| Ashton Speaks 17:13 - Jun 11 with 9761 views | GlasgowBlue |
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| Ashton Speaks on 23:06 - Jun 11 with 1081 views | WicklowBlue |
The absolute state of some of the comments on this thread!!!
Enjoy sticking your verbal knives into the club and Ashton etc.
For me I thought this was a well worded respectful goodbye, they worked closely over the past 4.5 years. But Ashton HAS to keep the club first and foremost, ITFC is the priority.
Respect to McK and I thought Ashton's message was spot on. If he didnt say anything everyone would be laying into him yet he did and people are doing the same.
Disappointed in the reactions here imho. |  | | |
| Ashton Speaks on 23:11 - Jun 11 with 1052 views | TheMoralMajority |
| Ashton Speaks on 23:02 - Jun 11 by Churchman |
Paragraph 1: it’s very possible to be wrong in judging people on what others say. Quite often they have an axe to grind. I don’t know who on this forum has met him but perhaps they can enlighten me.
Paragraph 2: very good of you to give him a smidgeon of credit.
Paragrapg 3: O’Leary was here to primarily facilitate and oversee the takeover. I believe he spent very little time here, living in the West Country. What his involvement was, I’ve no idea. Nor do I know how the club is structured. What is the level of accountability with the owners? How often does the CEO have to answer to them?
What do the other Directors do? The structure looks odd but we have owners 5000 miles away. What is Schwartz involvement? I don’t know enough about the structure and the titles are pretty unimportant. It’s what people actually do. Whatever it is, as the club grows it will have to change anyway.
The simple facts are three promotions in five seasons. One poor manager which isn’t down to the current owners and one good one. A club heading for oblivion before Gamechanger now starting in the Premier League in August for the second time in three seasons. A new training ground, Cat 1, ground tidied up, community work, full houses etc etc.
Maybe Ashton had nothing to do with any of that. Maybe he’s spent five years blundering about making bad signings and trying to unstick the coffee cup from his hand and doing passable impressions of Brent. You tell me.
Personally, I think as an outsider looking in and viewing then and now that he has done a terrific job overall. Has he made mistakes! Oh yes. Lots of them. But people that do stuff tend to get it wrong sometimes. The trick is whether they learn from them. In ITFCs case, comms in particular. It needs to be a lot better.
Would I want to know the bloke? Not really. I doubt we’d get on but I’d have to meet him to decide that. I worked with a number of people over the years with ‘reputations’ and I can think of only one a’hole that matched the billing.
That is how I see it and him. |
Has he made mistakes! Oh yes. Lots of them. But people that do stuff tend to get it wrong sometimes. The trick is whether they learn from them.
To learn from them, you tend to need to own them. Lie, deceive, cover up, lie again and then not apologise for any of it tends to suggest (to me at least) that he is not learning anything (other than maybe how to cover it up better next time).
Meanwhile, extolling virtues like "Running towards adversity" and "doing the right thing whilst no one is looking", whilst doing the exact opposite of that does not fill me with confidence in his character.
Words are cheap. Actions matter.
The guy has clearly done so much good for this club, which is what makes it so painful for him to completely obliterate all the trust and goodwill that he has built (for me... again).
Anyhow, I've said this all before, so I'm not here to relitigate. I just think that anyone can do a lot of good in life. Anyone can (and do) also make mistakes. How we respond to these mistakes is what marks us out as people. Ashton, for me, could not really have failed that test much harder. Being good at one thing does not mean I should turn a blind eye to things I find genuinely unpalatable. [Post edited 11 Jun 23:33]
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| Ashton Speaks on 23:13 - Jun 11 with 1042 views | TheMoralMajority |
| Ashton Speaks on 23:06 - Jun 11 by WicklowBlue |
The absolute state of some of the comments on this thread!!!
Enjoy sticking your verbal knives into the club and Ashton etc.
For me I thought this was a well worded respectful goodbye, they worked closely over the past 4.5 years. But Ashton HAS to keep the club first and foremost, ITFC is the priority.
Respect to McK and I thought Ashton's message was spot on. If he didnt say anything everyone would be laying into him yet he did and people are doing the same.
