| The Tories are dead aren't they? on 13:54 - Oct 7 with 2210 views | Steve_M |
I think Robert Jenrick's outright racism, given he is positioning to be their next leader, should be getting far more attention.
Apparently, a black journalist questioning him is fomenting terrorism:
Wow. Robert Jenrick doubles down by branding a black journalist's questions "ridiculous" and saying that the problem is not his comments, but "journalists like you who pop up and try to knock me down", adding that "this is the reason why terrorist attacks happen". ~AA — Best for Britain (@bestforbritain.org) 2025-10-07T08:43:32.642Z
That they can't spell the name of the country they wish to govern is just the incompetence side of the mess they're in. |  |
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| The Tories are dead aren't they? on 14:04 - Oct 7 with 2159 views | Blueschev |
| The Tories are dead aren't they? on 13:54 - Oct 7 by Steve_M |
I think Robert Jenrick's outright racism, given he is positioning to be their next leader, should be getting far more attention.
Apparently, a black journalist questioning him is fomenting terrorism:
Wow. Robert Jenrick doubles down by branding a black journalist's questions "ridiculous" and saying that the problem is not his comments, but "journalists like you who pop up and try to knock me down", adding that "this is the reason why terrorist attacks happen". ~AA — Best for Britain (@bestforbritain.org) 2025-10-07T08:43:32.642Z
That they can't spell the name of the country they wish to govern is just the incompetence side of the mess they're in. |
It's absolutely disgusting that this rhetoric is being spouted by the opposition. Ten years ago he would be gone, but now the language of the far right is increasingly becoming mainstream. I'm actually quite frightened for the future of this country. |  | | |
| The Tories are dead aren't they? on 14:12 - Oct 7 with 2120 views | MattinLondon |
| The Tories are dead aren't they? on 14:04 - Oct 7 by Blueschev |
It's absolutely disgusting that this rhetoric is being spouted by the opposition. Ten years ago he would be gone, but now the language of the far right is increasingly becoming mainstream. I'm actually quite frightened for the future of this country. |
Twenty years ago a clumsy charlatan such as him wouldn’t be anywhere near to being a MP yet alone on the front bench. The country needs strong and sensible opposition but instead we have Reform and a pathetic Tory Party. |  | | |
| The Tories are dead aren't they? on 15:02 - Oct 7 with 1950 views | Herbivore |
| The Tories are dead aren't they? on 13:54 - Oct 7 by Steve_M |
I think Robert Jenrick's outright racism, given he is positioning to be their next leader, should be getting far more attention.
Apparently, a black journalist questioning him is fomenting terrorism:
Wow. Robert Jenrick doubles down by branding a black journalist's questions "ridiculous" and saying that the problem is not his comments, but "journalists like you who pop up and try to knock me down", adding that "this is the reason why terrorist attacks happen". ~AA — Best for Britain (@bestforbritain.org) 2025-10-07T08:43:32.642Z
That they can't spell the name of the country they wish to govern is just the incompetence side of the mess they're in. |
Didn't he also say something recently about not wanting his daughters sharing a neighbourhood with asylum seekers? Make your mind up, Bob, do you want integration or are you just being a racist prick again? |  |
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| The Tories are dead aren't they? on 15:22 - Oct 7 with 1864 views | Radlett_blue |
| The Tories are dead aren't they? on 14:12 - Oct 7 by MattinLondon |
Twenty years ago a clumsy charlatan such as him wouldn’t be anywhere near to being a MP yet alone on the front bench. The country needs strong and sensible opposition but instead we have Reform and a pathetic Tory Party. |
Well, it's easy to criticise the Tories because they were in power for 14 years & didn't do a good job. And the result (driven also by uncontrolled immigration) is the rise of Reform. This must be far less palatable to most reasonable people. T
As with the rise of Trump, it's more sensible to ask why large proportions of both the USA & much of Europe are now supporting populists/extremists. I think it's largely because the life of Mr Average has become worse & that is likely to continue to do so, given low economic growth & poor demographics. And at a time when the top few percent (in USA more so, but also in Britain) are getting even richer. |  |
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| The Tories are dead aren't they? on 15:23 - Oct 7 with 1857 views | NthQldITFC |
| The Tories are dead aren't they? on 13:54 - Oct 7 by Steve_M |
I think Robert Jenrick's outright racism, given he is positioning to be their next leader, should be getting far more attention.
