| Roving gangs intimidating RNLI 11:49 - Sep 17 with 7313 views | jayessess |
Portsmouth RNLI forced to shut their Portsmouth lifeboat station because they're getting abuse and threats off fascist gangs.
https://www.independent.co.uk/
Beyond time something was done about these people? [Post edited 17 Sep 12:00]
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| Roving gangs intimidating RNLI on 14:37 - Sep 18 with 1312 views | DropCliffsNotBombs |
| Roving gangs intimidating RNLI on 12:50 - Sep 18 by Dubtractor |
That incident was a perfect example of how the immigration 'debate' has allowed people's racism to flourish. Anyone with brown skin is now seen as a legitimate target, because they might be an immigrant, and it doesn't actually matter if they are not anyway. |
It's frightening how emboldened those people have become. Surely even five years ago somebody posting something as abhorrent as TR did would not be tolerated on here by anyone?
Most worrying thing are the ones who know it's clearly vile, and wouldn't say it themselves, but wouldn't dream of challenging the bigotry because it 'upsets the right people'. |  | | |
| Roving gangs intimidating RNLI on 16:01 - Sep 18 with 1200 views | Mullet |
| Roving gangs intimidating RNLI on 14:37 - Sep 18 by DropCliffsNotBombs |
It's frightening how emboldened those people have become. Surely even five years ago somebody posting something as abhorrent as TR did would not be tolerated on here by anyone?
Most worrying thing are the ones who know it's clearly vile, and wouldn't say it themselves, but wouldn't dream of challenging the bigotry because it 'upsets the right people'. |
Racists and traitors |  |
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| Roving gangs intimidating RNLI on 17:11 - Sep 18 with 1126 views | Whos_blue |
| Roving gangs intimidating RNLI on 12:25 - Sep 18 by NewcyBlue |
jeez you're repetitively dull |
Wasn't all that to and fro unnecessarily tiresome?
The only good thing is that we can expect the same level of fastidious fact checking when articles attacking the left are posted.
Seemed an odd use of time, especially when most people can see there is an obvious link. But we move on. |  |
| "Look, I don't wanna be the same as everybody else. That's why I'm a Mod, see?" |
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| Roving gangs intimidating RNLI on 17:47 - Sep 18 with 1085 views | reusersfreekicks |
| Roving gangs intimidating RNLI on 12:30 - Sep 18 by EdwardStone |
My mental health has improved a great deal since I put him on ignore months ago
His never ending schtick about being a regular guy who wants to see fair play seemed to me to be cover for some rather unpleasant views |
Precisely |  | | |
| Roving gangs intimidating RNLI on 17:53 - Sep 18 with 1041 views | lowhouseblue |
| Roving gangs intimidating RNLI on 17:11 - Sep 18 by Whos_blue |
Wasn't all that to and fro unnecessarily tiresome?
The only good thing is that we can expect the same level of fastidious fact checking when articles attacking the left are posted.
Seemed an odd use of time, especially when most people can see there is an obvious link. But we move on. |
imagine having your assumptions challenged. if only everyone just posted the same views how much more comfortable life would be. |  |
| And so as the loose-bowelled pigeon of time swoops low over the unsuspecting tourist of destiny, and the flatulent skunk of fate wanders into the air-conditioning system of eternity, I notice it's the end of the show |
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| Roving gangs intimidating RNLI on 18:00 - Sep 18 with 1041 views | Whos_blue |
| Roving gangs intimidating RNLI on 17:53 - Sep 18 by lowhouseblue |
imagine having your assumptions challenged. if only everyone just posted the same views how much more comfortable life would be. |
Personally I didn't see it as much of a stretch to see the causality.
I genuinely have no issue with your critical reading approach. I just don't understand why you chose that particular report to cast doubt on, when near on everyone would accept the assumed causation.
