| TWTD is a hotbed of left wingers 08:15 - Mar 31 with 8919 views | urbanpenguin |
People keep writing on here that TWTD is full of "left wingers", or even worse "the far woke".
But is it? I didn't want to do a poll because that would only descend into a binfire, but I am nonetheless interested in the fact some people think this website has an Overton Window further to the left than other places in the world.
I suspect that what's actually happening is that those people who otherwise post on Twitter/X or in closed family Facebook groups are here suddenly encountering different views and counter opinions where normally there's a bubble of agreement.
That doesn't mean that everybody here is left wing, just that perhaps it slightly more reflects a broader society, but they cannot get their minds around that and so just believe and shout that they are drowning in a sea of lefties.
Or perhaps, for no logical reason I can imagine, a thirty year old website run by a couple of football fans has somehow turned into a Suffolk amalgam of Tribune, Pravda and The Morning Star, just with more content about Bontcho. [Post edited 31 Mar 8:17]
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| Little known fact…. on 09:04 - Mar 31 with 879 views | Herbivore |
| Little known fact…. on 09:03 - Mar 31 by TheMoralMajority |
I am also a Londoner, and I have to say, apart from being stabbed on a daily basis, my life has been fundamentally improved by the introduction of Sharia Law. |
Impossible to ever know what time it is in London though, what with your watch and phone being snatched every morning on your way to work. |  |
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| Little known fact…. on 09:09 - Mar 31 with 844 views | MattinLondon |
| Little known fact…. on 09:04 - Mar 31 by Herbivore |
Impossible to ever know what time it is in London though, what with your watch and phone being snatched every morning on your way to work. |
The last time I was in London I was stabbed to death a few times and I only went down for a weekend. Surprised I made it out of there. |  | | |
| TWTD is a hotbed of left wingers on 09:14 - Mar 31 with 806 views | ZedRodgers |
| TWTD is a hotbed of left wingers on 08:46 - Mar 31 by Herbivore |
You probably fall into the classical liberal position really. |
Yeah, bit of a Toby Young vibe. |  |
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| TWTD is a hotbed of left wingers on 09:15 - Mar 31 with 813 views | Guthrum |
The issue is that as politics becomes more polarised, perspectives and rhetoric follow suit. As the centre ground in debate becomes depopulated, it exaggerates the void between extremes. For those on the right, the other side are "woke". For those on the left, their opponents are "fascists". Neither term having any real, defined ideological meaning.
From a position wider on the fringes, more people (including moderates) appear to be "not in our camp of the rightly-thinking". The enemy, in other words.
People aren't trained to debate, so it becomes intensely personal, taken as attacks upon core identity. Thus rapidly descending into insults and even hinted threats of physical violence. |  |
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| TWTD is a hotbed of left wingers on 09:16 - Mar 31 with 792 views | TheMoralMajority |
| TWTD is a hotbed of left wingers on 09:14 - Mar 31 by ZedRodgers |
Yeah, bit of a Toby Young vibe. |
Oh! So you're Zed. Someone thought I was you over the weekend, so I will be keeping an eye on you to see if that was a compliment or not. |  |
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| TWTD is a hotbed of left wingers on 09:20 - Mar 31 with 779 views | urbanpenguin |
| TWTD is a hotbed of left wingers on 09:15 - Mar 31 by Guthrum |
The issue is that as politics becomes more polarised, perspectives and rhetoric follow suit. As the centre ground in debate becomes depopulated, it exaggerates the void between extremes. For those on the right, the other side are "woke". For those on the left, their opponents are "fascists". Neither term having any real, defined ideological meaning.
From a position wider on the fringes, more people (including moderates) appear to be "not in our camp of the rightly-thinking". The enemy, in other words.