Apparently, a black journalist questioning him is fomenting terrorism:
Wow. Robert Jenrick doubles down by branding a black journalist's questions "ridiculous" and saying that the problem is not his comments, but "journalists like you who pop up and try to knock me down", adding that "this is the reason why terrorist attacks happen". ~AA — Best for Britain (@bestforbritain.org) 2025-10-07T08:43:32.642Z
That they can't spell the name of the country they wish to govern is just the incompetence side of the mess they're in. |
"We can't have particular communities in this country where there's a heavy preponderance of one group or another."
I'll bet you a grand, Mr Jenrick, you nasty racist little bastard, that you wouldn't be complaining about a particular community where there's a heavy preponderance of white people, would you, you nasty racist little bastard? |  |
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| The Tories are dead aren't they? on 15:42 - Oct 7 with 1782 views | DJR |
| The Tories are dead aren't they? on 15:23 - Oct 7 by NthQldITFC |
"We can't have particular communities in this country where there's a heavy preponderance of one group or another."
I'll bet you a grand, Mr Jenrick, you nasty racist little bastard, that you wouldn't be complaining about a particular community where there's a heavy preponderance of white people, would you, you nasty racist little bastard? |
His grand family home is in Herefordshire, a long way from his constituency. According to the 2021 Census, 96.9% of the population are white. The village he lives in is even more white. [Post edited 7 Oct 15:45]
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| The Tories are dead aren't they? on 15:43 - Oct 7 with 1768 views | Herbivore |
| The Tories are dead aren't they? on 15:22 - Oct 7 by Radlett_blue |
Well, it's easy to criticise the Tories because they were in power for 14 years & didn't do a good job. And the result (driven also by uncontrolled immigration) is the rise of Reform. This must be far less palatable to most reasonable people. T
As with the rise of Trump, it's more sensible to ask why large proportions of both the USA & much of Europe are now supporting populists/extremists. I think it's largely because the life of Mr Average has become worse & that is likely to continue to do so, given low economic growth & poor demographics. And at a time when the top few percent (in USA more so, but also in Britain) are getting even richer. |
I think the reasons you give are sound, it's just a shame they are driven - largely by social and mainstream media primarily owned by that same top few percent - to the arms of snake oil salesmen who will only make their lot even worse while further lining their own pockets and those of their paymasters. Trump throws out a lot of rhetoric and is following through on some of it more this time, but mainly what he wants to do is push through policies that will benefit the super rich. Deregulation, lower taxes, it's basically more of the same economically but on steroids and it'll only further exacerbate the inequalities that help to push people towards the likes of Trump and Reform. | |
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| The Tories are dead aren't they? on 15:44 - Oct 7 with 1763 views | DJR |
You'd never guess it, but the man voted to Remain.
The expression "zeal of a convert" springs to mind but it is difficult to conclude that it is anything other naked ambition that drives everything he does. [Post edited 7 Oct 15:49]
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| The Tories are dead aren't they? on 15:47 - Oct 7 with 1749 views | Steve_M |
| The Tories are dead aren't they? on 15:22 - Oct 7 by Radlett_blue |
Well, it's easy to criticise the Tories because they were in power for 14 years & didn't do a good job. And the result (driven also by uncontrolled immigration) is the rise of Reform. This must be far less palatable to most reasonable people. T
As with the rise of Trump, it's more sensible to ask why large proportions of both the USA & much of Europe are now supporting populists/extremists. I think it's largely because the life of Mr Average has become worse & that is likely to continue to do so, given low economic growth & poor demographics. And at a time when the top few percent (in USA more so, but also in Britain) are getting even richer. |
The economic trajectories of the UK and US have been very different post-2008 financial crisis though. UK growth was well below the pre-crisis trend even before the self-inflicted harm of Brexit but the US economy has grown consistently until the post-covid inflationary bump. That many might feel life is getting worse is true, but I don't think that's close to being a sufficient answer.