Disappointed in the reactions here imho. |
fwiw, my above comment is about my wider view about what has gone before. The video from him re: the way forward is about what was expected. No more, no less. [Post edited 11 Jun 23:13]
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| Ashton Speaks on 23:13 - Jun 11 with 1037 views | Nthsuffolkblue |
| Ashton Speaks on 23:05 - Jun 11 by The_Flashing_Smile |
"I worry about him running my club."
You're not happy with the direction the club's gone in since he arrived? |
It is possible to be delighted with the direction the club has been taken and still have concerns about the man who appears to be becoming increasingly in control of it.
If Ashton makes another great appointment, all will be well. However, if the decision ends up not going well, I think Ashton will have to be the one who takes responsibility for that.
It may well be that my intense dislike of Farage and everything he stands for goes a long way in my lack of faith in Ashton after how he handled the whole situation. However, I am concerned that what has gone well can very quickly become undone. |  |
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| Ashton Speaks on 23:29 - Jun 11 with 956 views | WicklowBlue |
| Ashton Speaks on 23:11 - Jun 11 by TheMoralMajority |
Has he made mistakes! Oh yes. Lots of them. But people that do stuff tend to get it wrong sometimes. The trick is whether they learn from them.
To learn from them, you tend to need to own them. Lie, deceive, cover up, lie again and then not apologise for any of it tends to suggest (to me at least) that he is not learning anything (other than maybe how to cover it up better next time).
Meanwhile, extolling virtues like "Running towards adversity" and "doing the right thing whilst no one is looking", whilst doing the exact opposite of that does not fill me with confidence in his character.
Words are cheap. Actions matter.
The guy has clearly done so much good for this club, which is what makes it so painful for him to completely obliterate all the trust and goodwill that he has built (for me... again).
Anyhow, I've said this all before, so I'm not here to relitigate. I just think that anyone can do a lot of good in life. Anyone can (and do) also make mistakes. How we respond to these mistakes is what marks us out as people. Ashton, for me, could not really have failed that test much harder. Being good at one thing does not mean I should turn a blind eye to things I find genuinely unpalatable. [Post edited 11 Jun 23:33]
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"The guy has clearly done so much good for this club, which is what makes it so painful for him to completely obliterate all the trust and goodwill that he has built (for me... again)."
Specifics please instead of vaccous commentary. Maybe for you and I presume the Farage stuff is what you are alluding to?
I look at my club and where is has been since I have been on this planet, where we were headed in L1 under ME and where we are today.... are poles apart.
Appreciate people have strong political views but seriously?
"To learn from them, you tend to need to own them. Lie, deceive, cover up, lie again and then not apologise for any of it tends to suggest (to me at least) that he is not learning anything (other than maybe how to cover it up better next time)."
Think the above says more about you than anything else!
I'm going to leave it there, as this it really irritating when sports wise one of our best managers ever has departed and Ashton cant win no matter what he says... despite the two of them have been the best thing that happened to Towen in decades.
Whether you like it or not Ashton is now responsible for our next path forward. | | | |
| Ashton Speaks on 23:34 - Jun 11 with 943 views | Joey_Joe_Joe_Junior |
| Ashton Speaks on 23:06 - Jun 11 by WicklowBlue |
The absolute state of some of the comments on this thread!!!
Enjoy sticking your verbal knives into the club and Ashton etc.
For me I thought this was a well worded respectful goodbye, they worked closely over the past 4.5 years. But Ashton HAS to keep the club first and foremost, ITFC is the priority.
Respect to McK and I thought Ashton's message was spot on. If he didnt say anything everyone would be laying into him yet he did and people are doing the same.
Disappointed in the reactions here imho. |
DW about it, it’s their safe space. Look at the footage post QPR to see what the real mood is with our fanbase. TWTD isn’t a true reflection, it’s a rather angry minority IMO. Just look at that thread a few hours KM left, ridiculous.
I’ve got a few football reasons why Ashton might worry me but it’s quite clear it’s not what’s going on here. He’s also done a lot right for this club and the owners know that. |  |
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| Ashton Speaks on 23:41 - Jun 11 with 909 views | TheMoralMajority |
| Ashton Speaks on 23:29 - Jun 11 by WicklowBlue |
"The guy has clearly done so much good for this club, which is what makes it so painful for him to completely obliterate all the trust and goodwill that he has built (for me... again)."
Specifics please instead of vaccous commentary. Maybe for you and I presume the Farage stuff is what you are alluding to?
