| FFS Starmer 07:45 - Jun 29 with 11660 views | GlasgowBlue |
Not happy about this latest u turn tbh. Johnson dismantling DfID was a shameful, populist and very harmful move. Starmer gave a pledge to bring it back.
Sorry for going all koonters but he’s u turning on just about everything.
[Post edited 29 Jun 2023 8:07]
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| FFS Starmer on 08:02 - Jun 29 with 3609 views | Guthrum |
Sounds like he has a bunch of advisors who are working on the model "Be exactly like the Conservatives but without the personal idiocy and a bit more competent". The country needs something rather better than that. |  |
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| FFS Starmer on 08:09 - Jun 29 with 3560 views | Herbivore |
He's looked at the public finances and realised that within their own rules around fiscal policy they are literally not going to be able to do anything, so his response is to essentially have no policies. A more progressive leader might look at how a wealthy country might seek to balance its books by clawing back some of the wealth that big businesses and super rich individuals have accumulated in recent years whilst most of us have felt the pain and then using that money to invest in the country in ways that will boost growth that benefits everyone. Unfortunately, Labour is not a progressive party under Starmer and the best we're likely to get is something that feels a lot like the Con/Lib coalition of 2010-2015. |  |
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| FFS Starmer on 08:10 - Jun 29 with 3558 views | GlasgowBlue |
| FFS Starmer on 08:02 - Jun 29 by Guthrum |
Sounds like he has a bunch of advisors who are working on the model "Be exactly like the Conservatives but without the personal idiocy and a bit more competent". The country needs something rather better than that. |
I’m quite happy for a competent centrist government. But he’s even going back on the promise to return to the 0.7% aid spending target, which was a Cameron policy. So I’m not sure what he thinks will benefit Labour by ditching these policies. | |
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| FFS Starmer on 08:13 - Jun 29 with 3540 views | BanksterDebtSlave |
It's almost like he's a bit sh1t. |  |
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| FFS Starmer on 08:16 - Jun 29 with 3528 views | Herbivore |
It does rather look that way, which is a shame as I had hoped he might offer something better when he ran for the leadership and first became leader. | |
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| FFS Starmer on 08:22 - Jun 29 with 3504 views | DanTheMan |
| FFS Starmer on 08:16 - Jun 29 by Herbivore |
It does rather look that way, which is a shame as I had hoped he might offer something better when he ran for the leadership and first became leader. |
This is where I'm at, the number of policies they (Starmer) had which I quite liked but they have now dropped is growing longer and longer.
I think the above had it right, there's no money so instead of saying "hey, maybe we could increase taxes on the really wealthy who did very well out of COVID", we're just going with "no money, hold the course".
I'm glad we've at least still got the North Sea oil ban on the table and the increase in house-building but the list keeps growing slimmer. [Post edited 29 Jun 2023 8:28]
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| FFS Starmer on 08:29 - Jun 29 with 3472 views | BanksterDebtSlave |
| FFS Starmer on 08:22 - Jun 29 by DanTheMan |
This is where I'm at, the number of policies they (Starmer) had which I quite liked but they have now dropped is growing longer and longer.
I think the above had it right, there's no money so instead of saying "hey, maybe we could increase taxes on the really wealthy who did very well out of COVID", we're just going with "no money, hold the course".
