| Just Stop Oil protesters 17:52 - Apr 14 with 10478 views | gtsb1966 |
Absolute tossers. People today trying to go about their work, including me, and diesel was like gold dust. People worrying how they are going to earn a crust. Nine petrol stations on our route before we found diesel. Others were not so lucky. If they are going to sit in the road water cannon the lot of them. Rant over, happy easter. |  | | |  |
| Just Stop Oil protesters on 17:29 - Apr 15 with 1432 views | Plums |
Surprised nobody has posted this.
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| Just Stop Oil protesters on 17:51 - Apr 15 with 1394 views | NthQldITFC |
| Just Stop Oil protesters on 23:46 - Apr 14 by NthQldITFC |
When I see words like 'inconvenient' and 'disruption' used as arguments against desperately needed attempts to shift the political will of the country and the world, and when I hear people assuming that new technologies will only be any good if they can somehow maintain an unviable lifestyle (multi-car families etc. etc. etc.), I realise just how badly education on the scale and imminent impact of climate change has failed. |
On the other hand, you probably can't educate people who don't want to be educated because their own short-term 'needs' are more important to them than the entirety of the future of humanity and the rest of the fauna and flora.
For me, this is now just a 'horizon' issue, by which I mean that essentially everybody realises just how unprecedentedly serious or terminal the situation is, but that a lot of people tend to push it over their horizon and try to pretend that it won't matter to them because it is too far in the future.
Politicians horizons might only be five or ten years (as a active politician whose requirements are votes) and unfortunately they are the bastards who need to be driving the action. I suppose for many of us the natural horizon might only be ten, twenty or thirty years, but if you have kids just think what their horizon is. That's why kids are getting so depressed because they fundamentally realise that this issue is very much NOT over their horizon.
And yet people still whinge about 'inconvenience' and 'disruption'. It's utterly fkn stupid makes me fkn sick. |  |
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| Just Stop Oil protesters on 18:15 - Apr 15 with 1338 views | Ryorry |
| Just Stop Oil protesters on 17:51 - Apr 15 by NthQldITFC |
On the other hand, you probably can't educate people who don't want to be educated because their own short-term 'needs' are more important to them than the entirety of the future of humanity and the rest of the fauna and flora.
For me, this is now just a 'horizon' issue, by which I mean that essentially everybody realises just how unprecedentedly serious or terminal the situation is, but that a lot of people tend to push it over their horizon and try to pretend that it won't matter to them because it is too far in the future.
Politicians horizons might only be five or ten years (as a active politician whose requirements are votes) and unfortunately they are the bastards who need to be driving the action. I suppose for many of us the natural horizon might only be ten, twenty or thirty years, but if you have kids just think what their horizon is. That's why kids are getting so depressed because they fundamentally realise that this issue is very much NOT over their horizon.
And yet people still whinge about 'inconvenience' and 'disruption'. It's utterly fkn stupid makes me fkn sick. |
This is what baffles me. I'm in my 70s, don't have kids/grandkids, but am banging the climate crisis 1 minute to midnight drum pretty much every day of my life.
Yet the majority of CEOs, Boards & shareholders of oil/gas/coal global giants (not to mention politicians) do have kids, are likely to have grandkids in future - & still don't give a toss. As I've said many times, don't they realise or care that their grandkids won't be able to eat, drink or breathe gold bars? |  |
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| Just Stop Oil protesters on 18:41 - Apr 15 with 1319 views | Plums |
| Just Stop Oil protesters on 18:15 - Apr 15 by Ryorry |
This is what baffles me. I'm in my 70s, don't have kids/grandkids, but am banging the climate crisis 1 minute to midnight drum pretty much every day of my life.
