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Am I mistaken or did we turn down £1m for Judge from QPR 11:43 - Nov 27 with 1274 viewshype313

Or am I living in some parallel universe?

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Am I mistaken or did we turn down £1m for Judge from QPR on 11:45 - Nov 27 with 1157 viewscatch74

I’m thinking it was £400k and we wanted a million?

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Am I mistaken or did we turn down £1m for Judge from QPR on 11:57 - Nov 27 with 1113 viewsjayessess

The recruitment/retention under Lambert has been absolutely disastrous. Hurst's was worse, but only because more money was at stake.

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Am I mistaken or did we turn down £1m for Judge from QPR on 12:42 - Nov 27 with 1067 viewsMattinLondon

Am I mistaken or did we turn down £1m for Judge from QPR on 11:57 - Nov 27 by jayessess

The recruitment/retention under Lambert has been absolutely disastrous. Hurst's was worse, but only because more money was at stake.


At the time, keeping hold of Judge, was considered vital in order for the team to go forward. Some may well try to revise their position but most praised PL and ME for keeping hold of the player.

We turned down 7.5 million for McGoldrick. At the time great ambition to turn it down, injury hit season and again some fans erase their previous thoughts.
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Am I mistaken or did we turn down £1m for Judge from QPR on 12:46 - Nov 27 with 1053 viewsjayessess

Am I mistaken or did we turn down £1m for Judge from QPR on 12:42 - Nov 27 by MattinLondon

At the time, keeping hold of Judge, was considered vital in order for the team to go forward. Some may well try to revise their position but most praised PL and ME for keeping hold of the player.

We turned down 7.5 million for McGoldrick. At the time great ambition to turn it down, injury hit season and again some fans erase their previous thoughts.


Lambert is paid handsomely to have better judgement than us mere fans do.

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Am I mistaken or did we turn down £1m for Judge from QPR on 12:49 - Nov 27 with 1050 viewsclive_baker

Am I mistaken or did we turn down £1m for Judge from QPR on 11:57 - Nov 27 by jayessess

The recruitment/retention under Lambert has been absolutely disastrous. Hurst's was worse, but only because more money was at stake.


Not sure I agree with that. I actually think he's moulded a nice squad, generally he's made the right decisions on those he's moved on and those he's retained I would say. A few questionable short term signings in the relegation season, but I thought he did quite well thereafter.

The big issue is he just doesn't have a clue what to do with them or how to manage them.

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Am I mistaken or did we turn down £1m for Judge from QPR on 12:50 - Nov 27 with 1044 viewsDarth_Koont

Am I mistaken or did we turn down £1m for Judge from QPR on 12:42 - Nov 27 by MattinLondon

At the time, keeping hold of Judge, was considered vital in order for the team to go forward. Some may well try to revise their position but most praised PL and ME for keeping hold of the player.

We turned down 7.5 million for McGoldrick. At the time great ambition to turn it down, injury hit season and again some fans erase their previous thoughts.


Think that was much more down to the belief that Judge would come good for us. But arguably his performances have always been on the slide, even in a stronger team and at a lower level.

He seems entirely symbolic of Lambert’s own performance and inability to turn things around – while still making Judge one of the first names on his team sheet. I think there’s a clear connection there.
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Am I mistaken or did we turn down £1m for Judge from QPR on 12:57 - Nov 27 with 1025 viewsjayessess

Am I mistaken or did we turn down £1m for Judge from QPR on 12:49 - Nov 27 by clive_baker

Not sure I agree with that. I actually think he's moulded a nice squad, generally he's made the right decisions on those he's moved on and those he's retained I would say. A few questionable short term signings in the relegation season, but I thought he did quite well thereafter.

The big issue is he just doesn't have a clue what to do with them or how to manage them.


With the exception of KVY, I can't think of an incoming signing that has significantly improved our first team. With the exception of the youngsters, I'm also struggling to think of any contract extensions where the player is currently justifying their wage. Edwards maybe?

