| That first Tuanzebe yellow card... 17:09 - Feb 15 with 7102 views | tractorboy1978 |
Has to be one of the worst decisions I have ever seen. |  | | |  |
| That first Tuanzebe yellow card... on 10:25 - Feb 16 with 1600 views | Blue_In_Boston |
| That first Tuanzebe yellow card... on 08:21 - Feb 16 by tractorboy1978 |
He sees it once from a position of being right on top of it. It wasn't even a small touch of the ball, he clearly wins it.
In terms of the on pitch decision, I have more sympathy with the ref for the Chaplin one. Could be deemed a coming together from his angle. It was poor from the VAR not to intervene. |
You can be to close. It's a wrong decision end of. | | | |
| That first Tuanzebe yellow card... on 10:27 - Feb 16 with 1595 views | Blue_In_Boston |
| That first Tuanzebe yellow card... on 08:57 - Feb 16 by NthQldITFC |
I can kind of take that on board, but given the access to live video and replays the fourth official, or some other pratt, should be having a quiet word in his ear to say 'no yellow' or at least showing a bit of leniency later to balance the books. |
I don't think they ever do that. If a ref knew he had made a mistake you're almost asking him to make another to even things out. | | | |
| That first Tuanzebe yellow card... on 10:38 - Feb 16 with 1577 views | Vaughan8 |
Just looked at the stats and it was 7 fouls to 9.
9 fouls and 5 yellow cards? Or was a yellow given for dissent od time wasting or something?
Still a high % | | | |
| That first Tuanzebe yellow card... on 10:46 - Feb 16 with 1570 views | billlm |
| That first Tuanzebe yellow card... on 17:19 - Feb 15 by turtle2 |
until the second yellow - totally agree with you - both very light touches |
The second hands on his shoulder he could have played on goes down modern day football it's a yellow card,in my eyes it's cheating but they all do it, first he gets the ball no way a booking ref was wrong, |  | | |
| That first Tuanzebe yellow card... on 10:57 - Feb 16 with 1565 views | NthQldITFC |
| That first Tuanzebe yellow card... on 10:27 - Feb 16 by Blue_In_Boston |
I don't think they ever do that. If a ref knew he had made a mistake you're almost asking him to make another to even things out. |
In theory they don't...
Literally, from referees' apologist Keith Hackett, on the second yellow:
“It was rather harsh given the circumstances of what I consider to be a cheap first yellow that was avoidable.” [Post edited 16 Feb 11:04]
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| That first Tuanzebe yellow card... on 11:11 - Feb 16 with 1548 views | grow_our_own |
Yeh first one was never a yellow. Even if you take the (extreme IMO) view that the ball-touch didn't divert it enough to prevent the subsequent contact being a foul, it's inarguable that the ball was diverted sufficiently to disrupt Villa's break. Morgan Rogers would have had to stop, change direction, and retrieve the ball that had been diverted. Break would not have carried the same threat. Hence cannot be more than a free-kick. Cannot be a yellow. Axel didn't go to ground.
In that circumstance, when VAR knows, because everyone who's has seen the replay knows it wasn't a yellow, then at the point of the dismissal decision (which I think was a legitimate yellow), the first yellow must be retracted IMO. VAR was intended to prevent blatant, game-changing injustices: goals, penalties, and dismissals. It currently cannot intervene for two yellows, the rationale being: it would disrupt the flow of the game.
Two possible solutions:
1. After he awards the second yellow, VAR can call the ref over to review the first booking _only_.
2. Captains have limited referrals for whatever they want. Say one or two per half. If they waste them, and there's a Maradona hand-of-god, then tough titties.
#2 is more revolutionary, but I see no reason #1 can't be introduced. There's almost always plenty of time after an unjust first booking for VAR to be ready to _instantly_ trigger the ref-review by the time of a second yellow. So unlike other VAR interventions, this would not delay the game. The only time it would is when someone picks up two yellows in quick succession, then VAR would have to stop the game to consult footage of the first booking, but this will be for a tiny minority of second-yellow dismissals. Since it would be very unlikely to disrupt the flow of the game, I think this is a valid rule change. It would prevent game-ruining injustices like yesterday, at low game-spectacle cost. [Post edited 16 Feb 11:22]
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| That first Tuanzebe yellow card... on 11:25 - Feb 16 with 1498 views | redrickstuhaart |
| That first Tuanzebe yellow card... on 11:11 - Feb 16 by grow_our_own |
Yeh first one was never a yellow. Even if you take the (extreme IMO) view that the ball-touch didn't divert it enough to prevent the subsequent contact being a foul, it's inarguable that the ball was diverted sufficiently to disrupt Villa's break. Morgan Rogers would have had to stop, change direction, and retrieve the ball that had been diverted. Break would not have carried the same threat. Hence cannot be more than a free-kick. Cannot be a yellow. Axel didn't go to ground.