The dominance of that 0.1% in the US over media, and their resentments, coupled with the collapse of traditional media has definitely skewed perceptions, something covid just magnified. There are a lot of comfortably off Americans who like the vindictiveness of Trump though, or others who liked him on TV.
In the UK though, racism wasn't platformed in the same way that Musk and Paul Marshall are now championing it. The tabloids always had some racism within them, indeed so did broadsheets of left and right, but it was becoming less and less acceptable. Most people, I hope, still think it is but parts of the media and too many politicians seem to be rather enjoying it's comeback. | |
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| The Tories are dead aren't they? on 16:01 - Oct 7 with 1686 views | DJR |
I'm with Lord Sumption.
Lord Sumption, a former supreme court judge, told the World at One that Robert Jenrick’s proposal to change the judicial appointments process so that the lord chancellor (the justice secretary) appoints judges would be a “serious mistake”.
Sumption said that, before 2005, the lord chancellor did appoint judges. But opinion was “much less polarised” then, he said. He said the only Marxist to sit on the high court bench was appointed by Lord Hailsham, a Conservative. He went on:
"If judges were appointed in today’s polarised world by the lord chancellor, I do not think the public would have the same confidence in their independence. They’re actually appointed by the judicial appointments commission, which is an independent, non-political body, and it looks for the same qualities in the judges it appoints.
The only possible reason for going back to the old system would be to appoint judges who were less independent or more political than the ones appointed by the judicial appointments commission."
Sumption said the Jenrick policy would bring the UK closer to the US model, where the president appoints judges to the supreme court. He went on:
"In the United States, the supreme court has become subservient to the president and enabled him to behave like an autocrat. I think that that is a very serious business in the United States, and we should be very careful to take take warning from it."
Sumption also said he did not think it was objectionable for part-time judges to give free legal services to bodies like migration charities. Making public statements that were politically controversial was a form of misconduct, he said. But he said there were already procedures in place to deal with that. The system “works perfectly well”, he said.
He went on:
"Judges have got to be independent of the government and independent of political sentiment. I entirely agree with that. But they can’t be independent if they’re liable to denounced by politicians. I think that that is a serious mistake. It’s a misjudgment on his part." | | | |
| The Tories are dead aren't they? on 16:06 - Oct 7 with 1655 views | Blueschev |
| The Tories are dead aren't they? on 15:22 - Oct 7 by Radlett_blue |
Well, it's easy to criticise the Tories because they were in power for 14 years & didn't do a good job. And the result (driven also by uncontrolled immigration) is the rise of Reform. This must be far less palatable to most reasonable people. T
As with the rise of Trump, it's more sensible to ask why large proportions of both the USA & much of Europe are now supporting populists/extremists. I think it's largely because the life of Mr Average has become worse & that is likely to continue to do so, given low economic growth & poor demographics. And at a time when the top few percent (in USA more so, but also in Britain) are getting even richer. |
In the case of the UK I believe a major issue is there is a huge disconnect between politicians and the general population, and a feeling of helplessness. The choice at elections is essentially managers of the same economic system. State assets have largely been sold off, with no economic benefit to the population that supposedly used to own them. A generation of people are now worse off than their parents, with nobody offering any vision of how to reverse such a trend. There's also been a significant demographic change in the UK without warning, implemented by two political parties who at the same time as doing so have claimed they want to combat it. [Post edited 7 Oct 16:21]
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| The Tories are dead aren't they? on 16:09 - Oct 7 with 1612 views | Radlett_blue |
| The Tories are dead aren't they? on 15:47 - Oct 7 by Steve_M |
The economic trajectories of the UK and US have been very different post-2008 financial crisis though. UK growth was well below the pre-crisis trend even before the self-inflicted harm of Brexit but the US economy has grown consistently until the post-covid inflationary bump. That many might feel life is getting worse is true, but I don't think that's close to being a sufficient answer.
