| The third goal 22:17 - Dec 21 with 11798 views | Garv |
It's not even Muric's fault. It's the same pass we play every week and we've not made that mistake until now.
It's down to Cajuste, he strangely tries to take a touch and roll his man. Morsy just pops that off to O'Shea/Clarke in that situation when he gets it.
Yeah there's an argument for game management at that stage of the game, going into half time, but there's also the argument that pumping it long to Szmodics wasn't doing any good, and we had to keep trying to pass through them.
That's not on Muric in my opinion. |  |
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| The third goal on 23:10 - Dec 22 with 1590 views | reusersfreekicks |
| The third goal on 23:04 - Dec 22 by FrimleyBlue |
Do they? Because the facts are our keeper is doing whats asked of him. Our fullback is doing what's asked of him and our side being asked to pretend they are on par with other clubs at this level so just play out usual way. So if you're questioning player performances then you have to question the manager. If you aren't happy to question the manager because of the credit he has. Then facts don't matter. |
Nothing to do with any of that.
You state things as if they are facts when they are interpretations misquoted etc etc
Anyway as you're back to posting everywhere repeatedly on every thread I'll leave you to it. |  | | |
| The third goal on 23:12 - Dec 22 with 1578 views | FrimleyBlue |
| The third goal on 23:10 - Dec 22 by reusersfreekicks |
Nothing to do with any of that.
You state things as if they are facts when they are interpretations misquoted etc etc
Anyway as you're back to posting everywhere repeatedly on every thread I'll leave you to it. |
Thanks please do. |  |
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| The third goal on 23:42 - Dec 22 with 1526 views | 3_5_2 |
| The third goal on 20:38 - Dec 22 by PhilTWTD |
But players take the ball all the time on the edge of the area in that manner. Rarely in a situation like that are you going to make the run Cajuste makes and someone doesn't follow you. |
What a load of crap.
It’s high risk and there are better options
V poor decision to put Cajuste in that position. |  |
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| The third goal on 00:07 - Dec 23 with 1500 views | mrfixit426 |
| The third goal on 23:10 - Dec 22 by reusersfreekicks |
Nothing to do with any of that.
You state things as if they are facts when they are interpretations misquoted etc etc
Anyway as you're back to posting everywhere repeatedly on every thread I'll leave you to it. |
It's relentless, isn't it. I try to stay out of it as much as I can, but almost every thread descends into a slanging match because of one particular person trying to be "edgy."
I've said it before, but I just can't tolerate "know it alls" who painfully obviously know next to nothing. |  | | |
| The third goal on 00:16 - Dec 23 with 1477 views | FrimleyBlue |
| The third goal on 00:07 - Dec 23 by mrfixit426 |
It's relentless, isn't it. I try to stay out of it as much as I can, but almost every thread descends into a slanging match because of one particular person trying to be "edgy."
I've said it before, but I just can't tolerate "know it alls" who painfully obviously know next to nothing. |
Only one being edgy on this thread Is the one being precious about quotes. Everyone else was discussing the actual football moment and the OP. I do agree with you tho that one poster is relentless but it's their usual games. | |
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| The third goal on 00:17 - Dec 23 with 1481 views | NeedhamChris |
| The third goal on 23:42 - Dec 22 by 3_5_2 |
What a load of crap.
It’s high risk and there are better options
V poor decision to put Cajuste in that position. |
Have you watched us play much over the last couple of years?
High risk is exactly how we play (and it got us back to back promotions).
The decision to play that way is McKenna's - not Muric's. I've been critical of Muric, but crucifying him for that goal is just highlighting who understands what we're about and those that don't.
