| Hypothetically speaking 10:31 - Feb 22 with 18209 views | blueasfook |
On the remote chance that labour had won the election...
I wonder what noises Comrade Corbyn would be making to the Russians over their illegal invasion of Ukraine.
He would probably side with them and wish them well. |  |
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| Hypothetically speaking on 19:02 - Feb 22 with 1571 views | lowhouseblue |
this is easy just look at the weasely words and excuses that dk comes out with and there you have it. |  |
| And so as the loose-bowelled pigeon of time swoops low over the unsuspecting tourist of destiny, and the flatulent skunk of fate wanders into the air-conditioning system of eternity, I notice it's the end of the show |
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| Hypothetically speaking on 19:19 - Feb 22 with 1513 views | ArnoldMoorhen |
| Hypothetically speaking on 10:48 - Feb 22 by BloomBlue |
Definitely a fifth columnist |
And yet it was Boris who, whilst Foreign Secretary, flew to the Italian mansion of a Russian billionaire, without his police close protection officers, or any Civil Servants taking notes or minutes, as is standard practice when a Minister has a meeting with foreign nationals abroad. |  | | |
| Hypothetically speaking on 19:23 - Feb 22 with 1501 views | Seablu |
| Hypothetically speaking on 19:02 - Feb 22 by lowhouseblue |
this is easy just look at the weasely words and excuses that dk comes out with and there you have it. |
Wondered when you’d get the nudge from the dishonourable member up north.
He’s currently engaged asking David Baddiel exactly what you and he should think. |  | | |
| Hypothetically speaking on 19:26 - Feb 22 with 1480 views | lowhouseblue |
| Hypothetically speaking on 19:23 - Feb 22 by Seablu |
Wondered when you’d get the nudge from the dishonourable member up north.
He’s currently engaged asking David Baddiel exactly what you and he should think. |
as a stop the war type i really thought you'd be demonstrating outside the russian embassy. | |
| And so as the loose-bowelled pigeon of time swoops low over the unsuspecting tourist of destiny, and the flatulent skunk of fate wanders into the air-conditioning system of eternity, I notice it's the end of the show |
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| Hypothetically speaking on 19:33 - Feb 22 with 1463 views | ArnoldMoorhen |
I think it is not unreasonable to assume that Corbyn would be incredibly wary about getting involved in anything that might lead to, even proxy, warfare. For example, I don't think he would have sent the anti-tank weaponry out to Ukraine.
He is pretty much a pacificist, and would want to limit any British Military involvement overseas to that carried out under the auspices of the UN.
He was very wary about saying very much against Russia or Putin over the Salisbury poisonings. The question remains over whether it was because he was waiting for more evidence before passing judgement, or whether he was reluctant to criticise Russia. He said it was the former.
So I think he would have been more fully behind Macron's shuttle diplomacy, and wouldn't have made some of the comments that Johnson has made over the last few days eg "biggest war in Europe since WW2" (which is a very frightening prospect when the Balkan war is considered.)
My other gut feeling is that Putin has got what he wants now, and after a lot of hand-wringing and sanctions, everyone in the West will be mighty relieved when war doesn't follow, and the new "independent regions" will remain under Russian control. Then a "peace deal" will be signed, just before winter, and the sanctions can be relaxed so that Germany gets it's gas supplies switched back on, just as the temperatures start to drop.
That's my gut feeling, as a Labour voter. | | | |
| Hypothetically speaking on 19:35 - Feb 22 with 1450 views | Darth_Koont |
| Hypothetically speaking on 18:33 - Feb 22 by noggin |
Fair enough. You got the government you deserve. Thankfully I don't have to live with it. |
I don’t know about you nogs, but as someone else who’s lived with Scandinavian-style social democracy I’m gobsmacked by the health and education sector bods on this board (and throughout the UK) who so identify with their oppressors.
The result is low pay and poor results for two of the most important areas of society. It’s a tragedy for those working within it and the society they’re meant to help.
I have the greatest respect for my mother (ex-special needs teacher) and my sister (consultant radiologist and still committed to the institution of the NHS). But I’ve told them they should be dictating far higher standards for themselves and those in their care. |  |
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| Hypothetically speaking on 19:39 - Feb 22 with 1431 views | Darth_Koont |
| Hypothetically speaking on 19:02 - Feb 22 by lowhouseblue |
this is easy just look at the weasely words and excuses that dk comes out with and there you have it. |
Gmpf.
Tell it to your Mandelson sex doll. | |
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| Hypothetically speaking on 19:40 - Feb 22 with 1432 views | Seablu |
| Hypothetically speaking on 19:26 - Feb 22 by lowhouseblue |
as a stop the war type i really thought you'd be demonstrating outside the russian embassy. |
There’s your mistake.
