| Oh dear Cornwall on 16:14 - Aug 25 with 1605 views | Darth_Koont |
| Oh dear Cornwall on 15:25 - Aug 25 by Herbivore |
It seemed to be doing a better job of dedistributing our cash to where it was needed than we were able to manage. |
Indeed.
Outside of the single market that makes trade so much easier, a resulting focus on regions, cultures and communities is probably the best output from the EU's cross-border partnership.
And for countries like the UK with a pretty pathetic regional focus to start with, it's a lifesaver for many. There may be money still but there'll be a huge lack of political will unless it is spent in marginals and Leave MPs' constituencies. |  |
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| Oh dear Cornwall on 18:04 - Aug 25 with 1565 views | LeoMuff |
| Oh dear Cornwall on 16:08 - Aug 25 by tractordownsouth |
I agree completely, just think it's reasonable to ask for our funding to be replaced by central government, as Boris and others promised that in 2016.
The political scene has changed very quickly down here. The Lib Dems won every seat in 2005 but by 2015 it was all blue and hasn't changed since. North Cornwall, South East Cornwall and St Austell/Newquay are all safe Tory seats now with majorities of 15000+. Truro and Falmouth was the only remain constituency and is the closest with a 4000 majority so will probably flip to Labour, but the only realistic chance the Lib Dems have these days is in my home seat of St Ives, where they're 4000 behind. Was always going to be hard for them to recover post 2015 in a Brexit voting stronghold. |
The funding was never going to be replaced, we are way way too far from London to have any kind of voice, and our economy is the smallest of small fry , we contribute very little to the economy of the UK to be demanding anything. whatever we are promised will not be materialising of that I am sure. |  |
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| Oh dear Cornwall on 18:12 - Aug 25 with 1552 views | MattinLondon |
| Oh dear Cornwall on 15:25 - Aug 25 by Herbivore |
It seemed to be doing a better job of dedistributing our cash to where it was needed than we were able to manage. |
The trouble with Cornwall, as like many places, is that it’s not London or in the south-east and so the Tories don’t really care about it. |  | | |
| Oh dear Cornwall on 18:12 - Aug 25 with 1552 views | GlasgowBlue |
| Oh dear Cornwall on 15:25 - Aug 25 by Herbivore |
It seemed to be doing a better job of dedistributing our cash to where it was needed than we were able to manage. |
I don't disagree. And I don't trust that shyster Johnson will make up the shortfall from central government. But the point remains that we put in more than we took out and for every £1 the EU sent to our regions, we had already paid in £1.50*.
It's like me giving Tesco** £500, getting £350 worth of shopping in return and congratulating them for supporting my family with food, drink and toiletries.
And bringing it back to your point, yes, probably better giving it directly to Tesco rather than sending my 20 year old son who would have come back with £100 of goods and spent the rest on booze and birds.
I would have trusted Cameron and May to have used our funds for more wisely than Johnson.
*No idea what the real figure is but you get the point.
**Other Supermarkets are available. |  |
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| Oh dear Cornwall on 18:14 - Aug 25 with 1547 views | BryanPlug |
| Oh dear Cornwall on 00:48 - Aug 25 by jeera |
That aside, sort of, why are 2nd and 3rd homes not taxed to the hilt when those buying up properties in popular resort areas are forcing hardship, real hardship, onto local people?
All the pretty modest seaside towns have become the weekend playground of stupidly rich folk.
To think there's effectively a whole class been created through the greed of others.
And how it's been not only allowed, but encouraged to happen. |
[content removed at owner's request] |  |
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| Oh dear Cornwall on 18:18 - Aug 25 with 1537 views | GlasgowBlue |
| Oh dear Cornwall on 18:14 - Aug 25 by BryanPlug |
[content removed at owner's request] |
Surely people who can afford second homes in the countryside have already paid an enormous amount of tax on the money that they used to make the purchase.
And they will be paying council tax on said property despite hardly using the services that their council tax is collected for. | |
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| Oh dear Cornwall on 18:46 - Aug 25 with 1507 views | jaykay |
one thing about the e.u. only giving us are own money back, it didnt just end up in the south east. |  |
| forensic experts say footers and spruces fingerprints were not found at the scene after the weekends rows |
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| Oh dear Cornwall on 20:01 - Aug 25 with 1489 views | jeera |
| Oh dear Cornwall on 18:46 - Aug 25 by jaykay |
one thing about the e.u. only giving us are own money back, it didnt just end up in the south east. |
Once we're out of the EU proper, if we see our GDP fall [enough] as a consequence, we would have been better off just continuing to pay in.
