| If the UK were to rejoin the EU tomorrow 10:27 - Jun 20 with 6908 views | Basuco |
what brexit benefits would you miss most? (copied from twitter)
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| If the UK were to rejoin the EU tomorrow on 11:03 - Jun 21 with 1269 views | jeera |
| If the UK were to rejoin the EU tomorrow on 10:59 - Jun 21 by Dyland |
The vaccination programme was p1ss all to do with being in or out of the EU.
Do you really believe any countries' lockdown policies were/are dictated by any other body other than their national government?
Direct trade deals.... the DTI is still calling for reviews on pretty much all of them :)
The point about Spain is a fair one, unless you want to live there! |
Incredible isn't it. |  |
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| If the UK were to rejoin the EU tomorrow on 11:09 - Jun 21 with 1269 views | Dyland |
| If the UK were to rejoin the EU tomorrow on 11:03 - Jun 21 by jeera |
Incredible isn't it. |
Not really, unfortunately :)
I've 'got on with it' without 'moaning', as seems to be the main thrust of some leave voters' complaints. Shame the government is full of venal and incompetent shameless chancers who couldn't organise a football game at a football club.
The idea we have signed hundreds of trade deals comes from spin and lies from actual politicians. Makes my blood boil... the grand standing populism rather than the result itself. After all, Bojo was always a remainer until, well, fook it I can't be arsed any more! |  |
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| If the UK were to rejoin the EU tomorrow on 11:15 - Jun 21 with 1251 views | Lord_Lucan |
| If the UK were to rejoin the EU tomorrow on 09:38 - Jun 21 by giant_stow |
Getting the vaccine first had nothing to do with brexit. The govt picked a very talented person who's team secured great deals - this could have happened in or out of the EU. |
That’s true to an extent but that is what government is supposed to do and something that we have recently failed to do in other areas. The role of government is largely to pick the best man or women for the job and to do a good job.
Like many successes and failures some people try and re write history and when memory fades they attempt to put their argument down as fact.
If we had been part of EU we would have joined the EU vaccine procurement scheme, I think it might have been Hungary who tried to wriggle out of it down the line but it’s pretty clear we would have joined it.
I just tried to google an interview with Kate Bingham where she went into great detail about the above - but after a brief search I couldn’t find it and I haven’t got the time to fart around all of the day. I did though come across an article in the FT where she said this
I ask whether her team seriously considered working with the EU vaccine procurement scheme, which would have been possible last year before Brexit took effect. “The Commission was happy for us to join the European procurement but we would not have a seat at the table, we had to abandon all the work we had done to date, we could not speak either then or in the future to any potential vaccine companies that would conflict with what they might want to do, and they would tell us when we would get the vaccine,” Bingham says. “Being a Remainer, it wasn’t as if I came in with any strong views that we had to do it our own way,” she adds. “But, actually, that was not a very difficult decision.”
Another piece of “VC thinking” was “don’t penny-pinch.” “When we were negotiating, no vaccine company knew what it was going to cost to make their vaccines, so it was all being done with best efforts and best data at the time. If we’d gone in and said ‘you’re charging us too much’, then they’d have replied ‘it was lovely to know you’ and walked away. “We ended up with agreed prices per dose and an agreed schedule,” Bingham continues. “But it was all about ‘How do we get the vaccines quickly?’ rather than ‘Could we shave another 50p off each dose?’”
Here's another fairly balanced review in The Repubblica
https://www.repubblica.it/cronaca/2021/02/07/news/kate_bingham_interview_vaccine |  |
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| If the UK were to rejoin the EU tomorrow on 11:19 - Jun 21 with 1231 views | Dyland |
| If the UK were to rejoin the EU tomorrow on 11:15 - Jun 21 by Lord_Lucan |
That’s true to an extent but that is what government is supposed to do and something that we have recently failed to do in other areas. The role of government is largely to pick the best man or women for the job and to do a good job.
Like many successes and failures some people try and re write history and when memory fades they attempt to put their argument down as fact.
If we had been part of EU we would have joined the EU vaccine procurement scheme, I think it might have been Hungary who tried to wriggle out of it down the line but it’s pretty clear we would have joined it.