You really shouldn’t be thinking for yourself without the express permission of the organ grinder.
It’s a bit like letting Liz Truss out unsupervised. | | | |
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| Hypothetically speaking on 19:41 - Feb 22 with 1429 views | Darth_Koont |
| Hypothetically speaking on 17:32 - Feb 22 by SuperKieranMcKenna |
It’s a debate that’s been done to death on here.
Just a shame that we were given a choice of two privileged, incompetent bigots. My vote went elsewhere but is wasted without PR. |
Smeary McSmearface.
Stick to the facts, James. | |
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| Hypothetically speaking on 19:44 - Feb 22 with 1421 views | Darth_Koont |
| Hypothetically speaking on 17:45 - Feb 22 by Mullet |
There was no opposition, that's the point. They were too busy trying to purge the party and demonising their own supporter base etc.
All you've done there is further excuse Jezza and Momentum et al. He didn't lose an election, he barely turned up for one. Given what happened after, it's a clear inability to lead or handle the top job.
He handed the country to literally the worst and most incompetent leader and cabinet the Tories could muster. Just shrieking "smear!" and apologising for him no longer cuts it. There's more than just the votes in now.
He was utterly toot and due to those factors has been complicit in helping things get this far. |
Jeez. | |
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| Hypothetically speaking on 19:45 - Feb 22 with 1417 views | ArnoldMoorhen |
| Hypothetically speaking on 13:31 - Feb 22 by Manchesterblue |
I think we can safely say Putin wouldn't be doing this if Trump was still in,
Biden cant even keep awake. |
You really didn't pay much attention then. Trump was an avowed "non-interventionist". In US political theory terms he has a lot in common with many across the 20th century who argued that the USA should restrict itself to policing the Western hemisphere, and who were against, for example, US entry into WW1 and WW2.
He also put meat on the bones of this by actively discussing withdrawing US military funding from NATO.
He didn't support action in Syria, whose leader was supported by the Russians as he carried out acts of genocide, and began the process which led to the US withdrawal from Afghanistan. | | | |
| Hypothetically speaking on 19:49 - Feb 22 with 1404 views | Oldsmoker |
When I read the OP first sentence I went into a trance-like orgasmic state.
I have at last awoken and realised it was just a dream.
Dear Leader Corbyn would have nutted the ponce Putin.
Sorted. |  |
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| Hypothetically speaking on 20:11 - Feb 22 with 1369 views | ArnoldMoorhen |
| Hypothetically speaking on 17:54 - Feb 22 by noggin |
Which of his policies were the voters so against that voting tory was preferable? Of course, we know why so many of the working class voted tory but they won't admit it. |
You still don't get it! The problem wasn't the policies, it was Corbyn himself.
Whether we like it or not, a vote in a General Election is a combination of a vote for the local candidate, a vote for the policies/manifesto, and a vote for the preferred party leader. Somehow Corbyn was unable to win out against both May and Johnson.
He was damaged goods, because of the terrorist links/smears and because he was perceived as not being proud to be British, but many of his policies were very popular. He also lacked credibility and gravitas because he had never been a minister or responsible for anything of note. Had the same policies been put forward by Andy Burnham then I think the result would have been different. | | | |
| Hypothetically speaking on 20:38 - Feb 22 with 1331 views | lowhouseblue |
| Hypothetically speaking on 19:35 - Feb 22 by Darth_Koont |
I don’t know about you nogs, but as someone else who’s lived with Scandinavian-style social democracy I’m gobsmacked by the health and education sector bods on this board (and throughout the UK) who so identify with their oppressors.
The result is low pay and poor results for two of the most important areas of society. It’s a tragedy for those working within it and the society they’re meant to help.
I have the greatest respect for my mother (ex-special needs teacher) and my sister (consultant radiologist and still committed to the institution of the NHS). But I’ve told them they should be dictating far higher standards for themselves and those in their care. |
whereas the know-it-all member of the family, who lectures everyone on oppression, higher standards, and the equivalence of russia and the west, works in advertising. i rest my case. | |
| And so as the loose-bowelled pigeon of time swoops low over the unsuspecting tourist of destiny, and the flatulent skunk of fate wanders into the air-conditioning system of eternity, I notice it's the end of the show |
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| Hypothetically speaking on 20:41 - Feb 22 with 1320 views | noggin |
| Hypothetically speaking on 20:11 - Feb 22 by ArnoldMoorhen |
You still don't get it! The problem wasn't the policies, it was Corbyn himself.
Whether we like it or not, a vote in a General Election is a combination of a vote for the local candidate, a vote for the policies/manifesto, and a vote for the preferred party leader. Somehow Corbyn was unable to win out against both May and Johnson.
