| Masks post July 19 08:05 - Jul 5 with 9512 views | bluelagos |
Appears that the mandatory wearing of masks will be replaced by personal choice with govt guidance to wear them in enclosed busy places.
One obviously enclosed busy place is public transport, tubes, trains etc.
Playbook reported that TFL could retain masks as a condition of entry but it seems unlikely and would be unforecable imho.
So, is there a case for mask carriages, say 2 per tube, where you are expected to wear one. Would give those anxious or vulnerable the ability to travel as they choose and those who wish not to wear a mask the opportunity to do so without impacting on others by choosing a different carriage.
Good idea or as crp as my alternative days idea for pubs ? (Cv passport) [Post edited 5 Jul 2021 8:12]
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| Masks post July 19 on 15:10 - Jul 5 with 1600 views | bluelagos |
Clearly there are people who will continue wearing masks whatever and people who won't. So irrespective of what the govt. position should be, we will have the same issues whilst attending Portman Road in a little over 5 weeks time?
Presumably we risk a number of potential fans not attending if say 75% of fans don't mask up during the game. But if we had a couple of blocks (Or more if they sold out) where masks were mandatory, then everyone would be happy? | |
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| Masks post July 19 on 15:28 - Jul 5 with 1563 views | WeWereZombies |
| Masks post July 19 on 15:10 - Jul 5 by bluelagos |
Clearly there are people who will continue wearing masks whatever and people who won't. So irrespective of what the govt. position should be, we will have the same issues whilst attending Portman Road in a little over 5 weeks time?
Presumably we risk a number of potential fans not attending if say 75% of fans don't mask up during the game. But if we had a couple of blocks (Or more if they sold out) where masks were mandatory, then everyone would be happy? |
Not really - you still have the issue of people singing in close proximity to others...OK, two blocks in Churchmans it is... [Post edited 5 Jul 2021 19:30]
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| Masks post July 19 on 15:36 - Jul 5 with 1551 views | bluelagos |
| Masks post July 19 on 15:28 - Jul 5 by WeWereZombies |
Not really - you still have the issue of people singing in close proximity to others...OK, two blocks in Churchmans it is... [Post edited 5 Jul 2021 19:30]
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You may have stumbled on the reason, the need for social distancing is behind our slower than hoped new signings this summer. | |
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| Masks post July 19 on 15:37 - Jul 5 with 1549 views | WeWereZombies |
| Masks post July 19 on 15:08 - Jul 5 by StokieBlue |
Fair enough.
Given the responses you might want to work on your sarcastic posts :).
SB |
Get away with you, that post flaunted sarcasm to a level that 'Priscilla, Queen of the Desert' flaunted camp standing up on the rear seat of a bus with the gown flowing behind in the wind. | |
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| Masks post July 19 on 16:43 - Jul 5 with 1515 views | blueblueburleymcgrew |
| Masks post July 19 on 12:09 - Jul 5 by StokieBlue |
That's not really what I said.
We will have to live with it at some stage but lets not make equivalences with other diseases (flu for instance), without a working vaccine a lot of people will die of C19 and even with a working vaccine some will die.
If me wearing a mask whilst in a confined area such as public transports reduces that death toll by a good percentage then I'm happy to do it. The fact you think a personal choice not to wear one is as important as saving lives is something I don't agree with given wearing a mask is really not a big issue.
In the end, if your actions are affecting others it's perhaps always a good time to stop and reflect on those actions.
SB [Post edited 5 Jul 2021 12:10]
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Did you previously or will you now wear a mask through the flu season to protect vulnerable people?
My actions have so far been in complete acquiescence with the guidelines and the rules and I will continue to do so to protect myself and others, if the guidance changes then I will reflect on the new advice and make a judgement call based on the facts and evidence presented. |  | | |
| Masks post July 19 on 16:50 - Jul 5 with 1512 views | StokieBlue |
| Masks post July 19 on 16:43 - Jul 5 by blueblueburleymcgrew |
Did you previously or will you now wear a mask through the flu season to protect vulnerable people?
My actions have so far been in complete acquiescence with the guidelines and the rules and I will continue to do so to protect myself and others, if the guidance changes then I will reflect on the new advice and make a judgement call based on the facts and evidence presented. |
Can we please stop it with the flu false equivalences? It's beyond annoying now.
Seasonal Flu has a R of about 1.3 in comparison to the delta variants 6+ and the mortality rate is far lower for flu than it is for C19. There is no comparison to be had between the viruses and I thought we were past making them about 16 months ago.