I look at my club and where is has been since I have been on this planet, where we were headed in L1 under ME and where we are today.... are poles apart.
Appreciate people have strong political views but seriously?
"To learn from them, you tend to need to own them. Lie, deceive, cover up, lie again and then not apologise for any of it tends to suggest (to me at least) that he is not learning anything (other than maybe how to cover it up better next time)."
Think the above says more about you than anything else!
I'm going to leave it there, as this it really irritating when sports wise one of our best managers ever has departed and Ashton cant win no matter what he says... despite the two of them have been the best thing that happened to Towen in decades.
Whether you like it or not Ashton is now responsible for our next path forward. |
Glad you think my commentary is vacuous. Like I said before, I am not looking to relitigate here. And I am not looking to change anyone's minds. I have my views. For me integrity is important, for others, not so much, and that's fine. I accept that I am very much in the minority. I said my piece, repeatedly, at the time, so you are welcome to go through my posting history, as I don't really have any interest in dragging the board down to this again, I just felt I had to respond to a post that I felt mischaracterised the situation somewhat.
I will say though (as honestly, it annoys the living hell out of me that people seem to want to prescribe my views to politics)... It isn't, and never has been, about politics for me (beyond the fact that no team should be seen to align with any political party as politics are, by their nature, divisive). Could have been Farage, could have been Polanski, could have been Starmer. The person makes no difference, and besides that isn't my real issue. Hold your hands up, admit the mistake, we all move on.
My issue is lying, doubling down and lying again. I don't appreciate being lied to. Ever. By anyone. [Post edited 11 Jun 23:43]
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| Ashton Speaks on 23:50 - Jun 11 with 857 views | ITFCSG |
| Ashton Speaks on 23:41 - Jun 11 by TheMoralMajority |
Glad you think my commentary is vacuous. Like I said before, I am not looking to relitigate here. And I am not looking to change anyone's minds. I have my views. For me integrity is important, for others, not so much, and that's fine. I accept that I am very much in the minority. I said my piece, repeatedly, at the time, so you are welcome to go through my posting history, as I don't really have any interest in dragging the board down to this again, I just felt I had to respond to a post that I felt mischaracterised the situation somewhat.
I will say though (as honestly, it annoys the living hell out of me that people seem to want to prescribe my views to politics)... It isn't, and never has been, about politics for me (beyond the fact that no team should be seen to align with any political party as politics are, by their nature, divisive). Could have been Farage, could have been Polanski, could have been Starmer. The person makes no difference, and besides that isn't my real issue. Hold your hands up, admit the mistake, we all move on.
My issue is lying, doubling down and lying again. I don't appreciate being lied to. Ever. By anyone. [Post edited 11 Jun 23:43]
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Precisely. I don’t really care about whether he invited Farage or the King but when he has a track record of lying that’s it for me. I want a club and a CEO who has basic ethics and behave like a professional (screaming at fans? making offensive chants about a rival?)
I don’t want to be treated like an idiot by the CEO of the club I support
The fans who condone Ashton’s lying are in fact no different from Saints fans who defend Tonda’s spying. |  | | |
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| Ashton Speaks on 23:54 - Jun 11 with 834 views | Joey_Joe_Joe_Junior |
| Ashton Speaks on 23:50 - Jun 11 by ITFCSG |
Precisely. I don’t really care about whether he invited Farage or the King but when he has a track record of lying that’s it for me. I want a club and a CEO who has basic ethics and behave like a professional (screaming at fans? making offensive chants about a rival?)
I don’t want to be treated like an idiot by the CEO of the club I support
The fans who condone Ashton’s lying are in fact no different from Saints fans who defend Tonda’s spying. |
The king would have probably been worse for many! | |
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| Ashton Speaks on 23:59 - Jun 11 with 815 views | Churchman |
| Ashton Speaks on 23:50 - Jun 11 by ITFCSG |
Precisely. I don’t really care about whether he invited Farage or the King but when he has a track record of lying that’s it for me. I want a club and a CEO who has basic ethics and behave like a professional (screaming at fans? making offensive chants about a rival?)
I don’t want to be treated like an idiot by the CEO of the club I support
The fans who condone Ashton’s lying are in fact no different from Saints fans who defend Tonda’s spying. |
If you are now comparing Ashton’s actions to Southampton’s I give up.