It might turn out that money only existed in the first place because of our trade alliances etc.
There's still seems to be this myth that we will suddenly see factories magically rise up like mushrooms overnight and start to produce everything we dream of ourselves, totally ignoring that the opportunity was there anyway.
The only way new home-grown industry would be supported is if so many imports become so heavily taxed we couldn't afford to buy anything from anywhere but here, and being a monopoly, the average shopping bill would go through the roof.
With tariffs inevitably increasing, the rise in domestic cost of living seems to be on the cards anyway. |  |
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| Oh dear Cornwall on 20:07 - Aug 25 with 1487 views | jeera |
| Oh dear Cornwall on 18:18 - Aug 25 by GlasgowBlue |
Surely people who can afford second homes in the countryside have already paid an enormous amount of tax on the money that they used to make the purchase.
And they will be paying council tax on said property despite hardly using the services that their council tax is collected for. |
That people can afford to pay that tax and still be able to outprice others shows there is something very wrong.
Property ownership tax should be staggered until owning 4-5 properties is not viable.
Of course it would never happen here, but to think the basic requirement of even having a home, let alone being able to own one anymore, is so far out of reach for so many people that life ahead can only mean more profit for some and more despair for others...
Anyone working full time should be able to afford their own home. Someone waiting in a burger joint, working a full shift, should be able to get a mortgage and purchase a modest home. | |
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| Oh dear Cornwall on 20:19 - Aug 25 with 1483 views | azuremerlangus |
| Oh dear Cornwall on 20:07 - Aug 25 by jeera |
That people can afford to pay that tax and still be able to outprice others shows there is something very wrong.
Property ownership tax should be staggered until owning 4-5 properties is not viable.
Of course it would never happen here, but to think the basic requirement of even having a home, let alone being able to own one anymore, is so far out of reach for so many people that life ahead can only mean more profit for some and more despair for others...
Anyone working full time should be able to afford their own home. Someone waiting in a burger joint, working a full shift, should be able to get a mortgage and purchase a modest home. |
Unfortunately residential property is seen as a business opportunity rather than as just an affordable home these days.
The rental market is still very lucrative unless, as you suggest, that the tax structure is changed. |  |
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| Oh dear Cornwall on 20:49 - Aug 25 with 1472 views | Swansea_Blue |
| Oh dear Cornwall on 18:12 - Aug 25 by GlasgowBlue |
I don't disagree. And I don't trust that shyster Johnson will make up the shortfall from central government. But the point remains that we put in more than we took out and for every £1 the EU sent to our regions, we had already paid in £1.50*.
It's like me giving Tesco** £500, getting £350 worth of shopping in return and congratulating them for supporting my family with food, drink and toiletries.
And bringing it back to your point, yes, probably better giving it directly to Tesco rather than sending my 20 year old son who would have come back with £100 of goods and spent the rest on booze and birds.
I would have trusted Cameron and May to have used our funds for more wisely than Johnson.
*No idea what the real figure is but you get the point.
**Other Supermarkets are available. |
It’s disingenuous to try to make out it was our money. Our membership fee was for other things and we paid that with no expectation of money coming back the other way through Structural Funds. We only received those because some parts of the UK are amongst the poorest areas in Europe, including the accession countries. A damning indictment of our own regional development efforts over decades.
Furthermore, if we’re talking net fiscal benefit then where’s the money supposed to come from? It can’t come from any savings because their aren’t any. The full cost of Brexit is immense and swallows up our former annual contribution many times over. |  |
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| Oh dear Cornwall on 20:54 - Aug 25 with 1467 views | Swansea_Blue |
PS. And unless I’m missing something, that article’s title is awful. It doesn’t seem to have anything to do with “Cornish Brexiteers” demanding funding. It’s just the council pointing out they are going to be losing the money and asking for government to replace it. As you’d expect any council to do, irrespective of the referendum result in the region. | |
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| Oh dear Cornwall on 21:06 - Aug 25 with 1455 views | tractordownsouth |
| Oh dear Cornwall on 18:18 - Aug 25 by GlasgowBlue |
Surely people who can afford second homes in the countryside have already paid an enormous amount of tax on the money that they used to make the purchase.
And they will be paying council tax on said property despite hardly using the services that their council tax is collected for. |
There are loopholes which allow people to pay business rates rather than council tax down here, just for renting their holiday homes out for a few months. It puts them on the same level as legitimate hospitality businesses which isn't fair.
