| This pressure to end the lockdown 08:50 - Apr 27 with 10160 views | Steve_M |
Is it coming from anywhere other than the same right-wing columnists and media pundits who didn't want it in the first place? Opinion polls at the end of last week remained broadly supportive and suggests much of the public isn't expecting an imminent change.
Yes, it is undoubtedly doing economic damage to the country but then tens of thousands of deaths do that too. It's too early and the UK lacks the testing and contact tracing facilities, as yet, to ease it significantly.
I'm not convinced by long-lens pictures which compress people into seemingly larger groups on tabloid front pages. |  |
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| This pressure to end the lockdown on 09:00 - Apr 27 with 3742 views | itfcjoe |
The front page of the Express shows Brighton seafront and the photo isn't even from this weekend - there are cranes up on it which aren't currently there |  |
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| This pressure to end the lockdown on 09:02 - Apr 27 with 3718 views | Guthrum |
Indeed.
Moreover, the pressure to do it NOW, leveraged by easing in Spain and France, comes despite the fact we are patently at least two or three weeks behind those places in the progress of the disease and are numbers have not started coming down significantly yet. |  |
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| This pressure to end the lockdown on 09:03 - Apr 27 with 3718 views | StokieBlue |
There should be no lifting of the lockdown for a while yet.
However I can certainly see signs of "lockdown fatigue" here and it's getting worse daily. There are some people who don't seem to think it matters anymore unfortunately.
I suspect a lot of those people haven't been directly affected by someone who has had it and thus perhaps don't get the reasoning or requirement for the continued lockdown.
SB [Post edited 27 Apr 2020 9:04]
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| Avatar - IC410 - Tadpoles Nebula |
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| This pressure to end the lockdown on 09:08 - Apr 27 with 3691 views | longtimefan |
I wouldn't call the BBC right-wing but R4 Today this morning seemed almost totally devoted to encouraging a relaxation. I found it all rather concerning, especially the bit, seemly being whipped up by John Humphrys, complaining about the restrictions on over 70s. |  | | |
| This pressure to end the lockdown on 09:08 - Apr 27 with 3688 views | bluelagos |
There are lots of reasons why ending the lockdown would be beneficial so I think it a tad simplistic to only highlight the right wing libertarians who were, as you point out, reluctant in the first place.
The impact is way more than economic, the human cost of imprisoning people is significant in terms of their well being, issues of domestic and child abuse, educational outcomes, the list goes on.
And we are a global society, I was reading with some envy the planned Queensland state lockdown rules which are way more palatable than ours, whilst still maintaining bans of group activities and ensuring social distancing.
So I think there is much pressure to at least ease the lockdown whilst recognising the risks of so doing, in terms of possible lives lost.
Anyhow - as ever, we aren't going to solve it here. It is a very nuanced and difficult decision which is way more complicated than simply "listening to or following the science" irrespective of what anyone on here or on our TVs claims. |  |
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| This pressure to end the lockdown on 09:10 - Apr 27 with 3672 views | bluelagos |
| This pressure to end the lockdown on 09:00 - Apr 27 by itfcjoe |
The front page of the Express shows Brighton seafront and the photo isn't even from this weekend - there are cranes up on it which aren't currently there |
FFS. | |
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| This pressure to end the lockdown on 09:11 - Apr 27 with 3669 views | Guthrum |
| This pressure to end the lockdown on 09:03 - Apr 27 by StokieBlue |
There should be no lifting of the lockdown for a while yet.
However I can certainly see signs of "lockdown fatigue" here and it's getting worse daily. There are some people who don't seem to think it matters anymore unfortunately.
I suspect a lot of those people haven't been directly affected by someone who has had it and thus perhaps don't get the reasoning or requirement for the continued lockdown.
SB [Post edited 27 Apr 2020 9:04]
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Tho I think that "fatigue" is partly because the lockdown has never been properly addressed as a longer-term measure. There has been no "Blood, sweat and tears" speech outlining an extended and grim struggle. There have been noises from ministers and scientists about this having to go on for some time, but they are really rather muted and not presented as a coherent, clear message. | |
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| This pressure to end the lockdown on 09:13 - Apr 27 with 3660 views | sparks |
| This pressure to end the lockdown on 09:08 - Apr 27 by bluelagos |
There are lots of reasons why ending the lockdown would be beneficial so I think it a tad simplistic to only highlight the right wing libertarians who were, as you point out, reluctant in the first place.
