| So....the EU are refusing to renegotiate. 16:55 - Aug 6 with 24402 views | homer_123 |
Not surprising I guess.
Anyone think their stance might change as we veer towards Oct? |  |
| |  |
| So....the EU are refusing to renegotiate. on 07:36 - Aug 7 with 3282 views | Steve_M |
| So....the EU are refusing to renegotiate. on 19:30 - Aug 6 by Nthsuffolkblue |
There is one way for the EU to drop the back stop. However, it is to remain in the customs union which certainly will not suit the ERG. One would almost ask, if we are staying in the customs union (and accepting all the regulations that go with it) why leave at all?
The no confidence vote looks almost certain. Would we then get a different (cross-party) grouping form a government or a general election? The hard line leave supporters seem to hope Boris would get to choose a date for an election, would choose after 31st October and we would simply leave without a Government in place to oversee it. I very much doubt that situation would ever be allowed to arise. [Post edited 6 Aug 2019 19:38]
|
Not quite, the customs union covers goods, and in doing so reduces the potential for smuggling across a very open intra-Ireland border, but May always ignored services (as does Corbyn, as does Johnson....) which means that either UK regulatory standards need to stay in line with EU ones or there needs to be checks to ensure that any item exported from the UK to the EU aligns with those standards.
Unfortunately for us many in the Tory party want a regulatory race to the bottom so one advantage of Brexit for them is a weakening of EU food and environmental standards. Remember all those sewage covered British beaches int he 80s?
And the backstop is only the most obvious obstacle, remove that and the ERG will be moaning about us paying already agreed obligations to the EU and demanding we don't pay it next. |  |
| |
| So....the EU are refusing to renegotiate. on 07:46 - Aug 7 with 3261 views | TractorWood |
| So....the EU are refusing to renegotiate. on 19:21 - Aug 6 by gordon |
The chances of the EU changing it's position on the backstop have got to be pretty much zero. Whether we're genuinely committed to our own self-destruction, or just bluffing, I've no idea. I imagine Boris's plan doesn't really go much further than where we are now.
I guess we're going to see a no-confidence vote succeed in September, and then there are quite a few different outcomes possible.. |
They need to hurry up with a no confidence. If it leads to a GE then that needs 5 weeks grace. The default position by law will be no deal on 31/10/19 if we don't have a government.
All indications are that Boris and compare charging ahead with a deal ideally but seems unlikely so hence the prep for no deal.
It's so frustrating that this fringe issue that people have used as escapism is such a distraction from education, investment in infrastructure and sorting the NHS out. |  |
| |
| So....the EU are refusing to renegotiate. on 07:54 - Aug 7 with 3241 views | GlasgowBlue |
| So....the EU are refusing to renegotiate. on 07:46 - Aug 7 by TractorWood |
They need to hurry up with a no confidence. If it leads to a GE then that needs 5 weeks grace. The default position by law will be no deal on 31/10/19 if we don't have a government.
All indications are that Boris and compare charging ahead with a deal ideally but seems unlikely so hence the prep for no deal.
It's so frustrating that this fringe issue that people have used as escapism is such a distraction from education, investment in infrastructure and sorting the NHS out. |
There is a very interesting piece here from Toby Young in the possible scenarios a VOC bring up.
https://blogs.spectator.co.uk/2019/08/should-brexiteers-try-and-form-an-electora |  |
| |
| So....the EU are refusing to renegotiate. on 08:21 - Aug 7 with 3209 views | Herbivore |
The BBC are shocking, they just had some nobber being interviewed banging on about German cars and not being bullied. No challenge to him at all. He even said that politicians and the media are detached from reality, because they are ignoring that we buy German cars. Nobody even pointed out the irony of this idiot claiming that others are detached from reality. |  |
| |
| So....the EU are refusing to renegotiate. on 08:26 - Aug 7 with 3196 views | Pinewoodblue |
| So....the EU are refusing to renegotiate. on 07:46 - Aug 7 by TractorWood |
They need to hurry up with a no confidence. If it leads to a GE then that needs 5 weeks grace. The default position by law will be no deal on 31/10/19 if we don't have a government.