This ‘track record of lying’. Excluding the Farage visit please list them. I’ve seen plenty of comms screw ups like the seat move mess two years ago, giving it plenty at Lincoln, getting over excited after promotion and appearing in the dressing room. I don’t like his parading Wardley about much either, but a track record of lies implies a list. What is on it? |  | | |
| Ashton Speaks on 00:06 - Jun 12 with 808 views | TheMoralMajority |
| Ashton Speaks on 23:59 - Jun 11 by Churchman |
If you are now comparing Ashton’s actions to Southampton’s I give up.
This ‘track record of lying’. Excluding the Farage visit please list them. I’ve seen plenty of comms screw ups like the seat move mess two years ago, giving it plenty at Lincoln, getting over excited after promotion and appearing in the dressing room. I don’t like his parading Wardley about much either, but a track record of lies implies a list. What is on it? |
There doesn't need to be a list. It's a trust vs competence thing. They denied, denied, denied. It wasn't a little white lie!
Urrgh, screw it, I'm not going to get dragged into this again. I will just leave with a little hypothetical though.
Imagine a hospital chief surgeon. Over twenty years, they save thousands of lives. They pioneer new techniques, train generations of doctors, and are widely regarded as the best surgeon in the country.
One day, they make a serious mistake during an operation. Mistakes happen; medicine is difficult and human beings are fallible.
But instead of immediately reporting the error, they alter records to conceal it. When questions are raised, they deny wrongdoing. When evidence emerges, they blame junior staff. Only when incontrovertible proof appears do they issue a statement saying, "I'm sorry if people have been upset by recent events."
At that point, the issue is no longer the surgical mistake. The issue is that nobody can trust them. If a surgeon cannot be trusted to tell the truth when things go wrong, patients, colleagues and regulators can no longer have confidence in anything they say. Their extraordinary skill does not compensate for the loss of integrity; in fact, their seniority makes the dishonesty more serious, not less. | |
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| Ashton Speaks on 00:11 - Jun 12 with 776 views | BanksterDebtSlave |
| Ashton Speaks on 23:54 - Jun 11 by Joey_Joe_Joe_Junior |
The king would have probably been worse for many! |
When it comes to the detail you all have nothing! |  |
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| Ashton Speaks on 00:13 - Jun 12 with 776 views | Churchman |
| Ashton Speaks on 00:06 - Jun 12 by TheMoralMajority |
There doesn't need to be a list. It's a trust vs competence thing. They denied, denied, denied. It wasn't a little white lie!
Urrgh, screw it, I'm not going to get dragged into this again. I will just leave with a little hypothetical though.
Imagine a hospital chief surgeon. Over twenty years, they save thousands of lives. They pioneer new techniques, train generations of doctors, and are widely regarded as the best surgeon in the country.
One day, they make a serious mistake during an operation. Mistakes happen; medicine is difficult and human beings are fallible.
But instead of immediately reporting the error, they alter records to conceal it. When questions are raised, they deny wrongdoing. When evidence emerges, they blame junior staff. Only when incontrovertible proof appears do they issue a statement saying, "I'm sorry if people have been upset by recent events."
At that point, the issue is no longer the surgical mistake. The issue is that nobody can trust them. If a surgeon cannot be trusted to tell the truth when things go wrong, patients, colleagues and regulators can no longer have confidence in anything they say. Their extraordinary skill does not compensate for the loss of integrity; in fact, their seniority makes the dishonesty more serious, not less. |
Ahh, so the ‘track record of lying’ is basically the Farage thing. Fair enough. | | | |
| Ashton Speaks on 04:39 - Jun 12 with 683 views | Benters |
Lovely bloke.
Ashton in 100%. |  |
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| Ashton Speaks on 04:47 - Jun 12 with 664 views | Benters |
| Ashton Speaks on 23:50 - Jun 11 by ITFCSG |
Precisely. I don’t really care about whether he invited Farage or the King but when he has a track record of lying that’s it for me. I want a club and a CEO who has basic ethics and behave like a professional (screaming at fans? making offensive chants about a rival?)
I don’t want to be treated like an idiot by the CEO of the club I support
The fans who condone Ashton’s lying are in fact no different from Saints fans who defend Tonda’s spying. |
Offensive chants 😂 get a grip. | |
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| Ashton Speaks on 04:54 - Jun 12 with 656 views | Benters |
We get it buh you don’t like him and have (supposedly) given your season ticket back.
