| Last one out of the UK, switch off the lights 11:29 - Jul 11 with 2995 views | Darth_Koont |
After 12 years of Tory failure and wider failure around the world, Labour are pitching even further right and doubling down on neoliberalism!!?
Utter clowns. |  |
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| Last one out of the UK, switch off the lights on 11:34 - Jul 11 with 2211 views | ZXBlue |
Bizarre comment. |  | | |
| Last one out of the UK, switch off the lights on 11:34 - Jul 11 with 2213 views | STYG |
To be fair, making Britain richer is no bad thing, because then there is more to spread around, and furthermore it may actually just mean 'we are going to bin as much of Brexit as possible and beg our neighbours to help undo the Tory mess', which again is no bad thing.
They just can't say that yet. But I'd fully expect them to then sack of what they can and then say 'well, it's made Britain richer'.
No issue with the country having more money. Just needs to not end up in the pockets of politicians mates! However, it's a bit of a weird direction to take, unless they've worked out that's what they need to say to get the substantial 'thick' vote this time around. [Post edited 11 Jul 2022 11:35]
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| Last one out of the UK, switch off the lights on 11:34 - Jul 11 with 2211 views | Pinewoodblue |
Not convinced Starmer qualifies as a Socialist, seems to me that he stands to the right of Blair. |  |
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| Last one out of the UK, switch off the lights on 11:37 - Jul 11 with 2183 views | clive_baker |
Keir Cameron |  |
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| Last one out of the UK, switch off the lights on 11:37 - Jul 11 with 2183 views | Darth_Koont |
| Last one out of the UK, switch off the lights on 11:34 - Jul 11 by ZXBlue |
Bizarre comment. |
Well, I didn't expect you to agree.
However, this is meant to be the opposition and providing a democratic alternative. This isn't even centre-right but pure right-wing mantra. | |
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| Last one out of the UK, switch off the lights on 11:59 - Jul 11 with 2050 views | ZXBlue |
| Last one out of the UK, switch off the lights on 11:37 - Jul 11 by Darth_Koont |
Well, I didn't expect you to agree.
However, this is meant to be the opposition and providing a democratic alternative. This isn't even centre-right but pure right-wing mantra. |
So a successful economy is now 'right wing'. | | | |
| Last one out of the UK, switch off the lights on 12:03 - Jul 11 with 2027 views | Darth_Koont |
| Last one out of the UK, switch off the lights on 11:59 - Jul 11 by ZXBlue |
So a successful economy is now 'right wing'. |
No, most of them aren't. | |
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| Last one out of the UK, switch off the lights on 17:10 - Jul 11 with 1815 views | Darth_Koont |
And now banging on about the Magic Money Tree!!?
FFS. What a danger he and the Labour right are. They’d willingly throw us deeper into the mire of what brought us here just to cosplay as Labour in 1997.
But the world has changed, the failures of this limited thinking are clear and we’ve just gone through a pandemic where the case for necessary government borrowing and spending was surely made. However, just like our temporary “respect” for essential workers until they’re asking for a reasonable wage and working conditions, it seems to be business as usual and back to the politics of the individual and their self-interest trumping the greater good.
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| Last one out of the UK, switch off the lights on 17:25 - Jul 11 with 1767 views | ElephantintheRoom |
It’s almost as though he is trying to get electef | |
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| Last one out of the UK, switch off the lights on 17:43 - Jul 11 with 1726 views | Darth_Koont |
| Last one out of the UK, switch off the lights on 17:25 - Jul 11 by ElephantintheRoom |
It’s almost as though he is trying to get electef |
As leader of the Tory party?
We need more from a democracy than wall-to-wall visionless non-entities parroting right-wing editorials. | |
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| Last one out of the UK, switch off the lights on 19:27 - Jul 11 with 1565 views | GlasgowBlue |
| Last one out of the UK, switch off the lights on 17:10 - Jul 11 by Darth_Koont |
And now banging on about the Magic Money Tree!!?
FFS. What a danger he and the Labour right are. They’d willingly throw us deeper into the mire of what brought us here just to cosplay as Labour in 1997.
But the world has changed, the failures of this limited thinking are clear and we’ve just gone through a pandemic where the case for necessary government borrowing and spending was surely made. However, just like our temporary “respect” for essential workers until they’re asking for a reasonable wage and working conditions, it seems to be business as usual and back to the politics of the individual and their self-interest trumping the greater good.