In that circumstance, when VAR knows, because everyone who's has seen the replay knows it wasn't a yellow, then at the point of the dismissal decision (which I think was a legitimate yellow), the first yellow must be retracted IMO. VAR was intended to prevent blatant, game-changing injustices: goals, penalties, and dismissals. It currently cannot intervene for two yellows, the rationale being: it would disrupt the flow of the game.
Two possible solutions:
1. After he awards the second yellow, VAR can call the ref over to review the first booking _only_.
2. Captains have limited referrals for whatever they want. Say one or two per half. If they waste them, and there's a Maradona hand-of-god, then tough titties.
#2 is more revolutionary, but I see no reason #1 can't be introduced. There's almost always plenty of time after an unjust first booking for VAR to be ready to _instantly_ trigger the ref-review by the time of a second yellow. So unlike other VAR interventions, this would not delay the game. The only time it would is when someone picks up two yellows in quick succession, then VAR would have to stop the game to consult footage of the first booking, but this will be for a tiny minority of second-yellow dismissals. Since it would be very unlikely to disrupt the flow of the game, I think this is a valid rule change. It would prevent game-ruining injustices like yesterday, at low game-spectacle cost. [Post edited 16 Feb 11:22]
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Something needs to change. A second yellow is just as significant as a red in the context of the game.
3 times now, we have been done by second yellows which should never have led to sendings off. Harry Clarke won the ball for his first yellow. Phillips barely made contact, having pulled out, and was the vicitm of a massive over reaction. In an incident which shouldnt have ocurred if the blatant pen was given. To this day, I think VAR bottled the pen because they did not want to put the ref in the very awkward position of having issued a red card in a passage of play which ought not to have happened.
2 points v leicester. At least a point, probably 2 against Brentford. And then yesterday- who knows if we'd have held on, but we may have done. | | | |
| That first Tuanzebe yellow card... on 12:54 - Feb 16 with 1433 views | Blue_In_Boston |
| That first Tuanzebe yellow card... on 11:11 - Feb 16 by grow_our_own |
Yeh first one was never a yellow. Even if you take the (extreme IMO) view that the ball-touch didn't divert it enough to prevent the subsequent contact being a foul, it's inarguable that the ball was diverted sufficiently to disrupt Villa's break. Morgan Rogers would have had to stop, change direction, and retrieve the ball that had been diverted. Break would not have carried the same threat. Hence cannot be more than a free-kick. Cannot be a yellow. Axel didn't go to ground.
In that circumstance, when VAR knows, because everyone who's has seen the replay knows it wasn't a yellow, then at the point of the dismissal decision (which I think was a legitimate yellow), the first yellow must be retracted IMO. VAR was intended to prevent blatant, game-changing injustices: goals, penalties, and dismissals. It currently cannot intervene for two yellows, the rationale being: it would disrupt the flow of the game.
Two possible solutions:
1. After he awards the second yellow, VAR can call the ref over to review the first booking _only_.
2. Captains have limited referrals for whatever they want. Say one or two per half. If they waste them, and there's a Maradona hand-of-god, then tough titties.
#2 is more revolutionary, but I see no reason #1 can't be introduced. There's almost always plenty of time after an unjust first booking for VAR to be ready to _instantly_ trigger the ref-review by the time of a second yellow. So unlike other VAR interventions, this would not delay the game. The only time it would is when someone picks up two yellows in quick succession, then VAR would have to stop the game to consult footage of the first booking, but this will be for a tiny minority of second-yellow dismissals. Since it would be very unlikely to disrupt the flow of the game, I think this is a valid rule change. It would prevent game-ruining injustices like yesterday, at low game-spectacle cost. [Post edited 16 Feb 11:22]
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You can't make the rules up as you go along. VAR cannot get involved with yellow cards, unless it deems ir should be upgraded to a red. End of.