Agree to disagree I guess Lowers. | |
| "Look, I don't wanna be the same as everybody else. That's why I'm a Mod, see?" |
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| Roving gangs intimidating RNLI on 18:07 - Sep 18 with 1013 views | StokieBlue |
| Roving gangs intimidating RNLI on 18:00 - Sep 18 by Whos_blue |
Personally I didn't see it as much of a stretch to see the causality.
I genuinely have no issue with your critical reading approach. I just don't understand why you chose that particular report to cast doubt on, when near on everyone would accept the assumed causation.
Agree to disagree I guess Lowers. |
Correlation doesn't imply causation but it this care it was ridiculously obvious that it was correlated.
It was just an attempt to wind people up.
SB |  |
| Avatar - M101 - Pinwheel Galaxy |
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| Roving gangs intimidating RNLI on 18:08 - Sep 18 with 991 views | lowhouseblue |
| Roving gangs intimidating RNLI on 18:00 - Sep 18 by Whos_blue |
Personally I didn't see it as much of a stretch to see the causality.
I genuinely have no issue with your critical reading approach. I just don't understand why you chose that particular report to cast doubt on, when near on everyone would accept the assumed causation.
Agree to disagree I guess Lowers. |
absolutely agree to disagree.
the reason was that it really matters why the station was closed, and the linked article didn't give the reason. the second article did, but just assuming stuff is very dangerous.
very few non-left articles ever get linked on here and if they do they get crushed very quickly. i don't see the point of dissecting something that everyone has already rejected. if the site was full of the online right posting lies about small boats etc and vehemently agreeing with each other i would absolutely challenge those lies. thankfully it never is. [Post edited 18 Sep 18:16]
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| And so as the loose-bowelled pigeon of time swoops low over the unsuspecting tourist of destiny, and the flatulent skunk of fate wanders into the air-conditioning system of eternity, I notice it's the end of the show |
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| Roving gangs intimidating RNLI on 18:41 - Sep 18 with 947 views | Blueschev |
| Roving gangs intimidating RNLI on 17:53 - Sep 18 by lowhouseblue |
imagine having your assumptions challenged. if only everyone just posted the same views how much more comfortable life would be. |
Who’s doing that? You can’t just create an argument in your head then pretend you’re right and everyone else is stupid and following an imaginary crowd you’ve invented. That’s just weird. |  | | |
| Roving gangs intimidating RNLI on 18:47 - Sep 18 with 910 views | lowhouseblue |
| Roving gangs intimidating RNLI on 18:07 - Sep 18 by StokieBlue |
Correlation doesn't imply causation but it this care it was ridiculously obvious that it was correlated.
It was just an attempt to wind people up.
SB |
no it was an attempt to be clear about what the original article had said and what it hadn't said. reading news sources critically really matters. things being 'ridiculously obvious' is just a short cut to group think. | |
| And so as the loose-bowelled pigeon of time swoops low over the unsuspecting tourist of destiny, and the flatulent skunk of fate wanders into the air-conditioning system of eternity, I notice it's the end of the show |
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| Roving gangs intimidating RNLI on 19:49 - Sep 18 with 845 views | Freddies_Ears |
| Roving gangs intimidating RNLI on 13:02 - Sep 17 by Libero |
It's a really tricky situation- pushing against these idiots is only going make them push back even harder, the only way forwards is to invite them in and have them feel seen/listened/heard and of course, more importantly, if the quality of life goes up in the country, suddenly, miraculously, less of this sort of thing will happen. [Post edited 17 Sep 13:18]
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The quality of life in this country would go up hugely if we embraced people of different cultures and made them welcome, and if we rebuilt a proper non-confrontational economic relationship with our closest partners in Europe. But, who is stopping this? Oh. |  | | |
| Roving gangs intimidating RNLI on 21:36 - Sep 18 with 774 views | StokieBlue |
| Roving gangs intimidating RNLI on 18:47 - Sep 18 by lowhouseblue |
no it was an attempt to be clear about what the original article had said and what it hadn't said. reading news sources critically really matters. things being 'ridiculously obvious' is just a short cut to group think. |
Utter nonsense as well you know.