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Am I mistaken or did we turn down £1m for Judge from QPR on 12:57 - Nov 27 with 1021 viewsSwansea_Blue

Am I mistaken or did we turn down £1m for Judge from QPR on 12:42 - Nov 27 by MattinLondon

At the time, keeping hold of Judge, was considered vital in order for the team to go forward. Some may well try to revise their position but most praised PL and ME for keeping hold of the player.

We turned down 7.5 million for McGoldrick. At the time great ambition to turn it down, injury hit season and again some fans erase their previous thoughts.


That's how I remember it.

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Am I mistaken or did we turn down £1m for Judge from QPR on 13:14 - Nov 27 with 984 viewswkj

Am I mistaken or did we turn down £1m for Judge from QPR on 11:45 - Nov 27 by catch74

I’m thinking it was £400k and we wanted a million?


To think in retrospect that £400k for Judge would make them the mugs and not us.

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Am I mistaken or did we turn down £1m for Judge from QPR on 13:17 - Nov 27 with 979 viewsHerbivore

Am I mistaken or did we turn down £1m for Judge from QPR on 12:42 - Nov 27 by MattinLondon

At the time, keeping hold of Judge, was considered vital in order for the team to go forward. Some may well try to revise their position but most praised PL and ME for keeping hold of the player.

We turned down 7.5 million for McGoldrick. At the time great ambition to turn it down, injury hit season and again some fans erase their previous thoughts.


I wasn't fussed about keeping him as I was one of the few that thought he'd flattered to deceive in our relegation season. At the same time I had no great issue with the decision to keep him, it's not like it was a game changing bid from QPR.

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Am I mistaken or did we turn down £1m for Judge from QPR on 13:26 - Nov 27 with 952 viewsitfcjoe

Am I mistaken or did we turn down £1m for Judge from QPR on 12:49 - Nov 27 by clive_baker

Not sure I agree with that. I actually think he's moulded a nice squad, generally he's made the right decisions on those he's moved on and those he's retained I would say. A few questionable short term signings in the relegation season, but I thought he did quite well thereafter.

The big issue is he just doesn't have a clue what to do with them or how to manage them.


That's my view on it too, the squad is decent enough, with some shrewd signing and keeping holf of right men.

The squad is a little bit bloated which doesn't help likes of El miz and Dobra, but there is anough there for any other manager to come in and pick a style and team quite easily

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Am I mistaken or did we turn down £1m for Judge from QPR on 13:27 - Nov 27 with 948 viewsjayessess

Am I mistaken or did we turn down £1m for Judge from QPR on 13:17 - Nov 27 by Herbivore

I wasn't fussed about keeping him as I was one of the few that thought he'd flattered to deceive in our relegation season. At the same time I had no great issue with the decision to keep him, it's not like it was a game changing bid from QPR.


Factor in the wages and it probably cost us considerably more than, for example, loaning Sammie Szmodics, would have?

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Am I mistaken or did we turn down £1m for Judge from QPR on 13:33 - Nov 27 with 928 viewsclive_baker

Am I mistaken or did we turn down £1m for Judge from QPR on 12:57 - Nov 27 by jayessess

With the exception of KVY, I can't think of an incoming signing that has significantly improved our first team. With the exception of the youngsters, I'm also struggling to think of any contract extensions where the player is currently justifying their wage. Edwards maybe?


Norwood on a free was a good addition. He's had his injury problems but you can't really legislate for that, it's not like he had been plagued with them previously. Ward looks a very good signing on a free in what was a problem area. We were already committed to Donacien when Lambert joined but I dare say he would've pulled out of that if he could, which would've been prudent.

He moved on Roberts, Keane, Rowe, Harrison, Gerken, Spence, Ward, Adeyemi and I don't think we can regret any of those. Knudsen and Bart were inevitable.