Yet the majority of CEOs, Boards & shareholders of oil/gas/coal global giants (not to mention politicians) do have kids, are likely to have grandkids in future - & still don't give a toss. As I've said many times, don't they realise or care that their grandkids won't be able to eat, drink or breathe gold bars? |
I genuinely think it’s fear. Fear of breaking ranks and speaking up and so the status quo is maintained. It’s going to take a brave visionary in one of these organisation to put their head above the parapet - hopefully before it’s too late. | |
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| Just Stop Oil protesters on 18:45 - Apr 15 with 1306 views | solomon |
| Just Stop Oil protesters on 18:41 - Apr 15 by Plums |
I genuinely think it’s fear. Fear of breaking ranks and speaking up and so the status quo is maintained. It’s going to take a brave visionary in one of these organisation to put their head above the parapet - hopefully before it’s too late. |
You could say the visionaries already exist, maybe they’re gluing themselves to roads and blockading fuel depots? |  | | |
| Just Stop Oil protesters on 18:55 - Apr 15 with 1286 views | pointofblue |
| Just Stop Oil protesters on 18:41 - Apr 15 by Plums |
I genuinely think it’s fear. Fear of breaking ranks and speaking up and so the status quo is maintained. It’s going to take a brave visionary in one of these organisation to put their head above the parapet - hopefully before it’s too late. |
Or fear of losing an election. The environment is not the number one prioriry for most, hence the Conservative 'plan' for energy production avoided inland wind turbines - MPs thought they'd lose votes over it. |  |
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| Just Stop Oil protesters on 19:22 - Apr 15 with 1254 views | Swansea_Blue |
| Just Stop Oil protesters on 18:15 - Apr 15 by Ryorry |
This is what baffles me. I'm in my 70s, don't have kids/grandkids, but am banging the climate crisis 1 minute to midnight drum pretty much every day of my life.
Yet the majority of CEOs, Boards & shareholders of oil/gas/coal global giants (not to mention politicians) do have kids, are likely to have grandkids in future - & still don't give a toss. As I've said many times, don't they realise or care that their grandkids won't be able to eat, drink or breathe gold bars? |
That’s an easy one to explain. They have vested financial interests and that’s the most important thing to them. They probably think they can buy their way out of any future inconveniences. |  |
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| Just Stop Oil protesters on 20:04 - Apr 15 with 1204 views | jeera |
| Just Stop Oil protesters on 13:11 - Apr 15 by CoachRob |
Sorry about your cousin jeera, that is such a horrible experience and obviously, validates your point. I just despair we are doing nothing to stop civilisation collapse, we may already be beyond some irreversible tipping points and little research exists on what that would look like. Over 1,000 scientists have been risking arrest but to no avail, we have these activists trying but largely being mocked and ignored, and types like Hartley-Brewer suggesting activists should be run over. I did a brief talk to some Friends of the Earth activists and some of these people were in their eighties and nineties, the idea of causing physical harm to these people is abhorrent.
Sorry again, I didn't understand the personal context and these discussions are very hard given what is at stake - it is not easy to navigate a course without upsetting people. |
Sorry Rob, I hadn't seen this reply.
Yep, we're all good, thanks for the chat. |  |
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| Just Stop Oil protesters on 20:56 - Apr 15 with 1142 views | Ryorry |
| Just Stop Oil protesters on 19:22 - Apr 15 by Swansea_Blue |
That’s an easy one to explain. They have vested financial interests and that’s the most important thing to them. They probably think they can buy their way out of any future inconveniences. |
But the point I'm trying to make is that vested financial interests are literally going to be no earthly use to their grandkids, g.grandkids etc. if planet earth no longer has the capacity to provide clean water, food & air that will enable them to survive in the most basic way! | |
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| Just Stop Oil protesters on 20:57 - Apr 15 with 1141 views | Ryorry |
| Just Stop Oil protesters on 18:55 - Apr 15 by pointofblue |
Or fear of losing an election. The environment is not the number one prioriry for most, hence the Conservative 'plan' for energy production avoided inland wind turbines - MPs thought they'd lose votes over it. |
That might be part of it - ie short-termism. | |
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| Just Stop Oil protesters on 21:06 - Apr 15 with 1135 views | Swansea_Blue |
| Just Stop Oil protesters on 20:56 - Apr 15 by Ryorry |
But the point I'm trying to make is that vested financial interests are literally going to be no earthly use to their grandkids, g.grandkids etc. if planet earth no longer has the capacity to provide clean water, food & air that will enable them to survive in the most basic way! |
Frustrating isn’t it. You know that, I know that. But they’re greedy beggars ruled by money alone. I don’t think they care about anything else (probably see it as a load of leftie nonsense and mock those making a stand - as we’ve seen in this thread).