It's actually a very good idea for everyone to wear masks over the winter period to reduce transmission of all respiratory diseases. There has been virtually no flu this year because restrictions in place for C19 will nearly always stop flu given the lower R. I would actually support the wearing of masks on transport and in specified enclosed areas in the winter.
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| Avatar - IC410 - Tadpoles Nebula |
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| Masks post July 19 on 16:55 - Jul 5 with 1497 views | Steve_M |
Just for info:
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| Masks post July 19 on 16:58 - Jul 5 with 1490 views | blueblueburleymcgrew |
| Masks post July 19 on 16:50 - Jul 5 by StokieBlue |
Can we please stop it with the flu false equivalences? It's beyond annoying now.
Seasonal Flu has a R of about 1.3 in comparison to the delta variants 6+ and the mortality rate is far lower for flu than it is for C19. There is no comparison to be had between the viruses and I thought we were past making them about 16 months ago.
It's actually a very good idea for everyone to wear masks over the winter period to reduce transmission of all respiratory diseases. There has been virtually no flu this year because restrictions in place for C19 will nearly always stop flu given the lower R. I would actually support the wearing of masks on transport and in specified enclosed areas in the winter.
SB |
Are your mortality rates based on an largely unvaccinated public or has the impact of the vaccines been taken in to account?
I ask that honestly as I really don’t know the answer,. | | | |
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| Masks post July 19 on 17:06 - Jul 5 with 1470 views | lowhouseblue |
| Masks post July 19 on 16:50 - Jul 5 by StokieBlue |
Can we please stop it with the flu false equivalences? It's beyond annoying now.
Seasonal Flu has a R of about 1.3 in comparison to the delta variants 6+ and the mortality rate is far lower for flu than it is for C19. There is no comparison to be had between the viruses and I thought we were past making them about 16 months ago.
It's actually a very good idea for everyone to wear masks over the winter period to reduce transmission of all respiratory diseases. There has been virtually no flu this year because restrictions in place for C19 will nearly always stop flu given the lower R. I would actually support the wearing of masks on transport and in specified enclosed areas in the winter.
SB |
the comparison is between flu and covid within a population which will soon be 86% vaccinated. what you say was right 16 months ago but vaccines have changed that situation hugely. |  |
| And so as the loose-bowelled pigeon of time swoops low over the unsuspecting tourist of destiny, and the flatulent skunk of fate wanders into the air-conditioning system of eternity, I notice it's the end of the show |
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| Masks post July 19 on 17:07 - Jul 5 with 1470 views | Seablu |
| Masks post July 19 on 14:09 - Jul 5 by StokieBlue |
Interesting.
So what if the scientific advisors disagree with the government but the government ignore them and press ahead with no masks anyway?
Because that's the exact position we are in at the moment, the scientists don't think mask wearing should be removed as a rule.
So what is your position now?
SB |
I admire your patience, but it really is like trying to explain the rules of chess to an amoeba. |  | | |
| Masks post July 19 on 17:16 - Jul 5 with 1448 views | The_Last_Baron |
| Masks post July 19 on 13:59 - Jul 5 by StokieBlue |
I'd wager that someone is abused on the 19th July for wearing a mask. I hope not but I think it's almost a certainty.
Why wouldn't you wear a mask in certain situations to protect others? Is their health not important? Do you only ever do things that are mandatory to help others?
I honestly don't understand the mindset of a good proportion of people in this country. It makes absolutely no sense to me. Perhaps it's me.
SB |
Wear a mask. Double up if you want. However you're out of luck if you believe you have the right to enforce this unhygienic practice on others. |  |
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| Masks post July 19 on 17:38 - Jul 5 with 1415 views | tonybied |
| Masks post July 19 on 17:16 - Jul 5 by The_Last_Baron |
Wear a mask. Double up if you want. However you're out of luck if you believe you have the right to enforce this unhygienic practice on others. |
Unhygienic? Care to elaborate on why you feel face masks are unhygienic? [Post edited 5 Jul 2021 17:40]
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| Masks post July 19 on 17:38 - Jul 5 with 1415 views | StokieBlue |
| Masks post July 19 on 17:16 - Jul 5 by The_Last_Baron |
Wear a mask. Double up if you want. However you're out of luck if you believe you have the right to enforce this unhygienic practice on others. |
Who is trying to enforce it? I've simply said they shouldn't be changing the mask rules in confined spaces. It's the same stance as the experts although we know you don't like listening to experts.