The odds on it being closed for maintenance were far exceeded my the odds of it being closed due to recent events but you seized on the less likely scenario to rile people up. The article didn't even say what you were pushing anyway, it said that they had practices in place for when places are closed for maintenance.
You spent two pages arguing about an unlikely hypothetical which was wrong because you have to wind up one section of the forum.
Everyone has seen through you nowadays.
SB | |
| Avatar - M101 - Pinwheel Galaxy |
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| Roving gangs intimidating RNLI on 23:57 - Sep 18 with 681 views | Swansea_Blue |
| Roving gangs intimidating RNLI on 18:00 - Sep 18 by Whos_blue |
Personally I didn't see it as much of a stretch to see the causality.
I genuinely have no issue with your critical reading approach. I just don't understand why you chose that particular report to cast doubt on, when near on everyone would accept the assumed causation.
Agree to disagree I guess Lowers. |
I wouldn’t say it’s critical thought. That would require a focus on the actual evidence rather than introducing hypotheticals to distract from the evidence.
I can only imagine what you’re replying to from the various replies, but it’s a pattern for that poster to sow doubt on things and facts that most people would except. I don’t like being a sh*t and being personal, but I had to div list them a long time ago for my own sanity. Hopefully I’m just completely wrong. |  |
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| Roving gangs intimidating RNLI on 00:36 - Sep 19 with 653 views | rkc123 |
| Roving gangs intimidating RNLI on 15:56 - Sep 17 by lowhouseblue |
again if that was the case the rnli would state it. if the journalist had evidence that that was the case the journalist would state it. the journalist is instead hoping that readers will infer something that they can't evidence. the journalist is hoping that their article will be reposted on social media with a spin which they can't themselves justify.
the reason for posting is that in an age of online rumour and misinformation we should check that what we are stating is true and proven. inferring stuff because it fits our pre-existing world view is dangerous. if someone you disagreed with did it you would call it out. you should hold yourself to those same standards. |
Your first sentence is quite clearly not true (even before the further information came out confirming why the station was closed), the RNLI not stating the reason for the closure in no way indicated that the protests were not the cause. In fact not giving a reason very much suggested the inferred reason was correct as there would be very little reason for them not to say if it was closed due to a maintenance issue, whereas with the protests and threats causing the closure it is quite understandable why they might not have wanted to explicitly state that (i.e. they may have been advised that blaming the protests could have caused further targeting of their volunteers, they may not have wanted to confirm that the actions of the protestors had 'worked', they may have received legal advice not to name the protestor threat for a variety of reasons).
You say it is dangerous to infer stuff because it fits our pre-existing world view, which I agree with, but I would suggest it is equally dangerous to reject the clear and most reasonable conclusion just because it doesn't fit yours. [Post edited 19 Sep 0:38]
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| Roving gangs intimidating RNLI on 07:17 - Sep 19 with 549 views | Dubtractor |
| Roving gangs intimidating RNLI on 00:36 - Sep 19 by rkc123 |
Your first sentence is quite clearly not true (even before the further information came out confirming why the station was closed), the RNLI not stating the reason for the closure in no way indicated that the protests were not the cause. In fact not giving a reason very much suggested the inferred reason was correct as there would be very little reason for them not to say if it was closed due to a maintenance issue, whereas with the protests and threats causing the closure it is quite understandable why they might not have wanted to explicitly state that (i.e. they may have been advised that blaming the protests could have caused further targeting of their volunteers, they may not have wanted to confirm that the actions of the protestors had 'worked', they may have received legal advice not to name the protestor threat for a variety of reasons).
You say it is dangerous to infer stuff because it fits our pre-existing world view, which I agree with, but I would suggest it is equally dangerous to reject the clear and most reasonable conclusion just because it doesn't fit yours. [Post edited 19 Sep 0:38]
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Yeah, but critical thinking. |  |
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| Roving gangs intimidating RNLI on 07:39 - Sep 19 with 520 views | Dubtractor |
| Roving gangs intimidating RNLI on 23:57 - Sep 18 by Swansea_Blue |
I wouldn’t say it’s critical thought. That would require a focus on the actual evidence rather than introducing hypotheticals to distract from the evidence.