I just tried to google an interview with Kate Bingham where she went into great detail about the above - but after a brief search I couldn’t find it and I haven’t got the time to fart around all of the day. I did though come across an article in the FT where she said this
I ask whether her team seriously considered working with the EU vaccine procurement scheme, which would have been possible last year before Brexit took effect. “The Commission was happy for us to join the European procurement but we would not have a seat at the table, we had to abandon all the work we had done to date, we could not speak either then or in the future to any potential vaccine companies that would conflict with what they might want to do, and they would tell us when we would get the vaccine,” Bingham says. “Being a Remainer, it wasn’t as if I came in with any strong views that we had to do it our own way,” she adds. “But, actually, that was not a very difficult decision.”
Another piece of “VC thinking” was “don’t penny-pinch.” “When we were negotiating, no vaccine company knew what it was going to cost to make their vaccines, so it was all being done with best efforts and best data at the time. If we’d gone in and said ‘you’re charging us too much’, then they’d have replied ‘it was lovely to know you’ and walked away. “We ended up with agreed prices per dose and an agreed schedule,” Bingham continues. “But it was all about ‘How do we get the vaccines quickly?’ rather than ‘Could we shave another 50p off each dose?’”
Here's another fairly balanced review in The Repubblica
https://www.repubblica.it/cronaca/2021/02/07/news/kate_bingham_interview_vaccine |
Fair comment Lucers.
"The role of government is largely to pick the best man or women for the job and to do a good job."
This especially boils my p1ss. I'm working on an endless (not literally, unless countries keep breaking up into new ones!) stream of call for review from the DTI (intellectual property related) and the more I get involved in policy and government departments the more I see how little ministers know (or care) about their specific areas. | |
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| If the UK were to rejoin the EU tomorrow on 11:25 - Jun 21 with 1219 views | Swansea_Blue |
| If the UK were to rejoin the EU tomorrow on 09:31 - Jun 21 by braveblue |
Literally?
Go on. Do you not accept we had the vaccines earlier than the EU? It’s a matter of fact but carry on.
Be interesting to which others are not true and why. |
'Getting the vaccines and boosters months early. Saved thousands of lives.' - whilst that happened, it wasn't because we'd left the EU (as discussed by others).
'Getting out of lockdown months early.' - Nothing to do with being out of the EU. Lockdowns are a national issue for EU countries.
Points based immigration system - we had one when we were in the EU (albeit it couldn't be applied to EU nationals). And then you have to look at whether barriers to entry are doing us any favours now.
Helping Ukraine without EU squabbles - again, we could do this in the EU. Sure we'd be part of the 'squabbles' but it's a national decision.
Going to Spain with absolutely no difference to entry - could do this in the EU. And there are differences for some people.
Direct trade deals with over 200 countries - we don't have trade deals with over 200 countries. We've signed about 38 deals with somewhere around 97 countries and the vast majority of these we had trade deals with when we were part of the EU. The only notable one I can think of that's new is Australia, and the EU are in discussions with them. |  |
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| If the UK were to rejoin the EU tomorrow on 11:30 - Jun 21 with 1207 views | Lord_Lucan |
| If the UK were to rejoin the EU tomorrow on 11:19 - Jun 21 by Dyland |
Fair comment Lucers.
"The role of government is largely to pick the best man or women for the job and to do a good job."
This especially boils my p1ss. I'm working on an endless (not literally, unless countries keep breaking up into new ones!) stream of call for review from the DTI (intellectual property related) and the more I get involved in policy and government departments the more I see how little ministers know (or care) about their specific areas. |
I agree 100% and good luck with that because I tried to get into the IP thing with our name and products a year or so ago but it was so mind blowingly confusing for an oik like me that I ended up paying a firm in Cambridge to sort it out.
I, along with other representatives in my trade association body have been dealing with SNP for a year and I can tell you they are the most useless undemocratic bunch I have ever worked with - but that's another story.
At present I have a business issue that I need help with but there is absolutely no point in contacting my local MP as it is Tom Hunt and he wouldn't be able to understand it as he is a cretin.
Next - we cannot get any clear guidance from BEIS about CE / UKCA changes yet we are supposed to have this in place for products entering the country from 2023!!!
Good luck with your endeavours with IP - you will certainly need it. | |
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| If the UK were to rejoin the EU tomorrow on 11:31 - Jun 21 with 1203 views | Swansea_Blue |
| If the UK were to rejoin the EU tomorrow on 11:15 - Jun 21 by Lord_Lucan |
That’s true to an extent but that is what government is supposed to do and something that we have recently failed to do in other areas. The role of government is largely to pick the best man or women for the job and to do a good job.