He's 'promoted' Bishop and Dozzell more recently when fit, Woolfy more often than not although perhaps not enough. Lankester is getting opportunities, as is McGavin now due to injury. Generally speaking I think he can identify a player, but seems tactically inept and lacks the soft skills to get the most out of them.

It's speculation of course but I reckon MM would have this squad top of the league.

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Am I mistaken or did we turn down £1m for Judge from QPR on 13:45 - Nov 27 with 893 viewsBryanPlug

If Judge had gone to QPR he probably would be tearing it up and we’d be forever kicking ourselves. Such is our luck / awful coaching.
[Post edited 27 Nov 2020 13:46]

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Am I mistaken or did we turn down £1m for Judge from QPR on 13:52 - Nov 27 with 873 viewsjayessess

Am I mistaken or did we turn down £1m for Judge from QPR on 13:33 - Nov 27 by clive_baker

Norwood on a free was a good addition. He's had his injury problems but you can't really legislate for that, it's not like he had been plagued with them previously. Ward looks a very good signing on a free in what was a problem area. We were already committed to Donacien when Lambert joined but I dare say he would've pulled out of that if he could, which would've been prudent.

He moved on Roberts, Keane, Rowe, Harrison, Gerken, Spence, Ward, Adeyemi and I don't think we can regret any of those. Knudsen and Bart were inevitable.

He's 'promoted' Bishop and Dozzell more recently when fit, Woolfy more often than not although perhaps not enough. Lankester is getting opportunities, as is McGavin now due to injury. Generally speaking I think he can identify a player, but seems tactically inept and lacks the soft skills to get the most out of them.

It's speculation of course but I reckon MM would have this squad top of the league.


"Norwood on a free" is a bit misleading for me. He's probably on the most valuable contract at the club and doesn't play like it, even when fit.

Ward might be a useful stop-gap, but he doesn't significantly improve us going forward.

I don't think there was anything wrong with moving most of those players on (although not sure why he gets any credit for Keane), but equally, I can't say that any of the senior players we've kept have stepped up either. I think we're mostly agreed that our wage bill doesn't translate onto the pitch, surely?

Is it so beyond belief that the wages we spend on Chambers/Sears/Skuse, could find us someone better?
[Post edited 27 Nov 2020 13:54]

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Am I mistaken or did we turn down £1m for Judge from QPR on 13:55 - Nov 27 with 863 viewsclive_baker

Am I mistaken or did we turn down £1m for Judge from QPR on 13:45 - Nov 27 by BryanPlug

If Judge had gone to QPR he probably would be tearing it up and we’d be forever kicking ourselves. Such is our luck / awful coaching.
[Post edited 27 Nov 2020 13:46]


There's an element of this that's probably applicable to all our players. There's not a lot wrong with the personnel. I genuinely wouldn't swap it for Hull's squad for example, and they're sure as hell not a 3-0 on our own patch better than us. I wouldn't have been surprised if Jackson was banging them in for B'mouth at a higher level had he gone there too.

It's ironic that the best manager we've had in years has coincided with us having a weaker squad relative to our peers and 'over indexing' in terms of budget and league position. Now we're down a level and the roles are reversed, we've got a manager who is ensuring the whole is less than the sum of the parts.
[Post edited 27 Nov 2020 14:01]

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Am I mistaken or did we turn down £1m for Judge from QPR on 14:01 - Nov 27 with 846 viewsclive_baker

Am I mistaken or did we turn down £1m for Judge from QPR on 13:52 - Nov 27 by jayessess

"Norwood on a free" is a bit misleading for me. He's probably on the most valuable contract at the club and doesn't play like it, even when fit.

Ward might be a useful stop-gap, but he doesn't significantly improve us going forward.

I don't think there was anything wrong with moving most of those players on (although not sure why he gets any credit for Keane), but equally, I can't say that any of the senior players we've kept have stepped up either. I think we're mostly agreed that our wage bill doesn't translate onto the pitch, surely?