I can only imagine what you’re replying to from the various replies, but it’s a pattern for that poster to sow doubt on things and facts that most people would except. I don’t like being a sh*t and being personal, but I had to div list them a long time ago for my own sanity. Hopefully I’m just completely wrong. |
"Hopefully I’m just completely wrong."
You're not. | |
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| Roving gangs intimidating RNLI on 07:53 - Sep 19 with 499 views | Churchman |
The origin of saving lives at sea is actually a little more murky than it is perceived today. Those interested might find the attached worth a read.
https://fishingnews.co.uk/feat
Salvage and saving lives was basically all about making/scraping a living. Pay up or make your own arrangements. The main aim was salvage; booty; profit. From this, what we know as the RNLI developed.
Why am I interested? Because ancestors on my mums side were beachmen (see David Copperfield, Pegotty, boat house etc) then lifeboatmen. Two are remembered on the Caister memorial to the 1901 disaster where 9 of the crew died. There is a picture of the upside down boat in the article. The drowned men are inside it.
So is the current RNLI the people traffickers, French and British governments’ free taxi service? Of course it is. But please don’t blame the RNLI and the impossibly brave volunteers. The current mess is nothing to do with them. They are just doing what they have to do. I suppose we could go back to the 1800s and say to the migrants pay up or drown, but one would hope we have moved on from 250 years ago.
As for animals targeting them, it disgusts me. Go and protest to the people responsible, not RNLI personnel who do a job none of them could or would dare do.
Edit: the motto ‘Never turn back’ originates from the enquiry following the 1901 disaster. [Post edited 19 Sep 7:58]
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| Roving gangs intimidating RNLI on 08:15 - Sep 19 with 470 views | BlueBoots |
| Roving gangs intimidating RNLI on 07:53 - Sep 19 by Churchman |
The origin of saving lives at sea is actually a little more murky than it is perceived today. Those interested might find the attached worth a read.
https://fishingnews.co.uk/feat
Salvage and saving lives was basically all about making/scraping a living. Pay up or make your own arrangements. The main aim was salvage; booty; profit. From this, what we know as the RNLI developed.
Why am I interested? Because ancestors on my mums side were beachmen (see David Copperfield, Pegotty, boat house etc) then lifeboatmen. Two are remembered on the Caister memorial to the 1901 disaster where 9 of the crew died. There is a picture of the upside down boat in the article. The drowned men are inside it.
So is the current RNLI the people traffickers, French and British governments’ free taxi service? Of course it is. But please don’t blame the RNLI and the impossibly brave volunteers. The current mess is nothing to do with them. They are just doing what they have to do. I suppose we could go back to the 1800s and say to the migrants pay up or drown, but one would hope we have moved on from 250 years ago.
As for animals targeting them, it disgusts me. Go and protest to the people responsible, not RNLI personnel who do a job none of them could or would dare do.
Edit: the motto ‘Never turn back’ originates from the enquiry following the 1901 disaster. [Post edited 19 Sep 7:58]
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Can't be bothered to write up again, so refer you to a response I gave on another thread:
These balaclava wearing chaps in Dover by BlueBoots 10 Sep 9:14The fact that the RNLI have had to defend themselves from the question ‘Why is the RNLI a taxi service for illegal migrants?’ on their own website is shameful in itself:
https://rnli.org/about-us/our-work-in-the-channel
Another poster on this thread is bandying around a 1% statistic without any basis in fact, so here's one that is:
"The RNLI is a charity with one purpose: To save lives at sea. In 2025, volunteer lifeboat crew members like Dan launched to the rescue 9,058 times across the UK and Ireland. Just 109 (1.2%) of these launches were to small boats in the Channel."
The vast majority of the pickups at sea from small boat crossings are handled by the UK Border Force, not the RNLI; if I rang a taxi firm and they only sent me a cab 1 out of every 100 times I called them, I'd be pretty p1ssed off.