Like many successes and failures some people try and re write history and when memory fades they attempt to put their argument down as fact.
If we had been part of EU we would have joined the EU vaccine procurement scheme, I think it might have been Hungary who tried to wriggle out of it down the line but it’s pretty clear we would have joined it.
I just tried to google an interview with Kate Bingham where she went into great detail about the above - but after a brief search I couldn’t find it and I haven’t got the time to fart around all of the day. I did though come across an article in the FT where she said this
I ask whether her team seriously considered working with the EU vaccine procurement scheme, which would have been possible last year before Brexit took effect. “The Commission was happy for us to join the European procurement but we would not have a seat at the table, we had to abandon all the work we had done to date, we could not speak either then or in the future to any potential vaccine companies that would conflict with what they might want to do, and they would tell us when we would get the vaccine,” Bingham says. “Being a Remainer, it wasn’t as if I came in with any strong views that we had to do it our own way,” she adds. “But, actually, that was not a very difficult decision.”
Another piece of “VC thinking” was “don’t penny-pinch.” “When we were negotiating, no vaccine company knew what it was going to cost to make their vaccines, so it was all being done with best efforts and best data at the time. If we’d gone in and said ‘you’re charging us too much’, then they’d have replied ‘it was lovely to know you’ and walked away. “We ended up with agreed prices per dose and an agreed schedule,” Bingham continues. “But it was all about ‘How do we get the vaccines quickly?’ rather than ‘Could we shave another 50p off each dose?’”
Here's another fairly balanced review in The Repubblica
https://www.repubblica.it/cronaca/2021/02/07/news/kate_bingham_interview_vaccine |
Yes, I think it's likely to think we would have joined the EU vaccine procurement scheme. It's, likely without the Brexit mentality, we may no have thought to go it alone. Impossible to say for sure, but likely.
There would have eben benefits of doing so - better protections for citizens, cheaper, etc., but at the time the early start would have saved lives. | |
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| If the UK were to rejoin the EU tomorrow on 11:32 - Jun 21 with 1198 views | BlueNomad |
| If the UK were to rejoin the EU tomorrow on 15:33 - Jun 20 by giant_stow |
Brexiters crowing over their victory. Come to thing of it, where did all the crowing go? |
It's all on the BBC News website Have Your Say topics most days! |  | | |
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| If the UK were to rejoin the EU tomorrow on 11:38 - Jun 21 with 1194 views | BlueNomad |
| If the UK were to rejoin the EU tomorrow on 19:43 - Jun 20 by mutters |
At this stage there are a lot of unknowns, maybe this question is best asked in 10 years time?
When the UK joined the EC back in 72 lots of today's benefits of being part of the EU were not in place. It took time to evolve. Just as the UK being out of the EU will take time to evolve before the full picture can be understood |
Optimism on a massive scale | | | |
| If the UK were to rejoin the EU tomorrow on 11:47 - Jun 21 with 1176 views | Icantbelieveyousaidt |
| If the UK were to rejoin the EU tomorrow on 11:25 - Jun 21 by Swansea_Blue |
'Getting the vaccines and boosters months early. Saved thousands of lives.' - whilst that happened, it wasn't because we'd left the EU (as discussed by others).
'Getting out of lockdown months early.' - Nothing to do with being out of the EU. Lockdowns are a national issue for EU countries.
Points based immigration system - we had one when we were in the EU (albeit it couldn't be applied to EU nationals). And then you have to look at whether barriers to entry are doing us any favours now.
Helping Ukraine without EU squabbles - again, we could do this in the EU. Sure we'd be part of the 'squabbles' but it's a national decision.
Going to Spain with absolutely no difference to entry - could do this in the EU. And there are differences for some people.
Direct trade deals with over 200 countries - we don't have trade deals with over 200 countries. We've signed about 38 deals with somewhere around 97 countries and the vast majority of these we had trade deals with when we were part of the EU. The only notable one I can think of that's new is Australia, and the EU are in discussions with them. |
BREXIT BRITAIN has done more than the US and taken a "leading role" in helping Ukraine resist Russia's invasion of its country, a former White House advisor has astonishingly claimed.