He was damaged goods, because of the terrorist links/smears and because he was perceived as not being proud to be British, but many of his policies were very popular. He also lacked credibility and gravitas because he had never been a minister or responsible for anything of note. Had the same policies been put forward by Andy Burnham then I think the result would have been different. |
Oh I get it. You've just explained why you got Johnson as PM. You wanted a character, even if he's a persistent liar and openly racist. Who cares about policies? |  |
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| Hypothetically speaking on 21:35 - Feb 22 with 1269 views | ArnoldMoorhen |
| Hypothetically speaking on 20:41 - Feb 22 by noggin |
Oh I get it. You've just explained why you got Johnson as PM. You wanted a character, even if he's a persistent liar and openly racist. Who cares about policies? |
Eh? Nope, I voted for Labour. I abhor Johnson's amoral Government. But I understand why Corbyn didn't win, which is multi-faceted but believe that a politician with more experience, like Yvette Cooper or Andy Burnham, or who was less abashed about his Britishness, like war veteran Clive Lewis, would have done better than Corbyn.
Johnson had a back office that understood what was needed to win. He had the corrupt First Past the Post system (which is loaded towards the Tories and under-represents cities, as well as being destructive of third and fourth parties' chances) and he had the advantage of a pliant media.
Corbyn had the NHS (many doctors and nurses made videos supporting him) and, remarkably, many Police Officers, too. And the young. He connected with them. But he lost older, traditional Labour voters because he was tainted by association with the IRA and Hamas. He lost traditional Labour voters in the Jewish community, too, because he was perceived as being, at the least, careless about who he was seen with, and, again at the least, uninterested in supporting those who made complaints of anti-semitism.
Just as Corbyn won the young over, Johnson won over the older demographic. He had the Union Jack bunting, cream tea and Vera Lynn on the radiogram thing off pat. Some of those voters have still not forgiven Labour for inflation, power cuts and the loss of economic self-esteem in the 70s. Their gut instinct is to see the Tories as the safe and default option. Many of them made money from share privatisations, or bought their first house, under Thatcher in the 80s.
So the dice is loaded against the Labour Party. As well as all of the above, their most attractive policies cost a lot of money. Popular Tory policies involve lower taxes. But Johnson's strongest card (basically Last Night of the Proms and a cheeky hair ruffling) was up against Corbyn's weakness (a feeling that he isn't proud to be British) and in Brexit it became the central focus.
And that card played strongest to the demographic who are most likely to actually turn out and vote. | | | |
| Hypothetically speaking on 21:46 - Feb 22 with 1244 views | noggin |
| Hypothetically speaking on 21:35 - Feb 22 by ArnoldMoorhen |
Eh? Nope, I voted for Labour. I abhor Johnson's amoral Government. But I understand why Corbyn didn't win, which is multi-faceted but believe that a politician with more experience, like Yvette Cooper or Andy Burnham, or who was less abashed about his Britishness, like war veteran Clive Lewis, would have done better than Corbyn.
Johnson had a back office that understood what was needed to win. He had the corrupt First Past the Post system (which is loaded towards the Tories and under-represents cities, as well as being destructive of third and fourth parties' chances) and he had the advantage of a pliant media.
Corbyn had the NHS (many doctors and nurses made videos supporting him) and, remarkably, many Police Officers, too. And the young. He connected with them. But he lost older, traditional Labour voters because he was tainted by association with the IRA and Hamas. He lost traditional Labour voters in the Jewish community, too, because he was perceived as being, at the least, careless about who he was seen with, and, again at the least, uninterested in supporting those who made complaints of anti-semitism.
Just as Corbyn won the young over, Johnson won over the older demographic. He had the Union Jack bunting, cream tea and Vera Lynn on the radiogram thing off pat. Some of those voters have still not forgiven Labour for inflation, power cuts and the loss of economic self-esteem in the 70s. Their gut instinct is to see the Tories as the safe and default option. Many of them made money from share privatisations, or bought their first house, under Thatcher in the 80s.
So the dice is loaded against the Labour Party. As well as all of the above, their most attractive policies cost a lot of money. Popular Tory policies involve lower taxes. But Johnson's strongest card (basically Last Night of the Proms and a cheeky hair ruffling) was up against Corbyn's weakness (a feeling that he isn't proud to be British) and in Brexit it became the central focus.
And that card played strongest to the demographic who are most likely to actually turn out and vote. |
Everything you've said there tells us more about the English voter than anything else. | |
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| Hypothetically speaking on 21:47 - Feb 22 with 1236 views | Darth_Koont |
| Hypothetically speaking on 21:35 - Feb 22 by ArnoldMoorhen |
Eh? Nope, I voted for Labour. I abhor Johnson's amoral Government. But I understand why Corbyn didn't win, which is multi-faceted but believe that a politician with more experience, like Yvette Cooper or Andy Burnham, or who was less abashed about his Britishness, like war veteran Clive Lewis, would have done better than Corbyn.