How is it unhygienic - that's a properly weird take on things.
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| Avatar - IC410 - Tadpoles Nebula |
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| Masks post July 19 on 17:43 - Jul 5 with 1396 views | StokieBlue |
| Masks post July 19 on 17:06 - Jul 5 by lowhouseblue |
the comparison is between flu and covid within a population which will soon be 86% vaccinated. what you say was right 16 months ago but vaccines have changed that situation hugely. |
It's still a false equivalence. It's the comparison of one virus with heavy vaccinations against one we barely vaccinate against as a country. The worry is that the equivalence will continue to be pushed and when people need boosters or another vaccination they will decide it's just like flu and not bother.
There is definitely some truth in the fact that vaccines have changed the picture around C19 but we are quite a way from 86% double vaccinated (which is important as you know) and the efficacy of the vaccine is already being lowered considerably by the latest variants.
I don't see why wearing a mask in certain limited situations is an issue given it will reduce the spread of C19 and hugely reduce the spread of less infectious respiratory diseases.
I simply don't understand why some people are so completely against wearing a small mask for a small amount of time in a few scenarios.
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| Avatar - IC410 - Tadpoles Nebula |
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| Masks post July 19 on 17:44 - Jul 5 with 1394 views | StokieBlue |
| Masks post July 19 on 16:58 - Jul 5 by blueblueburleymcgrew |
Are your mortality rates based on an largely unvaccinated public or has the impact of the vaccines been taken in to account?
I ask that honestly as I really don’t know the answer,. |
That is certainly a valid point, it's based on an unvaccinated public (although we will need to wait for longer to confirm that) but it's also comparing a virus which has been vaccinated for against one which hasn't.
My worry is that if people make this equivalence they might not get vaccinated in the future because "it's just like flu" and once you're not vaccinated it's absolutely nothing like flu.
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| Avatar - IC410 - Tadpoles Nebula |
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| Masks post July 19 on 17:47 - Jul 5 with 1388 views | gordon |
| Masks post July 19 on 17:43 - Jul 5 by StokieBlue |
It's still a false equivalence. It's the comparison of one virus with heavy vaccinations against one we barely vaccinate against as a country. The worry is that the equivalence will continue to be pushed and when people need boosters or another vaccination they will decide it's just like flu and not bother.
There is definitely some truth in the fact that vaccines have changed the picture around C19 but we are quite a way from 86% double vaccinated (which is important as you know) and the efficacy of the vaccine is already being lowered considerably by the latest variants.
I don't see why wearing a mask in certain limited situations is an issue given it will reduce the spread of C19 and hugely reduce the spread of less infectious respiratory diseases.
I simply don't understand why some people are so completely against wearing a small mask for a small amount of time in a few scenarios.
SB |
The anti-mask thing is incredibly, incredibly stupid - it's such a small sacrifice to make to reduce the need for future restrictions / lockdowns, and reduce the amount of future deaths and hospitalisations. |  | | |
| Masks post July 19 on 18:03 - Jul 5 with 1362 views | Seablu |
| Masks post July 19 on 17:38 - Jul 5 by tonybied |
Unhygienic? Care to elaborate on why you feel face masks are unhygienic? [Post edited 5 Jul 2021 17:40]
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He won’t and he can’t.
He’ll be half way down another rabbit hole on twitter by now. | | | |
| Masks post July 19 on 18:09 - Jul 5 with 1353 views | Ewan_Oozami |
| Masks post July 19 on 17:16 - Jul 5 by The_Last_Baron |
Wear a mask. Double up if you want. However you're out of luck if you believe you have the right to enforce this unhygienic practice on others. |
"Unhygenic"? |  |
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| Masks post July 19 on 18:36 - Jul 5 with 1334 views | jaykay |
dear god do you need to be told what the consequences are. i expect you needed to be told what will happened if you didn't wear a seat belt and the drinking driving laws came into effect. its not your own safety but others as well |  |
| forensic experts say footers and spruces fingerprints were not found at the scene after the weekends rows |
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| Masks post July 19 on 18:49 - Jul 5 with 1321 views | lowhouseblue |
| Masks post July 19 on 17:43 - Jul 5 by StokieBlue |
It's still a false equivalence. It's the comparison of one virus with heavy vaccinations against one we barely vaccinate against as a country. The worry is that the equivalence will continue to be pushed and when people need boosters or another vaccination they will decide it's just like flu and not bother.
