| Keir Starmer is threatening to leave our crises unchanged… on 22:42 - Jul 17 with 2164 views | Vegtablue |
| Keir Starmer is threatening to leave our crises unchanged… on 10:10 - Jul 17 by Guthrum |
Altho it is a problem if we merely replace the present government with one which is identical, but slightly more efficient and more internally authoritarian. It may just be an impression, but it seems every time recently Starmer has been asked about a current Conservative policy, he answers that Labour intend to continue it once in power. Even Blair didn't do that.
I can stomach having just incremental progression, but no progression at all is a bit pointless. Koonters may have been right all along.
I suspect there are some planners and advisors at Labour head office who are so desperate to attract Conservative voters that they are resorting to pretending to be them. A theory which risks leaving behind all the people who might vote Labour because they want change. Also daft at a time when they were already well ahead in the polls. |
Not such a Darth Koont after all? |  | |  |
| Keir Starmer is threatening to leave our crises unchanged… on 00:28 - Jul 18 with 2106 views | Ryorry |
| Keir Starmer is threatening to leave our crises unchanged… on 13:43 - Jul 17 by Darth_Koont |
We can afford it. It’s about priorities and political will.
The policies weren’t rejected per se and not on any reasonable grounds re: cost/benefit. Because the policies themselves were barely discussed. |
"Because the policies themselves were barely discussed."
Just not true on here - I remember well that they were very much discussed & quite a few were extremely popular - but the concensus was that the manifesto was overloaded & the number of policies overwhelming - just too many to achieve over 5 years, assuming that Labour would get that long in govt. |  |
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| Keir Starmer is threatening to leave our crises unchanged… on 02:51 - Jul 18 with 2076 views | Zapers |
| Keir Starmer is threatening to leave our crises unchanged… on 21:17 - Jul 17 by DJR |
Sadly, its equivalents, the Times, the Telegraph and the FT, all have a paywall, which rather limits them as a source for debate. Personally, I would prefer to read what they are saying too.
The other way of looking at things is that if we had had 13 years of a Labour government, no doubt it would be Labour supporters in the minority on the general forum. [Post edited 17 Jul 2023 21:55]
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Bye pass the paywall? | | | |
| Keir Starmer is threatening to leave our crises unchanged… on 06:27 - Jul 18 with 2011 views | LegendofthePhoenix |
But they had not gone twenty yards when they stopped short. An uproar of voices was coming from the house. They rushed back and looked through the window again. Yes, a violent quarrel was in progress. There were shoutings, bangings on the table, sharp suspicious glances, furious denials. The source of the trouble appeared to be that Sir Keir and Mr. Sunak had each played an ace of spades simultaneously.
Twelve voices were shouting in anger, and they were all alike. No question, now, what had happened to the faces of the Labour MPs. The creatures outside looked from Labour to Tory, and from Tory to Labour, and from Labour to Tory again; but already it was impossible to say which was which. |  |
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| Keir Starmer is threatening to leave our crises unchanged… on 07:37 - Jul 18 with 1961 views | DJR |
| Keir Starmer is threatening to leave our crises unchanged… on 06:27 - Jul 18 by LegendofthePhoenix |
But they had not gone twenty yards when they stopped short. An uproar of voices was coming from the house. They rushed back and looked through the window again. Yes, a violent quarrel was in progress. There were shoutings, bangings on the table, sharp suspicious glances, furious denials. The source of the trouble appeared to be that Sir Keir and Mr. Sunak had each played an ace of spades simultaneously.
Twelve voices were shouting in anger, and they were all alike. No question, now, what had happened to the faces of the Labour MPs. The creatures outside looked from Labour to Tory, and from Tory to Labour, and from Labour to Tory again; but already it was impossible to say which was which. |
Very clever.
A satirical take on something that was already satire. |  | | |
| Keir Starmer is threatening to leave our crises unchanged… on 08:04 - Jul 18 with 1934 views | LegendofthePhoenix |
| Keir Starmer is threatening to leave our crises unchanged… on 07:37 - Jul 18 by DJR |
Very clever.
A satirical take on something that was already satire. |
Yes, GO could have learned a thing or two about satire from me . 
I put it on Owen Jones' youtube as well. Just hope I don't get done for copyright.  | |
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| Keir Starmer is threatening to leave our crises unchanged… on 08:11 - Jul 18 with 1923 views | DJR |
| Keir Starmer is threatening to leave our crises unchanged… on 08:04 - Jul 18 by LegendofthePhoenix |
Yes, GO could have learned a thing or two about satire from me .