The dominance of that 0.1% in the US over media, and their resentments, coupled with the collapse of traditional media has definitely skewed perceptions, something covid just magnified. There are a lot of comfortably off Americans who like the vindictiveness of Trump though, or others who liked him on TV.
In the UK though, racism wasn't platformed in the same way that Musk and Paul Marshall are now championing it. The tabloids always had some racism within them, indeed so did broadsheets of left and right, but it was becoming less and less acceptable. Most people, I hope, still think it is but parts of the media and too many politicians seem to be rather enjoying it's comeback. |
Yes, the USA & UK are (fortunately) very different. The US economy has continued to do better, largely because it remains the world leader in the largest & fastest growing industry- technology. The US, outside a few large cities, is also relatively under-populated, which means that property prices in many areas are low, allowing ordinary people to have a decent standard of living.
Yes, a lot of well off American like Trump, largely because he's an advocate of low taxation & is seen as pro-business.
My main point, though, is that it seems perverse for people to celebrate the demise of the Tories when it looks like they're going to be replaced by Reform. [Post edited 7 Oct 16:11]
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| The Tories are dead aren't they? on 16:45 - Oct 7 with 1503 views | Pinewoodblue |
If you want to keep a Labour Government, after the next election, you have to hope that somehow the Tories recover. |  |
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| The Tories are dead aren't they? on 17:01 - Oct 7 with 1438 views | giant_stow |
| The Tories are dead aren't they? on 16:06 - Oct 7 by Blueschev |
In the case of the UK I believe a major issue is there is a huge disconnect between politicians and the general population, and a feeling of helplessness. The choice at elections is essentially managers of the same economic system. State assets have largely been sold off, with no economic benefit to the population that supposedly used to own them. A generation of people are now worse off than their parents, with nobody offering any vision of how to reverse such a trend. There's also been a significant demographic change in the UK without warning, implemented by two political parties who at the same time as doing so have claimed they want to combat it. [Post edited 7 Oct 16:21]
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I think there's been two large demographic changes and one is influencing the other. Society is ageing, which we were warned about, and to address that, immigration has gone up.
A lot of young people are left without hope, as their masters are the ones suppressing wages, while letting asset prices surge. People's labour is now at a massive disadvantage to capital, and most young people have no capital. Hence they turn to Farage who sells them false hope and blame of the very immigrants who have been brought in to help suppress wages, largely for the benefit of older people who *do* generally have money to spend. |  |
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| The Tories are dead aren't they? on 17:27 - Oct 7 with 1346 views | Herbivore |
| The Tories are dead aren't they? on 17:01 - Oct 7 by giant_stow |
I think there's been two large demographic changes and one is influencing the other. Society is ageing, which we were warned about, and to address that, immigration has gone up.
A lot of young people are left without hope, as their masters are the ones suppressing wages, while letting asset prices surge. People's labour is now at a massive disadvantage to capital, and most young people have no capital. Hence they turn to Farage who sells them false hope and blame of the very immigrants who have been brought in to help suppress wages, largely for the benefit of older people who *do* generally have money to spend. |
Although there's been some support for Reform from youngsters, their support is mainly still from the older demographic so not sure that explanation of disenfranchised youth swinging to Farage fully scans. | |
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| The Tories are dead aren't they? on 17:51 - Oct 7 with 1289 views | giant_stow |
| The Tories are dead aren't they? on 17:27 - Oct 7 by Herbivore |
Although there's been some support for Reform from youngsters, their support is mainly still from the older demographic so not sure that explanation of disenfranchised youth swinging to Farage fully scans. |
Fair enough mr - I guess I got into a train of thought. Anything, but thinking of Sunday. | |
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| The Tories are dead aren't they? on 17:57 - Oct 7 with 1268 views | StokieBlue |
| The Tories are dead aren't they? on 15:23 - Oct 7 by NthQldITFC |
"We can't have particular communities in this country where there's a heavy preponderance of one group or another."