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Will you be gtreetin' like a ween when I remind you about your evolve politics links like you did with The Canary/ Novara/ Skwawkbox etc? |  |
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| Last one out of the UK, switch off the lights on 20:31 - Jul 11 with 1495 views | Swansea_Blue |
| Last one out of the UK, switch off the lights on 17:25 - Jul 11 by ElephantintheRoom |
It’s almost as though he is trying to get electef |
He won’t with speeches like that! |  |
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| Last one out of the UK, switch off the lights on 20:59 - Jul 11 with 1433 views | TractorWood |
| Last one out of the UK, switch off the lights on 11:34 - Jul 11 by Pinewoodblue |
Not convinced Starmer qualifies as a Socialist, seems to me that he stands to the right of Blair. |
Not sure how any one can deduce anything from his vague waffle. |  |
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| Last one out of the UK, switch off the lights on 21:02 - Jul 11 with 1425 views | tractordownsouth |
So you object to Britain being richer? |  |
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| Last one out of the UK, switch off the lights on 21:06 - Jul 11 with 1420 views | tractordownsouth |
| Last one out of the UK, switch off the lights on 17:10 - Jul 11 by Darth_Koont |
And now banging on about the Magic Money Tree!!?
FFS. What a danger he and the Labour right are. They’d willingly throw us deeper into the mire of what brought us here just to cosplay as Labour in 1997.
But the world has changed, the failures of this limited thinking are clear and we’ve just gone through a pandemic where the case for necessary government borrowing and spending was surely made. However, just like our temporary “respect” for essential workers until they’re asking for a reasonable wage and working conditions, it seems to be business as usual and back to the politics of the individual and their self-interest trumping the greater good.
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I think the bit about taxes is completely correct. Have you seen Javid, Hunt and Zahawi's pledged tax cuts? They're economically illiterate and it's right to attack them. | |
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| Last one out of the UK, switch off the lights on 21:20 - Jul 11 with 1396 views | Swansea_Blue |
| Last one out of the UK, switch off the lights on 21:06 - Jul 11 by tractordownsouth |
I think the bit about taxes is completely correct. Have you seen Javid, Hunt and Zahawi's pledged tax cuts? They're economically illiterate and it's right to attack them. |
The PM contenders lack any obvious signs of being political thinkers. Absolutely devoid of ideas.
Darth has a bit of a point about Starmer though, as his messages aren't especially inspiring (& his delivery hon this clip is awful, but that's not so important). He's obvious much better PM material than BJ (who isn't?) and probably than any of the contenders. I've yet to see any inspiring ideas to rally behind though. Maybe that's deliberate and they're more concerned with deflecting potential attacks than leading from the front. Maybe not, maybe they are also devoid of ideas, I'm not sure.
All I know is that Labour are nowhere near progressive enough for my liking (although still better than the government - but that's a low bar). We're crying out for something inspirational. | |
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| Last one out of the UK, switch off the lights on 21:22 - Jul 11 with 1387 views | tractordownsouth |
| Last one out of the UK, switch off the lights on 21:20 - Jul 11 by Swansea_Blue |
The PM contenders lack any obvious signs of being political thinkers. Absolutely devoid of ideas.
Darth has a bit of a point about Starmer though, as his messages aren't especially inspiring (& his delivery hon this clip is awful, but that's not so important). He's obvious much better PM material than BJ (who isn't?) and probably than any of the contenders. I've yet to see any inspiring ideas to rally behind though. Maybe that's deliberate and they're more concerned with deflecting potential attacks than leading from the front. Maybe not, maybe they are also devoid of ideas, I'm not sure.
All I know is that Labour are nowhere near progressive enough for my liking (although still better than the government - but that's a low bar). We're crying out for something inspirational. |
I think the conference needs to be big this year. There a lot of policy announcements but usually the leadership doesn't repeat them enough so people think there are no policies.
For the clip, I'd have solely focused on unfunded tax cuts, because as far as I know none of them have pledged massive spending. It moves the magic money tree argument onto Tory grounds and makes them look irresponsible, without criticism for spending. | |
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| Last one out of the UK, switch off the lights on 21:30 - Jul 11 with 1366 views | jeera |
| Last one out of the UK, switch off the lights on 21:02 - Jul 11 by tractordownsouth |
So you object to Britain being richer? |
I would like to register my concern as he didn't mention me personally!
I understand the distrust in Starmer for what it's worth; it is right to question his intentions.
He spoke of consulting the likes of Blair and Brown earlier with regards to winning elections, but I am more interested in knowing his policies for our country rather than how he intends to get into government.
He has become somewhat vague in that regard for me.
But am nonetheless starting to pin my hopes somewhat on him. Mostly through lack of choice though and the fact that I don't hate him. Sad isn't it. |  |
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| Last one out of the UK, switch off the lights on 21:44 - Jul 11 with 1326 views | pointofblue |
This approach might have worked with Johnson as PM, and may get Labour elected if the Conservatives elect a hard right candidate. But, either way, following the traditions of the past 43 years is not going to work. | |
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| Last one out of the UK, switch off the lights on 22:07 - Jul 11 with 1285 views | Kropotkin123 |
| Last one out of the UK, switch off the lights on 17:10 - Jul 11 by Darth_Koont |
And now banging on about the Magic Money Tree!!?