The impact is way more than economic, the human cost of imprisoning people is significant in terms of their well being, issues of domestic and child abuse, educational outcomes, the list goes on.
And we are a global society, I was reading with some envy the planned Queensland state lockdown rules which are way more palatable than ours, whilst still maintaining bans of group activities and ensuring social distancing.
So I think there is much pressure to at least ease the lockdown whilst recognising the risks of so doing, in terms of possible lives lost.
Anyhow - as ever, we aren't going to solve it here. It is a very nuanced and difficult decision which is way more complicated than simply "listening to or following the science" irrespective of what anyone on here or on our TVs claims. |
Its not particularly nuanced at all at this stage. Starmer is wrong to keep raising it- because it is plainly encouraging people to think that its on the way, and have started to act accordingly.
Meanwhile our figures for new cases are hovering at around 5k a day, despite 4/5 weeks of restrictions. These should surely be reducing but are not. If we are keeping a lid on at 5k a day with the restrictions, what on earth do people think will happen if they are relaxed?
https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/country/uk/ [Post edited 27 Apr 2020 9:16]
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| The presence of those seeking the truth is infinitely to be preferred to the presence of those who think they've found it.
(Sir Terry Pratchett) | | Poll: | Is Fred drunk this morning? |
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| This pressure to end the lockdown on 09:16 - Apr 27 with 3655 views | ElderGrizzly |
I agree, it is way too early to end the lockdown.
However, what other countries in a similar situation to us have done is set out what an exit might look like and we should at least be setting out that to manage expectations, because in the next month or so there will be very little change.
The challenge the Government has is if the majority of the EU, including Spain and Italy have relaxed restrictions, questions need to be answered on how we will. Otherwise you will have morons taking decisions themselves |  | | |
| This pressure to end the lockdown on 09:17 - Apr 27 with 3640 views | sparks |
| This pressure to end the lockdown on 09:16 - Apr 27 by ElderGrizzly |
I agree, it is way too early to end the lockdown.
However, what other countries in a similar situation to us have done is set out what an exit might look like and we should at least be setting out that to manage expectations, because in the next month or so there will be very little change.
The challenge the Government has is if the majority of the EU, including Spain and Italy have relaxed restrictions, questions need to be answered on how we will. Otherwise you will have morons taking decisions themselves |
Nations are not alike. We already have many pushing at the boundaries and beyond- and this is encouraging them. | |
| The presence of those seeking the truth is infinitely to be preferred to the presence of those who think they've found it.
(Sir Terry Pratchett) | | Poll: | Is Fred drunk this morning? |
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| This pressure to end the lockdown on 09:18 - Apr 27 with 3634 views | ElderGrizzly |
| This pressure to end the lockdown on 09:08 - Apr 27 by bluelagos |
There are lots of reasons why ending the lockdown would be beneficial so I think it a tad simplistic to only highlight the right wing libertarians who were, as you point out, reluctant in the first place.
The impact is way more than economic, the human cost of imprisoning people is significant in terms of their well being, issues of domestic and child abuse, educational outcomes, the list goes on.
And we are a global society, I was reading with some envy the planned Queensland state lockdown rules which are way more palatable than ours, whilst still maintaining bans of group activities and ensuring social distancing.
So I think there is much pressure to at least ease the lockdown whilst recognising the risks of so doing, in terms of possible lives lost.
Anyhow - as ever, we aren't going to solve it here. It is a very nuanced and difficult decision which is way more complicated than simply "listening to or following the science" irrespective of what anyone on here or on our TVs claims. |
UCL were saying even with a relaxed lockdown with strict social distancing, you are likely to see 60,000 deaths by October and 100,000 by the end of the year | | | |
| This pressure to end the lockdown on 09:19 - Apr 27 with 3613 views | ElderGrizzly |
| This pressure to end the lockdown on 09:17 - Apr 27 by sparks |
Nations are not alike. We already have many pushing at the boundaries and beyond- and this is encouraging them. |
I agree, but that message is not understood by the majority.
