| Fraser to Swansea? 12:20 - Dec 10 with 3134 views | ElderGrizzly |
We clearly haven't seen the best of him yet, but if Swansea think they can make use of him in the Championship surely a half way decent manager in this league can find a way to get the MK Dons form out of him?
|  | | |  |
| Fraser to Swansea? on 12:22 - Dec 10 with 2309 views | StokieBlue |
I think it depends on how you want to play.
I wouldn't be too upset to see him go if we made a profit to be honest. Having a few less options might actually make it easier for the manager.
As you say though, there is obviously quality in there that we haven't seen.
SB |  | | |
| Fraser to Swansea? on 12:24 - Dec 10 with 2273 views | hype313 |
| Fraser to Swansea? on 12:22 - Dec 10 by StokieBlue |
I think it depends on how you want to play.
I wouldn't be too upset to see him go if we made a profit to be honest. Having a few less options might actually make it easier for the manager.
As you say though, there is obviously quality in there that we haven't seen.
SB |
Agreed, if he clearly wants to play at 8 and the new guy doesn't operate that role, then we might aswell cash in as he looks toothless in other positions. |  |
| |
| Fraser to Swansea? on 12:24 - Dec 10 with 2274 views | SomethingBlue |
Might just be a case of a specific manager and very specific system/style getting the best of him though — it happens. [Post edited 10 Dec 2021 12:25]
|  |
| |
| Fraser to Swansea? on 12:26 - Dec 10 with 2237 views | clive_baker |
Cook stuck him on the left which didn't help. Came off the back of a great season at MK Dons and barely given him a chance in his preferred #10. A consequence of the squad imbalance really, that we've ended up with a back 4 that's 75% inherited and got Celina, Chaplin and Fraser as our #10 options, probably costing the best part £40k a week between them. [Post edited 10 Dec 2021 12:30]
|  |
| |
| Fraser to Swansea? on 12:26 - Dec 10 with 2224 views | BseaBlue |
Tend to agree. I reckon this will appeal to him though, knowing Swansea will play him in a system that suits him, with championship football to boot.
Have to agree with the comments below as well though. He doesn't have the flexibility to play anywhere within the attacking midfield remit so if it is for the right price, we should cash in. |  | | |
| Fraser to Swansea? on 12:28 - Dec 10 with 2200 views | abracaDOBRA_ |
this is the problem with signing too many players. problem is we've got Celina and Chaplin as other number 10 options. now were having to play Fraser out wide to accommodate for those 2. Fraser is at his best as a number 10 |  | | |
| Fraser to Swansea? on 12:32 - Dec 10 with 2095 views | Simonds92 |
| Fraser to Swansea? on 12:26 - Dec 10 by clive_baker |
Cook stuck him on the left which didn't help. Came off the back of a great season at MK Dons and barely given him a chance in his preferred #10. A consequence of the squad imbalance really, that we've ended up with a back 4 that's 75% inherited and got Celina, Chaplin and Fraser as our #10 options, probably costing the best part £40k a week between them. [Post edited 10 Dec 2021 12:30]
|
His preferred position according to him is no.8. | | | |
| Fraser to Swansea? on 12:36 - Dec 10 with 2046 views | ElderGrizzly |
| Fraser to Swansea? on 12:28 - Dec 10 by abracaDOBRA_ |
this is the problem with signing too many players. problem is we've got Celina and Chaplin as other number 10 options. now were having to play Fraser out wide to accommodate for those 2. Fraser is at his best as a number 10 |
Given Celina won't/very unlikely be here next season, it would be short-sighted to trade in a permanent player to allow a loan player to take his place? | | | |
Login to get fewer ads
| Fraser to Swansea? on 12:38 - Dec 10 with 2013 views | clive_baker |
| Fraser to Swansea? on 12:32 - Dec 10 by Simonds92 |
His preferred position according to him is no.8. |
I think he regards himself as an attacking midfielder, and his role at MK Dons would suggest that too. Even if he did want to be at #8, he hasn't played there much either, until Cook realised Morsy & Evans wasn't working. I would wager he's made <5 starts in a central area. He's not a wide man, clearly doesn't enjoy playing there. | |
| |
| Fraser to Swansea? on 12:38 - Dec 10 with 2012 views | StokieBlue |
| Fraser to Swansea? on 12:36 - Dec 10 by ElderGrizzly |
Given Celina won't/very unlikely be here next season, it would be short-sighted to trade in a permanent player to allow a loan player to take his place? |
Surely it depends who is more effective this season?
Clearly that is Celina.
Win need to win this season, not worry about possibly winning next season.