All indications are that Boris and compare charging ahead with a deal ideally but seems unlikely so hence the prep for no deal.
It's so frustrating that this fringe issue that people have used as escapism is such a distraction from education, investment in infrastructure and sorting the NHS out. |
There is even less time than that. After a vote of no confidence 14 days are allowed to give others a chance to form a government that thr HoC can approve. Thr five week period begins after that. If the vot of no confidence is any later thsn the first week after recall it will be too late.
We would probably leave the EU One hour after polling stations close. Government cannot make any controversial decisions in those five weeks either so couldn't postpone Brexit as that would be contrary to the law which still dictates we leave 11pm on 31st October. |  |
| |
| So....the EU are refusing to renegotiate. on 09:00 - Aug 7 with 3170 views | manchego |
| So....the EU are refusing to renegotiate. on 08:21 - Aug 7 by Herbivore |
The BBC are shocking, they just had some nobber being interviewed banging on about German cars and not being bullied. No challenge to him at all. He even said that politicians and the media are detached from reality, because they are ignoring that we buy German cars. Nobody even pointed out the irony of this idiot claiming that others are detached from reality. |
Sir Digby Jones. He's a full time Brexit blowhard.
Still with the "German car manufacturers will come running to us"
They only have the rest of the entire planet to sell to. |  | | |
| So....the EU are refusing to renegotiate. on 09:00 - Aug 7 with 3171 views | Steve_M |
So the UK nearly managed to agree a favourable trade deal with Canada then offered to cut tariffs globally in the event of a no deal Brexit and scuppered it:
https://www.cbc.ca/news/politics/canada-uk-trade-boris-wednesday-1.5221984
This is incredibly damning and confirms the complete lack of seriousness from the top of the Tory party. | |
| |
| So....the EU are refusing to renegotiate. on 09:04 - Aug 7 with 3164 views | eastwell_blue |
Toby Young...interesting? Never seen those words in the same sentence before. Vile bigot ...is that what you meant? |  | | |
Login to get fewer ads
| So....the EU are refusing to renegotiate. on 09:04 - Aug 7 with 3166 views | manchego |
| So....the EU are refusing to renegotiate. on 09:00 - Aug 7 by Steve_M |
So the UK nearly managed to agree a favourable trade deal with Canada then offered to cut tariffs globally in the event of a no deal Brexit and scuppered it:
https://www.cbc.ca/news/politics/canada-uk-trade-boris-wednesday-1.5221984
This is incredibly damning and confirms the complete lack of seriousness from the top of the Tory party. |
Killer quotes:
"Yes, the U.K. is an important and large market, but any negotiator sitting down with them would recognize that there's a different level of desperation with the Brits."
"Why negotiate with people who change their mind on a daily basis? And who likely won't be around to close off any deal? That's what it's come down to," Langrish said. | | | |
| So....the EU are refusing to renegotiate. on 09:06 - Aug 7 with 3158 views | BlueBadger |
| So....the EU are refusing to renegotiate. on 01:31 - Aug 7 by The_Last_Baron |
Bring on a WTO exit. The UK will thrive without the dead weight of the EU sucking it dry like a parasite. |
Idle question - if WTO terms are *that* great why does every trading nation on the planet seek alternative arrangements? [Post edited 7 Aug 2019 12:49]
|  |
| |
| So....the EU are refusing to renegotiate. on 09:09 - Aug 7 with 3150 views | Swansea_Blue |
| So....the EU are refusing to renegotiate. on 09:00 - Aug 7 by Steve_M |
So the UK nearly managed to agree a favourable trade deal with Canada then offered to cut tariffs globally in the event of a no deal Brexit and scuppered it:
https://www.cbc.ca/news/politics/canada-uk-trade-boris-wednesday-1.5221984
This is incredibly damning and confirms the complete lack of seriousness from the top of the Tory party. |
Amateurs aren't they. And we're expected to believe they're going to lead us to the sunlit uplands. Lolz. |  |
| |
| So....the EU are refusing to renegotiate. on 09:26 - Aug 7 with 3118 views | flimflam |
| So....the EU are refusing to renegotiate. on 08:26 - Aug 7 by Pinewoodblue |
There is even less time than that. After a vote of no confidence 14 days are allowed to give others a chance to form a government that thr HoC can approve. Thr five week period begins after that. If the vot of no confidence is any later thsn the first week after recall it will be too late.