Johnson had a back office that understood what was needed to win. He had the corrupt First Past the Post system (which is loaded towards the Tories and under-represents cities, as well as being destructive of third and fourth parties' chances) and he had the advantage of a pliant media.
Corbyn had the NHS (many doctors and nurses made videos supporting him) and, remarkably, many Police Officers, too. And the young. He connected with them. But he lost older, traditional Labour voters because he was tainted by association with the IRA and Hamas. He lost traditional Labour voters in the Jewish community, too, because he was perceived as being, at the least, careless about who he was seen with, and, again at the least, uninterested in supporting those who made complaints of anti-semitism.
Just as Corbyn won the young over, Johnson won over the older demographic. He had the Union Jack bunting, cream tea and Vera Lynn on the radiogram thing off pat. Some of those voters have still not forgiven Labour for inflation, power cuts and the loss of economic self-esteem in the 70s. Their gut instinct is to see the Tories as the safe and default option. Many of them made money from share privatisations, or bought their first house, under Thatcher in the 80s.
So the dice is loaded against the Labour Party. As well as all of the above, their most attractive policies cost a lot of money. Popular Tory policies involve lower taxes. But Johnson's strongest card (basically Last Night of the Proms and a cheeky hair ruffling) was up against Corbyn's weakness (a feeling that he isn't proud to be British) and in Brexit it became the central focus.
And that card played strongest to the demographic who are most likely to actually turn out and vote. |
So much to unpack in that. I’ll do it tomorrow, but how much of that is perception over reality?
Far, far too much. | |
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| Hypothetically speaking on 21:53 - Feb 22 with 1206 views | The_Flashing_Smile |
| Hypothetically speaking on 20:38 - Feb 22 by lowhouseblue |
whereas the know-it-all member of the family, who lectures everyone on oppression, higher standards, and the equivalence of russia and the west, works in advertising. i rest my case. |
Yeah because advertising is just like oppression, you muppet.
What's your job Mother Theresa? |  |
| Trust the process. Trust Phil. |
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| Hypothetically speaking on 21:56 - Feb 22 with 1184 views | lowhouseblue |
| Hypothetically speaking on 21:53 - Feb 22 by The_Flashing_Smile |
Yeah because advertising is just like oppression, you muppet.
What's your job Mother Theresa? |
no you're valuable too - processed sugar doesn't just sell itself. | |
| And so as the loose-bowelled pigeon of time swoops low over the unsuspecting tourist of destiny, and the flatulent skunk of fate wanders into the air-conditioning system of eternity, I notice it's the end of the show |
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| Hypothetically speaking on 21:57 - Feb 22 with 1178 views | jeera |
| Hypothetically speaking on 21:56 - Feb 22 by lowhouseblue |
no you're valuable too - processed sugar doesn't just sell itself. |
Why so personal?
Your standards have dropped. |  |
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| Hypothetically speaking on 21:57 - Feb 22 with 1177 views | Darth_Koont |
| Hypothetically speaking on 20:38 - Feb 22 by lowhouseblue |
whereas the know-it-all member of the family, who lectures everyone on oppression, higher standards, and the equivalence of russia and the west, works in advertising. i rest my case. |
You don’t think sales is part of society? You Leninist.
What do you do, Lowers? When you’re not blowing Satan’s horn. | |
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| Hypothetically speaking on 22:03 - Feb 22 with 1146 views | Darth_Koont |
| Hypothetically speaking on 21:56 - Feb 22 by lowhouseblue |
no you're valuable too - processed sugar doesn't just sell itself. |
I bet you 10 quid your job is more embarrassing. Especially given your posting history.
I’ve never been against capitalism. Just the way the benefits NEED to be shared. That’s why I’m literally a social democrat. | |
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| Hypothetically speaking on 22:09 - Feb 22 with 1118 views | lowhouseblue |
| Hypothetically speaking on 21:57 - Feb 22 by jeera |
Why so personal?
Your standards have dropped. |
oh, go on, i'm allowed one harribo joke. everyone else has had one. | |
| And so as the loose-bowelled pigeon of time swoops low over the unsuspecting tourist of destiny, and the flatulent skunk of fate wanders into the air-conditioning system of eternity, I notice it's the end of the show |
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| Hypothetically speaking on 22:12 - Feb 22 with 1089 views | The_Flashing_Smile |
| Hypothetically speaking on 22:09 - Feb 22 by lowhouseblue |
oh, go on, i'm allowed one harribo joke. everyone else has had one. |
I've not done Haribo ads for 5 years.
So come on, we're all dying to know your saintly job. Probably rescuing kittens from streams or something? | |
| Trust the process. Trust Phil. |
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