Despite us knowing about this for decades, the number of people taking it seriously is scarily small. We need David Attenborough on the case. His ocean plastics stuff was a game changer. For some reason people will listen to him whiling ignoring the experts (upon whose work Attenborough’s programmes are based, but that’s a logical jump too far for most). | |
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| Just Stop Oil protesters on 21:13 - Apr 15 with 1126 views | gtsb1966 |
| Just Stop Oil protesters on 21:06 - Apr 15 by Swansea_Blue |
Frustrating isn’t it. You know that, I know that. But they’re greedy beggars ruled by money alone. I don’t think they care about anything else (probably see it as a load of leftie nonsense and mock those making a stand - as we’ve seen in this thread).
Despite us knowing about this for decades, the number of people taking it seriously is scarily small. We need David Attenborough on the case. His ocean plastics stuff was a game changer. For some reason people will listen to him whiling ignoring the experts (upon whose work Attenborough’s programmes are based, but that’s a logical jump too far for most). |
"Mock those making a stand- as we've seen in this thread". I don't think that anyone who has criticised the protesters doesn't agree with their message. It's the way they are doing it. | | | |
| Just Stop Oil protesters on 00:49 - Apr 16 with 1044 views | BondiBlue |
| Just Stop Oil protesters on 16:09 - Apr 15 by jeera |
That post was intended as a response to all the comments suggesting no fuel = minor inconvenience.
There must be a thousand hypothetical situations that you could use. That one sprang to mind to me immediately because it was something that happened to my family, as in a little girl was wrongly sent home from hospital by an indifferent doctor calling her mother an over-fussing parent.
Dad got home from work, saw the child wasn't right and put her in the car driving like a madman to the hospital. She died in the car on the way.
I wasn't intending to cause offence but was a bit put out that people weren't acknowledging that no access to fuel can mean a damn sight more than a minor effing inconvenience to a great deal of people.
A bit of perspective and respect for other's needs would be nice.
But if you think a child has never had to be rushed to a hospital by a parent before and never will ever again, then you're right, I got nothing.
"What if " ffs.
Nor did I say people should not protest.
I also did not 'have a go' at anyone. I suggested a potential situation based on real-life experience.
On how many levels do you intend to be rude here exactly? [Post edited 15 Apr 2022 16:21]
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The fact that it has happened obviously answers my question and renders my point irrelevant. As the above poster has mentioned, i should have read on. Sorry about that. I was being insensitive but i'd argue i wasn't being rude. Nothing personal in there (at least, nothing knowingly personal). | |
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| Just Stop Oil protesters on 06:37 - Apr 16 with 983 views | solomon |
| Just Stop Oil protesters on 21:13 - Apr 15 by gtsb1966 |
"Mock those making a stand- as we've seen in this thread". I don't think that anyone who has criticised the protesters doesn't agree with their message. It's the way they are doing it. |
Just for the record I’m sympathetic to your view on this, yes it’s incredibly frustrating and annoying and I wish there was a way this could be done differently, trouble is we live in a time where misinformation is rife especially on climate change, those with vested interests in fossil fuels will due all they can to keep the status quo, it’s the battle of our age and we all have a part to play. | | | |
| Just Stop Oil protesters on 07:38 - Apr 16 with 960 views | Ely_Blue |
| Just Stop Oil protesters on 10:14 - Apr 15 by LeoMuff |
Rome wasn’t build in a day - lol
We have been aware for what 40-50 years that the planet will not survive if we continue in this way, almost uniform agreement that we are close to reaching a point of no return, yet governments including ours are still looking at new fossil fuels and licensing this.
Unfortunately the financial pain and losses of the cuts we need to make are too much for western governments to stomach, they have little desire to change enough as the lifespan of parliament/government they won’t see the benefit.