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| Roving gangs intimidating RNLI on 08:31 - Sep 19 with 433 views | NewcyBlue |
| Roving gangs intimidating RNLI on 07:53 - Sep 19 by Churchman |
The origin of saving lives at sea is actually a little more murky than it is perceived today. Those interested might find the attached worth a read.
https://fishingnews.co.uk/feat
Salvage and saving lives was basically all about making/scraping a living. Pay up or make your own arrangements. The main aim was salvage; booty; profit. From this, what we know as the RNLI developed.
Why am I interested? Because ancestors on my mums side were beachmen (see David Copperfield, Pegotty, boat house etc) then lifeboatmen. Two are remembered on the Caister memorial to the 1901 disaster where 9 of the crew died. There is a picture of the upside down boat in the article. The drowned men are inside it.
So is the current RNLI the people traffickers, French and British governments’ free taxi service? Of course it is. But please don’t blame the RNLI and the impossibly brave volunteers. The current mess is nothing to do with them. They are just doing what they have to do. I suppose we could go back to the 1800s and say to the migrants pay up or drown, but one would hope we have moved on from 250 years ago.
As for animals targeting them, it disgusts me. Go and protest to the people responsible, not RNLI personnel who do a job none of them could or would dare do.
Edit: the motto ‘Never turn back’ originates from the enquiry following the 1901 disaster. [Post edited 19 Sep 7:58]
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You completely misunderstand salvage (between two parties) vs rescuing of lives (RNLI). |  |
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| Roving gangs intimidating RNLI on 08:42 - Sep 19 with 416 views | Churchman |
| Roving gangs intimidating RNLI on 08:31 - Sep 19 by NewcyBlue |
You completely misunderstand salvage (between two parties) vs rescuing of lives (RNLI). |
Not really. Historically one led to the other. Sort of evolution, especially given the people doing this in the 18/19c lived in grinding poverty and understood the danger of the sea.
https://marthamhistorygroup.co
https://www.bbc.co.uk/norfolk/ [Post edited 19 Sep 8:46]
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| Roving gangs intimidating RNLI on 08:58 - Sep 19 with 381 views | SuperKieranMcKenna |
| Roving gangs intimidating RNLI on 07:53 - Sep 19 by Churchman |
The origin of saving lives at sea is actually a little more murky than it is perceived today. Those interested might find the attached worth a read.
https://fishingnews.co.uk/feat
Salvage and saving lives was basically all about making/scraping a living. Pay up or make your own arrangements. The main aim was salvage; booty; profit. From this, what we know as the RNLI developed.
Why am I interested? Because ancestors on my mums side were beachmen (see David Copperfield, Pegotty, boat house etc) then lifeboatmen. Two are remembered on the Caister memorial to the 1901 disaster where 9 of the crew died. There is a picture of the upside down boat in the article. The drowned men are inside it.
So is the current RNLI the people traffickers, French and British governments’ free taxi service? Of course it is. But please don’t blame the RNLI and the impossibly brave volunteers. The current mess is nothing to do with them. They are just doing what they have to do. I suppose we could go back to the 1800s and say to the migrants pay up or drown, but one would hope we have moved on from 250 years ago.
As for animals targeting them, it disgusts me. Go and protest to the people responsible, not RNLI personnel who do a job none of them could or would dare do.
Edit: the motto ‘Never turn back’ originates from the enquiry following the 1901 disaster. [Post edited 19 Sep 7:58]
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Ultimately, I feel sorry for these volunteers putting their safety at risk, for what is ultimately a government led problem. Quite why they haven’t put some kind of asylum centre on the French mainland is a disgrace really. Yes I know Brexit, but we’re still able to make a bilateral agreement, we already do in terms of funding. | | | |
| Roving gangs intimidating RNLI on 10:45 - Sep 19 with 293 views | lowhouseblue |
| Roving gangs intimidating RNLI on 21:36 - Sep 18 by StokieBlue |
Utter nonsense as well you know.
