| Loaning out dobra and el miz 13:32 - Sep 11 with 9815 views | Bluefish |
Seems too late for me. We should be involving them and trusting them, I just don't feel that prp trusts the kids. McGavin yes definitely but for dobra and el miz it feels they should have gone out last year (for longer in el mizouni case). |  |
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| Loaning out dobra and el miz on 13:34 - Sep 11 with 3446 views | ITFC_96 |
Said it plenty of times before. Lambert likes to play his dinosaurs instead of giving the promising youngsters game time. I would be livid. |  | | |
| Loaning out dobra and el miz on 13:35 - Sep 11 with 3436 views | Ftnfwest |
Agree, athough i'd prefer him to play for us, i could also maybe see the sense in getting el Miz out to cambridge say until the new year, bearing in mind he's got a minor injury at present - but Dobra? We could even get championship clubs wanting to loan him out, its that ridiculous. |  | | |
| Loaning out dobra and el miz on 13:38 - Sep 11 with 3416 views | Herbivore |
Agreed, to me it just looks like further evidence of how much he wasted last year. Dobra and El Miz were both in the first team picture for much of the season until El Miz went out for a spell with Cambridge. If he felt they needed to be playing regularly, why not make the effort to send them out in July or August last year? Then they'd be much more ready to push on for us this year. What was the value in keeping them around and not using them? Same with McGavin, why not get him a decent loan spell last year? Just smacks of a lack of strategy and planning. |  |
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| Loaning out dobra and el miz on 13:41 - Sep 11 with 3411 views | clive_baker |
I'm pretty critical of Lambert, and firmly remain so given the mess he's made of his time here, but I am inclined to agree with him on this. They both just need to play a lot of competitive football, and they won't do that here. They've shown that they're talented, full of promise, and as tempted as it is to think they should be more involved in the senior team especially given how sh1t we were last season, from what I've seen of both they're still way behind the likes of Judge, Sears, Edwards etc in terms of those wide roles. Then there's Lankester who seems something of a forgotten man at the moment. It remains to be seen what he can offer post his injury setback. Centrally we're really well stocked, so I can't see El-Miz getting a look in there anytime soon.
They're 19. Get them out to L2 to clubs where they're going to play regularly. It'll do them the world of good and they'll come back much better for it. I also think there's some merit in having a slightly trimmer squad ourselves which is easier to manage. |  |
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| Loaning out dobra and el miz on 13:43 - Sep 11 with 3387 views | ITFC_96 |
| Loaning out dobra and el miz on 13:41 - Sep 11 by clive_baker |
I'm pretty critical of Lambert, and firmly remain so given the mess he's made of his time here, but I am inclined to agree with him on this. They both just need to play a lot of competitive football, and they won't do that here. They've shown that they're talented, full of promise, and as tempted as it is to think they should be more involved in the senior team especially given how sh1t we were last season, from what I've seen of both they're still way behind the likes of Judge, Sears, Edwards etc in terms of those wide roles. Then there's Lankester who seems something of a forgotten man at the moment. It remains to be seen what he can offer post his injury setback. Centrally we're really well stocked, so I can't see El-Miz getting a look in there anytime soon.
They're 19. Get them out to L2 to clubs where they're going to play regularly. It'll do them the world of good and they'll come back much better for it. I also think there's some merit in having a slightly trimmer squad ourselves which is easier to manage. |
The same Edwards who has done nothing of note for the past year and the same Judge who goes missing every other game? | | | |
| Loaning out dobra and el miz on 13:47 - Sep 11 with 3378 views | gordon |
| Loaning out dobra and el miz on 13:41 - Sep 11 by clive_baker |
I'm pretty critical of Lambert, and firmly remain so given the mess he's made of his time here, but I am inclined to agree with him on this. They both just need to play a lot of competitive football, and they won't do that here. They've shown that they're talented, full of promise, and as tempted as it is to think they should be more involved in the senior team especially given how sh1t we were last season, from what I've seen of both they're still way behind the likes of Judge, Sears, Edwards etc in terms of those wide roles. Then there's Lankester who seems something of a forgotten man at the moment. It remains to be seen what he can offer post his injury setback. Centrally we're really well stocked, so I can't see El-Miz getting a look in there anytime soon.
They're 19. Get them out to L2 to clubs where they're going to play regularly. It'll do them the world of good and they'll come back much better for it. I also think there's some merit in having a slightly trimmer squad ourselves which is easier to manage. |
There's no way in the world that Edwards and Judge are going to be effective in those wide positions.