I would like to see, like in tennis, where you can appeal a decision - if your appeal is upheld then you keep it. On the downside the game would last forever. | | | |
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| That first Tuanzebe yellow card... on 12:58 - Feb 16 with 1429 views | NthQldITFC |
| That first Tuanzebe yellow card... on 12:54 - Feb 16 by Blue_In_Boston |
You can't make the rules up as you go along. VAR cannot get involved with yellow cards, unless it deems ir should be upgraded to a red. End of.
I would like to see, like in tennis, where you can appeal a decision - if your appeal is upheld then you keep it. On the downside the game would last forever. |
I rather think g_o_o is proposing suitable rule changes. End of. | |
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| That first Tuanzebe yellow card... on 13:10 - Feb 16 with 1423 views | JDB23 |
As soon as we had half our team booked in 45 mins v Liverpool on opening day just for looking at someone in a red shirt I knew this is what we would have to put up with all season. It's one thing to be bad, it's another to be bad and completely inconsistent within games depending on who is playing. | | | |
| That first Tuanzebe yellow card... on 13:48 - Feb 16 with 1376 views | grow_our_own |
| That first Tuanzebe yellow card... on 12:54 - Feb 16 by Blue_In_Boston |
You can't make the rules up as you go along. VAR cannot get involved with yellow cards, unless it deems ir should be upgraded to a red. End of.
I would like to see, like in tennis, where you can appeal a decision - if your appeal is upheld then you keep it. On the downside the game would last forever. |
"VAR cannot get involved with yellow cards" - I'm not suggesting it should, generally. Just the first when a second is awarded. Very low game disruption. Yesterday, VAR would have _instantly_ told the ref to go to the monitors and review the first booking only. Avoiding yesterday's injustice would only have taken as long as it takes for the ref to run to the side of the pitch and back. Small price worth paying.
That tennis model you describe is my #2 suggestion, but like you say, it's pretty revolutionary. Whereas VAR adjudicating first yellow at the point of the second would be easy to implement. [Post edited 16 Feb 13:49]
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| That first Tuanzebe yellow card... on 15:01 - Feb 16 with 1340 views | SamWhiteUK |
| That first Tuanzebe yellow card... on 10:38 - Feb 16 by Vaughan8 |
Just looked at the stats and it was 7 fouls to 9.
9 fouls and 5 yellow cards? Or was a yellow given for dissent od time wasting or something?
Still a high % |
Omari got booked for taking too long to get off the pitch |  | | |
| That first Tuanzebe yellow card... on 16:16 - Feb 16 with 1279 views | phillev231069 |
| That first Tuanzebe yellow card... on 08:04 - Feb 16 by textbackup |
Yet that fat jock pr1ck in CM for them could run about being a thug, shouting at the ref, and seemingly be absolutely fine to do as he pleased.
I’ve no issue with refs being sht, but just be consistent [Post edited 16 Feb 11:13]
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They are consistent....
Consistently shiiiiiiiite! | | | |
| That first Tuanzebe yellow card... on 19:45 - Feb 16 with 1227 views | berkstractorboy |
| That first Tuanzebe yellow card... on 12:54 - Feb 16 by Blue_In_Boston |
You can't make the rules up as you go along. VAR cannot get involved with yellow cards, unless it deems ir should be upgraded to a red. End of.
I would like to see, like in tennis, where you can appeal a decision - if your appeal is upheld then you keep it. On the downside the game would last forever. |
So they get it wrong yesterday and we can't change that however harsh it is. WHERE the rules must change is about the future. We are now, incorrectly, without Tuanzebe for the Spurs game. This is in the future. The PGMOL have the chance to review that and recommend that one of the yellows is overturned and thus the red should not have stood and there is no longer a ban to be served. We aren't being punished once for an incorrect decision, but twice and one for a game in the future where they can do something about it if they didn't remain with archaic rules. | | | |
| That first Tuanzebe yellow card... on 19:49 - Feb 16 with 1218 views | redrickstuhaart |
| That first Tuanzebe yellow card... on 19:45 - Feb 16 by berkstractorboy |
So they get it wrong yesterday and we can't change that however harsh it is. WHERE the rules must change is about the future. We are now, incorrectly, without Tuanzebe for the Spurs game. This is in the future. The PGMOL have the chance to review that and recommend that one of the yellows is overturned and thus the red should not have stood and there is no longer a ban to be served. We aren't being punished once for an incorrect decision, but twice and one for a game in the future where they can do something about it if they didn't remain with archaic rules. |
And its the third time this season it has happened to us... | | | |
| That first Tuanzebe yellow card... on 20:45 - Feb 16 with 1175 views | ibbleobble |
Ever? | | | |
| That first Tuanzebe yellow card... on 20:47 - Feb 16 with 1174 views | heavyweight |
For the first yellow the ref did seem to indicate that Axel had made two previous fouls , is that correct or was it his first offence ? | | | |
| That first Tuanzebe yellow card... on 20:54 - Feb 16 with 1159 views | PhilTWTD |
| That first Tuanzebe yellow card... on 20:47 - Feb 16 by heavyweight |
For the first yellow the ref did seem to indicate that Axel had made two previous fouls , is that correct or was it his first offence ? |
I wondered that as I didn't recall an earlier foul but forgot. But having had a look, according to Opta he committed only two fouls. Or 'fouls'.