I'm glad we've at least still got the North Sea oil ban on the table and the increase in house-building but the list keeps growing slimmer. [Post edited 29 Jun 2023 8:28]
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The oil thing is only in relation to new fields not existing ones, but don't hold your breath even on that. Difficult times will require difficult decisions etc.....etc... | |
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| FFS Starmer on 08:31 - Jun 29 with 3461 views | DanTheMan |
| FFS Starmer on 08:29 - Jun 29 by BanksterDebtSlave |
The oil thing is only in relation to new fields not existing ones, but don't hold your breath even on that. Difficult times will require difficult decisions etc.....etc... |
I'm aware, but right now that's better than the alternative which is open up more oil fields in the name of "energy security" when the oil and gas go onto the open market anyway. | |
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| FFS Starmer on 08:38 - Jun 29 with 3434 views | Guthrum |
| FFS Starmer on 08:10 - Jun 29 by GlasgowBlue |
I’m quite happy for a competent centrist government. But he’s even going back on the promise to return to the 0.7% aid spending target, which was a Cameron policy. So I’m not sure what he thinks will benefit Labour by ditching these policies. |
That's what i meant. He's going beyond "competent centrism" into aping recent Conservatism. He's already talking about a need for lower taxes, it'll be "Stop the boats!" next. | |
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| FFS Starmer on 08:47 - Jun 29 with 3403 views | SuperKieranMcKenna |
| FFS Starmer on 08:31 - Jun 29 by DanTheMan |
I'm aware, but right now that's better than the alternative which is open up more oil fields in the name of "energy security" when the oil and gas go onto the open market anyway. |
Are we therefore not just exporting the carbon emissions, and increasing it by transporting it here (appreciate some is imported in LNG, some via pipelines). Surely we’d be better off targeting consumption rather than extraction since the demand will still be there (and growing for petrochemicals).
Since most homes are still burning gas for heating, I’d like to see it taxed at a higher rate with funds set aside to help people insulate their homes and install heat pumps. This is largely an unaffordable luxury for many so grants would go a long way to reducing carbon consumption. |  | | |
| FFS Starmer on 08:51 - Jun 29 with 3374 views | DanTheMan |
| FFS Starmer on 08:47 - Jun 29 by SuperKieranMcKenna |
Are we therefore not just exporting the carbon emissions, and increasing it by transporting it here (appreciate some is imported in LNG, some via pipelines). Surely we’d be better off targeting consumption rather than extraction since the demand will still be there (and growing for petrochemicals).
Since most homes are still burning gas for heating, I’d like to see it taxed at a higher rate with funds set aside to help people insulate their homes and install heat pumps. This is largely an unaffordable luxury for many so grants would go a long way to reducing carbon consumption. |
Absolutely.
I imagine the real reason the Government wants to keep is that it's very easy to raise revenue by selling off licenses and keeping the status quo, it has almost nothing to do with energy security.
Making houses better insulated (a current Government policy they ignore) and moving from gas to other sources is the biggest way to reduce bills for people, as well as investing in cleaner forms of energy. It also doesn't help that right now we already pay the higher price for gas even when it's not the thing providing us energy which seems a bit bonkers.
But replacing boilers and heating systems is expensive and there needs to be Government support on it, especially for those who would have no chance of paying for upgrades. | |
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| FFS Starmer on 09:00 - Jun 29 with 3335 views | itfcjoe |
| FFS Starmer on 08:51 - Jun 29 by DanTheMan |
Absolutely.
I imagine the real reason the Government wants to keep is that it's very easy to raise revenue by selling off licenses and keeping the status quo, it has almost nothing to do with energy security.
Making houses better insulated (a current Government policy they ignore) and moving from gas to other sources is the biggest way to reduce bills for people, as well as investing in cleaner forms of energy. It also doesn't help that right now we already pay the higher price for gas even when it's not the thing providing us energy which seems a bit bonkers.
But replacing boilers and heating systems is expensive and there needs to be Government support on it, especially for those who would have no chance of paying for upgrades. |
And retro fitting heat pumps to existing houses is a fools errand - they just don't work well enough |  |
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| FFS Starmer on 09:02 - Jun 29 with 3320 views | Herbivore |
| FFS Starmer on 08:47 - Jun 29 by SuperKieranMcKenna |
Are we therefore not just exporting the carbon emissions, and increasing it by transporting it here (appreciate some is imported in LNG, some via pipelines). Surely we’d be better off targeting consumption rather than extraction since the demand will still be there (and growing for petrochemicals).