John Bolton, the former White House national security adviser, will make the dramatic admission later today (Tuesday). He will speak at the launch of a new report on Britain’s role in the world after the country's split from the European Union. Mr Bolton will cite the strong UK military backing of Ukraine as evidence that Brexit has restored the country's scope for independent action on the world stage.
The former White House national security adviser will say: "Britain has taken a leading role in the West’s efforts to defeat this aggression and to make the point to would-be aggressors around the world.
"In many respects, I say with some envy, taking a stronger and more effective view than the US."
The UK has been widely praised over its swift response in helping Ukraine fight back against Russia in the war.
Since the start of the invasion on February 24, Britain has pledged more than £1.3billion in support to Ukraine.
I guess Mr Bolton has got it wrong - now who do I believe!! Him or TWTD posters? |  | | |
| If the UK were to rejoin the EU tomorrow on 11:54 - Jun 21 with 1167 views | XYZ |
| If the UK were to rejoin the EU tomorrow on 11:47 - Jun 21 by Icantbelieveyousaidt |
BREXIT BRITAIN has done more than the US and taken a "leading role" in helping Ukraine resist Russia's invasion of its country, a former White House advisor has astonishingly claimed.
John Bolton, the former White House national security adviser, will make the dramatic admission later today (Tuesday). He will speak at the launch of a new report on Britain’s role in the world after the country's split from the European Union. Mr Bolton will cite the strong UK military backing of Ukraine as evidence that Brexit has restored the country's scope for independent action on the world stage.
The former White House national security adviser will say: "Britain has taken a leading role in the West’s efforts to defeat this aggression and to make the point to would-be aggressors around the world.
"In many respects, I say with some envy, taking a stronger and more effective view than the US."
The UK has been widely praised over its swift response in helping Ukraine fight back against Russia in the war.
Since the start of the invasion on February 24, Britain has pledged more than £1.3billion in support to Ukraine.
I guess Mr Bolton has got it wrong - now who do I believe!! Him or TWTD posters? |
Lol, John Bolton.
Which bit of UK action re Ukraine would not have been possible if part of the EU? | | | |
| If the UK were to rejoin the EU tomorrow on 11:55 - Jun 21 with 1164 views | Churchman |
| If the UK were to rejoin the EU tomorrow on 11:15 - Jun 21 by Lord_Lucan |
That’s true to an extent but that is what government is supposed to do and something that we have recently failed to do in other areas. The role of government is largely to pick the best man or women for the job and to do a good job.
Like many successes and failures some people try and re write history and when memory fades they attempt to put their argument down as fact.
If we had been part of EU we would have joined the EU vaccine procurement scheme, I think it might have been Hungary who tried to wriggle out of it down the line but it’s pretty clear we would have joined it.
I just tried to google an interview with Kate Bingham where she went into great detail about the above - but after a brief search I couldn’t find it and I haven’t got the time to fart around all of the day. I did though come across an article in the FT where she said this
I ask whether her team seriously considered working with the EU vaccine procurement scheme, which would have been possible last year before Brexit took effect. “The Commission was happy for us to join the European procurement but we would not have a seat at the table, we had to abandon all the work we had done to date, we could not speak either then or in the future to any potential vaccine companies that would conflict with what they might want to do, and they would tell us when we would get the vaccine,” Bingham says. “Being a Remainer, it wasn’t as if I came in with any strong views that we had to do it our own way,” she adds. “But, actually, that was not a very difficult decision.”
Another piece of “VC thinking” was “don’t penny-pinch.” “When we were negotiating, no vaccine company knew what it was going to cost to make their vaccines, so it was all being done with best efforts and best data at the time. If we’d gone in and said ‘you’re charging us too much’, then they’d have replied ‘it was lovely to know you’ and walked away. “We ended up with agreed prices per dose and an agreed schedule,” Bingham continues. “But it was all about ‘How do we get the vaccines quickly?’ rather than ‘Could we shave another 50p off each dose?’”
Here's another fairly balanced review in The Repubblica
https://www.repubblica.it/cronaca/2021/02/07/news/kate_bingham_interview_vaccine |
Excellent post Lucan.
I would add that U.K. regulatory approval for vaccines was a lot faster than the EUs too. In a bid to play politics and hide their ineptitude they did their best to trash the regulators here by suggesting they were cutting corners, going too fast, not safe etc.