Is it so beyond belief that the wages we spend on Chambers/Sears/Skuse, could find us someone better?
[Post edited 27 Nov 2020 13:54]


It's not misleading, it's generally accepted as a term for players that don't command a transfer fee. I've not coined the phrase.

I disagree on Ward, I think he significantly improves us vs. the alternative in Kenlock.

I agree that the budget isn't translating into performances and results, I think that's fact rather than opinion as we can reliably quantify that and we do have one of the higher budgets in the league, but I guess I'm saying I don't think it's been badly invested, I think the issue is we don't have a manager who knows how to get the best out of those players.

There will always be exceptions, no manager in history has a perfect record on signings when we apply hindsight. I think on balance the squad has taken a decent shape. The change I would make would be the management team that are tasked with setting them up appropriately and getting a tune out of them.

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Am I mistaken or did we turn down £1m for Judge from QPR on 15:05 - Nov 27 with 736 viewsBlueandTruesince82

Yes and imagine what it would would have been like on here had we sold him

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Am I mistaken or did we turn down £1m for Judge from QPR on 15:07 - Nov 27 with 734 viewshype313

Am I mistaken or did we turn down £1m for Judge from QPR on 15:05 - Nov 27 by BlueandTruesince82

Yes and imagine what it would would have been like on here had we sold him


To be fair hindsight is a wonderful thing, at the time I was desperately hopeful we would keep him, alas, he has turned into another Bullard.

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Am I mistaken or did we turn down £1m for Judge from QPR on 15:08 - Nov 27 with 733 viewscbower

Am I mistaken or did we turn down £1m for Judge from QPR on 12:42 - Nov 27 by MattinLondon

At the time, keeping hold of Judge, was considered vital in order for the team to go forward. Some may well try to revise their position but most praised PL and ME for keeping hold of the player.

We turned down 7.5 million for McGoldrick. At the time great ambition to turn it down, injury hit season and again some fans erase their previous thoughts.


Totally agree with this. At the time, fans believed Judge to have been central to our chances and there were few, if any dissenting voices about Town having to keep hold of him.. However, the problem has subsequently been Lambert's (mis)use of Judge as a player. Judge has publicly said he prefers to play centrally, a number 10 pulling the strings in behind a striker (or a front two). What has Lambert done? Invariably stuck him out wide either in a 433 or 442 formation in which he has limited impact on the game, cannot beat a man in a wide position and offers little or no protection to full backs or midfielders (depending on the formation played) because he does not have that kind of positional discipline. It's Lambert's inept tactical acumen that is at fault and has contributed significantly to Town fans opinions of Judge (who has been poor btw)

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Am I mistaken or did we turn down £1m for Judge from QPR on 15:24 - Nov 27 with 698 viewsDarth_Koont

Am I mistaken or did we turn down £1m for Judge from QPR on 15:08 - Nov 27 by cbower

Totally agree with this. At the time, fans believed Judge to have been central to our chances and there were few, if any dissenting voices about Town having to keep hold of him.. However, the problem has subsequently been Lambert's (mis)use of Judge as a player. Judge has publicly said he prefers to play centrally, a number 10 pulling the strings in behind a striker (or a front two). What has Lambert done? Invariably stuck him out wide either in a 433 or 442 formation in which he has limited impact on the game, cannot beat a man in a wide position and offers little or no protection to full backs or midfielders (depending on the formation played) because he does not have that kind of positional discipline. It's Lambert's inept tactical acumen that is at fault and has contributed significantly to Town fans opinions of Judge (who has been poor btw)


Not sure Judge’s control or use of the ball justifies that role and his wandering seems to make a position a bit moot.