Its why an open plan is important, even if that is likely to show another 6 weeks of similar measures to now | | | |
| This pressure to end the lockdown on 09:21 - Apr 27 with 3598 views | sparks |
| This pressure to end the lockdown on 09:19 - Apr 27 by ElderGrizzly |
I agree, but that message is not understood by the majority.
Its why an open plan is important, even if that is likely to show another 6 weeks of similar measures to now |
I dont agree- all this talk of relaxation is clearly leading people to relax now.
Meanwhile our figures are stable but not reducing for new cases. 5k a day WITH restrictions, and not improving much. This ought not to be happening, surely? 5 weeks in, 2 weeks incubation- and we are not impacting new cases much. | |
| The presence of those seeking the truth is infinitely to be preferred to the presence of those who think they've found it.
(Sir Terry Pratchett) | | Poll: | Is Fred drunk this morning? |
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| This pressure to end the lockdown on 09:28 - Apr 27 with 3586 views | NotSure |
You talk of ten of thousands of deaths.
I know this is unpleasant to say but the vast majority of these people who died were economically inactive. Every death is a tragedy but this disease is currently not killing many young people.
My household doesn't care about this lockdown anymore and just like my neighbours on either side we are going out when we want and accepting visitors. |  | | |
| This pressure to end the lockdown on 09:28 - Apr 27 with 3548 views | StokieBlue |
| This pressure to end the lockdown on 09:11 - Apr 27 by Guthrum |
Tho I think that "fatigue" is partly because the lockdown has never been properly addressed as a longer-term measure. There has been no "Blood, sweat and tears" speech outlining an extended and grim struggle. There have been noises from ministers and scientists about this having to go on for some time, but they are really rather muted and not presented as a coherent, clear message. |
Not sure I agree.
People know this is a big deal, they should know the lockdown is until they are told it's not. It's not like there isn't 24/7 coverage detailing this. The lockdown has perhaps the one thing that has had a clear message from the government. There is a lockdown for 3 more weeks then it is assessed again.
People have decided it doesn't apply to them for whatever reason and are doing as they please. I don't think they should be given excuses about "poor communication" for what is essentially a selfish decision to ignore the rules.
SB | |
| Avatar - IC410 - Tadpoles Nebula |
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| This pressure to end the lockdown on 09:30 - Apr 27 with 3538 views | StokieBlue |
| This pressure to end the lockdown on 09:28 - Apr 27 by NotSure |
You talk of ten of thousands of deaths.
I know this is unpleasant to say but the vast majority of these people who died were economically inactive. Every death is a tragedy but this disease is currently not killing many young people.
My household doesn't care about this lockdown anymore and just like my neighbours on either side we are going out when we want and accepting visitors. |
You are part of the problem with a selfish attitude like that. You're alright so screw everyone else.
I can only assume due to your avatar that you're a troll.
SB | |
| Avatar - IC410 - Tadpoles Nebula |
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| This pressure to end the lockdown on 09:31 - Apr 27 with 3532 views | factual_blue |
| This pressure to end the lockdown on 09:28 - Apr 27 by NotSure |
You talk of ten of thousands of deaths.
I know this is unpleasant to say but the vast majority of these people who died were economically inactive. Every death is a tragedy but this disease is currently not killing many young people.
My household doesn't care about this lockdown anymore and just like my neighbours on either side we are going out when we want and accepting visitors. |
That's the way to ensure economically active people and the young do get the disease and die.
So go on, win yourself a Darwin award. |  |
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| This pressure to end the lockdown on 09:32 - Apr 27 with 3512 views | GeoffSentence |
| This pressure to end the lockdown on 09:13 - Apr 27 by sparks |
Its not particularly nuanced at all at this stage. Starmer is wrong to keep raising it- because it is plainly encouraging people to think that its on the way, and have started to act accordingly.
Meanwhile our figures for new cases are hovering at around 5k a day, despite 4/5 weeks of restrictions. These should surely be reducing but are not. If we are keeping a lid on at 5k a day with the restrictions, what on earth do people think will happen if they are relaxed?
https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/country/uk/ [Post edited 27 Apr 2020 9:16]
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I have been wondering about the stubbornness of the new infection figures which do seem to hardly be shifting even though the number of new deaths are, albeit slowly dropping.