Linked to this, they did their best to destroy AZs reputation too with no foundation whatsoever. Politics and money. In terms of Covid AZ vaccine, Macron succeeded and the cost to that was 1000s of lives. The EU did not cover themselves in glory on this any more than they have with their Ukraine response.
Not being in the EU was in my view beneficial when it came to the vaccination programme and undoubtably saved lives in this country. This is no excuse for the governments many Covid failures (that cost lives) to add their list of chaos, but on this they got it broadly right, regardless of whether it was by accident or design. |  | | |
| If the UK were to rejoin the EU tomorrow on 11:57 - Jun 21 with 1161 views | MattinLondon |
| If the UK were to rejoin the EU tomorrow on 11:47 - Jun 21 by Icantbelieveyousaidt |
BREXIT BRITAIN has done more than the US and taken a "leading role" in helping Ukraine resist Russia's invasion of its country, a former White House advisor has astonishingly claimed.
John Bolton, the former White House national security adviser, will make the dramatic admission later today (Tuesday). He will speak at the launch of a new report on Britain’s role in the world after the country's split from the European Union. Mr Bolton will cite the strong UK military backing of Ukraine as evidence that Brexit has restored the country's scope for independent action on the world stage.
The former White House national security adviser will say: "Britain has taken a leading role in the West’s efforts to defeat this aggression and to make the point to would-be aggressors around the world.
"In many respects, I say with some envy, taking a stronger and more effective view than the US."
The UK has been widely praised over its swift response in helping Ukraine fight back against Russia in the war.
Since the start of the invasion on February 24, Britain has pledged more than £1.3billion in support to Ukraine.
I guess Mr Bolton has got it wrong - now who do I believe!! Him or TWTD posters? |
Bolton, like Trump, does not like multi- national organisations such as the EU or the UN. If I remember him correctly he doesn’t like international law or anything that limits the US.
He also doesn’t approve of the EU challenging America’s position as the leading power of the west as well as the Euro becoming stronger against the US Dollar.
Bolton may well not be the most neutral person when it comes to ‘independent’ states vs big international organisations. |  | | |
| If the UK were to rejoin the EU tomorrow on 12:03 - Jun 21 with 1152 views | Churchman |
| If the UK were to rejoin the EU tomorrow on 11:30 - Jun 21 by Lord_Lucan |
I agree 100% and good luck with that because I tried to get into the IP thing with our name and products a year or so ago but it was so mind blowingly confusing for an oik like me that I ended up paying a firm in Cambridge to sort it out.
I, along with other representatives in my trade association body have been dealing with SNP for a year and I can tell you they are the most useless undemocratic bunch I have ever worked with - but that's another story.
At present I have a business issue that I need help with but there is absolutely no point in contacting my local MP as it is Tom Hunt and he wouldn't be able to understand it as he is a cretin.
Next - we cannot get any clear guidance from BEIS about CE / UKCA changes yet we are supposed to have this in place for products entering the country from 2023!!!
Good luck with your endeavours with IP - you will certainly need it. |
Between 2014 - 2017, I was working in an area where some of my colleagues were working on devolution projects (putting in tax regimes, systems etc). They found the SNP the most dysfunctional, difficult crowd to deal with imaginable, so I’m not surprised you’ve had trouble with them. | | | |
| If the UK were to rejoin the EU tomorrow on 12:03 - Jun 21 with 1154 views | DanTheMan |
| If the UK were to rejoin the EU tomorrow on 11:57 - Jun 21 by MattinLondon |
Bolton, like Trump, does not like multi- national organisations such as the EU or the UN. If I remember him correctly he doesn’t like international law or anything that limits the US.
He also doesn’t approve of the EU challenging America’s position as the leading power of the west as well as the Euro becoming stronger against the US Dollar.
Bolton may well not be the most neutral person when it comes to ‘independent’ states vs big international organisations. |
I enjoy the bits they didn't copy from the Express article.
The US has pledged £4.3billion in security assistance since Joe Biden became President 18 months ago, which includes 6,500 Javelin anti-armour systems, 108 155mm Howitzers and 20 Mi-17 helicopters.
The UK has donated some 0.18 percent of its GDP in weapons, while the US has sent the equivalent of 0.22 percent.
Oh.