He’s a “free” attacking midfielder. But just not sure how that helps his teammates or us trying to get a team to develop.
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Am I mistaken or did we turn down £1m for Judge from QPR on 15:29 - Nov 27 with 690 viewsPilgrimblue

Am I mistaken or did we turn down £1m for Judge from QPR on 15:08 - Nov 27 by cbower

Totally agree with this. At the time, fans believed Judge to have been central to our chances and there were few, if any dissenting voices about Town having to keep hold of him.. However, the problem has subsequently been Lambert's (mis)use of Judge as a player. Judge has publicly said he prefers to play centrally, a number 10 pulling the strings in behind a striker (or a front two). What has Lambert done? Invariably stuck him out wide either in a 433 or 442 formation in which he has limited impact on the game, cannot beat a man in a wide position and offers little or no protection to full backs or midfielders (depending on the formation played) because he does not have that kind of positional discipline. It's Lambert's inept tactical acumen that is at fault and has contributed significantly to Town fans opinions of Judge (who has been poor btw)


At Brentford he was a winger and not a central mid so why we or PL expect him to be anything different is asking too much. He definitely benefited from being part of a free flowing attacking team.
When QPR came knocking i'd have sold him, whatever the offer. Trouble he wants to be everywhere but cant deliver and i doubt he would be much good if he jest stayed out wide as he lacks the pace he once had.
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Am I mistaken or did we turn down £1m for Judge from QPR on 15:34 - Nov 27 with 679 viewsHerbivore

Am I mistaken or did we turn down £1m for Judge from QPR on 15:08 - Nov 27 by cbower

Totally agree with this. At the time, fans believed Judge to have been central to our chances and there were few, if any dissenting voices about Town having to keep hold of him.. However, the problem has subsequently been Lambert's (mis)use of Judge as a player. Judge has publicly said he prefers to play centrally, a number 10 pulling the strings in behind a striker (or a front two). What has Lambert done? Invariably stuck him out wide either in a 433 or 442 formation in which he has limited impact on the game, cannot beat a man in a wide position and offers little or no protection to full backs or midfielders (depending on the formation played) because he does not have that kind of positional discipline. It's Lambert's inept tactical acumen that is at fault and has contributed significantly to Town fans opinions of Judge (who has been poor btw)


He's played centrally plenty and has been given licence to drift wherever we've played him. Lambert's issue with Judge is that he persists in playing him full stop when it's clear that he's done at any decent level of football.

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Am I mistaken or did we turn down £1m for Judge from QPR on 16:20 - Nov 27 with 640 viewsjayessess

Am I mistaken or did we turn down £1m for Judge from QPR on 14:01 - Nov 27 by clive_baker

It's not misleading, it's generally accepted as a term for players that don't command a transfer fee. I've not coined the phrase.

I disagree on Ward, I think he significantly improves us vs. the alternative in Kenlock.

I agree that the budget isn't translating into performances and results, I think that's fact rather than opinion as we can reliably quantify that and we do have one of the higher budgets in the league, but I guess I'm saying I don't think it's been badly invested, I think the issue is we don't have a manager who knows how to get the best out of those players.

There will always be exceptions, no manager in history has a perfect record on signings when we apply hindsight. I think on balance the squad has taken a decent shape. The change I would make would be the management team that are tasked with setting them up appropriately and getting a tune out of them.


I think in context "on a free" implies he was cheap and therefore it's OK that he's been underwhelming, even when fit. Whereas in reality he's been pretty costly for what he is.

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Am I mistaken or did we turn down £1m for Judge from QPR on 16:54 - Nov 27 with 598 viewsjas0999

Am I mistaken or did we turn down £1m for Judge from QPR on 11:57 - Nov 27 by jayessess

The recruitment/retention under Lambert has been absolutely disastrous. Hurst's was worse, but only because more money was at stake.


Not really more money at stake. If anything we made a transfer fee profit that summer. Reduced the wage bill too by selling the better top earning players. The mistake was getting rid of the better players and replace with poor players with limited championship experience.
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