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Bullying is A - OK peeps! on 14:12 - Nov 20 by SpruceMoose
That reminds me, unrelated to the poster you mentioned, but I can't believe we got through Black History Month without someone giving me the chance to reply 'Every other month of the year' to the question "When is White History Month!?"
Bullying is A - OK peeps! on 14:12 - Nov 20 by Bluefish
When is it?
Every other month of the year.
Thanks mate.
[Post edited 20 Nov 2020 14:15]
Pronouns: He/Him/His.
"Imagine being a heterosexual white male in Britain at this moment. How bad is that. Everything you say is racist, everything you say is homophobic. The Woke community have really f****d this country."
Bullying is A - OK peeps! on 14:12 - Nov 20 by SpruceMoose
That reminds me, unrelated to the poster you mentioned, but I can't believe we got through Black History Month without someone giving me the chance to reply 'Every other month of the year' to the question "When is White History Month!?"
I was waiting for that comment as and was primed for the same reply.
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Bullying is A - OK peeps! on 14:28 - Nov 20 with 794 views
Bullying is A - OK peeps! on 13:51 - Nov 20 by woiii
No, you can always attend court if you're that bothered.
I just wonder how bad this is compared to what is commonplace in the private sector. Normal practice in my industry when someone is underperforming is to tell everyone what a c-word they are and then fire them. Shouting and swearing directly is usually reserved for when a whole team is underperforming.
Also, I've built up a network of contacts with Indian resources over the years and rarely use anyone who's UK educated. They work incredibly hard, long hours and deliver the requirement without question. I wonder if this is the culture clash here.
Bullying is A - OK peeps! on 14:05 - Nov 20 by SpruceMoose
Yeah... that's no' normal bud. It's not commonplace in the private sector, just your workplace seemingly.
[Post edited 20 Nov 2020 14:06]
It's not like it's an everyday occurrence, but it does happen. Some people are worse than others, and the ones that really are bullies tend to get moved along eventually (although the last senior manager I worked for was terrible, had been warned about her behaviour and, last time I looked, is still thriving in the same org.). I should note that I've worked for around ten different companies over the last twenty years so I'm not inexperienced. I've also worked with ex public sector people who've always been razor sharp in my experience, and just as hard.... and that's why I question whether this guy is at fault or not as he comes from the generation of civil servant where, if you had the right degree and passed the entry exam, you would be given a department to manage without any experience i.e. you'd get on the gravy train
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Bullying is A - OK peeps! on 14:37 - Nov 20 with 774 views
Bullying is A - OK peeps! on 14:12 - Nov 20 by Churchman
Is it as commonplace as you imply? Having worked for 2 large private sector companies, 1 small and contract worked for a couple more in addition to 16 years in the civil service the only time I saw the appalling behaviour Patel is accused of and you seem to think is normal is in the Civil Service (on rare occasions) including with politicians and their people (more common). In the early 2000s, I worked for an IT company making software for Financial Advisors. It was hard, demanding work and people could and were be asked to leave immediately if they weren’t performing. But I never saw them bullied or verbally abused in the way you describe. The staff were encouraged, motivated, incentivised, cared about on the basis that if they were looked after, they’d look after the company.
If you believe ‘Shouting and swearing’ at teams or individuals is they way to motivate people, I shall agree to differ. I have never seen bullying or ‘tell do’ management achieve anything other than sometimes short term, fear driven gain and long term damage to employer and employees.
There’s no culture clash. Just good and bad practices by good and bad (rotten) people, in my view.
It depends exactly what is meant by shouting and swearing. In my experience there are often raised voices and effing and blinding. A few months ago the product owner joined our morning scrum and told everyone in no uncertain terms that if they did X again they would be sacked tomorrow. That sort of thing.
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Bullying is A - OK peeps! on 14:39 - Nov 20 with 767 views
Bullying is A - OK peeps! on 14:37 - Nov 20 by woiii
It depends exactly what is meant by shouting and swearing. In my experience there are often raised voices and effing and blinding. A few months ago the product owner joined our morning scrum and told everyone in no uncertain terms that if they did X again they would be sacked tomorrow. That sort of thing.
Sounds more like how an office is portrayed in TV shows to be fair.
Pronouns: He/Him/His.
"Imagine being a heterosexual white male in Britain at this moment. How bad is that. Everything you say is racist, everything you say is homophobic. The Woke community have really f****d this country."