We have the biggest disparity between wages and house prices in the country and there's a massive amount of public sector dependancy. People are of course allowed to have second homes if that's what they wish to spend their money on, but the council tax system should discourage excess demand in a county where prices are already high.
https://www.cornwalllive.com/news/business/second-homes-tax-loophole-costs-18394 |  |
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| Oh dear Cornwall on 21:51 - Aug 25 with 1428 views | jeera |
| Oh dear Cornwall on 20:54 - Aug 25 by Swansea_Blue |
PS. And unless I’m missing something, that article’s title is awful. It doesn’t seem to have anything to do with “Cornish Brexiteers” demanding funding. It’s just the council pointing out they are going to be losing the money and asking for government to replace it. As you’d expect any council to do, irrespective of the referendum result in the region. |
Although part of me can't help wondering if there's a quick quid to be made by getting down to the beaches and flogging a few MCGA hats. | |
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| Oh dear Cornwall on 21:52 - Aug 25 with 1422 views | jeera |
| Oh dear Cornwall on 20:19 - Aug 25 by azuremerlangus |
Unfortunately residential property is seen as a business opportunity rather than as just an affordable home these days.
The rental market is still very lucrative unless, as you suggest, that the tax structure is changed. |
Well that's that solved then.
Come the revolution, that's what we're gonna do. | |
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| Oh dear Cornwall on 23:53 - Aug 25 with 1383 views | reusersfreekicks |
| Oh dear Cornwall on 20:07 - Aug 25 by jeera |
That people can afford to pay that tax and still be able to outprice others shows there is something very wrong.
Property ownership tax should be staggered until owning 4-5 properties is not viable.
Of course it would never happen here, but to think the basic requirement of even having a home, let alone being able to own one anymore, is so far out of reach for so many people that life ahead can only mean more profit for some and more despair for others...
Anyone working full time should be able to afford their own home. Someone waiting in a burger joint, working a full shift, should be able to get a mortgage and purchase a modest home. |
Congrats on an outstanding post! |  | | |
| Oh dear Cornwall on 08:00 - Aug 26 with 1333 views | pointofblue |
| Oh dear Cornwall on 13:20 - Aug 25 by giant_stow |
Maybe Cornish leave voters need to see the result of their damaging votes and live it, rather than plead for money that could be spent in areas that didn't cause this mess?
I'm with Spruce on this personally. |
Though there will still be a decent proportion of Remain voters in Cornwall - should they be made to suffer because of the decision made by others which was out of their hands? |  |
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| Oh dear Cornwall on 08:10 - Aug 26 with 1326 views | GlasgowBlue |
| Oh dear Cornwall on 20:49 - Aug 25 by Swansea_Blue |
It’s disingenuous to try to make out it was our money. Our membership fee was for other things and we paid that with no expectation of money coming back the other way through Structural Funds. We only received those because some parts of the UK are amongst the poorest areas in Europe, including the accession countries. A damning indictment of our own regional development efforts over decades.
Furthermore, if we’re talking net fiscal benefit then where’s the money supposed to come from? It can’t come from any savings because their aren’t any. The full cost of Brexit is immense and swallows up our former annual contribution many times over. |
It’s not disingenuous to say it is our money. We are, or were, a NET contributor.
Malta, Cyprus, Spain, Slovenia, Estonia, Croatia, Latvia, Bulgaria, Slovakia, Lithuania, Luxembourg, Chezch Republic, Belgium, Romania, Portugal, Greece, Portugal and Poland all have the same benefits as the U.K. for being members of the EU despite taking out more than they put in.
Herbie makes a perfectly reasonable point when he says that the EU are / were better custodians and distributors of these funds.
Imo it’s disingenuous to say that this wasn’t our money coming back. | |
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| Oh dear Cornwall (n/t) on 08:30 - Aug 26 with 1315 views | bluelagos |
| Oh dear Cornwall on 08:10 - Aug 26 by GlasgowBlue |
It’s not disingenuous to say it is our money. We are, or were, a NET contributor.
Malta, Cyprus, Spain, Slovenia, Estonia, Croatia, Latvia, Bulgaria, Slovakia, Lithuania, Luxembourg, Chezch Republic, Belgium, Romania, Portugal, Greece, Portugal and Poland all have the same benefits as the U.K. for being members of the EU despite taking out more than they put in.
Herbie makes a perfectly reasonable point when he says that the EU are / were better custodians and distributors of these funds.
Imo it’s disingenuous to say that this wasn’t our money coming back. |
Eu is a club and we paid a membership fee. Club distibutes monies as per its rules.
Whilst we were net contributers to state the money they distribute is 'our money' is absurd imho. We might be funding it but it is as much 'our money' as a gym's money is yours once you have paid your membership.