SB | | | |
| Fraser to Swansea? on 12:38 - Dec 10 with 2013 views | abracaDOBRA_ |
| Fraser to Swansea? on 12:36 - Dec 10 by ElderGrizzly |
Given Celina won't/very unlikely be here next season, it would be short-sighted to trade in a permanent player to allow a loan player to take his place? |
Yep. I like Celina as an impact player anyway. Difficult one really, Fraser has shown to be decent in spells of games. He needs a run to be effective though. Was pretty crap Tuesday night. But I guess they all were! | | | |
| Fraser to Swansea? on 12:39 - Dec 10 with 1996 views | StokieBlue |
| Fraser to Swansea? on 12:38 - Dec 10 by abracaDOBRA_ |
Yep. I like Celina as an impact player anyway. Difficult one really, Fraser has shown to be decent in spells of games. He needs a run to be effective though. Was pretty crap Tuesday night. But I guess they all were! |
I do wonder where this "impact player" stuff comes from.
His best matches haven't been from the bench and his stats are better than any of the other forward players.
It makes no sense to me at all. I think it's driven by a predetermined view many of our fans have rather than the reality.
SB | | | |
| Fraser to Swansea? on 12:39 - Dec 10 with 1993 views | tractorboy1978 |
| Fraser to Swansea? on 12:24 - Dec 10 by SomethingBlue |
Might just be a case of a specific manager and very specific system/style getting the best of him though — it happens. [Post edited 10 Dec 2021 12:25]
|
I don't know, Burton seemed to get the best out of him too. 30 goals and 27 assists in his last 3 seasons and we've not seen anything like that from him - the recent Ipswich way! [Post edited 10 Dec 2021 12:49]
| | | |
| Fraser to Swansea? on 12:41 - Dec 10 with 1961 views | monty_radio |
| Fraser to Swansea? on 12:26 - Dec 10 by BseaBlue |
Tend to agree. I reckon this will appeal to him though, knowing Swansea will play him in a system that suits him, with championship football to boot.
Have to agree with the comments below as well though. He doesn't have the flexibility to play anywhere within the attacking midfield remit so if it is for the right price, we should cash in. |
Personally I would be sorry to see him go. He has craft and guile about him which deserve to be put to better use than we have made of it. Swansea already have a useful no8 in Downes, but, if this report is correct, the manager there wants to have Fraser's skillset on his books. If our corners and free-kicks are going to be left entirely to Evans then any Town improvement would be on hold. | |
| |
| Fraser to Swansea? on 12:41 - Dec 10 with 1953 views | nodge_blue |
He feels like a player that needs to be in a specific system and have other around him that do the graft. if we think we can do that then fair enough, but otherwise he just doesn't seem to be playing well here. Games pass him by. |  |
| |
| Fraser to Swansea? on 12:42 - Dec 10 with 1944 views | ElderGrizzly |
| Fraser to Swansea? on 12:38 - Dec 10 by abracaDOBRA_ |
Yep. I like Celina as an impact player anyway. Difficult one really, Fraser has shown to be decent in spells of games. He needs a run to be effective though. Was pretty crap Tuesday night. But I guess they all were! |
We need to find a way to get his MK Dons return of 14 goals and 10 assists.
He also made the most number of key passes in the league last season too.
Played in the right position, I believe he is significantly more consistent than Celina | | | |
| Fraser to Swansea? on 12:43 - Dec 10 with 1927 views | jayessess |
| Fraser to Swansea? on 12:38 - Dec 10 by clive_baker |
I think he regards himself as an attacking midfielder, and his role at MK Dons would suggest that too. Even if he did want to be at #8, he hasn't played there much either, until Cook realised Morsy & Evans wasn't working. I would wager he's made <5 starts in a central area. He's not a wide man, clearly doesn't enjoy playing there. |
I was a little confused as to what "#8" really means, tbh. In terms of positioning, is there a massive difference in role and positioning between the furthest forward centre midfielder in a 4-3-3 and the #10 in a 4-2-3-1?
Surely, in both nominal positions a clever midfielder like Fraser is free to take up whatever position enables them to best influence the game? |  |
| |
| Fraser to Swansea? on 12:43 - Dec 10 with 1922 views | abracaDOBRA_ |
| Fraser to Swansea? on 12:39 - Dec 10 by StokieBlue |
I do wonder where this "impact player" stuff comes from.
His best matches haven't been from the bench and his stats are better than any of the other forward players.
It makes no sense to me at all. I think it's driven by a predetermined view many of our fans have rather than the reality.
SB |
Doesn't come from anywhere other than it being my opinion.
I just think he drifts out of games. He hasn't had a game where he's been good for the full 90. Therefore, I think its worth giving 70 minutes to Chaplin who usually puts in a full shift, whilst giving 20 minutes to Celina to do his 'thing'. His goal against Shrewsbury came from coming off the bench when we were looking for a bit of magic. | | | |
| Fraser to Swansea? on 12:45 - Dec 10 with 1900 views | ElderGrizzly |
| Fraser to Swansea? on 12:43 - Dec 10 by jayessess |
I was a little confused as to what "#8" really means, tbh. In terms of positioning, is there a massive difference in role and positioning between the furthest forward centre midfielder in a 4-3-3 and the #10 in a 4-2-3-1?
Surely, in both nominal positions a clever midfielder like Fraser is free to take up whatever position enables them to best influence the game? |
I think one of the biggest problems is what is playing alongside him.