We would probably leave the EU One hour after polling stations close. Government cannot make any controversial decisions in those five weeks either so couldn't postpone Brexit as that would be contrary to the law which still dictates we leave 11pm on 31st October. |
Someone understands at last.
We leave on 31st with or without a deal. If the EU will not budge then it is no deal.
There is no time left to change anything and the only 2 ways to stop Brexit is a change of government or a change of law. Neither will happen and its also part of EU law which trumps ours so not entirely in our hands anyway.
A vote of no confidence will simply be ignored by Boris.
He simply has to do nothing and we leave. Simple. |  |
| All men and women are created, by the, you know the, you know the thing. |
| |
| So....the EU are refusing to renegotiate. on 09:31 - Aug 7 with 3108 views | Herbivore |
| So....the EU are refusing to renegotiate. on 09:26 - Aug 7 by flimflam |
Someone understands at last.
We leave on 31st with or without a deal. If the EU will not budge then it is no deal.
There is no time left to change anything and the only 2 ways to stop Brexit is a change of government or a change of law. Neither will happen and its also part of EU law which trumps ours so not entirely in our hands anyway.
A vote of no confidence will simply be ignored by Boris.
He simply has to do nothing and we leave. Simple. |
So you're cool with one individual overriding parliamentary democracy? | |
| |
| So....the EU are refusing to renegotiate. on 09:50 - Aug 7 with 3075 views | Pinewoodblue |
| So....the EU are refusing to renegotiate. on 09:26 - Aug 7 by flimflam |
Someone understands at last.
We leave on 31st with or without a deal. If the EU will not budge then it is no deal.
There is no time left to change anything and the only 2 ways to stop Brexit is a change of government or a change of law. Neither will happen and its also part of EU law which trumps ours so not entirely in our hands anyway.
A vote of no confidence will simply be ignored by Boris.
He simply has to do nothing and we leave. Simple. |
Ironic that 31st October is a date insisted on by EU. Didn't May want it to be 31st December. | |
| |
| So....the EU are refusing to renegotiate. on 09:52 - Aug 7 with 3069 views | Pinewoodblue |
| So....the EU are refusing to renegotiate. on 09:31 - Aug 7 by Herbivore |
So you're cool with one individual overriding parliamentary democracy? |
All Boris is doing is use the rules to his advantage. It isn't a question of ignoring democracy. | |
| |
| So....the EU are refusing to renegotiate. on 10:01 - Aug 7 with 3057 views | Steve_M |
| So....the EU are refusing to renegotiate. on 09:09 - Aug 7 by Swansea_Blue |
Amateurs aren't they. And we're expected to believe they're going to lead us to the sunlit uplands. Lolz. |
Yep, and when all the other benefits prove equally illusory what then? The UK will have trashed its reputation and economy for the benefit of a small number of already wealthy people. | |
| |
| So....the EU are refusing to renegotiate. on 10:08 - Aug 7 with 3045 views | GlasgowBlue |
| So....the EU are refusing to renegotiate. on 09:04 - Aug 7 by eastwell_blue |
Toby Young...interesting? Never seen those words in the same sentence before. Vile bigot ...is that what you meant? |
Your first post since November 2018. You shouldn’t have bothered.
But you demonstrate why it’s impossible to have a reasonable debate on this subject. Some people prefer to shoot the messenger and ignore the message.
Forget who is writing the article, it raises some interesting points re what could happen in the event of a VOC. and it’s from somebody reasonably close to the leadership so understands the mindset.
Steve Bannon is a vile racists bigot but I’d read with interest what he has to say about the inner workings at his time in the White House. [Post edited 7 Aug 2019 10:16]
| |
| |
| So....the EU are refusing to renegotiate. on 10:13 - Aug 7 with 3029 views | DanTheMan |
| So....the EU are refusing to renegotiate. on 10:01 - Aug 7 by Steve_M |
Yep, and when all the other benefits prove equally illusory what then? The UK will have trashed its reputation and economy for the benefit of a small number of already wealthy people. |
It doesn't matter anymore, just find something else to blame and the cycle continues.