If it were me I'd move Edwards on if at all possible, treat Judge as a central midfielder (but also try to move on one of Nolan/Judge, although this may be difficult), and use Dobra, Lankester and El Miz as back-up to Sears / Jackson in the wide forward positions. The games will come thick and fast, and Jackson may be off anyway. |  | | |
| Loaning out dobra and el miz on 13:47 - Sep 11 with 3379 views | Bluefish |
| Loaning out dobra and el miz on 13:41 - Sep 11 by clive_baker |
I'm pretty critical of Lambert, and firmly remain so given the mess he's made of his time here, but I am inclined to agree with him on this. They both just need to play a lot of competitive football, and they won't do that here. They've shown that they're talented, full of promise, and as tempted as it is to think they should be more involved in the senior team especially given how sh1t we were last season, from what I've seen of both they're still way behind the likes of Judge, Sears, Edwards etc in terms of those wide roles. Then there's Lankester who seems something of a forgotten man at the moment. It remains to be seen what he can offer post his injury setback. Centrally we're really well stocked, so I can't see El-Miz getting a look in there anytime soon.
They're 19. Get them out to L2 to clubs where they're going to play regularly. It'll do them the world of good and they'll come back much better for it. I also think there's some merit in having a slightly trimmer squad ourselves which is easier to manage. |
We are only league 1 ourselves. We should be building a team to accommodate Dobra, El Mizouni and Lankester. Like I said I can see that McGavin is further down the list in terms of experience and players in front of him, realistically we have Dozzell, Bishop, Downes etc all in the way but Edwards and Judge should not the blocking the path for Lankester, Dobra or El Mizouni. We will lose Dozzell for a pittance at the end of this season, it will be a shame to lose the others as well | |
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| Loaning out dobra and el miz on 13:48 - Sep 11 with 3369 views | BryanPlug |
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| Loaning out dobra and el miz on 13:49 - Sep 11 with 3357 views | gordon |
| Loaning out dobra and el miz on 13:47 - Sep 11 by Bluefish |
We are only league 1 ourselves. We should be building a team to accommodate Dobra, El Mizouni and Lankester. Like I said I can see that McGavin is further down the list in terms of experience and players in front of him, realistically we have Dozzell, Bishop, Downes etc all in the way but Edwards and Judge should not the blocking the path for Lankester, Dobra or El Mizouni. We will lose Dozzell for a pittance at the end of this season, it will be a shame to lose the others as well |
Yup, agree with this. The likes of Judge, Edwards, Nolan etc. got us to 11th in League One. They aren't going to be miraculously better this year just because Lambert has announced that now we're going to have a plan. | | | |
| Loaning out dobra and el miz on 13:50 - Sep 11 with 3354 views | Kieran_Knows |
| Loaning out dobra and el miz on 13:41 - Sep 11 by clive_baker |
I'm pretty critical of Lambert, and firmly remain so given the mess he's made of his time here, but I am inclined to agree with him on this. They both just need to play a lot of competitive football, and they won't do that here. They've shown that they're talented, full of promise, and as tempted as it is to think they should be more involved in the senior team especially given how sh1t we were last season, from what I've seen of both they're still way behind the likes of Judge, Sears, Edwards etc in terms of those wide roles. Then there's Lankester who seems something of a forgotten man at the moment. It remains to be seen what he can offer post his injury setback. Centrally we're really well stocked, so I can't see El-Miz getting a look in there anytime soon.
They're 19. Get them out to L2 to clubs where they're going to play regularly. It'll do them the world of good and they'll come back much better for it. I also think there's some merit in having a slightly trimmer squad ourselves which is easier to manage. |
What part of loaning them out does this come under in the '5 point plan' though? |  |
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| Loaning out dobra and el miz on 13:55 - Sep 11 with 3329 views | Keno |
totally agree |  |
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| Loaning out dobra and el miz on 14:01 - Sep 11 with 3302 views | Herbivore |
| Loaning out dobra and el miz on 13:41 - Sep 11 by clive_baker |
I'm pretty critical of Lambert, and firmly remain so given the mess he's made of his time here, but I am inclined to agree with him on this. They both just need to play a lot of competitive football, and they won't do that here. They've shown that they're talented, full of promise, and as tempted as it is to think they should be more involved in the senior team especially given how sh1t we were last season, from what I've seen of both they're still way behind the likes of Judge, Sears, Edwards etc in terms of those wide roles. Then there's Lankester who seems something of a forgotten man at the moment. It remains to be seen what he can offer post his injury setback. Centrally we're really well stocked, so I can't see El-Miz getting a look in there anytime soon.