All the protesters here want is a commitment to no more new fossil fuel licensing and production as I understand it, which should be a given really if we are serious about properly tackling this issue. |
So what happens when technology can’t keep up? Let’s say the government commits to no new fossil fuels but we can’t produce enough renewables or clean energy? What happens when the government commits to electric car targets that can’t be met because the large car companies won’t make them more affordable? |  |
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| Just Stop Oil protesters on 07:55 - Apr 16 with 941 views | solomon |
| Just Stop Oil protesters on 07:38 - Apr 16 by Ely_Blue |
So what happens when technology can’t keep up? Let’s say the government commits to no new fossil fuels but we can’t produce enough renewables or clean energy? What happens when the government commits to electric car targets that can’t be met because the large car companies won’t make them more affordable? |
Why do you think they won’t get more affordable? | | | |
| Just Stop Oil protesters on 08:38 - Apr 16 with 929 views | NthQldITFC |
| Just Stop Oil protesters on 06:37 - Apr 16 by solomon |
Just for the record I’m sympathetic to your view on this, yes it’s incredibly frustrating and annoying and I wish there was a way this could be done differently, trouble is we live in a time where misinformation is rife especially on climate change, those with vested interests in fossil fuels will due all they can to keep the status quo, it’s the battle of our age and we all have a part to play. |
Misinformation and disinformation is rife, but I'm feeling that in climate change we're actually moving past this phase a little. There seems to be very little outright denial any more (compared with say ten years ago), but then there's so little discussion of the issue compared to its importance and compared to the things which exercise our media at the moment. People on the whole just seem to be trying to forget about the issue, which is very cowardly, and denigrating those who are trying desperately to make the cowards brave enough to face it again.
If you were a dispassionate alien observer looking at out planet, you'd think that environmental issues and climate change in particular were the only things of any real importance, and yet these stupid creatures are doing absolutely f. all about it, and still driving around pumping out CO2 mostly for completely trivial purposes. Stamped in red on the report back to Epsilon 9 would probably be 'BASKET CASE SPECIES, DOOMED PLANET' [Post edited 16 Apr 2022 8:39]
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| Just Stop Oil protesters on 08:56 - Apr 16 with 917 views | LeoMuff |
| Just Stop Oil protesters on 21:13 - Apr 15 by gtsb1966 |
"Mock those making a stand- as we've seen in this thread". I don't think that anyone who has criticised the protesters doesn't agree with their message. It's the way they are doing it. |
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/science-environment-61110406
Article today saying we need to reduce by 43% by 2030, I ask you again how would you draw attention to this ? As most other things have been tried over the last 40 years and government still don’t listen |  |
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| Just Stop Oil protesters on 09:00 - Apr 16 with 912 views | LeoMuff |
| Just Stop Oil protesters on 07:38 - Apr 16 by Ely_Blue |
So what happens when technology can’t keep up? Let’s say the government commits to no new fossil fuels but we can’t produce enough renewables or clean energy? What happens when the government commits to electric car targets that can’t be met because the large car companies won’t make them more affordable? |
I’m pretty sure if we can furlough most of the country and come up with a rolled out vaccine in a year to a novel virus we could subsidy electric vehicles, chargers, the tech is there unfortunately we just cut the subsidy we had in place.
As I said it’s all doable but when your in the pockets of the oil companies the disincentives are huge | |
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| Just Stop Oil protesters on 10:06 - Apr 16 with 876 views | BanksterDebtSlave |
| Just Stop Oil protesters on 08:38 - Apr 16 by NthQldITFC |
Misinformation and disinformation is rife, but I'm feeling that in climate change we're actually moving past this phase a little. There seems to be very little outright denial any more (compared with say ten years ago), but then there's so little discussion of the issue compared to its importance and compared to the things which exercise our media at the moment. People on the whole just seem to be trying to forget about the issue, which is very cowardly, and denigrating those who are trying desperately to make the cowards brave enough to face it again.
If you were a dispassionate alien observer looking at out planet, you'd think that environmental issues and climate change in particular were the only things of any real importance, and yet these stupid creatures are doing absolutely f. all about it, and still driving around pumping out CO2 mostly for completely trivial purposes. Stamped in red on the report back to Epsilon 9 would probably be 'BASKET CASE SPECIES, DOOMED PLANET' [Post edited 16 Apr 2022 8:39]
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If I am entirely honest, and speaking as someone who has for as long as I can remember been painfully aware of our environmental vandalism, I think it's too late already. On a global level the pillage and pollution accelerates and in the developed world a few better off people get to play lip service to change via new stuff and platitudes. We are led by fools in the pockets of corporations and I see no reason for optimism regarding the fundamental reset that is required. "It's the economy stupid." |  |
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| Just Stop Oil protesters on 10:25 - Apr 16 with 839 views | eireblue |
| Just Stop Oil protesters on 08:38 - Apr 16 by NthQldITFC |
Misinformation and disinformation is rife, but I'm feeling that in climate change we're actually moving past this phase a little. There seems to be very little outright denial any more (compared with say ten years ago), but then there's so little discussion of the issue compared to its importance and compared to the things which exercise our media at the moment. People on the whole just seem to be trying to forget about the issue, which is very cowardly, and denigrating those who are trying desperately to make the cowards brave enough to face it again.