I put it on Owen Jones' youtube as well. Just hope I don't get done for copyright. |
I think you're OK, as I checked your version with the original which is freely available on Project Gutenberg. | | | |
| Keir Starmer is threatening to leave our crises unchanged… on 08:16 - Jul 18 with 1914 views | Herbivore |
| Keir Starmer is threatening to leave our crises unchanged… on 21:06 - Jul 17 by ibbleobble |
It’s the most consistently cited median on this forum so it’s perfectly rationale given it’s central to every discussion going. I assume folk are maximising their subscription to the fullest as a means for reasoned debate and it’s a sound median in the context of non-profit medians but some alternative citations wouldn’t go amiss for more balanced debate. [Post edited 17 Jul 2023 21:46]
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Guardian readers know their mediums from their medians and their rationals from their rationales.
But if you'd like a counterpoint to the criticism of Starmer linked to in this thread, then here is one: https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2023/jul/17/labour-critics-record-keir
Oh wait, that's also from the Guardian. How weird, I thought it was just a left wing propaganda sheet that peddled the same lines constantly? |  |
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| Keir Starmer is threatening to leave our crises unchanged… on 08:25 - Jul 18 with 1883 views | DJR |
As always, Steve Bell is pretty savage on the latest furore.
https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/picture/2023/jul/17/steve-bell-keir-st
The interesting thing with the Guardian is that it does allow a range of left wing views, with Steve Bell being to the left and Polly Toynbee to the right.
My experience is that isn't true of the Mail, Express, Telegraph and Times which tend to have a very right wing party line. [Post edited 18 Jul 2023 9:35]
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| Keir Starmer is threatening to leave our crises unchanged… on 09:29 - Jul 18 with 1811 views | DanTheMan |
| Keir Starmer is threatening to leave our crises unchanged… on 08:16 - Jul 18 by Herbivore |
Guardian readers know their mediums from their medians and their rationals from their rationales.
But if you'd like a counterpoint to the criticism of Starmer linked to in this thread, then here is one: https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2023/jul/17/labour-critics-record-keir
Oh wait, that's also from the Guardian. How weird, I thought it was just a left wing propaganda sheet that peddled the same lines constantly? |
People not understanding how the "Comment is free" sections works is a constant source of annoyance for me. |  |
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| Keir Starmer is threatening to leave our crises unchanged… on 19:07 - Jul 18 with 1672 views | ibbleobble |
| Keir Starmer is threatening to leave our crises unchanged… on 08:16 - Jul 18 by Herbivore |
Guardian readers know their mediums from their medians and their rationals from their rationales.
But if you'd like a counterpoint to the criticism of Starmer linked to in this thread, then here is one: https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2023/jul/17/labour-critics-record-keir
Oh wait, that's also from the Guardian. How weird, I thought it was just a left wing propaganda sheet that peddled the same lines constantly? |
You took the time to write a post calling out a few typos as the basis for a retort with some weak leftist jibe that doesn’t actually make sense!? Bravo. I credited The Guardian as a good source - you do try hard, I’ll give you that. My point was simply that debate on this forum would be far better if it wasn’t simply centred around extracts from the same paper day-in-day-out. There are plenty of interesting think tanks and investigative journalism sites for wider discussion. | | | |
| Keir Starmer is threatening to leave our crises unchanged… on 19:19 - Jul 18 with 1657 views | Herbivore |
| Keir Starmer is threatening to leave our crises unchanged… on 19:07 - Jul 18 by ibbleobble |
You took the time to write a post calling out a few typos as the basis for a retort with some weak leftist jibe that doesn’t actually make sense!? Bravo. I credited The Guardian as a good source - you do try hard, I’ll give you that. My point was simply that debate on this forum would be far better if it wasn’t simply centred around extracts from the same paper day-in-day-out. There are plenty of interesting think tanks and investigative journalism sites for wider discussion. |
Not sure how one would repeatedly type median instead of medium as a typo, but there we are.