People aren't trained to debate, so it becomes intensely personal, taken as attacks upon core identity. Thus rapidly descending into insults and even hinted threats of physical violence. |
Both Fascist and Woke have meanings. And I try to use them both correctly. | | | |
| TWTD is a hotbed of left wingers on 09:23 - Mar 31 with 763 views | ElderGrizzly |
| TWTD is a hotbed of left wingers on 08:34 - Mar 31 by Herbivore |
The UK has fallen into the American made trap of considering liberal attitudes to be left wing. Classical liberalism is a centre right ideology. Being liberal and being left wing are two very different things. You're right on the Guardian, it's very much a liberal publication with some mild nods to reducing inequality but it's hardly The Socialist Worker. Labour currently are centre right, anyone who thinks Labour are of the left doesn't understand politics. |
This is it exactly.
The vitriol in the US is because it is has gone so far to the right, that the centre-left people are seen as extreme. Biden and Harris positioned as communists and extreme left, when they were centre at best, if not slightly right of centre.
I'm very much centre-left here and thought I had middle of the road views, but they are not twisted by Farage and Lowe's lot into extreme-left, 'woke' views. |  | | |
| TWTD is a hotbed of left wingers on 09:25 - Mar 31 with 737 views | Libero |
| TWTD is a hotbed of left wingers on 09:20 - Mar 31 by urbanpenguin |
Both Fascist and Woke have meanings. And I try to use them both correctly. |
Fascism is clearly definable as a far-right, authoritarian, and ultranationalist political ideology characterized by a dictatorial leader, centralised autocracy, militarism, and forcible suppression of opposition.
It promotes a nation or race above individual rights, emphasising a strict social hierarchy and state control of society and the economy
"woke" not so much, infact "woke" originated in African American Vernacular to mean being alert to racial prejudice and systemic injustice.
While historically a term of empowerment, it has evolved into a highly contentious, often pejorative term used to mock or criticise progressive, left-leaning views on social justice, inclusivity, and identity. [Post edited 31 Mar 9:27]
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| TWTD is a hotbed of left wingers on 09:26 - Mar 31 with 716 views | urbanpenguin |
| TWTD is a hotbed of left wingers on 09:25 - Mar 31 by Libero |
Fascism is clearly definable as a far-right, authoritarian, and ultranationalist political ideology characterized by a dictatorial leader, centralised autocracy, militarism, and forcible suppression of opposition.
It promotes a nation or race above individual rights, emphasising a strict social hierarchy and state control of society and the economy
"woke" not so much, infact "woke" originated in African American Vernacular to mean being alert to racial prejudice and systemic injustice.
While historically a term of empowerment, it has evolved into a highly contentious, often pejorative term used to mock or criticise progressive, left-leaning views on social justice, inclusivity, and identity. [Post edited 31 Mar 9:27]
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Yes, I try to use both for their original and actual meanings. | | | |
| TWTD is a hotbed of left wingers on 09:28 - Mar 31 with 702 views | Libero |
| TWTD is a hotbed of left wingers on 09:26 - Mar 31 by urbanpenguin |
Yes, I try to use both for their original and actual meanings. |
I'd say any use of woke isn't useful - it plays into the weirdos who essentially use it for a wide variety of things that they don't understand, fear or hold discrimination for.
...but that's probably just woke nonsense. [Post edited 31 Mar 9:28]
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| TWTD is a hotbed of left wingers on 09:28 - Mar 31 with 699 views | Herbivore |
| TWTD is a hotbed of left wingers on 09:23 - Mar 31 by ElderGrizzly |
This is it exactly.
The vitriol in the US is because it is has gone so far to the right, that the centre-left people are seen as extreme. Biden and Harris positioned as communists and extreme left, when they were centre at best, if not slightly right of centre.