The odds on it being closed for maintenance were far exceeded my the odds of it being closed due to recent events but you seized on the less likely scenario to rile people up. The article didn't even say what you were pushing anyway, it said that they had practices in place for when places are closed for maintenance.
You spent two pages arguing about an unlikely hypothetical which was wrong because you have to wind up one section of the forum.
Everyone has seen through you nowadays.
SB |
i never said it had been closed for maintenance i said that the only reason for closure referred to by the rnli, as reported in the article, was maintenance etc. reading on the basis of assumptions derived from your prior world view is dangerous. i wasn't pushing anything, i was pointing out what the article actually said and that it didn't assert causation or provide evidence of causation. if you really find that observation of fact unsettling it says more about you than me.
your 'ridiculously obvious' is just the same as the 'common sense' that other people, whom i'm sure you despise, use to justify lazy assumptions.
the usual abuse from the usual group really doesn't worry me. | |
| And so as the loose-bowelled pigeon of time swoops low over the unsuspecting tourist of destiny, and the flatulent skunk of fate wanders into the air-conditioning system of eternity, I notice it's the end of the show |
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| Roving gangs intimidating RNLI on 11:04 - Sep 19 with 258 views | NewcyBlue |
The beachmen were primarily salvage crews, who rescued people as a by product.
The first lifeboats, which were converted fishing boats, were crewed with the purpose of rescuing people. If they were then asked it became a salvage operation, and that was between two private parties.
Salvage has always had a no cure no pay element, but there has never been a no pay no rescue element to lifeboat crews. | |
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| Roving gangs intimidating RNLI on 11:58 - Sep 19 with 183 views | Churchman |
| Roving gangs intimidating RNLI on 08:58 - Sep 19 by SuperKieranMcKenna |
Ultimately, I feel sorry for these volunteers putting their safety at risk, for what is ultimately a government led problem. Quite why they haven’t put some kind of asylum centre on the French mainland is a disgrace really. Yes I know Brexit, but we’re still able to make a bilateral agreement, we already do in terms of funding. |
Absolutely agree. | | | |
| Roving gangs intimidating RNLI on 12:37 - Sep 19 with 115 views | Churchman |
| Roving gangs intimidating RNLI on 11:04 - Sep 19 by NewcyBlue |
The beachmen were primarily salvage crews, who rescued people as a by product.
The first lifeboats, which were converted fishing boats, were crewed with the purpose of rescuing people. If they were then asked it became a salvage operation, and that was between two private parties.
Salvage has always had a no cure no pay element, but there has never been a no pay no rescue element to lifeboat crews. |
This is from the internet. Not reliable, but I’ve read it elsewhere.
Before specialized rescue fleets emerged, saving lives at sea operated under harsh financial realities:
The Property Loophole: Traditional admiralty law operated on a strict "no cure, no pay" system. Rescuers could only claim a reward if they brought back physical property.
If a captain chose to fill their boat with starving passengers instead of barrels of valuable cargo, they could legally end up with zero financial compensation for their time, risk, and fuel/supplies.
Opportunistic Extortion: Because rescuers could not legally bill a shipowner or government for saving a human life, some passing ships and coastal dwellers took matters into their own hands.
Desperate passengers were occasionally forced to trade coins, jewelry, and luxury personal belongings on the spot just to secure a seat on a boat to the mainland.
Humanitarian Charity: Most actual life-saving efforts depended entirely on the goodwill of local fishermen and coastal communities. Long before institutional funding, these volunteers frequently risked their lives to pull survivors from the surf, bringing them ashore to provide food and medical care purely out of charity.
This predates lifeboats as we know them. The first documented Caister lifeboat was 1791, 33 years before the RNLI was founded. I believe that my ancestors volunteered on the Yarmouth and Caister boats - my mother remembers her grandfather’s gear hanging up and she thought he was part of a Yarmouth crew after he finished his sea serving days. | | | |
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