Share some of your favourite sources, be the change you want to see. | |
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| Keir Starmer is threatening to leave our crises unchanged… on 19:30 - Jul 18 with 1637 views | Mullet |
| Keir Starmer is threatening to leave our crises unchanged… on 19:07 - Jul 18 by ibbleobble |
You took the time to write a post calling out a few typos as the basis for a retort with some weak leftist jibe that doesn’t actually make sense!? Bravo. I credited The Guardian as a good source - you do try hard, I’ll give you that. My point was simply that debate on this forum would be far better if it wasn’t simply centred around extracts from the same paper day-in-day-out. There are plenty of interesting think tanks and investigative journalism sites for wider discussion. |
Weren't you trumpeting the hypodermic model the other day? You never did explain what you meant unfortunately.
Seems here, you're not offering up these "interesting think tanks and investigative journalism" either. Why is that? |  |
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| Keir Starmer is threatening to leave our crises unchanged… on 19:59 - Jul 18 with 1592 views | ibbleobble |
| Keir Starmer is threatening to leave our crises unchanged… on 19:30 - Jul 18 by Mullet |
Weren't you trumpeting the hypodermic model the other day? You never did explain what you meant unfortunately.
Seems here, you're not offering up these "interesting think tanks and investigative journalism" either. Why is that? |
The hypodermic model is a media theory devised by a theorist called Marshall McLuhan in the 60s / 70s about the mass being passive recipients to media messages.
Do you want links to think tanks or investigative journalism sites? Is that what you’re asking? Seems you’re just jumping in at the defence of others when I haven’t gone on the attack. I’ve merely stated that for a more balanced debate, it’d be nice to dip into this forum and not see The Guardian as a predominant source of insight…constantly.
Here’s s few I frequent that you can have:
https://fabians.org.uk/
https://www.nber.org/
https://www.thebureauinvestigates.com
https://www.propublica.org/ | | | |
| Keir Starmer is threatening to leave our crises unchanged… on 20:13 - Jul 18 with 1554 views | Mullet |
| Keir Starmer is threatening to leave our crises unchanged… on 19:59 - Jul 18 by ibbleobble |
The hypodermic model is a media theory devised by a theorist called Marshall McLuhan in the 60s / 70s about the mass being passive recipients to media messages.
Do you want links to think tanks or investigative journalism sites? Is that what you’re asking? Seems you’re just jumping in at the defence of others when I haven’t gone on the attack. I’ve merely stated that for a more balanced debate, it’d be nice to dip into this forum and not see The Guardian as a predominant source of insight…constantly.
Here’s s few I frequent that you can have:
https://fabians.org.uk/
https://www.nber.org/
https://www.thebureauinvestigates.com
https://www.propublica.org/ |
I'm well aware what it is, and the arguments and critiques of it. I'm still unsure if you believe it to be valid and effective, whilst arguing that "your" media as it were is better. McLuhan's work is predated by nearly 2 decades by Adorno et al. (who were studying the Nazis use of propaganda).
I was speaking solely to you about what you posted, and you've replied with something tangential to your prior argument and then framed something as "attack" and "defence" for some reason.
It's a very strange line to tread it has to be said. Do you not think you need to offer up alternative examples specifically related to a given thread for example? | |
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| Keir Starmer is threatening to leave our crises unchanged… on 20:47 - Jul 18 with 1497 views | ibbleobble |
| Keir Starmer is threatening to leave our crises unchanged… on 20:13 - Jul 18 by Mullet |
I'm well aware what it is, and the arguments and critiques of it. I'm still unsure if you believe it to be valid and effective, whilst arguing that "your" media as it were is better. McLuhan's work is predated by nearly 2 decades by Adorno et al. (who were studying the Nazis use of propaganda).
I was speaking solely to you about what you posted, and you've replied with something tangential to your prior argument and then framed something as "attack" and "defence" for some reason.
It's a very strange line to tread it has to be said. Do you not think you need to offer up alternative examples specifically related to a given thread for example? |
You’ve fallen into the trap of polarisation, as many seem to do on here. I’m not arguing my, ‘media is better’. I’ve simply stated several times now that for a better, well rounded debate, it’d be prudent and more engaging to look at other sources other than The Guardian.
You seem to have bowled in trying to point score (IMO).
Do I think McLuhan’s theory is still correct? Interesting. You’d naturally assume it’s not the case but given that the global economy was for a time run by Twitter, you’d have to say his theory still holds true on some counts, which reflects poorly given how our dated it seems with the means we now have at our disposal for reasoned insight and debate.