FFS. What a danger he and the Labour right are. They’d willingly throw us deeper into the mire of what brought us here just to cosplay as Labour in 1997.
But the world has changed, the failures of this limited thinking are clear and we’ve just gone through a pandemic where the case for necessary government borrowing and spending was surely made. However, just like our temporary “respect” for essential workers until they’re asking for a reasonable wage and working conditions, it seems to be business as usual and back to the politics of the individual and their self-interest trumping the greater good.
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He banged on about "what are they cutting" and where the tories are suddenly "borrowing" from. The magic money was one of three insults that amounted to 10 secs of the clip you sent.
Your criticism of everything he says and does just makes me distrust you and your credibility to assess him. |  |
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| Last one out of the UK, switch off the lights on 23:41 - Jul 11 with 1163 views | lowhouseblue |
seriously, off you go then, bye.  |  |
| And so as the loose-bowelled pigeon of time swoops low over the unsuspecting tourist of destiny, and the flatulent skunk of fate wanders into the air-conditioning system of eternity, I notice it's the end of the show |
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| Last one out of the UK, switch off the lights on 08:36 - Jul 12 with 990 views | Darth_Koont |
| Last one out of the UK, switch off the lights on 22:07 - Jul 11 by Kropotkin123 |
He banged on about "what are they cutting" and where the tories are suddenly "borrowing" from. The magic money was one of three insults that amounted to 10 secs of the clip you sent.
Your criticism of everything he says and does just makes me distrust you and your credibility to assess him. |
I don't criticise everything he says and does. But I do criticise the stuff that makes a mockery of his leadership "pledges". Which is a lot.
He's more comfortable aping the Tories. Here he's perpetuating the damaging myth of the Magic Money Tree when it is borrowing, pure and simple. And a shibboleth of the right that holds back our political debate and indeed limits the policies we see as a country.
We *should* be moving away from this after the experience of the pandemic. So yeah, I expect far more from an opposition leader who is ostensibly there to offer an alternative, let alone one that isn't itself right wing. | |
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| Last one out of the UK, switch off the lights on 08:50 - Jul 12 with 948 views | giant_stow |
| Last one out of the UK, switch off the lights on 08:36 - Jul 12 by Darth_Koont |
I don't criticise everything he says and does. But I do criticise the stuff that makes a mockery of his leadership "pledges". Which is a lot.
He's more comfortable aping the Tories. Here he's perpetuating the damaging myth of the Magic Money Tree when it is borrowing, pure and simple. And a shibboleth of the right that holds back our political debate and indeed limits the policies we see as a country.
We *should* be moving away from this after the experience of the pandemic. So yeah, I expect far more from an opposition leader who is ostensibly there to offer an alternative, let alone one that isn't itself right wing. |
Out of interest, how much borrowing do you think is appropriate or safe? |  |
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| Last one out of the UK, switch off the lights on 08:53 - Jul 12 with 942 views | Swansea_Blue |
| Last one out of the UK, switch off the lights on 08:36 - Jul 12 by Darth_Koont |
I don't criticise everything he says and does. But I do criticise the stuff that makes a mockery of his leadership "pledges". Which is a lot.
He's more comfortable aping the Tories. Here he's perpetuating the damaging myth of the Magic Money Tree when it is borrowing, pure and simple. And a shibboleth of the right that holds back our political debate and indeed limits the policies we see as a country.
We *should* be moving away from this after the experience of the pandemic. So yeah, I expect far more from an opposition leader who is ostensibly there to offer an alternative, let alone one that isn't itself right wing. |
Yeah, not the brightest move to give credence to the magic money tree slur normally used (very successfully) by the Tories. That especially seems like a bit of an own goal. God knows what his attempted quip about the moon was either.
He’s got an open door here to just challenge the wild, uncosted promises made by some of the candidates. And where one (Zahawi, I think) said they’d fund tax cuts by cutting the civil service/public services, he could easily go after the impacts of austerity. I’m not sure why he needs to try and go a bit jokey/weird. He’s not good at it. | |
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| Last one out of the UK, switch off the lights on 09:00 - Jul 12 with 904 views | Darth_Koont |
| Last one out of the UK, switch off the lights on 08:50 - Jul 12 by giant_stow |
Out of interest, how much borrowing do you think is appropriate or safe? |
That's a fairly academic point. Depends what you're borrowing for. You borrow what is necessary to invest in society (for a return) or to cover costs like the pandemic.
We've borrowed 1.7 trillion pounds since the crash of 2008. That's propped up companies and their profits but left wider society pretty much on their own. We are also making the poorest in society suffer the most with austerity and generally underfunding welfare, including seeing 4+ million kids in poverty.
So I think borrowing that much to put the country in its present state is too much. If the same had been spent on infrastructure, health, education and welfare that would have been more appropriate and safer in the long run. [Post edited 12 Jul 2022 9:04]
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