I'm very much centre-left here and thought I had middle of the road views, but they are not twisted by Farage and Lowe's lot into extreme-left, 'woke' views. |
*Lowie | |
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| TWTD is a hotbed of left wingers on 09:29 - Mar 31 with 694 views | BlacknGoldnBlue |
They say that you progress further right as you get older. I haven't. I'm a socialist and my politics have moved left as I've aged. I subscribe to Tribune, go on marches and protest - I am proud to be a "woke leftie"! |  |
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| TWTD is a hotbed of left wingers on 09:32 - Mar 31 with 665 views | Guthrum |
| TWTD is a hotbed of left wingers on 09:20 - Mar 31 by urbanpenguin |
Both Fascist and Woke have meanings. And I try to use them both correctly. |
"Woke" has never had a clear definition. "Fascist" has been taken well outside it's original meaning (modern useage owes more to Rick from the Young Ones than to 1920s Italian political movements*).
* A mix of socialist-inspired economics, nationalism and authoritarian leadership models. In terms of racism/persecution of Jews, no worse than anywhere else in Europe or America at the time, until well into the alliance with nazi Germany, two decades after gaining power. | |
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| TWTD is a hotbed of left wingers on 09:34 - Mar 31 with 652 views | Libero |
| TWTD is a hotbed of left wingers on 09:29 - Mar 31 by BlacknGoldnBlue |
They say that you progress further right as you get older. I haven't. I'm a socialist and my politics have moved left as I've aged. I subscribe to Tribune, go on marches and protest - I am proud to be a "woke leftie"! |
I've always been told this too - in reality what I think they mean is, as some people get older and realise they have personally accrued certain trappings and a certain standard of living, they start to care less about others and instead fear losing what they have.
It of course isn't true for everyone - but it is fair to say that many people are governed by fear and self preservation. [Post edited 31 Mar 9:35]
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| TWTD is a hotbed of left wingers on 09:45 - Mar 31 with 604 views | LA_Tractor_Boy |
I'm amazed how many people get worked up by politics, bearing in mind how little anyone can do to control it.
Have more chance of influencing the result on Easter Monday by getting behind the team. |  | | |
| TWTD is a hotbed of left wingers on 09:45 - Mar 31 with 591 views | WeWereZombies |
| TWTD is a hotbed of left wingers on 09:15 - Mar 31 by Guthrum |
The issue is that as politics becomes more polarised, perspectives and rhetoric follow suit. As the centre ground in debate becomes depopulated, it exaggerates the void between extremes. For those on the right, the other side are "woke". For those on the left, their opponents are "fascists". Neither term having any real, defined ideological meaning.
From a position wider on the fringes, more people (including moderates) appear to be "not in our camp of the rightly-thinking". The enemy, in other words.
People aren't trained to debate, so it becomes intensely personal, taken as attacks upon core identity. Thus rapidly descending into insults and even hinted threats of physical violence. |
You don't have to be trained to debate, you just have to be decent and listen as well as speak truthfully. And then you learn as you go along, and you never stop learning...no matter how well trained you get. |  |
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| TWTD is a hotbed of left wingers on 09:49 - Mar 31 with 560 views | Nthsuffolkblue |
| TWTD is a hotbed of left wingers on 09:45 - Mar 31 by LA_Tractor_Boy |
I'm amazed how many people get worked up by politics, bearing in mind how little anyone can do to control it.
Have more chance of influencing the result on Easter Monday by getting behind the team. |
It's almost as if politics impacts our lives. |  |
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| TWTD is a hotbed of left wingers on 09:51 - Mar 31 with 549 views | urbanpenguin |
| TWTD is a hotbed of left wingers on 09:45 - Mar 31 by LA_Tractor_Boy |
I'm amazed how many people get worked up by politics, bearing in mind how little anyone can do to control it.
Have more chance of influencing the result on Easter Monday by getting behind the team. |
A couple of thoughts here
I get "worked up about it" because it meaningfully affects my life. I would not be married unless gay rights changed, my career is structurally impacted by government funding (or lack of) in the arts and education, my mortgage goes up and down depending on political decisions. So yeah, I get worked up about it.
But, also, we very much can impact politics, both with a big P and a small one.