Also doesn't address XYZs point that this would still be possible in the EU unless I'm missing something. [Post edited 21 Jun 2022 12:04]
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| If the UK were to rejoin the EU tomorrow on 12:07 - Jun 21 with 1136 views | Dyland |
| If the UK were to rejoin the EU tomorrow on 11:30 - Jun 21 by Lord_Lucan |
I agree 100% and good luck with that because I tried to get into the IP thing with our name and products a year or so ago but it was so mind blowingly confusing for an oik like me that I ended up paying a firm in Cambridge to sort it out.
I, along with other representatives in my trade association body have been dealing with SNP for a year and I can tell you they are the most useless undemocratic bunch I have ever worked with - but that's another story.
At present I have a business issue that I need help with but there is absolutely no point in contacting my local MP as it is Tom Hunt and he wouldn't be able to understand it as he is a cretin.
Next - we cannot get any clear guidance from BEIS about CE / UKCA changes yet we are supposed to have this in place for products entering the country from 2023!!!
Good luck with your endeavours with IP - you will certainly need it. |
"At present I have a business issue that I need help with but there is absolutely no point in contacting my local MP as it is Tom Hunt and he wouldn't be able to understand it as he is a cretin."
You've let Tom off lightly there. I'd have added a strong adjective innit ba.
Yes and the irony is I'm an expert in my area of IP, but trying to even advise the goons and mooks making legislation and negotiating trade deals is next to impossible. | |
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| If the UK were to rejoin the EU tomorrow on 12:07 - Jun 21 with 1139 views | GeoffSentence |
| If the UK were to rejoin the EU tomorrow on 11:47 - Jun 21 by Icantbelieveyousaidt |
BREXIT BRITAIN has done more than the US and taken a "leading role" in helping Ukraine resist Russia's invasion of its country, a former White House advisor has astonishingly claimed.
John Bolton, the former White House national security adviser, will make the dramatic admission later today (Tuesday). He will speak at the launch of a new report on Britain’s role in the world after the country's split from the European Union. Mr Bolton will cite the strong UK military backing of Ukraine as evidence that Brexit has restored the country's scope for independent action on the world stage.
The former White House national security adviser will say: "Britain has taken a leading role in the West’s efforts to defeat this aggression and to make the point to would-be aggressors around the world.
"In many respects, I say with some envy, taking a stronger and more effective view than the US."
The UK has been widely praised over its swift response in helping Ukraine fight back against Russia in the war.
Since the start of the invasion on February 24, Britain has pledged more than £1.3billion in support to Ukraine.
I guess Mr Bolton has got it wrong - now who do I believe!! Him or TWTD posters? |
Being in the EU was no barrier to leading the way in the Balkans, marching into Iraq or sending troops to Afghanistan. Ergo, I call bullsh1t on any suggestion that our ability and desire to throw our weight around militarily is beefed up by brexit. |  |
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| If the UK were to rejoin the EU tomorrow on 12:09 - Jun 21 with 1127 views | Icantbelieveyousaidt |
| If the UK were to rejoin the EU tomorrow on 11:54 - Jun 21 by XYZ |
Lol, John Bolton.
Which bit of UK action re Ukraine would not have been possible if part of the EU? |
LONDON – Where post-Brexit Britain leads, the EU follows. At least, that’s the view among some British officials who are quietly congratulating themselves on the U.K.’s quick reactions to the Ukraine war.
In the two months since Putin’s forces invaded, Britain has sought to play a leading role in the efforts to help Ukraine in its fight – sending weapons, taking a hard line on Russian fuel exports and moving to cut import tariffs for Ukrainian goods.
Skeptics argue some of the U.K. moves amount to posturing aimed at scoring Brexit points. London failed to quickly set up a system for helping desperate Ukrainian refugees and took its time to sanction Russian oligarchs.
In other areas, Britain has been quicker to make key decisions while European Union countries struggle to reach agreements among themselves. The British move to cut tariffs, for example, was a precursor to the EU proposing the same.
Ukrainian President Volodymyr Zelenskyy has even praised British Prime Minister Boris Johnson for “helping more” than other leaders – and condemned EU members who have been slower to stop buying the Russian oil and gas that continues to fund the conflict.
Johnson is set to become the first world leader to address the parliament in Kyiv via videolink today. "This is Ukraine’s finest hour, an epic chapter in your national story that will be remembered and recounted for generations to come," he was preparing to say.
