| Labour to introduce PR 16:39 - Sep 21 with 3915 views | Mullet |
Thought this would be commented on given it's a step towards a fairer society arguably. Also has a strong Ipswich connection with Sandy Martin heading up the group.
Interesting to see it being driven by unions changing stance too. FPTP is almost as backwards as the deferential monarchist attitude. Given the wreckage Truss will almost undoubtedly leave behind for Labour after the next GE, electoral reform seems essential. Can't be like Brexit though, needs to be defined clearly for voters before passing it. |  |
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| Labour to introduce PR on 16:43 - Sep 21 with 2458 views | giant_stow |
Hadn't seen that but the best piece of political news in a long time. |  |
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| Labour to introduce PR on 16:44 - Sep 21 with 2433 views | GlasgowBlue |
Not quite.
It's being debated at conference this year. Just as it was last year.
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| Labour to introduce PR on 16:46 - Sep 21 with 2438 views | Zx1988 |
| Labour to introduce PR on 16:44 - Sep 21 by GlasgowBlue |
Not quite.
It's being debated at conference this year. Just as it was last year.
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Having read the Grauniad article, it would appear that the key difference this year is that a significant proportion of the Unions now support PR. If the Unions are now on side, it will make it much easier for the motion to be approved at conference. |  |
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| Labour to introduce PR on 16:46 - Sep 21 with 2424 views | Mullet |
| Labour to introduce PR on 16:44 - Sep 21 by GlasgowBlue |
Not quite.
It's being debated at conference this year. Just as it was last year.
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Union support means it'll go through though making it a formality I'd have thought. | |
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| Labour to introduce PR on 16:49 - Sep 21 with 2395 views | Hackneyblueboy |
| Labour to introduce PR on 16:46 - Sep 21 by Zx1988 |
Having read the Grauniad article, it would appear that the key difference this year is that a significant proportion of the Unions now support PR. If the Unions are now on side, it will make it much easier for the motion to be approved at conference. |
Out of interest why do you call it the Grauniad? I've never understood the reference... | | | |
| Labour to introduce PR on 16:49 - Sep 21 with 2395 views | Churchman |
I’m very much in favour of this. It would mean I had a vote worthy of the name. Where I live, the Tory always gets in. It could be Laura Trott, Putin or a dog turd. Pin a blue rosette on it and in it goes. It doesn’t matter who I vote for as things stand. Under PR it would.
FPTP is anachronistic and open to the party in power trying to bend things with boundary changes and other tricks of the trade. |  | | |
| Labour to introduce PR on 16:50 - Sep 21 with 2384 views | jeera |
| Labour to introduce PR on 16:49 - Sep 21 by Hackneyblueboy |
Out of interest why do you call it the Grauniad? I've never understood the reference... |
I think there was time it became known for a series of spelling mistakes.
I think. |  |
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| Labour to introduce PR on 16:51 - Sep 21 with 2373 views | Zx1988 |
| Labour to introduce PR on 16:49 - Sep 21 by Hackneyblueboy |
Out of interest why do you call it the Grauniad? I've never understood the reference... |
Back in the days when newspapers were manually-typeset, the Guardian had a fairly famous reputation for typographical errors, which led to Private Eye dubbing it "The Grauniad". It's a nickname that has stuck to this day, and is even used in a self-deprecating manner by the paper itself, with www.grauniad.co.uk redirecting to the main page.
https://www.theguardian.com/media/2021/may/12/guardian-200-typo-negative-best-wo [Post edited 21 Sep 2022 16:54]
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| Labour to introduce PR on 16:53 - Sep 21 with 2354 views | Perublue |
Didn't we have a referendum on PR a few years back with about a 20% turnout ? |  |
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| Labour to introduce PR on 16:55 - Sep 21 with 2340 views | jeera |
| Labour to introduce PR on 16:53 - Sep 21 by Perublue |
Didn't we have a referendum on PR a few years back with about a 20% turnout ? |
Are you thinking of the AV one? | |
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| Labour to introduce PR on 16:55 - Sep 21 with 2341 views | positivity |
| Labour to introduce PR on 16:53 - Sep 21 by Perublue |
Didn't we have a referendum on PR a few years back with about a 20% turnout ? |
a very weird form of pr, with no support from either of the 2 major parties | |
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| Labour to introduce PR on 17:06 - Sep 21 with 2300 views | You_Bloo_Right |
Mmm.