If you were a dispassionate alien observer looking at out planet, you'd think that environmental issues and climate change in particular were the only things of any real importance, and yet these stupid creatures are doing absolutely f. all about it, and still driving around pumping out CO2 mostly for completely trivial purposes. Stamped in red on the report back to Epsilon 9 would probably be 'BASKET CASE SPECIES, DOOMED PLANET' [Post edited 16 Apr 2022 8:39]
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Oi, I could get another 10 years out of this assignment, don’t go spoiling it by writing my report for me. |  | | |
| Just Stop Oil protesters on 10:48 - Apr 16 with 808 views | Leaky |
| Just Stop Oil protesters on 09:06 - Apr 15 by solomon |
This is such a hard issue to nail down, we are in a position of which there is no turning back, fossil fuels have to end. The EV issue is central to this, I’m fortunate enough to be able to run one now and hopefully there will soon be a trickle down of used EVs coming on stream in the not too distant future (not sure if used prices will be Low enough to get the uptake required) EV uptake is not happening fast enough with those who can and should be buying EV’s this is also true of companies who are still not getting enough company car drivers over to electric also, sure range is an issue for some ,but not all. although I don’t qualify for a company car my firm seemed utterly uninterested that I bought one and now travel to work emission free, it’s an ingrained belief that fossil fuels can’t be bettered and like so many others they are clinging on to the vain hope that all this environmental fuss is going to be reversed, when you consider the utterly pathetic attempt by the government to improve and ready the required infrastructure you have to say they can’t be blamed for believing that. Stop oil and insulate Britain seem to understand what they need to do to make change happen, unfortunately most of us seem not able to (by circumstances) help make that change happen. |
However you don't travel to work emission free, you have just moved your emissions to the power station |  | | |
| Just Stop Oil protesters on 11:00 - Apr 16 with 784 views | EdwardStone |
| Just Stop Oil protesters on 10:48 - Apr 16 by Leaky |
However you don't travel to work emission free, you have just moved your emissions to the power station |
Green electricity?
Y' know.... from renewables
PV solar? Wind? Tidal? Hydro? Bio mass?
That kind of thing |  | | |
| Just Stop Oil protesters on 13:09 - Apr 16 with 696 views | The_Flashing_Smile |
| Just Stop Oil protesters on 21:06 - Apr 15 by Swansea_Blue |
Frustrating isn’t it. You know that, I know that. But they’re greedy beggars ruled by money alone. I don’t think they care about anything else (probably see it as a load of leftie nonsense and mock those making a stand - as we’ve seen in this thread).
Despite us knowing about this for decades, the number of people taking it seriously is scarily small. We need David Attenborough on the case. His ocean plastics stuff was a game changer. For some reason people will listen to him whiling ignoring the experts (upon whose work Attenborough’s programmes are based, but that’s a logical jump too far for most). |
I think it's a combination of individuals thinking their little bit doesn't really hurt too much, kicking the can down the road, and outright denial.
It would be great to get the CEOs and owners of the biggest polluters in a room and ask them if they give a feck about their children/grandchildren. |  |
| Trust the process. Trust Phil. |
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| Just Stop Oil protesters on 13:17 - Apr 16 with 682 views | J2BLUE |
| Just Stop Oil protesters on 13:09 - Apr 16 by The_Flashing_Smile |
I think it's a combination of individuals thinking their little bit doesn't really hurt too much, kicking the can down the road, and outright denial.
It would be great to get the CEOs and owners of the biggest polluters in a room and ask them if they give a feck about their children/grandchildren. |
It's a shame there isn't some sort of truth serum. I think the honest answer would be something like "my family will be fine because we are rich so these problems will not affect us. I do not give a fook about YOUR grandchildren" |  |
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