To your other point regarding the OP, my angle is different; a more generalised view about how debate on here is started rather than the subject matter itself. | | | |
| Keir Starmer is threatening to leave our crises unchanged… on 21:15 - Jul 18 with 1449 views | ibbleobble |
| Keir Starmer is threatening to leave our crises unchanged… on 20:13 - Jul 18 by Mullet |
I'm well aware what it is, and the arguments and critiques of it. I'm still unsure if you believe it to be valid and effective, whilst arguing that "your" media as it were is better. McLuhan's work is predated by nearly 2 decades by Adorno et al. (who were studying the Nazis use of propaganda).
I was speaking solely to you about what you posted, and you've replied with something tangential to your prior argument and then framed something as "attack" and "defence" for some reason.
It's a very strange line to tread it has to be said. Do you not think you need to offer up alternative examples specifically related to a given thread for example? |
Regarding the OPs question though, the only way is Starmer, there is no other option. It doesn’t matter how Ill prepared this Labour Party are at present, the current situation is untenable. The Conservatives will surely lose but what happens next? Starmer needs to find cash and lots of it and he needs to embed a strategy to appease the unions, empower the public sector and generate cash to begin funding declining infrastructure to bring back trust to a beleaguered and watered down Labour movement.
If it were me, I’d immediately look at the education system and reinvigorate opportunities for the youth to feel free to make informed choices without the burden of debt and I’d streamline processes to get students into active employment quicker. I’d introduce better, more measured pay thresholds in the public sector with more lucrative long term incentives ie: tax breaks, better pension plans and cash incentives to reinvest in training/education. I’d look to pilot this, possibly in the health system, which needs the most attention. This pilot would serve as a model to integrating a degrowth strategy to slow the rise of unregulated capitalism which needs much tighter checks and balances to curtail how it’s being exploited.
How would I raise cash in this economic turmoil? Quite simply I’d be radical and legalise drugs and reinvest that into the public sector to begin implementing degrowth. Jobs? Always the question when degrowth is mentioned. Where will jobs come from? Again, the public sector. Until any government sorts out the public sector and gets its own house in order to show a better way, capitalist opportunists will continue to exploit weak points and people will suffer. The public sector needs major investment and a new strategy as a means to showing people a better means to prosper.
That’s a bit of a ramble and not very structured, admittedly. It’s probably too radical for some but if this Labour government is going to succeed it needs to stand up, be bold and do something way out of kilter with the status quo. If not, they’ll crumble. | | | |
| Keir Starmer is threatening to leave our crises unchanged… on 21:30 - Jul 18 with 1441 views | DJR |
| Keir Starmer is threatening to leave our crises unchanged… on 20:47 - Jul 18 by ibbleobble |
You’ve fallen into the trap of polarisation, as many seem to do on here. I’m not arguing my, ‘media is better’. I’ve simply stated several times now that for a better, well rounded debate, it’d be prudent and more engaging to look at other sources other than The Guardian.
You seem to have bowled in trying to point score (IMO).
Do I think McLuhan’s theory is still correct? Interesting. You’d naturally assume it’s not the case but given that the global economy was for a time run by Twitter, you’d have to say his theory still holds true on some counts, which reflects poorly given how our dated it seems with the means we now have at our disposal for reasoned insight and debate.
To your other point regarding the OP, my angle is different; a more generalised view about how debate on here is started rather than the subject matter itself. |
The impression I get is that more posters on the general thread are anti-Tory than pro-Tory, but I imagine the position would be reversed if we had had 13 years of a Labour government.
Leaving aside the fact that the Times and the Telegraph are paywalled, there is nothing to prevent those who are not anti-Tory from posting sources other than the Guardian, but it is perhaps not surprising that those anti-Tory would be more likely to quote from the Guardian, which actually is free.
As it is, this thread shows that there are those with doubts about Keir Starmer, and those without, so it is not the case that a single left wing view is portrayed.
Incidentally, a friend (as a subscriber) gave me a buckshee subscription to the Telegraph a couple of weeks, so I will perhaps do as you suggest and use it as a source for the general section. The only thing I would say is that reading the Telegraph you wouldn't think the Tories have been in power for 13 years because many of the article seem to me to be rather paranoid about the state of the world.