There's a number of hurdles to jump. The topic has to survive the categorisation process (what does the confernce want to debate), then survive the compositing process, then win a vote. And, of course, that's just a conference decision and not binding on the leadership.
It has to come though. And if the elctorate is to have a say then let us chose the type of PR (perhaps by use of the STV) rather than whether or not PR is adopted.
Edit: I seem to be making the same points as others. TWTD world just moves too fast for me sometimes. [Post edited 21 Sep 2022 17:07]
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| Labour to introduce PR on 17:13 - Sep 21 with 2246 views | Perublue |
| Labour to introduce PR on 16:55 - Sep 21 by jeera |
Are you thinking of the AV one? |
Yep,thanks mate that was the one. | |
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| Labour to introduce PR on 17:18 - Sep 21 with 2225 views | Perublue |
| Labour to introduce PR on 16:55 - Sep 21 by positivity |
a very weird form of pr, with no support from either of the 2 major parties |
Why and who pushed for it and how did we end up voting on it ? | |
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| Labour to introduce PR on 17:19 - Sep 21 with 2219 views | jeera |
| Labour to introduce PR on 17:06 - Sep 21 by You_Bloo_Right |
Mmm.
There's a number of hurdles to jump. The topic has to survive the categorisation process (what does the confernce want to debate), then survive the compositing process, then win a vote. And, of course, that's just a conference decision and not binding on the leadership.
It has to come though. And if the elctorate is to have a say then let us chose the type of PR (perhaps by use of the STV) rather than whether or not PR is adopted.
Edit: I seem to be making the same points as others. TWTD world just moves too fast for me sometimes. [Post edited 21 Sep 2022 17:07]
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Almost 20 past 5. | |
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| Labour to introduce PR on 17:21 - Sep 21 with 2214 views | cbower |
Depends a great deal on the form of PR. However, almost any variant has to be better than a system which allows a single party with (more often than not) substantially less than than 50% of the popular vote in terms of turnout (even less if you calculate that figure on the whole electorate) to have whopping parliamentary majorities. Might also covince some liberals / Greens to vote tactically for Labour in some key marginals. [Post edited 21 Sep 2022 17:23]
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| Labour to introduce PR on 17:22 - Sep 21 with 2207 views | You_Bloo_Right |
| Labour to introduce PR on 17:18 - Sep 21 by Perublue |
Why and who pushed for it and how did we end up voting on it ? |
From Wiki:
The United Kingdom Alternative Vote referendum was held on Thursday 5 May 2011 (the same date as local elections in many areas) in the United Kingdom to choose the method of electing MPs at subsequent general elections. It occurred as a provision of the Conservative—Liberal Democrat coalition agreement drawn up in 2010 (after a general election that had resulted in the first hung parliament since February 1974) and also indirectly in the aftermath of the 2009 expenses scandal.
The referendum concerned whether or not to replace the present "first-past-the-post" system with the "alternative vote" (AV) method. The proposal to introduce AV was rejected by 67.9% of voters on a national turnout of 42%.