Ministers are patting themselves on the back. International Trade Secretary Anne-Marie Trevelyan, a Brexiteer, told POLITICO the government had cut tariffs on Ukraine via its free-trade agreement with the war-torn nation "because that means we can do it at pace.” That would have been impossible before Brexit.
Anand Menon, boss of the U.K. in a Changing Europe think tank, said it made sense that a post-Brexit British government would hope to steal a march on the EU at a time of crisis. “The politics of Brexit meant that the government wanted to be out there and being seen,” he said. “It has a political point to prove.”
Government officials insist that the U.K. has not been puffing out its post-Brexit chest. “If there was an opportunity to make that case, this would be it,” said one. “But we haven’t been, it’s just kind of happened without us shoehorning Brexit into everything.”
From my perspective nowt is that clear cut. I am not one of those who believes that everything the govt does is awful, or everything the opposition does is good. Who would want to be a politician of any party today!!!
How many of us could honestly say we would like to be tracked 24 hours a day, knowing that someone somewhere is always willing to 'drop you' in it.
Anyway I am so old that I can remember when John Bolton played for ITFC. I assume it is not the same one!! | | | |
| If the UK were to rejoin the EU tomorrow on 12:11 - Jun 21 with 1118 views | MattinLondon |
| If the UK were to rejoin the EU tomorrow on 12:03 - Jun 21 by DanTheMan |
I enjoy the bits they didn't copy from the Express article.
The US has pledged £4.3billion in security assistance since Joe Biden became President 18 months ago, which includes 6,500 Javelin anti-armour systems, 108 155mm Howitzers and 20 Mi-17 helicopters.
The UK has donated some 0.18 percent of its GDP in weapons, while the US has sent the equivalent of 0.22 percent.
Oh.
Also doesn't address XYZs point that this would still be possible in the EU unless I'm missing something. [Post edited 21 Jun 2022 12:04]
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On a separate point I think it was championed by some tabloid that the UK was now able to finalise defence pacts with both Sweden and Finland due to being outside of the EU. Whatever paper it was neglected to mention that both Sweden and Norway were able to do likewise whilst being in the EU. | | | |
| If the UK were to rejoin the EU tomorrow on 12:16 - Jun 21 with 1108 views | factual_blue |
| If the UK were to rejoin the EU tomorrow on 15:31 - Jun 20 by Eireannach_gorm |
Moving from Leitrim to London would indeed be a severe culture shock. |
Particularly for Londoners, who are used to culture. |  |
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| If the UK were to rejoin the EU tomorrow on 12:17 - Jun 21 with 1109 views | Icantbelieveyousaidt |
| If the UK were to rejoin the EU tomorrow on 12:07 - Jun 21 by GeoffSentence |
Being in the EU was no barrier to leading the way in the Balkans, marching into Iraq or sending troops to Afghanistan. Ergo, I call bullsh1t on any suggestion that our ability and desire to throw our weight around militarily is beefed up by brexit. |
Thank you for your impolite opinion - why have you replaced the letter 'i' though with the number '1' in one of your words. By the way I might with certain points agree with you; your delivery I can not.... | | | |
| If the UK were to rejoin the EU tomorrow on 12:21 - Jun 21 with 1092 views | GeoffSentence |
| If the UK were to rejoin the EU tomorrow on 12:17 - Jun 21 by Icantbelieveyousaidt |
Thank you for your impolite opinion - why have you replaced the letter 'i' though with the number '1' in one of your words. By the way I might with certain points agree with you; your delivery I can not.... |
Blunt maybe, impolite no.
There's a filter for naughty words on here, though bull isnt that naughty it doesn't get through the filter unchanged. | |
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| If the UK were to rejoin the EU tomorrow on 12:32 - Jun 21 with 1079 views | BlueBadger |
| If the UK were to rejoin the EU tomorrow on 12:17 - Jun 21 by Icantbelieveyousaidt |
Thank you for your impolite opinion - why have you replaced the letter 'i' though with the number '1' in one of your words. By the way I might with certain points agree with you; your delivery I can not.... |
It's not an opinion though, it's a fact. |  |
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| If the UK were to rejoin the EU tomorrow on 12:33 - Jun 21 with 1082 views | Swansea_Blue |
| If the UK were to rejoin the EU tomorrow on 11:47 - Jun 21 by Icantbelieveyousaidt |
BREXIT BRITAIN has done more than the US and taken a "leading role" in helping Ukraine resist Russia's invasion of its country, a former White House advisor has astonishingly claimed.