But do you have to be so nasty about the man who has helped and achieved 3 promotions in 4 seasons? | |
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| Ashton Speaks on 06:18 - Jun 12 with 604 views | Wakh |
| Ashton Speaks on 21:43 - Jun 11 by FrimleyBlue |
Ah thanks. Thats where i saw it. Apologies for saying it was from km himseld. |
No worries. You weren’t wrong and didn’t deserve the replies you got. | | | |
| Ashton Speaks on 06:42 - Jun 12 with 559 views | PioneerBlue |
| Ashton Speaks on 23:06 - Jun 11 by WicklowBlue |
The absolute state of some of the comments on this thread!!!
Enjoy sticking your verbal knives into the club and Ashton etc.
For me I thought this was a well worded respectful goodbye, they worked closely over the past 4.5 years. But Ashton HAS to keep the club first and foremost, ITFC is the priority.
Respect to McK and I thought Ashton's message was spot on. If he didnt say anything everyone would be laying into him yet he did and people are doing the same.
Disappointed in the reactions here imho. |
Im with you. I cant believe so many words can be written about the ceo and chairman (i know this is another thing that causes such considerable concern for some writers). He was offering a public view on an outgoing manager and the process to follow. That was all.
How are people so absorbed in MA the personality cult, why and how he says things. I know he's in an important and enviable position, but seriously, he is a leader of a football club, not the Archbishop, Pope or some other extrahuman entity. He is in place to help the club move forward at a community and football level, as a director for the ownership group, and to help identify and allow the coaching team to fly, he has done these things pretty well to date. If you dont like his personality it is a you problem im afraid as the kids say 🙄 | |
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| Ashton Speaks on 06:57 - Jun 12 with 535 views | Benters |
| Ashton Speaks on 06:42 - Jun 12 by PioneerBlue |
Im with you. I cant believe so many words can be written about the ceo and chairman (i know this is another thing that causes such considerable concern for some writers). He was offering a public view on an outgoing manager and the process to follow. That was all.
How are people so absorbed in MA the personality cult, why and how he says things. I know he's in an important and enviable position, but seriously, he is a leader of a football club, not the Archbishop, Pope or some other extrahuman entity. He is in place to help the club move forward at a community and football level, as a director for the ownership group, and to help identify and allow the coaching team to fly, he has done these things pretty well to date. If you dont like his personality it is a you problem im afraid as the kids say 🙄 |
Well said. | |
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| Ashton Speaks on 07:16 - Jun 12 with 496 views | The_Flashing_Smile |
| Ashton Speaks on 00:06 - Jun 12 by TheMoralMajority |
There doesn't need to be a list. It's a trust vs competence thing. They denied, denied, denied. It wasn't a little white lie!
Urrgh, screw it, I'm not going to get dragged into this again. I will just leave with a little hypothetical though.
Imagine a hospital chief surgeon. Over twenty years, they save thousands of lives. They pioneer new techniques, train generations of doctors, and are widely regarded as the best surgeon in the country.
One day, they make a serious mistake during an operation. Mistakes happen; medicine is difficult and human beings are fallible.
But instead of immediately reporting the error, they alter records to conceal it. When questions are raised, they deny wrongdoing. When evidence emerges, they blame junior staff. Only when incontrovertible proof appears do they issue a statement saying, "I'm sorry if people have been upset by recent events."
At that point, the issue is no longer the surgical mistake. The issue is that nobody can trust them. If a surgeon cannot be trusted to tell the truth when things go wrong, patients, colleagues and regulators can no longer have confidence in anything they say. Their extraordinary skill does not compensate for the loss of integrity; in fact, their seniority makes the dishonesty more serious, not less. |
You're doing a great job of not relitigating this again! |  |
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| Ashton Speaks on 07:37 - Jun 12 with 469 views | Benters |
| Ashton Speaks on 00:06 - Jun 12 by TheMoralMajority |
There doesn't need to be a list. It's a trust vs competence thing. They denied, denied, denied. It wasn't a little white lie!
Urrgh, screw it, I'm not going to get dragged into this again. I will just leave with a little hypothetical though.
