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is that Nazi/Fascist/Racist apologists are a real problem in some corners of this forum, and not just from the people who would instantly suspect.
Apparently you can throw a Nazi salute at a fairly well known far right event and people will say "put he may have just been waving". You can get in trouble at work for attending a widely regarded racist march and people are more bothered about defending freedom of speech than actual fascists running around our streets throwing said Nazi salutes.
Granted, it is the minority, but some of you people who think you are impartial and sit on the fence in these matters really need to consider what bothers you more and how far you are willing to go to brush this type of stuff off as no big deal or say "BUT YOU'RE BEING MEAN TO THE NAZIS WHICH IS JUST AS BAD".
Even if you identify as right or far right, you are in some dangerously f*cked territory when you shrug your shoulders at Nazis.
One quite sad thing we've discovered this week on TWTD on 15:19 - Oct 17 by Kieran_Knows
How we doing Rommers? Back after your summer meltdown?
[Post edited 17 Oct 2018 15:20]
I’ve been back a while. I just barely post. Though i did chuckle at you thinking I left because I was angry at the Waggy sale. As if that would make me choose to leave TWTD.
I’m just enjoying my new life at uni so don’t really have the time to post on here. I still read some of these threads though.
One quite sad thing we've discovered this week on TWTD on 15:23 - Oct 17 by The_Romford_Blue
I’ve been back a while. I just barely post. Though i did chuckle at you thinking I left because I was angry at the Waggy sale. As if that would make me choose to leave TWTD.
I’m just enjoying my new life at uni so don’t really have the time to post on here. I still read some of these threads though.
Fair enough, must've missed a few of your posts then.
One quite sad thing we've discovered this week on TWTD on 15:23 - Oct 17 by The_Romford_Blue
I’ve been back a while. I just barely post. Though i did chuckle at you thinking I left because I was angry at the Waggy sale. As if that would make me choose to leave TWTD.
I’m just enjoying my new life at uni so don’t really have the time to post on here. I still read some of these threads though.
Please post what you had for breakfast last week....
One quite sad thing we've discovered this week on TWTD on 15:23 - Oct 17 by The_Romford_Blue
I’ve been back a while. I just barely post. Though i did chuckle at you thinking I left because I was angry at the Waggy sale. As if that would make me choose to leave TWTD.
I’m just enjoying my new life at uni so don’t really have the time to post on here. I still read some of these threads though.
What are your feelings now still down in two seasons?
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One quite sad thing we've discovered this week on TWTD on 15:27 - Oct 17 with 5418 views
There needs to be balance. You can't just create the rules to suit your argument. There was a picture of Corbyn posted which people instantly dismissed as an opportunistic snapshot out of context. The picture of the FLA member was immediately labelled a Nazi. Now I don't disagree with the interpretation of these two pictures but you have to be consistent. If the Corbyn photo is dismissed then you have to acknowledge that the FLA member may have been caught in similar circumstances. Again, we're 99.9% sure we have this right but we can't have it both ways.
I think the problem with so much these days is that people argue based on emotion, preformed beliefs and within their own context. People need to be consistent and stick to facts. Look at the Brexit stuff. You can read two articles in opposition to Brexit which are night and day. The first will call all leavers thick racists who don't have a clue what they voted for and the other can be fact based, concise and sensible. Both leave you feeling very differently about the same argument.
We need less attacks on groups like the FLA based on them all being thick idiots because the fact is some (most?) of them genuinely seem to believe it's just a group of well meaning people opposing horrible things. Certain people never learn. Stick to facts and be polite. It will get people far further than silly attacks which just make people retreat further into their entrenched position. Even with me, when I see Brexiters called thick, clueless racists who have sold their country out I think fook you even though the argument against Brexit has become too obvious to ignore. It's no wonder people push back at posts like 'LOL AT THE DUMB RACIST NAZIS' rather than posting the clip of the man actually repeatedly proudly doing the Nazi salute to prove beyond doubt that there are very unsavoury elements attached to these groups.
Some people need to decide what is more important, their moral high ground or actually exposing these groups. This isn't all aimed at you Callis, more at the general attitude to people who initially support groups like the FLA.
I think any compromise on allowing free speech is a very slippery slope. Any ruling made to stop hateful free speech can be used to stop someone speaking the truth against corrupted power.
Hateful speech is fairly useless if you deprive the speaker of a forum and an audience.
Did he throw a Nazi salute? If he did he is a c unit of the lowest order.
The Nazi salute - is it only illegal in Germany? Surely this represents a hate crime?
HOWEVER
If he did not throw a Nazi salute, the march was legal, the group organizing it are not banned... it would be an erosion of free speech, something which allows people to have an alternative view to that each or any of us hold. As long as it is legal.
the march was organised by a group who are known to be fairly unpleasant racists. the people on the march were therefore highly likely to be fairly unpleasant racists. but a photo of someone with their arm in the air doesn't prove that person to be a fascist, or that the march is a fascist march (I do think that the definition of fascism as a political philosophy does involve a bit more than waving your arm about). so let's save the word 'fascist' for people who are known to be fascists. lets not use it as just an even stronger word for racists and other people we disagree with. otherwise we disempower language.
no one would shrug their shoulders at real Nazis - but we are allowed to ask "is it a real Nazi or is it an unpleasant racist with their arm in the air?". I know that's not as simple and unnuanced as things tend to be in you world, but hey life is complex.
[Post edited 17 Oct 2018 15:57]
And so as the loose-bowelled pigeon of time swoops low over the unsuspecting tourist of destiny, and the flatulent skunk of fate wanders into the air-conditioning system of eternity, I notice it's the end of the show
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One quite sad thing we've discovered this week on TWTD on 15:56 - Oct 17 with 5255 views
One quite sad thing we've discovered this week on TWTD on 15:48 - Oct 17 by caught-in-limbo
I'd class myself as an establishment-wary lefty.
I think any compromise on allowing free speech is a very slippery slope. Any ruling made to stop hateful free speech can be used to stop someone speaking the truth against corrupted power.
Hateful speech is fairly useless if you deprive the speaker of a forum and an audience.
I think free speech is GREAT. I also think that the courts are generally very cautious and hesitant in the application of hate speech laws. when they are applied they are applied for good reason. generally the courts keep out of thigs otherwise.
And so as the loose-bowelled pigeon of time swoops low over the unsuspecting tourist of destiny, and the flatulent skunk of fate wanders into the air-conditioning system of eternity, I notice it's the end of the show
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One quite sad thing we've discovered this week on TWTD on 16:01 - Oct 17 with 5222 views
My grandad used to tell me that in his day it was patriotic to be seen punching nazis, rather than saying 'well actually the there lot are just as bad'.
[Post edited 17 Oct 2018 22:32]
I'm one of the people who was blamed for getting Paul Cook sacked. PM for the full post.
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