They're 19. Get them out to L2 to clubs where they're going to play regularly. It'll do them the world of good and they'll come back much better for it. I also think there's some merit in having a slightly trimmer squad ourselves which is easier to manage. |
It is very disappointing though that after the abject failure of last season the plan seems to be to stick with the one paced old pros that underwhelmed rather than giving the talented kids a chance. I was looking forward to seeing a bit more of El Miz and Dobra, it's a shame it's going to be Nolan and Judge given the nod again after such a poor effort from them last season. | |
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| Loaning out dobra and el miz on 14:05 - Sep 11 with 3282 views | clive_baker |
| Loaning out dobra and el miz on 13:50 - Sep 11 by Kieran_Knows |
What part of loaning them out does this come under in the '5 point plan' though? |
It's part of the maturation process for the younger players, to get them ready for the starting XI. We could well have a side including Woolfy, Bishop, Downes, Dozzell and maybe Lankester too on a good day. 5 academy graduates in the side, so there's evidence enough to suggest if players are good enough there are opportunities. I just think it's an awful lot to ask of the next 'tranche' a la Dobra and El-Miz to expect that of them right now. They're both raw, and I think they'll benefit more from being a more involved member of a squad in the league below.
As for the senior pro's here, yes some (many) under-performed last season, but there's a multitude of reasons for that which largely all point back at the management IMO. They're the issues which need addressing before casting everyone associated with the club in the past 2 years aside, or we'll continue in this downward spiral. | |
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| Loaning out dobra and el miz on 14:08 - Sep 11 with 3270 views | ITFC_96 |
| Loaning out dobra and el miz on 14:05 - Sep 11 by clive_baker |
It's part of the maturation process for the younger players, to get them ready for the starting XI. We could well have a side including Woolfy, Bishop, Downes, Dozzell and maybe Lankester too on a good day. 5 academy graduates in the side, so there's evidence enough to suggest if players are good enough there are opportunities. I just think it's an awful lot to ask of the next 'tranche' a la Dobra and El-Miz to expect that of them right now. They're both raw, and I think they'll benefit more from being a more involved member of a squad in the league below.
As for the senior pro's here, yes some (many) under-performed last season, but there's a multitude of reasons for that which largely all point back at the management IMO. They're the issues which need addressing before casting everyone associated with the club in the past 2 years aside, or we'll continue in this downward spiral. |
There will probably be Championship clubs looking to loan them, let alone clubs below us. | | | |
| Loaning out dobra and el miz on 14:08 - Sep 11 with 3270 views | jayessess |
| Loaning out dobra and el miz on 14:01 - Sep 11 by Herbivore |
It is very disappointing though that after the abject failure of last season the plan seems to be to stick with the one paced old pros that underwhelmed rather than giving the talented kids a chance. I was looking forward to seeing a bit more of El Miz and Dobra, it's a shame it's going to be Nolan and Judge given the nod again after such a poor effort from them last season. |
Lambert should definitely be waiting as late as possible before deciding that our senior professionals aren't going to be just as disappointing as they were last year... |  |
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| Loaning out dobra and el miz on 14:11 - Sep 11 with 3259 views | IpswichKnight |
| Loaning out dobra and el miz on 13:50 - Sep 11 by Kieran_Knows |
What part of loaning them out does this come under in the '5 point plan' though? |
point 5.1 subsection b clause 75.1.1
The manager reserves the right to punish the younger players for making his selections last season look even more stupid than what was originally thought. These players will be punished by being told to go out on loan when the manager knows full well no L2 club can afford a 1p sweet never mind an extra grand a week. Said players will be punished by having to watch the senior players continue to run like walking in treacle and attempting to tackle thin air. | | | |
| Loaning out dobra and el miz on 14:19 - Sep 11 with 3220 views | clive_baker |
| Loaning out dobra and el miz on 14:08 - Sep 11 by ITFC_96 |
There will probably be Championship clubs looking to loan them, let alone clubs below us. |
I would be very surprised if any of the 3 (El-Miz, Dobra, McGavin) are attracting the interest of Championship clubs on loan with a view to playing regular football this season. Time will tell on that one. | |
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| Loaning out dobra and el miz on 14:19 - Sep 11 with 3219 views | Garv |
| Loaning out dobra and el miz on 13:38 - Sep 11 by Herbivore |
Agreed, to me it just looks like further evidence of how much he wasted last year. Dobra and El Miz were both in the first team picture for much of the season until El Miz went out for a spell with Cambridge. If he felt they needed to be playing regularly, why not make the effort to send them out in July or August last year? Then they'd be much more ready to push on for us this year. What was the value in keeping them around and not using them? Same with McGavin, why not get him a decent loan spell last year? Just smacks of a lack of strategy and planning. |
It's a good point, but we don't even know they didn't try to loan them out last season. Could be the right club never came in, players didn't want to go etc. We saw with Nydam's spell in Scotland not all loans work out. |  |
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| Loaning out dobra and el miz on 14:20 - Sep 11 with 3216 views | ITFC_96 |
| Loaning out dobra and el miz on 14:19 - Sep 11 by clive_baker |
I would be very surprised if any of the 3 (El-Miz, Dobra, McGavin) are attracting the interest of Championship clubs on loan with a view to playing regular football this season. Time will tell on that one. |
Brighton would certainly have sent Dobra on loan to a club above us, at the very least. | | | |
| Loaning out dobra and el miz on 14:24 - Sep 11 with 3197 views | itfcjoe |
| Loaning out dobra and el miz on 14:05 - Sep 11 by clive_baker |
It's part of the maturation process for the younger players, to get them ready for the starting XI. We could well have a side including Woolfy, Bishop, Downes, Dozzell and maybe Lankester too on a good day. 5 academy graduates in the side, so there's evidence enough to suggest if players are good enough there are opportunities. I just think it's an awful lot to ask of the next 'tranche' a la Dobra and El-Miz to expect that of them right now. They're both raw, and I think they'll benefit more from being a more involved member of a squad in the league below.