I'll bet you a grand, Mr Jenrick, you nasty racist little bastard, that you wouldn't be complaining about a particular community where there's a heavy preponderance of white people, would you, you nasty racist little bastard? |
He's also now said that area looked like a slum.
Given his party were recently in power for 15 years he might want to have a think about that if it's actually his opinion.
SB |  | | |
| The Tories are dead aren't they? on 18:03 - Oct 7 with 1236 views | bluelagos |
Fingers crossed. |  |
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| The Tories are dead aren't they? on 18:17 - Oct 7 with 1193 views | redrickstuhaart |
| The Tories are dead aren't they? on 14:04 - Oct 7 by Blueschev |
It's absolutely disgusting that this rhetoric is being spouted by the opposition. Ten years ago he would be gone, but now the language of the far right is increasingly becoming mainstream. I'm actually quite frightened for the future of this country. |
Its becoming normalised. Trump has led the way and these people are following.
"Emboldened". |  | | |
| The Tories are dead aren't they? on 18:40 - Oct 7 with 1142 views | redrickstuhaart |
| The Tories are dead aren't they? on 16:01 - Oct 7 by DJR |
I'm with Lord Sumption.
Lord Sumption, a former supreme court judge, told the World at One that Robert Jenrick’s proposal to change the judicial appointments process so that the lord chancellor (the justice secretary) appoints judges would be a “serious mistake”.
Sumption said that, before 2005, the lord chancellor did appoint judges. But opinion was “much less polarised” then, he said. He said the only Marxist to sit on the high court bench was appointed by Lord Hailsham, a Conservative. He went on:
"If judges were appointed in today’s polarised world by the lord chancellor, I do not think the public would have the same confidence in their independence. They’re actually appointed by the judicial appointments commission, which is an independent, non-political body, and it looks for the same qualities in the judges it appoints.
The only possible reason for going back to the old system would be to appoint judges who were less independent or more political than the ones appointed by the judicial appointments commission."
Sumption said the Jenrick policy would bring the UK closer to the US model, where the president appoints judges to the supreme court. He went on:
"In the United States, the supreme court has become subservient to the president and enabled him to behave like an autocrat. I think that that is a very serious business in the United States, and we should be very careful to take take warning from it."
Sumption also said he did not think it was objectionable for part-time judges to give free legal services to bodies like migration charities. Making public statements that were politically controversial was a form of misconduct, he said. But he said there were already procedures in place to deal with that. The system “works perfectly well”, he said.
He went on:
"Judges have got to be independent of the government and independent of political sentiment. I entirely agree with that. But they can’t be independent if they’re liable to denounced by politicians. I think that that is a serious mistake. It’s a misjudgment on his part." |
He is absolutely correct. I hadn't seen Jenrick suggesting this change.
A very troubling prospect, because you can just see reform borrowing the policy too. Straight out of the Trump playbook, yet again. | | | |
| The Tories are dead aren't they? on 19:00 - Oct 7 with 1094 views | Swansea_Blue |
| The Tories are dead aren't they? on 16:01 - Oct 7 by DJR |
I'm with Lord Sumption.
Lord Sumption, a former supreme court judge, told the World at One that Robert Jenrick’s proposal to change the judicial appointments process so that the lord chancellor (the justice secretary) appoints judges would be a “serious mistake”.