https://optaplayerstats.statsperform.com/en_GB/soccer/premier-league-2024-2025/9
This post has been edited by an administrator |  | | |
| That first Tuanzebe yellow card... on 00:44 - Feb 17 with 1027 views | bournemouthblue |
He got a pretty dodgy yellow against Norwich for winning the ball also |  |
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| That first Tuanzebe yellow card... on 09:14 - Feb 17 with 877 views | artsbossbeard |
Watched Liverpool twice this week where both Kounate & Bradley pick up deserved yellow cards, commit further offences without the ref reaching for the red and allowing for them both to be subbed off when it's obvious that their next challenge will result in another yellow.
Axel's first yellow is ridiculous - and right if front of the ref and you can't help but come to the conclusion that we're getting a raw deal here. |  |
| Please note: prior to hitting the post button, I've double checked for anything that could be construed as "Anti Semitic" and to the best of my knowledge it isn't. Anything deemed to be of a Xenophobic nature is therefore purely accidental or down to your own misconstruing. | | Poll: | Raining in IP8 - shall I get the washing in? |
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| That first Tuanzebe yellow card... on 10:16 - Feb 17 with 804 views | Nutkins_Return |
That's slightly OTT but it's a poor decision that has cost us. I could live with him missing the contact and giving the foul. Understandable....but to give the yellow anyway was very harsh.
Silly from Tuanzebe still the second tackle which was a clear yellow but yes the first booking is very poor. | |
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| That first Tuanzebe yellow card... on 12:22 - Feb 17 with 701 views | Dubtractor |
| That first Tuanzebe yellow card... on 09:14 - Feb 17 by artsbossbeard |
Watched Liverpool twice this week where both Kounate & Bradley pick up deserved yellow cards, commit further offences without the ref reaching for the red and allowing for them both to be subbed off when it's obvious that their next challenge will result in another yellow.
Axel's first yellow is ridiculous - and right if front of the ref and you can't help but come to the conclusion that we're getting a raw deal here. |
It is quite hard to escape the conclusion of there being a big club bias isn't it? |  |
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| That first Tuanzebe yellow card... on 12:30 - Feb 17 with 677 views | tonybied |
It's good that he's admitted that it was an error, but the 'let's get VAR up and running before we allow yellows to be looked at' comment! WTF, is 5 years not long enough to count as being up and running? These are exactly the kind of thing that need changing in VAR for people to start trusting that it's being used to come to a fair and correct decision 99% of the time! (there are always going to be rare occasions where an incorrect decision is come to so it's unrealistic to expect 100% correct decisions will ever be achieved) |  | | |
| That first Tuanzebe yellow card... on 13:36 - Feb 17 with 597 views | PhilTWTD |
| That first Tuanzebe yellow card... on 12:30 - Feb 17 by tonybied |
It's good that he's admitted that it was an error, but the 'let's get VAR up and running before we allow yellows to be looked at' comment! WTF, is 5 years not long enough to count as being up and running? These are exactly the kind of thing that need changing in VAR for people to start trusting that it's being used to come to a fair and correct decision 99% of the time! (there are always going to be rare occasions where an incorrect decision is come to so it's unrealistic to expect 100% correct decisions will ever be achieved) |
Yes, seemed a daft comment to me as well. Not overcomplicating things to have a look at yellow card decisions which lead to reds in the same manner as straight reds. | | | |
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