Cajuste not dealing with it as well doesnt make it any higher risk a pass than the 99% of times we do it properly. |  |
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| The third goal on 00:19 - Dec 23 with 1454 views | mrfixit426 |
| The third goal on 00:16 - Dec 23 by FrimleyBlue |
Only one being edgy on this thread Is the one being precious about quotes. Everyone else was discussing the actual football moment and the OP. I do agree with you tho that one poster is relentless but it's their usual games. |
Let's quote "relentless" and then add up and compare our respective comments over the last 14 days. | | | |
| The third goal on 00:21 - Dec 23 with 1436 views | NeedhamChris |
| The third goal on 23:09 - Dec 22 by Libero |
Didn’t you get told off by the Burns family for exactly this kind of silliness? |
Yet another thread derailed because people have to play the man not the ball. | |
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| The third goal on 00:25 - Dec 23 with 1404 views | FrimleyBlue |
| The third goal on 00:19 - Dec 23 by mrfixit426 |
Let's quote "relentless" and then add up and compare our respective comments over the last 14 days. |
I wasn't referring to your posts. You made it out that I was being relentlessly edgy. I wasn't. The poster you replied to however hasn't discussed the football. Or the OP but had spent their time relentlessly picking fault in my posts without again discussing the actual football chats we've all been sharing. I've really enjoyed the discussions over the weekend. Some good convo and debate. Shame its all gone to sht again because its better for some to try to gain I dunno what they gain tbhm | |
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| The third goal on 00:27 - Dec 23 with 1389 views | Libero |
| The third goal on 00:21 - Dec 23 by NeedhamChris |
Yet another thread derailed because people have to play the man not the ball. |
Weird you’d highlight my comment which was ignored by everyone (thus ‘derailing’ nothing) and not the comments of the two kicking lumps out of the guy!
Also, somewhat of an irony to claim a threads been detailed while simultaneously derailing a thread? I dunno, I’ve not posted on here much lately, maybe this is normal.
Apologies for offence caused. [Post edited 23 Dec 2024 0:30]
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| The third goal on 00:28 - Dec 23 with 1377 views | FrimleyBlue |
| The third goal on 23:09 - Dec 22 by Libero |
Didn’t you get told off by the Burns family for exactly this kind of silliness? |
Why would I get told off for defending the goalkeeper?, | |
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| The third goal on 00:29 - Dec 23 with 1376 views | reusersfreekicks |
| The third goal on 00:19 - Dec 23 by mrfixit426 |
Let's quote "relentless" and then add up and compare our respective comments over the last 14 days. |
I think he means me! Cos I picked him up on grandiose 90% statement, as did others and then misquoting KM. Oh and cos he's on every thread going and it's tedious
A replay of couple of years back. Hey ho... [Post edited 23 Dec 2024 0:32]
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| The third goal on 00:37 - Dec 23 with 1345 views | mrfixit426 |
| The third goal on 00:29 - Dec 23 by reusersfreekicks |
I think he means me! Cos I picked him up on grandiose 90% statement, as did others and then misquoting KM. Oh and cos he's on every thread going and it's tedious
A replay of couple of years back. Hey ho... [Post edited 23 Dec 2024 0:32]
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Indeed. There are posters on here I disagree with, but this is a constant stream of alternate takes on OPs on almost every single thread. It's tiresome, relentless and ruins the forum IMO.
You can't ignore him because he's everywhere, so threads make no sense. It's the sneering sense of superiority of knowledge which has absolutely no relevance to what's actually happening which is the most infuriating.
I actually think I'm done here. Just because of him. | | | |
| The third goal on 07:50 - Dec 23 with 1243 views | NeedhamChris |
| The third goal on 00:27 - Dec 23 by Libero |
Weird you’d highlight my comment which was ignored by everyone (thus ‘derailing’ nothing) and not the comments of the two kicking lumps out of the guy!
Also, somewhat of an irony to claim a threads been detailed while simultaneously derailing a thread? I dunno, I’ve not posted on here much lately, maybe this is normal.
Apologies for offence caused. [Post edited 23 Dec 2024 0:30]
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Short answer, because I'm an idiot that replied to the wrong person!