Bullying is A - OK peeps! on 14:37 - Nov 20 by woiii
It depends exactly what is meant by shouting and swearing. In my experience there are often raised voices and effing and blinding. A few months ago the product owner joined our morning scrum and told everyone in no uncertain terms that if they did X again they would be sacked tomorrow. That sort of thing.
Do you have an HR department? Have you suggested the product owners grows up and read about employment law before they cost the business a lot of money?
Bullying is A - OK peeps! on 14:42 - Nov 20 by Bluefish
Do you have an HR department? Have you suggested the product owners grows up and read about employment law before they cost the business a lot of money?
They'd taken a shortcut and put something into production that brought the system down - then they lied about it until I worked out what had happened (and they had been warned about this sort of thing before). Not one of my best days at work that.
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Bullying is A - OK peeps! on 14:46 - Nov 20 with 751 views
Bullying is A - OK peeps! on 14:29 - Nov 20 by woiii
It's not like it's an everyday occurrence, but it does happen. Some people are worse than others, and the ones that really are bullies tend to get moved along eventually (although the last senior manager I worked for was terrible, had been warned about her behaviour and, last time I looked, is still thriving in the same org.). I should note that I've worked for around ten different companies over the last twenty years so I'm not inexperienced. I've also worked with ex public sector people who've always been razor sharp in my experience, and just as hard.... and that's why I question whether this guy is at fault or not as he comes from the generation of civil servant where, if you had the right degree and passed the entry exam, you would be given a department to manage without any experience i.e. you'd get on the gravy train
I thought the Civil Service was a gravy train too, before I worked for it. It isn’t. It can be as hard and demanding as the private sector, particularly the higher up the food chain you go. If you worked in the world of project delivery, the main difference is the motive. In the private sector, it’s profit. Time is money. If you are working on government projects (e.g. those you see in the Budget or those supporting Brexit), the motive is political imperative, budgets, critical time based delivery (like food and medicines!). The aims are different as is work in the day to day departments, but the principles of work are the same.
Demanding high standards and outputs in the workplace is fine. Swearing and abusing people, macho kick-ass is for the movies and for stupid a-holes in my view
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Bullying is A - OK peeps! on 14:49 - Nov 20 with 739 views
Bullying is A - OK peeps! on 14:48 - Nov 20 by Churchman
I thought the Civil Service was a gravy train too, before I worked for it. It isn’t. It can be as hard and demanding as the private sector, particularly the higher up the food chain you go. If you worked in the world of project delivery, the main difference is the motive. In the private sector, it’s profit. Time is money. If you are working on government projects (e.g. those you see in the Budget or those supporting Brexit), the motive is political imperative, budgets, critical time based delivery (like food and medicines!). The aims are different as is work in the day to day departments, but the principles of work are the same.
Demanding high standards and outputs in the workplace is fine. Swearing and abusing people, macho kick-ass is for the movies and for stupid a-holes in my view
It is only hard because all of the others are off sick
Bullying is A - OK peeps! on 14:48 - Nov 20 by Churchman
I thought the Civil Service was a gravy train too, before I worked for it. It isn’t. It can be as hard and demanding as the private sector, particularly the higher up the food chain you go. If you worked in the world of project delivery, the main difference is the motive. In the private sector, it’s profit. Time is money. If you are working on government projects (e.g. those you see in the Budget or those supporting Brexit), the motive is political imperative, budgets, critical time based delivery (like food and medicines!). The aims are different as is work in the day to day departments, but the principles of work are the same.
Demanding high standards and outputs in the workplace is fine. Swearing and abusing people, macho kick-ass is for the movies and for stupid a-holes in my view
Agree with all that, you have to suck up the a-holes (what a vision) in the private sector though.
NB: you have regulatory projects in the private sector too though, and health and safety projects.. things like that. So it's not always about profit
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Bullying is A - OK peeps! on 14:53 - Nov 20 with 735 views
Bullying is A - OK peeps! on 14:43 - Nov 20 by woiii
What do you mean? You think I made it up for fun?
No, I'm saying that it sounds like the people in charge are acting under some false impression that people in their position are supposed to act like that because that's how successful go getters have often been portrayed in our society.
Really, it speaks to an incredibly poor, weak and ineffective management culture, and if that approach was taken at my firm they'd be out the door in a flash. The majority of the corporate world has moved on from thinking that the best results and the most motivated and passionate staff are achieved through a culture of fear and uncertainty.