For four years I was a prominent opponent of a massive and extremely dodgy construction project by Boris Johnson and some friends. It was a lot, a lot, of hard work and I was not the only person leading an opposition. But ultimately we were successful, against a whole set of powers, connections and monies. And it really emboldened me to realise that protest can work and that the "little man" with tact, togetherness, wit, energy and facts can beat the big ones. [Post edited 31 Mar 10:20]
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| Little known fact…. on 09:52 - Mar 31 with 544 views | bluelagos |
| Little known fact…. on 09:09 - Mar 31 by MattinLondon |
The last time I was in London I was stabbed to death a few times and I only went down for a weekend. Surprised I made it out of there. |
I tried to go to London once but as a white straight male I was turned away by the far woke. Bastards. |  |
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| TWTD is a hotbed of left wingers on 09:53 - Mar 31 with 534 views | Libero |
| TWTD is a hotbed of left wingers on 09:45 - Mar 31 by LA_Tractor_Boy |
I'm amazed how many people get worked up by politics, bearing in mind how little anyone can do to control it.
Have more chance of influencing the result on Easter Monday by getting behind the team. |
I can only assume it doesn't affect you personally in any meaningful way?
I'm Dad to a 6 year old boy with high support needs, I work in the arts and entertainment, I'm chronically ill, I'm part of the LGBTQ community, I have a number of friends that are trans, I'm kinship carer for my partners two teenage siblings who were put in our care by social services, I'm caring for my 90 year old Great Uncle, I receive benefits to top up our household income, support the children and to support my own needs for my own disabilities.
These factors of my life are inherently political, but I remember a time in my life where as an individual, I was not so under-attack politically.
I think when something touches elements of your life in a profound way, you've every right to not only engage with it, but engage in your own authentic manner that you feel is proportionate to your own lived experience. | | | |
| TWTD is a hotbed of left wingers on 09:56 - Mar 31 with 502 views | GlasgowBlue |
| TWTD is a hotbed of left wingers on 08:46 - Mar 31 by Herbivore |
You probably fall into the classical liberal position really. |
First up against the wall come the revolution then Herbs? |  |
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| TWTD is a hotbed of left wingers on 09:59 - Mar 31 with 505 views | OldBlueFart |
To be fair, we've had a pretty strong left wing this season...  | | | |
| TWTD is a hotbed of left wingers on 10:01 - Mar 31 with 486 views | bluelagos |
| TWTD is a hotbed of left wingers on 09:45 - Mar 31 by LA_Tractor_Boy |
I'm amazed how many people get worked up by politics, bearing in mind how little anyone can do to control it.
Have more chance of influencing the result on Easter Monday by getting behind the team. |
Really?
In parliament right now is a bill called The Hillsborough Law. The prime minister has agreed to it passing, it is a govt bill.
It will when passed introduce a legal duty of candour so that if people like the SYP ever repeated their actions of lying to a public inquiry, it would be a criminal offense.
Groups like the infected blood guys, post office subpostmasters and grenfell untied have all joined the campaign.
It was started by ordinary people. Like you, like me. | |
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| TWTD is a hotbed of left wingers on 10:03 - Mar 31 with 464 views | GlasgowBlue |
| TWTD is a hotbed of left wingers on 09:16 - Mar 31 by TheMoralMajority |
Oh! So you're Zed. Someone thought I was you over the weekend, so I will be keeping an eye on you to see if that was a compliment or not. |
According to someone who has know him since he was a lad, Zed is BackToRussia. | |
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| TWTD is a hotbed of left wingers on 10:04 - Mar 31 with 472 views | WeWereZombies |
| TWTD is a hotbed of left wingers on 09:56 - Mar 31 by GlasgowBlue |
First up against the wall come the revolution then Herbs? |
In part of the coursework for my philosophy masters degree there was an observation that after the Spanish civil war ended Franco was sort of happy to allow some Marxist professors to keep their university posts, they served as useful 'Aunt Sallys' for the fascists. Liberals, however, were generally hounded out of any influential post (bear in mind that we get the term from Los Liberales, the radical force within Latin politics from a century or two ago.) | |
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