Sumption said that, before 2005, the lord chancellor did appoint judges. But opinion was “much less polarised” then, he said. He said the only Marxist to sit on the high court bench was appointed by Lord Hailsham, a Conservative. He went on:
"If judges were appointed in today’s polarised world by the lord chancellor, I do not think the public would have the same confidence in their independence. They’re actually appointed by the judicial appointments commission, which is an independent, non-political body, and it looks for the same qualities in the judges it appoints.
The only possible reason for going back to the old system would be to appoint judges who were less independent or more political than the ones appointed by the judicial appointments commission."
Sumption said the Jenrick policy would bring the UK closer to the US model, where the president appoints judges to the supreme court. He went on:
"In the United States, the supreme court has become subservient to the president and enabled him to behave like an autocrat. I think that that is a very serious business in the United States, and we should be very careful to take take warning from it."
Sumption also said he did not think it was objectionable for part-time judges to give free legal services to bodies like migration charities. Making public statements that were politically controversial was a form of misconduct, he said. But he said there were already procedures in place to deal with that. The system “works perfectly well”, he said.
He went on:
"Judges have got to be independent of the government and independent of political sentiment. I entirely agree with that. But they can’t be independent if they’re liable to denounced by politicians. I think that that is a serious mistake. It’s a misjudgment on his part." |
Racism in the Tory party doesn’t surprise me, but this is a very dangerous direction to be heading. The bloke’s an opportunistic chancer and I hope he (or others on the lunatic right) don’t go down this route. We have to keep the judiciary independent and not follow the US model. |  |
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| The Tories are dead aren't they? on 19:07 - Oct 7 with 1073 views | OldFart71 |
| The Tories are dead aren't they? on 16:06 - Oct 7 by Blueschev |
In the case of the UK I believe a major issue is there is a huge disconnect between politicians and the general population, and a feeling of helplessness. The choice at elections is essentially managers of the same economic system. State assets have largely been sold off, with no economic benefit to the population that supposedly used to own them. A generation of people are now worse off than their parents, with nobody offering any vision of how to reverse such a trend. There's also been a significant demographic change in the UK without warning, implemented by two political parties who at the same time as doing so have claimed they want to combat it. [Post edited 7 Oct 16:21]
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I agree with what you say. I can see totally where young people are coming from when they say that things are nowhere near as good for them as their parents.
Then when I look back a while my parents and to a even greater extent my grandparents were a lot worse off than I was.
I'm not saying everything was milk and honey. It wasn't. Jobs were easy to come by, but many were poorly paid. There wasn't a minimum wage, although there would be overtime paid at time and a half or double time.
I got married at 23. We said we'd have a quiet wedding. Mother-in-law had a silencer on the shotgun.
My ex was pregnant. I worked for the lawnmowers in Stowmarket. Hard, dirty work on a production line.
Luckily by the time my second was born I had a better job and a few years later I bought my first house.
10 years later I was divorced and basically started again. New mortgage and kids to look after. Along with my partner we took in two stray friends of our children. So a full house for a few years. Both working full time and Sunday was fun as the washing machine would be on all day along with the tumble dryer into the late evening. Good job energy was a bit cheaper then.
Now a grandfather I still try to help my kids, both financially and advice wise.
I have had and am having a decent life.
I will try my hardest to also make the life of my grandchildren as good as I can. I see it as my duty. I'm not wealthy, but I'm not skint either. | | | |
| The Tories are dead aren't they? on 19:25 - Oct 7 with 1025 views | Plums |
| The Tories are dead aren't they? on 18:17 - Oct 7 by redrickstuhaart |
Its becoming normalised. Trump has led the way and these people are following.
"Emboldened". |
I was in the hospital in Boston, Lincs yesterday. There was an old bloke in a Make England Great Again hat...
If the people he's supporting get in, the medics who treated him won't be around and he'd have to pay to sit in the same chair he was using. I'd have had a conversation with him but TBH he didn't look as though it would be welcomed.
Emboldened is the right word.
Edit: the irony of Pilgrim Hospital being named after people travelling to populate other lands in boats is rather delicious. [Post edited 7 Oct 19:27]
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