Since most homes are still burning gas for heating, I’d like to see it taxed at a higher rate with funds set aside to help people insulate their homes and install heat pumps. This is largely an unaffordable luxury for many so grants would go a long way to reducing carbon consumption. |
As far as I can tell, the government grants for heat pumps have only served to add £5k on to the cost that installers charge. I looked at quotes before the scheme started and the cost was roughly £8k to £10k, since the grants were introduced it's now more like £15k+. The only people who can afford heat pumps are those who are comfortably off, most middle and low earners still use gas so if you tax gas at a higher rate you are effectively punishing people who can't afford the alternative. | |
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| FFS Starmer on 09:05 - Jun 29 with 3291 views | DJR |
| FFS Starmer on 08:09 - Jun 29 by Herbivore |
He's looked at the public finances and realised that within their own rules around fiscal policy they are literally not going to be able to do anything, so his response is to essentially have no policies. A more progressive leader might look at how a wealthy country might seek to balance its books by clawing back some of the wealth that big businesses and super rich individuals have accumulated in recent years whilst most of us have felt the pain and then using that money to invest in the country in ways that will boost growth that benefits everyone. Unfortunately, Labour is not a progressive party under Starmer and the best we're likely to get is something that feels a lot like the Con/Lib coalition of 2010-2015. |
One of his pledges (now abandoned) was to increase increase taxes on the top 5%, which is not affected by the state of public finances and would give Labour more headroom (and is something the SNP have done).
Even Miliband proposed to reintroduce the 50% top rate of tax and introduce a mansion tax. But he was regarded as a dangerous lefty by the Blairites, now back in control.
In my view, the economic model (some call it neo-liberalism) which has prevailed for 40 years has completely failed us with crumbling public services, and a younger generation certain to be poorer than their parents.
In contrast, the more successful and more equal western European nations, have stuck more closely to the social democratic model that prevailed in in this country before Thatcher, which recognises the need for higher taxation to ensure decent public services.
Sadly, the Labour Party these days, in my view, is not willing to do anything more than tinker with the current model not least because I think it fundamentally agrees with it. As I have mentioned before on TWTD, a friend of mine knows an adviser to Sadiq Khan, a staunch Blairite, and people like him were pretty supportive of, and relaxed about, people like Cameron, Osborne and Johnson (when he was London mayor).
And with the control they now have on selections, in my view they have ensured that Labour will never return to the /"leftist" policies of Miliband, let alone anything approaching Foot, Kinnock, Smith or Corbyn. [Post edited 29 Jun 2023 11:39]
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| FFS Starmer on 09:10 - Jun 29 with 3257 views | Ryorry |
FFS. How about seeing what he *actually* does, if and when he’s able to, because actually in power. |  |
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| FFS Starmer on 09:13 - Jun 29 with 3226 views | Pinewoodblue |
| FFS Starmer on 08:31 - Jun 29 by DanTheMan |
I'm aware, but right now that's better than the alternative which is open up more oil fields in the name of "energy security" when the oil and gas go onto the open market anyway. |
Petrochemical products are everywhere and are integral to modern societies. They include plastics, fertilisers, packaging, clothing, digital devices, medical equipment, detergents, tires and many others. They are also found in many parts of the modern energy system, including solar panels, wind turbine blades, batteries, thermal insulation for buildings, and electric vehicle parts. |  |
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| FFS Starmer on 09:13 - Jun 29 with 3225 views | BanksterDebtSlave |
| FFS Starmer on 09:10 - Jun 29 by Ryorry |
FFS. How about seeing what he *actually* does, if and when he’s able to, because actually in power. |
You mean when it's too late? But not to worry at that point we can vote in the blue team again. | |
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| FFS Starmer on 09:15 - Jun 29 with 3215 views | JakeITFC |
Well at least the grown ups are back in charge, eh. |  | | |
| FFS Starmer on 09:17 - Jun 29 with 3205 views | BanksterDebtSlave |
| FFS Starmer on 08:51 - Jun 29 by DanTheMan |
Absolutely.