On a turnout of 42.2 percent, 68 percent voted 'No' and 32 percent voted 'Yes'. Ten of the 440 local voting areas recorded 'Yes' votes above 50 per cent: four were Oxford, Cambridge, Edinburgh Central and Glasgow Kelvin, with the remaining six being in London. | |
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| Labour to introduce PR on 17:35 - Sep 21 with 2140 views | positivity |
| Labour to introduce PR on 17:18 - Sep 21 by Perublue |
Why and who pushed for it and how did we end up voting on it ? |
you bloo right's answered it very succinctly, basically a condition of the lib dems naive coalition with the tories in 2010 | |
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| Labour to introduce PR on 17:42 - Sep 21 with 2112 views | J2BLUE |
I suspect Tories and most Labour MPs will unite on the lie that the electorate have no interest in PR as we rejected AV so clearly couldn't possibly be interested in any other type of reform. |  |
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| Labour to introduce PR on 17:47 - Sep 21 with 2067 views | GeoffSentence |
| Labour to introduce PR on 16:55 - Sep 21 by positivity |
a very weird form of pr, with no support from either of the 2 major parties |
No support from any parties, not even the lib dems who have been pushing for PR for years |  |
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| Labour to introduce PR on 17:47 - Sep 21 with 2056 views | Ryorry |
| Labour to introduce PR on 17:22 - Sep 21 by You_Bloo_Right |
From Wiki:
The United Kingdom Alternative Vote referendum was held on Thursday 5 May 2011 (the same date as local elections in many areas) in the United Kingdom to choose the method of electing MPs at subsequent general elections. It occurred as a provision of the Conservative—Liberal Democrat coalition agreement drawn up in 2010 (after a general election that had resulted in the first hung parliament since February 1974) and also indirectly in the aftermath of the 2009 expenses scandal.
The referendum concerned whether or not to replace the present "first-past-the-post" system with the "alternative vote" (AV) method. The proposal to introduce AV was rejected by 67.9% of voters on a national turnout of 42%.
On a turnout of 42.2 percent, 68 percent voted 'No' and 32 percent voted 'Yes'. Ten of the 440 local voting areas recorded 'Yes' votes above 50 per cent: four were Oxford, Cambridge, Edinburgh Central and Glasgow Kelvin, with the remaining six being in London. |
I doubt the majority of voters understood how it worked. |  |
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| Labour to introduce PR on 17:48 - Sep 21 with 2053 views | GlasgowBlue |
| Labour to introduce PR on 16:46 - Sep 21 by Mullet |
Union support means it'll go through though making it a formality I'd have thought. |
PR would be a positive move. However, cording to Labour Party rules, The party is not bound by policy passed at its annual conference — even if motions are passed unanimously. It is Labour’s national policy forum (NPF) and ‘Clause V’ meeting before an election that decides which parts of the party programme are included in the manifesto.
That’s basically to stop crackpot motions getting passed and then becoming policy.. | |
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| Labour to introduce PR on 17:49 - Sep 21 with 2041 views | Mullet |
| Labour to introduce PR on 17:48 - Sep 21 by GlasgowBlue |
PR would be a positive move. However, cording to Labour Party rules, The party is not bound by policy passed at its annual conference — even if motions are passed unanimously. It is Labour’s national policy forum (NPF) and ‘Clause V’ meeting before an election that decides which parts of the party programme are included in the manifesto.
That’s basically to stop crackpot motions getting passed and then becoming policy.. |
Yeah, but Corbyn. | |
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| Labour to introduce PR on 17:49 - Sep 21 with 2036 views | jeera |
| Labour to introduce PR on 17:47 - Sep 21 by GeoffSentence |
No support from any parties, not even the lib dems who have been pushing for PR for years |
The only concern I had with that* is if it were to be tried and found to be wanting would we then be stuck with it as the new system?
I.e. the public have spoken therefore it cannot be undone, or rather replaced again with a purer format of PR.
*AV [Post edited 21 Sep 2022 19:16]
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| Labour to introduce PR on 18:25 - Sep 21 with 1922 views | Kropotkin123 |
| Labour to introduce PR on 16:53 - Sep 21 by Perublue |
Didn't we have a referendum on PR a few years back with about a 20% turnout ? |
Those who have their voting power stolen by the majority don't care whether there was a referendum where people decided our vote should remain unequal. |  |
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