Morsy simply doesn't have the defensive and positional discipline we all hoped he did so our midfield is way too open | | | |
| Fraser to Swansea? on 12:45 - Dec 10 with 1898 views | homer_123 |
| Fraser to Swansea? on 12:39 - Dec 10 by StokieBlue |
I do wonder where this "impact player" stuff comes from.
His best matches haven't been from the bench and his stats are better than any of the other forward players.
It makes no sense to me at all. I think it's driven by a predetermined view many of our fans have rather than the reality.
SB |
Indeed. Whether Celina will be here next year or not - he's been the most effective player we've got:
Celina by homer_123 29 Nov 2021 13:52If you look at his effect on games from a stats perspective...then he's contributing as much, if not more than anyone.
Celina 4 goals, 3 assists
Chaplin 4 goals, 2 assists
Evans, 3 goals, 3 assist
Burns 3 goals, 3 assists
Aluko 3 goals, 0 assists
Fraser 1 goal, 2 assists
Edwards 0 goals, 0 assists
|  |
| |
| Fraser to Swansea? on 12:53 - Dec 10 with 1805 views | StokieBlue |
| Fraser to Swansea? on 12:43 - Dec 10 by abracaDOBRA_ |
Doesn't come from anywhere other than it being my opinion.
I just think he drifts out of games. He hasn't had a game where he's been good for the full 90. Therefore, I think its worth giving 70 minutes to Chaplin who usually puts in a full shift, whilst giving 20 minutes to Celina to do his 'thing'. His goal against Shrewsbury came from coming off the bench when we were looking for a bit of magic. |
Guess it's a game of opinions but I disagree.
Chaplin has been poor recently and the stats for the season he is below Celina is everything except goals (and Celina is only 1 behind in less matches and only just fit). We don't need players who are in the game for 90 minutes, we need players who can win the match.
Giving Celina 20 minutes and then everyone complaining when he's not done anything because he didn't have time is annoying.
Seems to be based more on feelings than evidence.
SB [Post edited 10 Dec 2021 12:53]
| | | |
| Fraser to Swansea? on 12:56 - Dec 10 with 1762 views | StokieBlue |
| Fraser to Swansea? on 12:45 - Dec 10 by homer_123 |
Indeed. Whether Celina will be here next year or not - he's been the most effective player we've got:
Celina by homer_123 29 Nov 2021 13:52If you look at his effect on games from a stats perspective...then he's contributing as much, if not more than anyone.
Celina 4 goals, 3 assists
Chaplin 4 goals, 2 assists
Evans, 3 goals, 3 assist
Burns 3 goals, 3 assists
Aluko 3 goals, 0 assists
Fraser 1 goal, 2 assists
Edwards 0 goals, 0 assists
|
It's even clearer than that if you look at other factors:
For instance, chances created:
Chalin = 9 = 0.53 per match
Celina = 17 = 1.21 per match
https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/teams/ipswich-town/top-scorers
Chaplin seems to get a very easy ride because he scored a few in quick succession and runs around a bit. He's good but doesn't seem to be as effective as Celina.
SB | | | |
| Fraser to Swansea? on 12:56 - Dec 10 with 1758 views | NthQldITFC |
I don't think he's a number 10 or a left winger!, I think he sits in a midfield three with two 'grafters', with a slightly free role allowing him a bit of space to pick his passes. Hopefully the new manager will try something like this:
3-5-2~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Walton
Donacien - Edmundson - Woolfy
Burns - Fraser - Morsy - El Miz - KVY
Bonne/Pigott - Celina/Chaplin (early swaps) |  |
| |
| Fraser to Swansea? on 12:59 - Dec 10 with 1735 views | TheIpswichWay |
| Fraser to Swansea? on 12:45 - Dec 10 by ElderGrizzly |
I think one of the biggest problems is what is playing alongside him.
Morsy simply doesn't have the defensive and positional discipline we all hoped he did so our midfield is way too open |
Exactly this and when Fraser played as the 10 the other night the lack of pace from him, Morsy and Evans was glaring. The 10 in a 4231 has to do so much work that I think Fraser's lack of pace will always restrict what he can offer there. Chaplin has had most success in that role but plays it 5-10 yards further forward than Fraser wants to which is why Bonne looks so much more isolated without Chaplin as the 10. | | | |
| Fraser to Swansea? on 13:00 - Dec 10 with 1730 views | homer_123 |
| Fraser to Swansea? on 12:56 - Dec 10 by StokieBlue |
It's even clearer than that if you look at other factors:
For instance, chances created:
Chalin = 9 = 0.53 per match
Celina = 17 = 1.21 per match
https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/teams/ipswich-town/top-scorers
Chaplin seems to get a very easy ride because he scored a few in quick succession and runs around a bit. He's good but doesn't seem to be as effective as Celina.
SB |
Ohh - indeed SB. No question that Celina is our stand out player in terms of effectiveness.
To be fair to Chaplin, he probably does a little more in terms of pressing, and tracking back etc. than Celina - but if we want 'match winners' Celina is the player. | |
| |
| |
By continuing to use the site, you agree to our use of cookies and to abide by our Terms and Conditions.