Doesn't have to be true, you just need to lie enough so that nothing sticks. |  |
| |
| So....the EU are refusing to renegotiate. on 10:15 - Aug 7 with 3016 views | Herbivore |
| So....the EU are refusing to renegotiate. on 09:52 - Aug 7 by Pinewoodblue |
All Boris is doing is use the rules to his advantage. It isn't a question of ignoring democracy. |
He's talking about ignoring the will of Parliament in order to force through a policy that has not been agreed by Parliament and that has no meaningful mandate. That is the very definition of ignoring democracy. | |
| |
| So....the EU are refusing to renegotiate. on 10:18 - Aug 7 with 3000 views | flimflam |
| So....the EU are refusing to renegotiate. on 09:31 - Aug 7 by Herbivore |
So you're cool with one individual overriding parliamentary democracy? |
Not really but was not really cool about the result of the first referendum pretty much being ignored also but do not feel the need to go on and on about it on here on a daily basis. | |
| All men and women are created, by the, you know the, you know the thing. |
| |
| So....the EU are refusing to renegotiate. on 10:21 - Aug 7 with 2986 views | footers |
| So....the EU are refusing to renegotiate. on 10:18 - Aug 7 by flimflam |
Not really but was not really cool about the result of the first referendum pretty much being ignored also but do not feel the need to go on and on about it on here on a daily basis. |
We didn't ignore the result of the first referendum. We joined the EEC. |  |
| |
| So....the EU are refusing to renegotiate. on 10:26 - Aug 7 with 2970 views | flimflam |
| So....the EU are refusing to renegotiate. on 10:21 - Aug 7 by footers |
We didn't ignore the result of the first referendum. We joined the EEC. |
I apologise for speaking balderdash my friend. | |
| All men and women are created, by the, you know the, you know the thing. |
| |
| So....the EU are refusing to renegotiate. on 10:27 - Aug 7 with 2966 views | footers |
| So....the EU are refusing to renegotiate. on 10:26 - Aug 7 by flimflam |
I apologise for speaking balderdash my friend. |
No problem. Just ensure it doesn't happen again. | |
| |
| So....the EU are refusing to renegotiate. on 10:29 - Aug 7 with 2957 views | Herbivore |
| So....the EU are refusing to renegotiate. on 10:18 - Aug 7 by flimflam |
Not really but was not really cool about the result of the first referendum pretty much being ignored also but do not feel the need to go on and on about it on here on a daily basis. |
We negotiated a withdrawal agreement so we could leave in March as per the referendum result so no, the referendum wasn't ignored. If you're unhappy that we didn't leave then take it up with the no deal Brexiteers in the ERG who blocked the withdrawal agreement getting through parliament. The fact that parliament has rejected our negotiated exit doesn't mean there is a mandate to ignore the will of Parliament and leave without a deal. | |
| |
| So....the EU are refusing to renegotiate. on 10:35 - Aug 7 with 2934 views | flimflam |
| So....the EU are refusing to renegotiate. on 10:29 - Aug 7 by Herbivore |
We negotiated a withdrawal agreement so we could leave in March as per the referendum result so no, the referendum wasn't ignored. If you're unhappy that we didn't leave then take it up with the no deal Brexiteers in the ERG who blocked the withdrawal agreement getting through parliament. The fact that parliament has rejected our negotiated exit doesn't mean there is a mandate to ignore the will of Parliament and leave without a deal. |
So you really believe that the will of the sitting MP's was to allow Brexit to happen.
So there are no MPs who openly wish to stop Brexit altogether regardless of the result of the referendum and also state they would continue to ignore any future results?
Thats what I call undemocratic. Simply running down the clock to allow the referendum result to be honoured and on our terms and not the EU's is the right thing to do and certainly not undemocratic.
Yes the ERG prevented it going through previously but it was not Brexit, or at least the Brexit that I voted for as was half in half out shake it all about. | |
| All men and women are created, by the, you know the, you know the thing. |
| |
| |
By continuing to use the site, you agree to our use of cookies and to abide by our Terms and Conditions.