As an example, I have recently joined a gym, and used the toilet today for the first time. As it is a fairly small gym, it has only two toilets and they happen to be unisex. I didn't bat an eye-lid, but in Telegraphland that takes one into the entire gender/trans debate, and had I been a Telegraph writer, I would have no doubt written a condemnatory article about it. [Post edited 18 Jul 2023 21:34]
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| Keir Starmer is threatening to leave our crises unchanged… on 21:35 - Jul 18 with 1427 views | Swansea_Blue |
| Keir Starmer is threatening to leave our crises unchanged… on 21:30 - Jul 18 by DJR |
The impression I get is that more posters on the general thread are anti-Tory than pro-Tory, but I imagine the position would be reversed if we had had 13 years of a Labour government.
Leaving aside the fact that the Times and the Telegraph are paywalled, there is nothing to prevent those who are not anti-Tory from posting sources other than the Guardian, but it is perhaps not surprising that those anti-Tory would be more likely to quote from the Guardian, which actually is free.
As it is, this thread shows that there are those with doubts about Keir Starmer, and those without, so it is not the case that a single left wing view is portrayed.
Incidentally, a friend (as a subscriber) gave me a buckshee subscription to the Telegraph a couple of weeks, so I will perhaps do as you suggest and use it as a source for the general section. The only thing I would say is that reading the Telegraph you wouldn't think the Tories have been in power for 13 years because many of the article seem to me to be rather paranoid about the state of the world.
As an example, I have recently joined a gym, and used the toilet today for the first time. As it is a fairly small gym, it has only two toilets and they happen to be unisex. I didn't bat an eye-lid, but in Telegraphland that takes one into the entire gender/trans debate, and had I been a Telegraph writer, I would have no doubt written a condemnatory article about it. [Post edited 18 Jul 2023 21:34]
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I don’t remember this place being pro-Tory back in 2010. I could be wrong although it should be easy enough to check. I can’t remember when Phil’s Great Reset was when we moved hosts/servers (whatever), but if it was post 2010 (which I think it was, there’s always the wayback machine). |  |
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| Keir Starmer is threatening to leave our crises unchanged… on 23:56 - Jul 18 with 1312 views | CoachRob |
| Keir Starmer is threatening to leave our crises unchanged… on 21:15 - Jul 18 by ibbleobble |
Regarding the OPs question though, the only way is Starmer, there is no other option. It doesn’t matter how Ill prepared this Labour Party are at present, the current situation is untenable. The Conservatives will surely lose but what happens next? Starmer needs to find cash and lots of it and he needs to embed a strategy to appease the unions, empower the public sector and generate cash to begin funding declining infrastructure to bring back trust to a beleaguered and watered down Labour movement.
If it were me, I’d immediately look at the education system and reinvigorate opportunities for the youth to feel free to make informed choices without the burden of debt and I’d streamline processes to get students into active employment quicker. I’d introduce better, more measured pay thresholds in the public sector with more lucrative long term incentives ie: tax breaks, better pension plans and cash incentives to reinvest in training/education. I’d look to pilot this, possibly in the health system, which needs the most attention. This pilot would serve as a model to integrating a degrowth strategy to slow the rise of unregulated capitalism which needs much tighter checks and balances to curtail how it’s being exploited.
How would I raise cash in this economic turmoil? Quite simply I’d be radical and legalise drugs and reinvest that into the public sector to begin implementing degrowth. Jobs? Always the question when degrowth is mentioned. Where will jobs come from? Again, the public sector. Until any government sorts out the public sector and gets its own house in order to show a better way, capitalist opportunists will continue to exploit weak points and people will suffer. The public sector needs major investment and a new strategy as a means to showing people a better means to prosper.
That’s a bit of a ramble and not very structured, admittedly. It’s probably too radical for some but if this Labour government is going to succeed it needs to stand up, be bold and do something way out of kilter with the status quo. If not, they’ll crumble. |
Degrowth would require a reduction in energy and material throughput in order to align the UK with it's Paris commitments and planetary boundaries. This would require a sacrifice from our citizens in terms of material standard of living.
I found the Labour Party, and this was true under Corbyn as well, is largely clueless on the climate and ecological crisis. It is spun as an opportunity to get richer and dismisses the points that scientists are trying to get across.
I would be interested to hear where you learnt about degrowth as what you are putting across doesn't sound like the research I've read and discussed at various seminars. |  | | |
| Keir Starmer is threatening to leave our crises unchanged… on 13:46 - Jul 19 with 1178 views | DJR |
This exchange from PMQs made me laugh. And despite all the SNP's recent woes, it does make me think they will do better when it comes to the next election than some are predicting, given the apparent similarity between the two main parties, something the SNP are focusing on.
