beyond me.
I've not remotely suggested people can't discuss immigration - because, erm, that's not hate speech. I've not said anything about "people you disagree with or find offensive".
Ridiculous straw men all over the place. What is wrong with you?
Yes, hate speech is already in law. I'm talking about the application of that law and holding social media companies, as the publishers, more accountable. Of course you can discern the difference between hate speech and just disagreeing with something, if you have the will to do so. | |
| Trust the process. Trust Phil. |
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