As for the senior pro's here, yes some (many) under-performed last season, but there's a multitude of reasons for that which largely all point back at the management IMO. They're the issues which need addressing before casting everyone associated with the club in the past 2 years aside, or we'll continue in this downward spiral. |
Last year was such a wasted year, in nearly all respects.
I think whilst we have a big squad, sending them both out is a bit much - especially El miz who impressed at Cambridge and can play in basically any of the midfield and forward positions.
Dobra is a bit greener, and McGavin has more traffic in his way so can just about accept them - but for me letting Idi go would be a mistake as he has that X Factor and swagger we sometimes lack as a team. He wouldn't be far off starting for me |  |
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| Loaning out dobra and el miz on 14:24 - Sep 11 with 3192 views | clive_baker |
| Loaning out dobra and el miz on 14:20 - Sep 11 by ITFC_96 |
Brighton would certainly have sent Dobra on loan to a club above us, at the very least. |
Not sure that is certain, to be fair. Nor will we ever know. With regards, to your first point, time will tell where the loan interest comes from, but if these lads are playing regular football in the Championship this season I'll eat my hat. | |
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| Loaning out dobra and el miz on 14:27 - Sep 11 with 3184 views | JDB23 |
So much for the youth aspect of the 5 point plan.
We could have a starting line up like the below for the majority of the season:
Holy
KVY/Chambers Woolf Nsiala Ward
Bishop Nolan Dozzell
Judge Norwood/Hawkins Sears
That is 2 players under the age of 24. | | | |
| Loaning out dobra and el miz on 14:35 - Sep 11 with 3148 views | Herbivore |
| Loaning out dobra and el miz on 14:19 - Sep 11 by Garv |
It's a good point, but we don't even know they didn't try to loan them out last season. Could be the right club never came in, players didn't want to go etc. We saw with Nydam's spell in Scotland not all loans work out. |
If we couldn't find them a club last season there's zero chance of finding them one this time around with the way clubs' finances are being hit. I agree that loan spells are a bit of a lottery which is why I'm not keen on them going out at this point in their development when they could be pushing for regular minutes. If they'd gone out last season it would have made much more sense. I find it hard to believe that nobody would have taken them given their ability and potential. | |
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| Loaning out dobra and el miz on 14:37 - Sep 11 with 3144 views | Herbivore |
| Loaning out dobra and el miz on 14:27 - Sep 11 by JDB23 |
So much for the youth aspect of the 5 point plan.
We could have a starting line up like the below for the majority of the season:
Holy
KVY/Chambers Woolf Nsiala Ward
Bishop Nolan Dozzell
Judge Norwood/Hawkins Sears
That is 2 players under the age of 24. |
I suspect that if we lose Downes that will very much be our regular line up, possibly Huws might force himself in ahead of Nolan. | |
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| Loaning out dobra and el miz on 14:41 - Sep 11 with 3125 views | Terry_Nutkins |
| Loaning out dobra and el miz on 13:34 - Sep 11 by ITFC_96 |
Said it plenty of times before. Lambert likes to play his dinosaurs instead of giving the promising youngsters game time. I would be livid. |
Except this doesn't make any sense does it.
Last season you moaned that he rotated so by definition that wasn't the case was it. Plenty of younger players got in.
This season he's run the rule over this squad in pre-season and effectively promoted Drinnan, Dozzell and Ndaba with Lankaster back and also being one of the youngsters he's looking to keep and play. With Bishop (also pretty young and obvs not a dinasaur also being first choice) it's reasonable and absolutely clearly not to 'play his dinasaurs'. Why would you just ignore what's obvious just to make a silly statement?!
Not to mention Woolf by the way. That old Dinosaur at 21 and Downes who would be playing. Our entire midfield would be academy. Grow up! [Post edited 11 Sep 2020 14:49]
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