John Bolton, the former White House national security adviser, will make the dramatic admission later today (Tuesday). He will speak at the launch of a new report on Britain’s role in the world after the country's split from the European Union. Mr Bolton will cite the strong UK military backing of Ukraine as evidence that Brexit has restored the country's scope for independent action on the world stage.
The former White House national security adviser will say: "Britain has taken a leading role in the West’s efforts to defeat this aggression and to make the point to would-be aggressors around the world.
"In many respects, I say with some envy, taking a stronger and more effective view than the US."
The UK has been widely praised over its swift response in helping Ukraine fight back against Russia in the war.
Since the start of the invasion on February 24, Britain has pledged more than £1.3billion in support to Ukraine.
I guess Mr Bolton has got it wrong - now who do I believe!! Him or TWTD posters? |
Lovely, but misses the point of the thread entirely. We have always supported military actions, whether in or out of the EU.
We had a leading role in the Gulf War - 53k troops; 3 times more than France who provided the next most from Europe.
We had a leading role with the US in the Iraq War. 46,000 troops committed, which was well over a order of magnitude more than the next country allocation.
We had a leading role in Afghanistan - $30 bn spent and second only to the US.
Etc.
The point being we could (and likely would) have operated just the same way inside the EU. [Post edited 21 Jun 2022 12:39]
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| If the UK were to rejoin the EU tomorrow on 12:37 - Jun 21 with 1070 views | DanTheMan |
| If the UK were to rejoin the EU tomorrow on 12:09 - Jun 21 by Icantbelieveyousaidt |
LONDON – Where post-Brexit Britain leads, the EU follows. At least, that’s the view among some British officials who are quietly congratulating themselves on the U.K.’s quick reactions to the Ukraine war.
In the two months since Putin’s forces invaded, Britain has sought to play a leading role in the efforts to help Ukraine in its fight – sending weapons, taking a hard line on Russian fuel exports and moving to cut import tariffs for Ukrainian goods.
Skeptics argue some of the U.K. moves amount to posturing aimed at scoring Brexit points. London failed to quickly set up a system for helping desperate Ukrainian refugees and took its time to sanction Russian oligarchs.
In other areas, Britain has been quicker to make key decisions while European Union countries struggle to reach agreements among themselves. The British move to cut tariffs, for example, was a precursor to the EU proposing the same.
Ukrainian President Volodymyr Zelenskyy has even praised British Prime Minister Boris Johnson for “helping more” than other leaders – and condemned EU members who have been slower to stop buying the Russian oil and gas that continues to fund the conflict.
Johnson is set to become the first world leader to address the parliament in Kyiv via videolink today. "This is Ukraine’s finest hour, an epic chapter in your national story that will be remembered and recounted for generations to come," he was preparing to say.
Ministers are patting themselves on the back. International Trade Secretary Anne-Marie Trevelyan, a Brexiteer, told POLITICO the government had cut tariffs on Ukraine via its free-trade agreement with the war-torn nation "because that means we can do it at pace.” That would have been impossible before Brexit.
Anand Menon, boss of the U.K. in a Changing Europe think tank, said it made sense that a post-Brexit British government would hope to steal a march on the EU at a time of crisis. “The politics of Brexit meant that the government wanted to be out there and being seen,” he said. “It has a political point to prove.”
Government officials insist that the U.K. has not been puffing out its post-Brexit chest. “If there was an opportunity to make that case, this would be it,” said one. “But we haven’t been, it’s just kind of happened without us shoehorning Brexit into everything.”
From my perspective nowt is that clear cut. I am not one of those who believes that everything the govt does is awful, or everything the opposition does is good. Who would want to be a politician of any party today!!!
How many of us could honestly say we would like to be tracked 24 hours a day, knowing that someone somewhere is always willing to 'drop you' in it.
Anyway I am so old that I can remember when John Bolton played for ITFC. I assume it is not the same one!! |
You'd be better off posting the full articles, as it seems like you're cutting out critical pieces.
https://www.politico.eu/article/brexit-britain-help-ukraine/ | |
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