"Stephen Flynn, the SNP leader at Westminster, says the two-child benefit cap has left 250,000 children in poverty. Does the PM take comfort from Labour’s support for it?
Sunak says he welcomes Labour’s support for it. But Keir Starmer has never kept a promise he has made, he says.
Flynn says Scots expect child poverty from the Tories. But not from Labour. A shiver is running along the Labour frontbench, he says, looking for a spine to go up."
EDIT: the full exchange is certainly worth looking at.
https://www.msn.com/en-gb/news/uknews/the-full-exchange-stephen-flynn-grills-ris
[Post edited 19 Jul 2023 13:58]
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| Keir Starmer is threatening to leave our crises unchanged… on 14:53 - Jul 19 with 1144 views | noggin |
| Keir Starmer is threatening to leave our crises unchanged… on 13:46 - Jul 19 by DJR |
This exchange from PMQs made me laugh. And despite all the SNP's recent woes, it does make me think they will do better when it comes to the next election than some are predicting, given the apparent similarity between the two main parties, something the SNP are focusing on.
"Stephen Flynn, the SNP leader at Westminster, says the two-child benefit cap has left 250,000 children in poverty. Does the PM take comfort from Labour’s support for it?
Sunak says he welcomes Labour’s support for it. But Keir Starmer has never kept a promise he has made, he says.
Flynn says Scots expect child poverty from the Tories. But not from Labour. A shiver is running along the Labour frontbench, he says, looking for a spine to go up."
EDIT: the full exchange is certainly worth looking at.
https://www.msn.com/en-gb/news/uknews/the-full-exchange-stephen-flynn-grills-ris
[Post edited 19 Jul 2023 13:58]
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Sir Kid Starver. |  |
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| Keir Starmer is threatening to leave our crises unchanged… on 15:47 - Jul 19 with 1084 views | Darth_Koont |
| Keir Starmer is threatening to leave our crises unchanged… on 14:53 - Jul 19 by noggin |
Sir Kid Starver. |
“Sir Kid Starver” will play well into his Tory base.
Clever. |  |
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| Keir Starmer is threatening to leave our crises unchanged… on 22:30 - Jul 19 with 993 views | ibbleobble |
| Keir Starmer is threatening to leave our crises unchanged… on 23:56 - Jul 18 by CoachRob |
Degrowth would require a reduction in energy and material throughput in order to align the UK with it's Paris commitments and planetary boundaries. This would require a sacrifice from our citizens in terms of material standard of living.
I found the Labour Party, and this was true under Corbyn as well, is largely clueless on the climate and ecological crisis. It is spun as an opportunity to get richer and dismisses the points that scientists are trying to get across.
I would be interested to hear where you learnt about degrowth as what you are putting across doesn't sound like the research I've read and discussed at various seminars. |
You’re right and I can see why my post reads like that. The point I was trying to make is that, in my opinion, before we can implement a degrowth strategy in this country, we need to bring some modicum of equality back to the labour market to lift those in most need out of poverty - after all, degrowth aspires to measure prosperity by social and environmental well being so reducing / eradicating unemployment is a good place to start!
There are 2 million people unemployed in this country of which the legalisation and regulation of drugs governed as a public sector initiative could significantly reduce. In terms of degrowth, this could be perceived as a backward step as it’s about more production but a step back to go two forward to improving prosperity.
Reducing resource and energy is paramount; not reduction in GDP. The art is in balancing the reduction of output whilst maintaining the same GDP (or increasing) whilst equally distributing wealth and introducing sound time management strategies.
This is a great blog for context and what I refer often to. Some fascinating insights in here which even Economists I work with who are very pro GDP as a barometer for success would find it hard to counter argue. I think the key point which is misunderstood with degrowth (largely because of the term) is that degrowth isn’t about reducing all sectors, it’s about reducing only ones that need to be and improving ones that provide the most benefit to the mass to address inequality and inequity. So to your point about reducing material benefits, I see it more about replacing the means of those benefits with less destructive entities rather than making large compromises or detrimental sacrifices.
https://www.jasonhickel.org/blog/tag/degrowth [Post edited 20 Jul 2023 7:57]
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