I imagine the real reason the Government wants to keep is that it's very easy to raise revenue by selling off licenses and keeping the status quo, it has almost nothing to do with energy security.
Making houses better insulated (a current Government policy they ignore) and moving from gas to other sources is the biggest way to reduce bills for people, as well as investing in cleaner forms of energy. It also doesn't help that right now we already pay the higher price for gas even when it's not the thing providing us energy which seems a bit bonkers.
But replacing boilers and heating systems is expensive and there needs to be Government support on it, especially for those who would have no chance of paying for upgrades. |
May as well throw this into the mix.
https://www.theguardian.com/environment/2023/jun/20/gas-stoves-benzene-levels-st
'Leaving a single gas hob on for 45 minutes raised benzene levels to above that found in secondhand tobacco smoking, or at the boundary of oil and gas plants, with emissions 10 to 25 times higher than that from electric coil stoves. Even low-burning hobs, or gas oven use, emit significant levels of benzene. Induction stoves emit no benzene at all, the researchers found.
The peer-reviewed study, led by scientists at Stanford University, is the first to use new monitors to effectively measure benzene indoors. Even low doses of airborne benzene raise the risk of a variety of cancers, including lymphomas and leukemia, by damaging people’s bone marrow. Elevated levels of benzene can linger for six hours throughout a house or apartment after a gas stove is turned off.' | |
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| FFS Starmer on 09:17 - Jun 29 with 3203 views | DanTheMan |
| FFS Starmer on 09:13 - Jun 29 by Pinewoodblue |
Petrochemical products are everywhere and are integral to modern societies. They include plastics, fertilisers, packaging, clothing, digital devices, medical equipment, detergents, tires and many others. They are also found in many parts of the modern energy system, including solar panels, wind turbine blades, batteries, thermal insulation for buildings, and electric vehicle parts. |
Great, we'll just keep plowing on then and when we can't grow food we can eat plastic. | |
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| FFS Starmer on 09:19 - Jun 29 with 3190 views | Herbivore |
| FFS Starmer on 09:10 - Jun 29 by Ryorry |
FFS. How about seeing what he *actually* does, if and when he’s able to, because actually in power. |
It's kind of important to know what someone stands for and what kind of policies they are going to be implementing before voting for them to run the country. | |
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| FFS Starmer on 09:24 - Jun 29 with 3159 views | homer_123 |
| FFS Starmer on 09:19 - Jun 29 by Herbivore |
It's kind of important to know what someone stands for and what kind of policies they are going to be implementing before voting for them to run the country. |
Although, it would not be unfair or incorrect to say that pretty much no party delivers on their policies or manifestos. |  |
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| FFS Starmer on 09:27 - Jun 29 with 3143 views | Pinewoodblue |
| FFS Starmer on 09:17 - Jun 29 by DanTheMan |
Great, we'll just keep plowing on then and when we can't grow food we can eat plastic. |
We need to find alternatives, not sure we can grow enough of the right plants to produce all we need to replace petrochemicals produced from oil.
There are no simple answers. | |
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| FFS Starmer on 09:29 - Jun 29 with 3135 views | DanTheMan |
| FFS Starmer on 09:27 - Jun 29 by Pinewoodblue |
We need to find alternatives, not sure we can grow enough of the right plants to produce all we need to replace petrochemicals produced from oil.
There are no simple answers. |
Maybe you should go explain this to the IPCC, I'm sure they didn't consider any of this when they told us we cannot afford any more oil and gas fields. | |
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| FFS Starmer on 09:36 - Jun 29 with 3092 views | The_Flashing_Smile |
| FFS Starmer on 09:13 - Jun 29 by BanksterDebtSlave |
You mean when it's too late? But not to worry at that point we can vote in the blue team again. |
What's your solution? Bitch about Starmer on a football messageboard?
"When it's too late?" So it's not too late now? Brilliant. Where do I sign and what do I need to do? |  |
| Trust the process. Trust Phil. |
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