All I have come up with is that the new infection numbers are increasing alongside testing rates.
I have no idea if that is right, but it doesn't make sense for the infection rates to stay steady and yet deaths to drop. |  |
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| This pressure to end the lockdown on 09:33 - Apr 27 with 3508 views | factual_blue |
| This pressure to end the lockdown on 09:00 - Apr 27 by itfcjoe |
The front page of the Express shows Brighton seafront and the photo isn't even from this weekend - there are cranes up on it which aren't currently there |
What do you expect from the newspaper of choice on certain village greens? | |
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| This pressure to end the lockdown on 09:34 - Apr 27 with 3520 views | NotSure |
| This pressure to end the lockdown on 09:30 - Apr 27 by StokieBlue |
You are part of the problem with a selfish attitude like that. You're alright so screw everyone else.
I can only assume due to your avatar that you're a troll.
SB |
We only changed our attitude this Saturday after discussions with friends and neighbours.
Still making sacrifices like not visiting the parents and if I caught a cold I'd definitely isolate myself.
No trolling, there's lots of people now ignoring this lockdown. The summers coming, the virus will go away for a few months, so enjoy life and stop worrying. | | | |
| This pressure to end the lockdown on 09:34 - Apr 27 with 3490 views | factual_blue |
| This pressure to end the lockdown on 09:16 - Apr 27 by ElderGrizzly |
I agree, it is way too early to end the lockdown.
However, what other countries in a similar situation to us have done is set out what an exit might look like and we should at least be setting out that to manage expectations, because in the next month or so there will be very little change.
The challenge the Government has is if the majority of the EU, including Spain and Italy have relaxed restrictions, questions need to be answered on how we will. Otherwise you will have morons taking decisions themselves |
On a point of order, the key qualification for this cabinet is that you are a moron. | |
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| This pressure to end the lockdown on 09:35 - Apr 27 with 3475 views | gordon |
| This pressure to end the lockdown on 09:21 - Apr 27 by sparks |
I dont agree- all this talk of relaxation is clearly leading people to relax now.
Meanwhile our figures are stable but not reducing for new cases. 5k a day WITH restrictions, and not improving much. This ought not to be happening, surely? 5 weeks in, 2 weeks incubation- and we are not impacting new cases much. |
We're just picking up a greater proportion of actual cases as the numbers we're testing increases. |  | | |
| This pressure to end the lockdown on 09:36 - Apr 27 with 3458 views | monytowbray |
| This pressure to end the lockdown on 09:08 - Apr 27 by bluelagos |
There are lots of reasons why ending the lockdown would be beneficial so I think it a tad simplistic to only highlight the right wing libertarians who were, as you point out, reluctant in the first place.
The impact is way more than economic, the human cost of imprisoning people is significant in terms of their well being, issues of domestic and child abuse, educational outcomes, the list goes on.
And we are a global society, I was reading with some envy the planned Queensland state lockdown rules which are way more palatable than ours, whilst still maintaining bans of group activities and ensuring social distancing.
So I think there is much pressure to at least ease the lockdown whilst recognising the risks of so doing, in terms of possible lives lost.
Anyhow - as ever, we aren't going to solve it here. It is a very nuanced and difficult decision which is way more complicated than simply "listening to or following the science" irrespective of what anyone on here or on our TVs claims. |
I think years of mental health struggles have made this much easier for me and many close friends oddly. As roundabout as it sounds large chunks of my life have been shut inside, struggling to function and full of fear. This is the same but at least it's rational, and I've had the therapy/counselling to deal with these feelings. It's those who have been lucky enough to never feel that way until now I worry about. |  |
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| This pressure to end the lockdown on 09:36 - Apr 27 with 3480 views | DanTheMan |
| This pressure to end the lockdown on 09:28 - Apr 27 by NotSure |
You talk of ten of thousands of deaths.
I know this is unpleasant to say but the vast majority of these people who died were economically inactive. Every death is a tragedy but this disease is currently not killing many young people.
My household doesn't care about this lockdown anymore and just like my neighbours on either side we are going out when we want and accepting visitors. |
"I know this is unpleasant to say but the vast majority of these people who died were economically inactive. Every death is a tragedy but this disease is currently not killing many young people."
That's not just unpleasant, that is absolutely horrid. |  |
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