There is definitely some truth in the fact that vaccines have changed the picture around C19 but we are quite a way from 86% double vaccinated (which is important as you know) and the efficacy of the vaccine is already being lowered considerably by the latest variants.
I don't see why wearing a mask in certain limited situations is an issue given it will reduce the spread of C19 and hugely reduce the spread of less infectious respiratory diseases.
I simply don't understand why some people are so completely against wearing a small mask for a small amount of time in a few scenarios.
SB |
86% first dose, 64% second dose. time wise we're not far off getting to 86% fully vaccinated.
i agree entirely that we need to keep up vigilance against covid and it will all go wrong if boosters are needed and we have a low take up.
clearly prior to vaccination there was no equivalence. but GIVEN the high rate of vaccination in terms of the likely number of deaths going forward, seasonal flu and covid are now comparable. in policy terms from this point the they have similarly severe public health impacts. we don't shut down the economy because of seasonal flu and the case for continuing to do that in the case of covid is now weak.
but wearing face coverings isn't shutting down the economy. making that still mandatory on transport etc seems uncontroversial to me. if people continue to follow hands, face, space, stay at home when they have symptoms, and wear face coverings appropriately we may find that seasonal flu, and associated deaths, actually fall in future. | |
| And so as the loose-bowelled pigeon of time swoops low over the unsuspecting tourist of destiny, and the flatulent skunk of fate wanders into the air-conditioning system of eternity, I notice it's the end of the show |
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| Masks post July 19 on 19:04 - Jul 5 with 1309 views | jeera |
| Masks post July 19 on 17:16 - Jul 5 by The_Last_Baron |
Wear a mask. Double up if you want. However you're out of luck if you believe you have the right to enforce this unhygienic practice on others. |
I think you are confusing masks with handkerchiefs.
Besides, I don't think most people have been using the same one for all this time.
They can be bought in packs of 3/5 etc and washed after each use.
It's fine really. Just don't blow your nose on them, you can buy disposable tissues for that.
All good. [Post edited 5 Jul 2021 19:06]
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| Masks post July 19 on 19:46 - Jul 5 with 1267 views | 26_Paz |
| Masks post July 19 on 17:07 - Jul 5 by Seablu |
I admire your patience, but it really is like trying to explain the rules of chess to an amoeba. |
There really is no need to be quite so rude. |  |
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| Masks post July 19 on 20:21 - Jul 5 with 1235 views | Swansea_Blue |
| Masks post July 19 on 14:16 - Jul 5 by 26_Paz |
I’d have to think about it if and when that happens. I might just carry one and wear it if somewhere is particularly crowded |
It's happened. https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/av/uk-57728218
Whitty's unofficial ground rules for himself:
Wear a mask when:
1. In any situation indoors and crowded or in close proximity to other people, especially now that the epidemic is significant and rising
2. Required by any competent authority
3. Someone else was uncomfortable about a lack of mask wearing, so as a matter of courtesy
Food for thought really - as they've emphasised the importance of mask wearing, despite the contradictory messaging in the relaxation of all legal controls. |  |
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| Masks post July 19 on 20:25 - Jul 5 with 1229 views | syntaxerror |
| Masks post July 19 on 09:42 - Jul 5 by StokieBlue |
Indeed, although it will make some difference. Every element you remove from the restrictions allows C19 to spread at closer to it's natural R value which is now >6 for the Delta variant. Vaccines will reduce that due to a lower viral load but we are still looking at a virus which is far more transmissible than it was when it emerged 18 months ago.
I would also question if people are still really wearing their masks at the moment, I see a good proportion who have totally stopped in shops etc already and certainly on transport it seems to have gone right out the window.
Nothing we can do now, the Tories have made their decision based on what they feel are the import factors so we will just wait and see how things turn out over the next 6 weeks or so. It's definitely possible things will tick along fine with no increase in hospitalisation.
SB [Post edited 5 Jul 2021 9:48]
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Would these important factors be Boris realising he has to keep the back-benchers happy after Hancock's half hour of infamy? |  | | |
| Masks post July 19 on 20:27 - Jul 5 with 1222 views | dickie |
| Masks post July 19 on 17:16 - Jul 5 by The_Last_Baron |
Wear a mask. Double up if you want. However you're out of luck if you believe you have the right to enforce this unhygienic practice on others. |
The human race is still just a bunch of dumb apes |  | | |
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