[Post edited 26 Aug 2020 8:35]
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| Oh dear Cornwall on 08:42 - Aug 26 with 1299 views | bluelagos |
| Oh dear Cornwall on 08:10 - Aug 26 by GlasgowBlue |
It’s not disingenuous to say it is our money. We are, or were, a NET contributor.
Malta, Cyprus, Spain, Slovenia, Estonia, Croatia, Latvia, Bulgaria, Slovakia, Lithuania, Luxembourg, Chezch Republic, Belgium, Romania, Portugal, Greece, Portugal and Poland all have the same benefits as the U.K. for being members of the EU despite taking out more than they put in.
Herbie makes a perfectly reasonable point when he says that the EU are / were better custodians and distributors of these funds.
Imo it’s disingenuous to say that this wasn’t our money coming back. |
Ref those countries having the same benefits, I think that is far from true when you consider their relative sizes and development of respective economies.
The benefit of access to the free market are clearly greater to the Uk than to Malta. To ignore that and claim we have the same benefits isnt really a fair representation of that aspect of membership. | |
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| Oh dear Cornwall on 09:16 - Aug 26 with 1282 views | Herbivore |
| Oh dear Cornwall on 08:42 - Aug 26 by bluelagos |
Ref those countries having the same benefits, I think that is far from true when you consider their relative sizes and development of respective economies.
The benefit of access to the free market are clearly greater to the Uk than to Malta. To ignore that and claim we have the same benefits isnt really a fair representation of that aspect of membership. |
Indeed. The EU redistributing wealth to some extent is a reflection that the equality of opportunity they offer doesn't provide anything like material equality. As well as the free market benefiting large economies like ours, free movement also means working age people from poorer EU countries can move to wealthier countries to earn more. Good for those individuals but not good for countries losing a large chunk of their labour force and tax base. We benefit from filling labour gaps with comparatively cheap EU workers. We should see our larger contributions as reflecting the larger benefits we accrue through membership. |  |
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| Oh dear Cornwall on 09:38 - Aug 26 with 1261 views | GeoffSentence |
| Oh dear Cornwall on 08:42 - Aug 26 by bluelagos |
Ref those countries having the same benefits, I think that is far from true when you consider their relative sizes and development of respective economies.
The benefit of access to the free market are clearly greater to the Uk than to Malta. To ignore that and claim we have the same benefits isnt really a fair representation of that aspect of membership. |
Although in other ways the smaller countries actually benefit more. In terms of representation for instance there is one MEP for every 82,000 Maltese and one for every 865,000 Germans. |  |
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| Oh dear Cornwall (n/t) on 11:06 - Aug 26 with 1243 views | GlasgowBlue |
| Oh dear Cornwall (n/t) on 08:30 - Aug 26 by bluelagos |
Eu is a club and we paid a membership fee. Club distibutes monies as per its rules.
Whilst we were net contributers to state the money they distribute is 'our money' is absurd imho. We might be funding it but it is as much 'our money' as a gym's money is yours once you have paid your membership.
[Post edited 26 Aug 2020 8:35]
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It would be very odd if I paid £500 a year to be a member of a gym and found out that over half the other members were actually being paid to be members of the same gym and that money came from my membership fees. | |
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| Oh dear Cornwall (n/t) on 11:37 - Aug 26 with 1235 views | manchego |
| Oh dear Cornwall (n/t) on 11:06 - Aug 26 by GlasgowBlue |
It would be very odd if I paid £500 a year to be a member of a gym and found out that over half the other members were actually being paid to be members of the same gym and that money came from my membership fees. |
The UK benefitted to the tune of £80 billion quid a year from being in the EU. Don't make out like we're doing everyone else a favour.
Estimated membership fee is £9 billion. |  | | |
| Oh dear Cornwall on 12:23 - Aug 26 with 1212 views | BrixtonBlue |
| Oh dear Cornwall on 20:54 - Aug 25 by Swansea_Blue |
PS. And unless I’m missing something, that article’s title is awful. It doesn’t seem to have anything to do with “Cornish Brexiteers” demanding funding. It’s just the council pointing out they are going to be losing the money and asking for government to replace it. As you’d expect any council to do, irrespective of the referendum result in the region. |
Of course it is. The council represents the people of Cornwall. They should've made damn sure the people realised what they were voting for, and the people should've realised if you vote to leave the EU you'll lose the EU funding. It's not rocket science.
Absolutely unbelievable that a county so reliant on EU funding would vote en masse to Leave. What on earth were they thinking? |  |
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