I get your point, but Is it possible to derail something that has already been derailed? | |
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| The third goal on 08:04 - Dec 23 with 1218 views | NeedhamChris |
| The third goal on 00:37 - Dec 23 by mrfixit426 |
Indeed. There are posters on here I disagree with, but this is a constant stream of alternate takes on OPs on almost every single thread. It's tiresome, relentless and ruins the forum IMO.
You can't ignore him because he's everywhere, so threads make no sense. It's the sneering sense of superiority of knowledge which has absolutely no relevance to what's actually happening which is the most infuriating.
I actually think I'm done here. Just because of him. |
The thing is you can ignore him - it's a bit sad that people require an effective ignore button to do so. If that was the majority view, then people could just, you know, 'ignore' him the old fashioned way.
Personally, is there a lot of stuff from him on here..yes. does that sometimes irritate, yes. However I think it's the constant need of some to demonstrate their superiority of knowledge and go after him that actually makes the threads a bit tedious.
On this particular thread, I don't see much wrong with what he's posted, and it is in support of the OP not a contrarian view. It's also a view that Phil has taken on other threads (re: it being what McKenna wants), so I really don't see any justification for another thread of people trying to argue with him.
Maybe Phil has a different view, but all I see is people falling over themselves to argue the toss with Frimley, only to then complain about the impact of all of his posts.
It's a vicious circle and won't stop until people demonstrate an ability to take on the views, not the poster. | |
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| The third goal on 08:25 - Dec 23 with 1186 views | GlasgowBlue |
| The third goal on 00:17 - Dec 23 by NeedhamChris |
Have you watched us play much over the last couple of years?
High risk is exactly how we play (and it got us back to back promotions).
The decision to play that way is McKenna's - not Muric's. I've been critical of Muric, but crucifying him for that goal is just highlighting who understands what we're about and those that don't.
Cajuste not dealing with it as well doesnt make it any higher risk a pass than the 99% of times we do it properly. |
Indeed. A Carbon copy of the goal we conceded at Hull in April, which was also just a few minutes before half time.
In that instance it was Hladky and Morsy. |  |
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| The third goal on 08:32 - Dec 23 with 1162 views | itfcjoe |
It’s not the decisive error as there is still chance for Jens to put his foot through it quickly or just get rid asap - but the pass is never on, Muric has the view of the whole pitch and he can see what Jens can’t - that Bruno has jumped on the press and is too close for that pass.
Its a brainless pass when combined with that game state - game is likely well gone but a chance to regroup at half time and aim for the next goal in the match |  |
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| The third goal on 08:53 - Dec 23 with 1125 views | Chrisd |
Why managers get their keepers to play these suicidal passes I don’t know? ‘This is how we play’ mantra when there appears so many goals given away in this cheap manner is becoming ridiculous. The fact all clubs appear to play in the Guardiola style is one thing, but managers of these teams -including us- don’t have Guardiola players at their disposal, yet still insist on giving cheap goals away which certainly give us an an uphill battle in games. Just wish managers would show a bit imagination instead of merely sticking to Plan A come high or hell water. | |
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| The third goal on 09:48 - Dec 23 with 1029 views | itfc_statman |
| The third goal on 17:48 - Dec 22 by PhilTWTD |
It is a facet of how we play, and have done for a couple of seasons. Obviously he would want it executed better but evidently doesn't want us to stop playing out like that. And, as others have said, we didn't really have an option to go long with no Delap or Hirst. |
It's bizarre to me. He's correct in that we've conceded less from it than some other teams but that's mostly been down to poor opposition finishing.
We don't go long from goal-kicks enough and we don't go long enough in general. If you go for as-close-to-similar sides as us, that are staying up, they've adjusted in the past 12 months and all go longer - Everton, Forest, West Ham, Brentford, Palace, Bournemouth - all of them play far more direct than we do now.