Pronouns: He/Him/His.
"Imagine being a heterosexual white male in Britain at this moment. How bad is that. Everything you say is racist, everything you say is homophobic. The Woke community have really f****d this country."
The Tory MPs tweeting about how lovely she is are a disgrace. They're as bad as those in Labour who brought the lawsuit against anti-semitism whistleblowers - it's gaslighting victims.
Interesting to see some of them using identity politics to defend her bullying as well. Seems like racism of low expectations to me.
A female, BAME, daughter of immigrants who:
• speaks out against the “woke†left • won’t vote the way they say she should • wants controlled immigration • dared to become Home Secretary
Bullying is A - OK peeps! on 14:53 - Nov 20 by SpruceMoose
No, I'm saying that it sounds like the people in charge are acting under some false impression that people in their position are supposed to act like that because that's how successful go getters have often been portrayed in our society.
Really, it speaks to an incredibly poor, weak and ineffective management culture, and if that approach was taken at my firm they'd be out the door in a flash. The majority of the corporate world has moved on from thinking that the best results and the most motivated and passionate staff are achieved through a culture of fear and uncertainty.
I think the problem a lot of the time with contractors is they look at what they're earning each month and think that's how important they are... when in reality they're on an over inflated salary for convenience. There is a lot of pressure though, I've seen people lose it in team meetings a few times. I had to let someone go last year for having a full meltdown because their workstream was going to sh1t, they went on a beautiful rant which culminated in them digging out one of the stream leads who wasn't present... It was fun to watch , but was going too far (and they were useless).
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Bullying is A - OK peeps! on 15:06 - Nov 20 with 706 views
Bullying is A - OK peeps! on 15:03 - Nov 20 by woiii
I think the problem a lot of the time with contractors is they look at what they're earning each month and think that's how important they are... when in reality they're on an over inflated salary for convenience. There is a lot of pressure though, I've seen people lose it in team meetings a few times. I had to let someone go last year for having a full meltdown because their workstream was going to sh1t, they went on a beautiful rant which culminated in them digging out one of the stream leads who wasn't present... It was fun to watch , but was going too far (and they were useless).
Sounds like an exhausting and unproductive environment to me. Hope you're coping with it ok!
Pronouns: He/Him/His.
"Imagine being a heterosexual white male in Britain at this moment. How bad is that. Everything you say is racist, everything you say is homophobic. The Woke community have really f****d this country."
‘Ministers are normally expected to resign if they break the code. But although Sir Alex - who was asked by the PM to investigate the allegations - found the code had been broken, Mr Johnson took a different view and he has the final say.’
Patel and Boris deserve each other. C***S the pair of them.
Bullying is A - OK peeps! on 15:06 - Nov 20 by SpruceMoose
Sounds like an exhausting and unproductive environment to me. Hope you're coping with it ok!
Nope, I fookin hate it and can't wait to retire. But that's mainly because of the delivery stress. It doesn't get directly confrontational very often, it's just not unheard of.
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Bullying is A - OK peeps! on 15:10 - Nov 20 with 694 views
Bullying is A - OK peeps! on 15:09 - Nov 20 by woiii
Nope, I fookin hate it and can't wait to retire. But that's mainly because of the delivery stress. It doesn't get directly confrontational very often, it's just not unheard of.
Sounds rough, good luck matey.
Pronouns: He/Him/His.
"Imagine being a heterosexual white male in Britain at this moment. How bad is that. Everything you say is racist, everything you say is homophobic. The Woke community have really f****d this country."
From the BBC "She is positioned on the right of the party - she voted against gay marriage, campaigned against the smoking ban, and previously advocated bringing back the death penalty, before later saying she did not support it".... Classy. I said on one thread yesterday i hated Boris with a passion. Today i hate him even more the spineless c***.
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Bullying is A - OK peeps! on 16:24 - Nov 20 with 632 views
Bullying is A - OK peeps! on 16:18 - Nov 20 by gtsb1966
From the BBC "She is positioned on the right of the party - she voted against gay marriage, campaigned against the smoking ban, and previously advocated bringing back the death penalty, before later saying she did not support it".... Classy. I said on one thread yesterday i hated Boris with a passion. Today i hate him even more the spineless c***.
This clip should cheer you up. She's a dangerous, vindictive idiot who shouldn't be allowed anywhere near government.
footers QC - Prosecution Barrister, Hasketon Law Chambers
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