Imagine a hospital chief surgeon. Over twenty years, they save thousands of lives. They pioneer new techniques, train generations of doctors, and are widely regarded as the best surgeon in the country.
One day, they make a serious mistake during an operation. Mistakes happen; medicine is difficult and human beings are fallible.
But instead of immediately reporting the error, they alter records to conceal it. When questions are raised, they deny wrongdoing. When evidence emerges, they blame junior staff. Only when incontrovertible proof appears do they issue a statement saying, "I'm sorry if people have been upset by recent events."
At that point, the issue is no longer the surgical mistake. The issue is that nobody can trust them. If a surgeon cannot be trusted to tell the truth when things go wrong, patients, colleagues and regulators can no longer have confidence in anything they say. Their extraordinary skill does not compensate for the loss of integrity; in fact, their seniority makes the dishonesty more serious, not less. |
So I take it you won’t be going to any games in the new season? | |
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| Ashton Speaks on 08:02 - Jun 12 with 443 views | waveneyblue |
| Ashton Speaks on 23:02 - Jun 11 by Churchman |
Paragraph 1: it’s very possible to be wrong in judging people on what others say. Quite often they have an axe to grind. I don’t know who on this forum has met him but perhaps they can enlighten me.
Paragraph 2: very good of you to give him a smidgeon of credit.
Paragrapg 3: O’Leary was here to primarily facilitate and oversee the takeover. I believe he spent very little time here, living in the West Country. What his involvement was, I’ve no idea. Nor do I know how the club is structured. What is the level of accountability with the owners? How often does the CEO have to answer to them?
What do the other Directors do? The structure looks odd but we have owners 5000 miles away. What is Schwartz involvement? I don’t know enough about the structure and the titles are pretty unimportant. It’s what people actually do. Whatever it is, as the club grows it will have to change anyway.
The simple facts are three promotions in five seasons. One poor manager which isn’t down to the current owners and one good one. A club heading for oblivion before Gamechanger now starting in the Premier League in August for the second time in three seasons. A new training ground, Cat 1, ground tidied up, community work, full houses etc etc.
Maybe Ashton had nothing to do with any of that. Maybe he’s spent five years blundering about making bad signings and trying to unstick the coffee cup from his hand and doing passable impressions of Brent. You tell me.
Personally, I think as an outsider looking in and viewing then and now that he has done a terrific job overall. Has he made mistakes! Oh yes. Lots of them. But people that do stuff tend to get it wrong sometimes. The trick is whether they learn from them. In ITFCs case, comms in particular. It needs to be a lot better.
Would I want to know the bloke? Not really. I doubt we’d get on but I’d have to meet him to decide that. I worked with a number of people over the years with ‘reputations’ and I can think of only one a’hole that matched the billing.
That is how I see it and him. |
Excellent post sir 👏 |  | | |
| Ashton Speaks on 08:11 - Jun 12 with 414 views | waveneyblue |
| Ashton Speaks on 00:06 - Jun 12 by TheMoralMajority |
There doesn't need to be a list. It's a trust vs competence thing. They denied, denied, denied. It wasn't a little white lie!
Urrgh, screw it, I'm not going to get dragged into this again. I will just leave with a little hypothetical though.
Imagine a hospital chief surgeon. Over twenty years, they save thousands of lives. They pioneer new techniques, train generations of doctors, and are widely regarded as the best surgeon in the country.
One day, they make a serious mistake during an operation. Mistakes happen; medicine is difficult and human beings are fallible.
But instead of immediately reporting the error, they alter records to conceal it. When questions are raised, they deny wrongdoing. When evidence emerges, they blame junior staff. Only when incontrovertible proof appears do they issue a statement saying, "I'm sorry if people have been upset by recent events."
At that point, the issue is no longer the surgical mistake. The issue is that nobody can trust them. If a surgeon cannot be trusted to tell the truth when things go wrong, patients, colleagues and regulators can no longer have confidence in anything they say. Their extraordinary skill does not compensate for the loss of integrity; in fact, their seniority makes the dishonesty more serious, not less. |
Have you considered counselling?
I'm being serious | | | |
| Ashton Speaks on 08:14 - Jun 12 with 401 views | Benters |
| Ashton Speaks on 08:11 - Jun 12 by waveneyblue |
Have you considered counselling?
I'm being serious |
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