We're behind the curve in that sense - teams set traps and half-decent one's expose us trying to play out from the back like that. I suspect we won't change this season as we would have done already but for me it's a recipe for being relegated with < 20 points | | | |
| The third goal on 11:29 - Dec 23 with 945 views | Chrisd |
| The third goal on 09:48 - Dec 23 by itfc_statman |
It's bizarre to me. He's correct in that we've conceded less from it than some other teams but that's mostly been down to poor opposition finishing.
We don't go long from goal-kicks enough and we don't go long enough in general. If you go for as-close-to-similar sides as us, that are staying up, they've adjusted in the past 12 months and all go longer - Everton, Forest, West Ham, Brentford, Palace, Bournemouth - all of them play far more direct than we do now.
We're behind the curve in that sense - teams set traps and half-decent one's expose us trying to play out from the back like that. I suspect we won't change this season as we would have done already but for me it's a recipe for being relegated with < 20 points |
I agree. Simply going long at times, get their defence turned and gain territory would be better than giving the ball away in our defensive third and gifting the opposition a chance or worse a goal. We are so predictable at times, we would get away with it in L1 and the Championship, but these sides in the EPL quickly work us out. They don't really need to work hard to force a mistake against us. | |
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| The third goal on 13:10 - Dec 23 with 837 views | itfcjoe |
| The third goal on 11:29 - Dec 23 by Chrisd |
I agree. Simply going long at times, get their defence turned and gain territory would be better than giving the ball away in our defensive third and gifting the opposition a chance or worse a goal. We are so predictable at times, we would get away with it in L1 and the Championship, but these sides in the EPL quickly work us out. They don't really need to work hard to force a mistake against us. |
We do go long plenty, I’d imagine the stats show we do so more than most teams | |
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| The third goal on 13:32 - Dec 23 with 790 views | IPSWICHFANITFC |
I thought Bruno was very alert to it as well. He pressed aggressively and got the reward.
The game management was the most disappointing thing. In added time, 2-0 down, if that ball goes long then we go in to HT at 0-2. Chance to tweak something, next goal after HT is massive etc, but 0-3 at HT and you can't see a route back given how good Newcastle were compared to us. |  |
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| The third goal on 13:52 - Dec 23 with 736 views | DJR |
| The third goal on 13:10 - Dec 23 by itfcjoe |
We do go long plenty, I’d imagine the stats show we do so more than most teams |
And as I said earlier in the thread, Muric's long kicking isn't particularly good, so it really means we just concede possession. [Post edited 23 Dec 2024 13:53]
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| The third goal on 14:02 - Dec 23 with 697 views | itfcjoe |
| The third goal on 13:52 - Dec 23 by DJR |
And as I said earlier in the thread, Muric's long kicking isn't particularly good, so it really means we just concede possession. [Post edited 23 Dec 2024 13:53]
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Highest average distance of goal kick - Unai Simon 62.0 [presumably yards]
Aro Muric - 51.7 [81st percentile]
Average - 43.2
Lowest - Vicario - 21.6
So we go much longer on average than most teams | |
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| The third goal on 14:43 - Dec 23 with 646 views | DJR |
| The third goal on 14:02 - Dec 23 by itfcjoe |
Highest average distance of goal kick - Unai Simon 62.0 [presumably yards]
Aro Muric - 51.7 [81st percentile]
Average - 43.2
Lowest - Vicario - 21.6
So we go much longer on average than most teams |
There are slightly different figures in a Telegraph article yesterday but they tell a similar story.
https://www.telegraph.co.uk/football/2024/12/22/playing-out-from-the-back-southa
It's paywalled, but I've managed to gain access by signing up.
It does it by team rather than goalkeeper, with Everton having an average goal kick of 45 metres and us being in joint third place with 40 metres.
Arsenal is also 40 metres but Chelsea, Man City and Liverpool are all 22 metres. The lowest is Southampton and Spurs with 15 metres each.
EDIT: I've just realised Simon plays in Spain, so your figures may be for the top European leagues. The Telegraph's figures are for the Premier League. But each suggests Muric is at the top end of playing long. [Post edited 23 Dec 2024 14:52]
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